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Ask Slashdot: Advice For Getting Tech Career Back On Track

First time accepted submitter msamp writes "After the dotcom bubble burst so long ago,when tech jobs were so scarce, I went back to school and finished my PhD in Physics. They lied — there really is no shortage of scientists. Before the downturn I was a product manager for home networking equipment. Since getting the degree I have been program/project manager for small DoD and NASA instrumentation programs. I desperately want back into network equipment product management, but my networking tech skills aren't up to date. I find networking technology absolutely trivial and have been retraining on my own, but hiring managers see the gap and the PhD and run screaming. I'm more than willing to start over in network admin but can't even get considered for that. Suggestions?"

15 of 232 comments (clear)

  1. Apply at a university by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative

    My IT department is full of people with tons of degrees doing various IT tasks.

  2. Start your own business by saphena · · Score: 5, Insightful

    That way your qualifications won't matter and won't get in the way

    1. Re:Start your own business by IceNinjaNine · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Yeah, I'm going to have to agree with this. The stinging irony is that your PhD is going to scare folks off despite that it demonstrates that you've got quite the noggin on your shoulders. Unless you're willing to omit it from your resume (which some MAY consider lying by omission) along with some creative verbage about what you were doing during that time, doing your own thing as the parent suggests may be the path of least resistance.

      A friend of mine has a PhD in Chemical Engineering and an MS in Computer Science. He always takes the risk and omits the PhD as he was getting no love from employers otherwise.

    2. Re:Start your own business by t0qer · · Score: 5, Interesting

      After a 12 year Hiatus (I got laid off in 2001) I'm finally getting back to IT, I start a new job monday, it pays a bundle, wife is happy, kids will have benefits..So what did I do in those 12 years?

      I worked at a karaoke bar in San Jose. My friends and I made a karaoke jukebox, tried to market it to karaoke companies (failed miserably, they're like the music companies battling technology in the 90's) It was great, it was fun for a while but no benefits, low pay, and an abusive owner finally made me start taking the steps to get out of it.

      2010 I tried running for city council. Lost but it got my foot in the door with local politicians. Last campaign season, I helped one candidate win by using a combination of twilio/openvbx for robocalls (at cost.. $0.02) 40,000 robocalls. Most candidates pay between $0.79 to $0.83 a call, so I consider it to be a pretty huge contribution.

      During my interview I was totally open and honest about my last 12 years. Why didn't I W2 for the last 12 years? Why are these gaps here in my employment? Lucky for me my hiring manager had been in a similar situation... The entire company was really impressed with all my political work in the last year. (In my new role, I'll be doing IT stuff in a board room, so knowing how to mind your political p's and q's to make a good initial impression was super important)
      When I was first laid off in 2001, I never dreamed of doing any kind of volunteer work or activism. I was in my late 20's, and too self centered to give a shit. I thought my salary was my worth, and working for free/volunteer was beneath me. Took a few years of eating humble pie in a karaoke bar to adjust that attitude.

      So my advice, find some local volunteer things to work on that appeal to you. See how you can wrangle your tech knowledge in there. Me? I just happened to love all the skullduggery and drama involved with politics. YMMV.

    3. Re:Start your own business by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

      I helped one candidate win by using a combination of twilio/openvbx for robocalls

      Go fuck yourself.

    4. Re:Start your own business by GameboyRMH · · Score: 5, Insightful

      This. Or just cut the pretense and make real money as a black hat.

      --
      "When information is power, privacy is freedom" - Jah-Wren Ryel
    5. Re:Start your own business by lurker1997 · · Score: 5, Funny

      I often joke that if I ever have to apply for a (non-academic) job, my chances will be better if I just put 'prison' for the four years I was doing my Ph.D. in order to explain the time gap.

    6. Re:Start your own business by jittles · · Score: 5, Insightful

      I'm on my third career-relevant jobs (including an internship) since graduating from college in 2010. The only time I go back further than those three jobs in my employment history is when they ask for it - then I'll include being an RA in college, being a dishwasher/delivery driver summers during college and highschool, etc. Even then, I almost never go back to my first "real" job at age 14. Every interview I've been at, they've been far more interested in projects (or even hobbies) I've done relevant to the position rather than every little bit of job and education history I have. I often omit the networking course I did during high school too just because it's small cheese compared to my more recent history and just wastes valuable space I could use for listing projects I've done more recently instead.

      Third job in less than 3 years? Wow. Why the high turnover rate? That would scare me more than a resume with a PH.D on it.

  3. Hid your PhD by Janek+Kozicki · · Score: 5, Insightful

    As much as I hate to say that, hiding a part of your education from resume (like not mentioning your PhD) is a pretty common method of getting employment. Of course with lower salary. They run screaming just because they think that they would need to pay more, because you had PhD. OTOH, I'd say it's more interesting to puruse academic career, where money is low, but at least people apprecieate how educated you really are. And you don't need to hide your PhD. That's just my opinion. And that's why I puruse this career :)

    --
    #
    #\ @ ? Colonize Mars
    #
  4. Please don't start a business by mapuche · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Not everybody has what it takes to make a successful business. And starting a company because you can't find a job won't help. If you can't find a job, hardly you will find clients.

