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Lew Rockwell: Ron Paul Not Using the State or UN to Control RonPaul.Com

New submitter sbulut77 writes with a follow up to accusations Ron Paul is using the UN to gain control of ronpaul.com. "Lew Rockwell explains the RonPaul.com issue. There is so much misinformation on this topic, his blog is very welcome. His blog entry is pretty short and well-written please read the blog post directly." From the article: "Ron is not calling on the UN. ICANN has four approved arbitration organizations. Because the RP.com guys registered Ron's name in Australia, the international arbitration option must be used. Yes, it is associated with the UN. Too bad, but one must play the cards one is dealt. The UN itself is not involved, though note — whatever else is wrong with it — the UN is not a State."

13 of 232 comments (clear)

  1. So he is not using the UN, just the UN by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Just admit to being a hypocrite instead of playing semantic games.

    1. Re:So he is not using the UN, just the UN by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I'm not (wasn't?) a Ron Paul fan, or an Ayn Rand fan, but this sounds a lot more like when she collected social security payments.

      People complained that it was hypocritical, but her response was something like, "I don't think this should exist, but I'm taking what's mine." In Paul's case it's, "I don't think things should work this way, but I have to work within the system as it is."

      I mean, he probably still pays income tax like he's supposed to, too.

    2. Re:So he is not using the UN, just the UN by AlphaWolf_HK · · Score: 3, Insightful

      ICANN is a private organization, and ICANN makes it pretty clear what the rules are on domain name ownership, and what domain names can and can't be used for. That effectively, as the blog points out, makes domain names leased rather than owned (especially considering you have to pay for them each year, even if only a small amount.)

      ICANN has designated a few entities as arbiters to these rules. The UN happens to be one of them. Had ICANN made Timothy Lord one of these arbiters, then Ron Paul would have to have gone to Timothy Lord with this dispute instead of the UN. Would that mean Ron Paul, or anybody else for that matter, would be forced to recognize Timothy Lord as being an authority on global governance? I really don't think so.

      As a libertarian myself, I don't support Ron Paul. However, similar to him, I am against the UN. Some things that the UN takes into *serious* consideration are implementing global blaspheme laws and removing IANA from the US department of commerce, handing it to oversight which includes heavy influence from countries like China and Russia, who really don't like the free internet as it exists today. If a private organization like ICANN says that it won't take any action unless I talk to X entity first, then I'll oblige.

      --
      Careful with names containing L slashdot.org/~AiphaWolf_HK slashdot.org/~AlphaWoif_HK slashdot.org/~AiphaWoif_HK
    3. Re:So he is not using the UN, just the UN by jeffmeden · · Score: 4, Insightful

      her response was something like, "I don't think this should exist, but I'm taking what's mine."

      And with that one sentence she undid every single argument she stood behind. Had she truly held those beliefs, she would have proclaimed "i won't take SS because it's not mine, it is someone elses and they should be able to keep it". Instead, she responded "i will take SS because as long as someone else can get something for nothing, why the fuck shouldn't I?"

    4. Re:So he is not using the UN, just the UN by greg1104 · · Score: 1, Insightful

      If the free market value for the property was $250K, there would be multiple bidders willing to pay that amount. This case is more like extortion than it is a market. "We gots this domain with your name on it...sure would be a shame if we said bad things about you there". It is domain squatting bullshit, and they're lucky the penalty is only losing the domain. This isn't sex.com or something that has some inherent market value to multiple buyers. It's only worth anything because of the association of Ron Paul, the politician, and it's only worth >$0 to him alone.

      The sellers are playing their own semantic game, where they've only offered the sale of the domain plus their mailing list, for a large sum based on the list value. They only did that because the market value of the domain itself, the only thing Paul was interested in, is zero. They know it's not worth anything because they're bound by the domain agreement, which says you can't do the thing they did. This is more like a contract dispute than it is government involvement. The distinction is that you don't have to buy a .com domain and agree to its terms. But if you choose to do so, you then have to follow the rules you agreed to.

    5. Re:So he is not using the UN, just the UN by Desler · · Score: 5, Insightful

      So as was pointed out, she was being a hypocrite. This would be like claiming to have been an abolitionist yet owning slaves and saying "Oh well, the system allows me to do so". It's fucking bullshit.

    6. Re:So he is not using the UN, just the UN by baKanale · · Score: 3, Insightful

      While I agree that it is hypocritical to oppose a system and then turn around and surreptitiously make use of it, the "I don't think this should exist, but I'm taking what's mine" argument could be taken to mean that since she (presumably) paid into the system then she was merely retrieving what was already taken from her in the first place.

  2. Re:dishonest twat by ByOhTek · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Not to mention, he is implying that forcibly taking the domain from the group is his only/primary option, whereas they did give him a price (and a not-exorbant, given the circumstances one at that) to take it, or the option of a very large degree of use/control for free.

    He's got shreds of honesty, but they are negative valued.

    --
    Self proclaimed typo king, and inventor of the bear destroying coffee table (patent not pending).
  3. This Is Beyond Inane & Changes Nothing by eldavojohn · · Score: 5, Insightful
    Okay so I read this rebuttal and I stand by my earlier position.

    From my understanding, the group made a good faith offering of ronpaul.org to Ron Paul for free but wanted $250,000 for the commercial ronpaul.com in order to recoup the work and effort they put in. On top of that, I see nothing malicious, untruthful, slanderous or libelous on ronpaul.com -- quite the opposite! So this is how capitalism works, I have something you want and I have come to own it by legal means so it doesn't matter if it has your name on it or not. I'm sure they could drum up another person out there named Ron Paul if you want to play that game. Now, with all that said, the only option in a libertarian world is to either pay that sum, get a different URL or tell your followers to stop going to ronpaul.com. Turning to any -- and I mean ANY -- higher power to subvert that desired price is, by definition, appealing to a governing body to impose some form of regulation. And the only reason is to subvert the sale and tendering of cash from your hands to the party who has due ownership and control. Ron Paul says "Property rights are the foundation of all rights in a free society." And this is a directly contradictory action to that maxim whether he is a private citizen or not.

    Ron is not using the State to acquire RonPaul.com. He could have brought a lawsuit in US government courts, but he did not.

    Just because you use another arm or governing body instead of the official United States government does not mean you aren't using the State.

    He is seeking to have ICANN enforce its own rules against cybersquatting, including the rule against registering a famous person’s name and making money off it.

    Wait wait wait. I'm confused. You see, you're using the R word and your calling it a "rule" but I think the word that Ron Paul and most libertarians like to use is "regulation" and then they spit because it leaves a dirty taste in their mouth. What is the difference between rules against cybersquatting and government regulation? What is the difference between the New York Times using Ron Paul's name to sell newspapers and this site printing facts about him to make money? This isn't about what is right and wrong, this about the convenience of owning a domain. Ron Paul even has a different official domain, is this site parading around purporting to be the official Ron Paul domain? No? Then what exactly are your allegations?

    Anyone registering a URL agrees to keep all the rules, just as he must pay a recurring fee. A URL is not private property in the normal sense. It is a license, and ICANN is a private, non-profit organization.

    Wrong, ICANN was created to assume their responsibilities under a United States Department of Commerce contract. Haven't you been following the news where the rest of the world wants the US to give up control of ICANN? They act on the US Government's behalf. And in a libertarian world there would be no rules. Money and the free market would set the rules. In a free market you would have a whole bunch of different DNS registrars and lookup services. You could pick whichever one you liked the best. They would be for sale as entities. Big corporations could just pay them to change their DNS records to point resolution of weaker companies to their websites. When you typed in a URL it could go wherever the money tells it to go and if you don't like that, you might change to OpenDNS or someone else -- if they exist. But everyone has a price in a libertarian world. Rules are regulations and regulations are bad in a libertarian world. End of story. Rules ruin the free market. Regulations ruin capitalism and they are a hallmark of socialism.

    Ron is not calling on the UN. ICANN has four approved arbitration organizations. Because the RP.com guys registered Ron's name in Au

    --
    My work here is dung.
    1. Re:This Is Beyond Inane & Changes Nothing by Darkness404 · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Which is one of the reasons why intellectual "property" is such an absurd concept.

      Every system of property is designed with one thing in mind: Scarcity.

      If you take away scarcity, there's no need to have property. If my car could be duplicated infinitely so that anyone who wanted one could have one, imagine filing the police report:

      Me: Someone stole my car last night!
      Officer: What does your car look like?
      Me: Well, I drove it here, so take a look out in the parking lot
      Officer: So... Someone stole your car but yet it was there in the morning?
      Me: Yes!
      Officer: Was any of the gas gone?
      Me: No.
      Officer: Did the thief take anything?
      Me: No.
      Officer: Was anything broken or damaged?
      Me: No.
      Officer: So... what exactly is the crime?
      Me: But... they STOLE my car!

      The only "IP" worth having is trademarks because it prevents fraud (you can't have two game makers called Nintendo that both use the exact same logo because consumers will consistently be defrauded because there is no way to tell the two different products apart).

      --
      Taxation is legalized theft, no more, no less.
  4. No change by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Title should still read:

    "Libertarian unwilling to pay market value for property, asks for government help."

    All the semantic wrangling in the world can't get you out of the fact that Ron Paul is going to have to realize that his infantile political philosophy just doesn't work in the real world.

  5. Re:Put the straw man away by 1u3hr · · Score: 4, Insightful

    You can't call someone a hypocrite for following the same rules everyone else is currently following.

    Yes you can, if it's something he has said was morally wrong.

  6. Not enough Libertopian novels for you! by sirwired · · Score: 4, Insightful

    If you read the SF novels detailing life in Libertopia, you'll find that, as if by magic, citizens voluntarily donate enough of their income to feed, clothe, and house those that are poor through no fault of their own. They purchase, build, and staff a full parks system out of the goodness of their hearts.

    They are willing to lay their lives down, free of charge (and provide weapons and ammo, no less!) for their country/planet/space station. Everybody is cool with the idea that murder is a civil matter to be dealt with by heirs, who will gladly pay for the investigation. (And, by unspoken extension, if you don't have any heirs that like you, your life isn't worth $hit.) As long as you can pay the economic damages for your doings, well, you can pretty much do whatever you want.