  5. Look. Most HR types are Vogon-like idiots. by gestalt_n_pepper · · Score: 5, Funny

    Not actually evil, but bad-tempered, bureaucratic, officious and callous. In the USA, they're frequently female and quietly but intensely crazy. Forget anything rational when dealing with them. Go around them. Get your resume' to a thinking person with actual skills, common sense and the ability to do arithmetic. That person may be able to slide you around blockage of HR. Get in as a consultant or a temp and make them dependent on you. Threaten to walk if you don't get hired.

    As in most of the rest of America now, working through the system doesn't work. Adjust your thinking accordingly.

    --
    Please do not read this sig. Thank you.
    1. Re:Look. Most HR types are Vogon-like idiots. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

      That's the tell him to way, coward!

  6. Listen to your tone by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative

    I suspect it is attitude that is as much the problem as anything. While some employers do worry about over qualification, the tone of your question says "I think I'm the smartest person in the room and I'm going to be a nightmare to manage." Even in tech soft skills are hugely important.

    Thinking there was a shortage of physics PhDs shows a lack of listening and research (I say this as a physics faculty), the oversubsciption rate has been huge for ages. So I suspect this attitude (if I'm not misreading the post) has been there for a while.

    So you might really consider some classes in people skills—how to interview, how to listen and work in a team. These classes can be found in many community colleges and can be quite helpful (don't dismiss the CC classes, they can be excellent). Then I'd look for an opportunity to show teamwork and make sure you check the attitude at the door when you interview.

  7. Roll your own by holophrastic · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Stop thinking that someone else has a job for you. Start creating jobs for someone else. If you're over the age of 30, your community needs you to create jobs, not take them.

    You've got an interesting world of experience. Cross-industry experience no less. Start your own company -- don't let the big word fool you, it's meaningless. You'll pay far fewer taxes, you'll be able to get free and very inexpensive employees from schools, co-ops, interns, neighbours, and anyone willing to "start at the bottom".

    It needn't be a big company. Just you and a physical assitant is all you need. And you want the physical assistant a) so you can shift your business into a different path to be flexible in five years and b) so you can worry about business admin stuff like client relations and invoicing and c) because someone should cover for you when you're on a beach somewhere enjoying life.

    Clients don't tend to ask for credentials -- I own and run a programming company, and no client has ever asked. They ask about skills. You've got 'em.

    And since it's your business, you can get just about any client by offering to do the work and not collect any money until the end. It's only a risk if you don't know what you're doing. If you do, you manage to buy a new client with nothing more than delaying payment by a month or two. That's effectively free client acquisition.

    Dude, just dive in. Expect to pay $2'000 per year on accountants and lawyers, just to get it off your plate and so your government talks to them instead of you. You don't need insurance unless you're punching holes into walls -- and those premiums aren't a big deal either.

    Get decent business cards, and give them to your neighbours. Each of them works in an office building somewhere. And each of their employers needs networking done at some point.

    Take small jobs, they turn into big jobs. Take small clients, they turn into big clients. Take clients with bounded projects that have a start and an end. They'll become your best repeat business. Don't spend more than 25% of your typical month on a single client (with many exceptions of course).

    Small business helps small business. Talk to other small business owners. Even your competitors. It doesn't hurt my business to help my small-business competitors. It just improves both of our small businesses vs the many many others. If you've got no one to talk to, talk to me.

  8. You need to work on communications skills by enjar · · Score: 5, Insightful

    The narrative you post is extremely hard to follow and makes little sense. Let's try to decipher.

    You lost your job when then dot com bubble burst and went back to school. You finished a PhD in Physics. You then found out your were sold a bill of goods about jobs of people with PhDs in Physics and there is some sort of glut.

    Then you have been doing some sort of project management for DoD and NASA. Now is where things get really weird.

    " I desperately want back into network equipment product management, but my networking tech skills aren't up to date."

    Pulling that apart, you are talking about a job more on the business side than the technology side of the business. Technical skills are important in product management, but so is a head for business. That could be one reason that people don't "get' you -- they see that you went back to school and spent time and money on getting a PhD in Physics. You didn't go back to school to get an advanced degree in CS, EE, or a MBA. You went back for Physics and now you are trying to get into product marketing. But things get a little weirder.

    "I find networking technology absolutely trivial"

    I really, sincerely hope this is a typo. Finding something "trival" has considerable negative connotations to it, and if you say that to a hiring manager, they are going to think you are going to be just biding your time with their "trivial" nonsense product and looking to move onto something more interesting the moment it shows up. It would be better to say that you enjoy certain challenges or explain what you find interesting rather than saying something is "trivial".

    And then finally,

    "I'm more than willing to start over in network admin"

    I don't see that you need to move to this, you need to concentrate and present the skills you have and exercise in program/project management and previous skills to get into some sort of networking gig. But you do need to address some rather good questions a hiring manager would have, specifically:

    - Why did you get a doctorate in Physics when you were interested in product management?
    - What excites you about networking and product management?

    I also highly recommend that all job seekers thoroughly read and use "What Color is Your Parachute?". If nothing else, it will walk you through making a coherent case for yourself of why you want to pursue a given career, and that coherent presentation is going to make hiring managers stop running and start listening more. Right now if I was hiring a job that was responsible for setting the business direction of a networking product, I'd be worried about hiring you because your record shows you actively running from the business development aspects of your career.

    Your Physics degree is certainly not worthless and should not be hidden. You can most likely take on complicated problems, decompose them at a high level, aren't afraid of the unknown, etc. Also the fact that you finished your PhD means that you can stick with something, too.