Brown vs. Startup Over a Sandwich

An anonymous reader writes "Crunchbutton, founded by Yale grads, is trying to replicate the success of its one-button food delivery service in and around Brown University. The controversy began when the startup delivered a popular Brown sandwich called the 'Spicy With' to students. Brown's lawyers sent Crunchbutton a cease and desist letter, demanding that the company remove any associations with the university or its name. The startup says it has complied with the demands, yet Brown has not backed off, and it expects to be served with a lawsuit. This tale illustrates the perils of encouraging entrepreneurship while protecting the interests of a big educational institution."

Comments

Brown?

[Anonymous Coward]

Why would they name their university after the color of poop? They should have payed attention to the brown Microsoft Zune fiasco.

The decline and fall of the American Empire

[M. Baranczak]

people tend to choose the same one or two items whenever they call a particular restaurant for delivery or take-out. And restaurants tend to have a few popular items that they make particularly well. Why not match up supply and demand with a smart button that makes ordering super-simple?

For people who think that ordering food delivery is just too much work.

Re:The decline and fall of the American Empire

[gl4ss]

ordering food is one of those things that's much, much better done with a machine than with a phone.

first off, phone takes much more time. not only that, but it takes two persons time leading to one person at the sandwich place practically having to do phone duty. and since he has to do some sort of data input from mumblings of callers with bad lines, it's error prone. it's much, much simpler if the guy ordering the stuff does the data input into textual form that prints out on a slip for the cook. even simpler if he pays up front too(no joke orders).

whenever I order kebab, I do it online. much simpler for everyone involved - all the kebab/pizza places here have staff that have moved in from elsewhere - try explaining valkosipuli and jauhelihakastike to them over phone.

it's not as much about laziness as it is about getting what you actually want!

Nothing to report

[schneidafunk]

In the article, it says he complied with the legal threat and that is pretty much the end of the story. They have not been taken to court. All else in the article is just publicity for the company.

That being said, I don't see why they need to focus on campuses at all, except it's a good market for delivery & cell phone usage. There is no need for a lawsuit and they already stopped delivering food associated to Brown.

Re:Nothing to report

[Obfuscant]

Food delivery service is popular with a population of people which generally don't own cars or have the equipment, utensils and/or time to cook their own meals? Its shocking that they figured this out all on their own.

Except it isn't food delivery, it's food ordering. The delivery is still the responsibility of the restaurant. They've simply added a layer to the front end of the process that means that the restaurant doesn't have to pay someone to talk on the phone taking orders. Clean, simple. Fewer errors. Quick. Win win win.

It seems their in as good a position as ... well, Domino's and all the other services that offer pretty much the same thing.

The closest Dominos comes to this is what little they copy from Little Caesar's. I think Dominos does this now, but Little Caesar's had learned that they can make money by stocking pre-made pizza in two styles. People walk in, and instead of a five minute ordering process ("what would you like on that, would you like extra cheese, what kind of crust yada yada yada") and a ten minute wait to bake it, the customer says "pepperoni" and the guy behind the counter hands him one. Done done done.

Although, LC has started to fall back to it's old habits and is slowing the process down. "Would you like crazy bread..." Don't want. Didn't ask for. Gimme pizza. I go.

Wha... ?

[TWX]

I'm still trying to wrap my brain around this...

They do not claim to be the restaurant, they claim to be a courier service. They mention what the restaurant provides, and they create a method to allow one to use school-food-accounts to pay for it. The restaurant and thus the school still gets paid.

Then there are somewhat generic words like "Brown" and "Spicy With". I am curious as to how the school could hold on to "Spicy With" when that's a description, in the same fashion that Apple got denied trademark on "iPad Mini" because it's a description, not a name...

Re:Wha... ?

[fermion]

in a perfect world that would be ok. In the real world people complain about everything. The service opens Brown up to any number of complaints. For instance the help screen says contact the restaurant for problems with an order.This means if food does not get delivered correctly, the restaurant has to deal with it.

In addition you note that school food account is used to pay. These are often paid by their parents,so it open the school up to the most dreadful thing, parent phone calls. One imagines that there is a delivery fee, and that the delivery fee is something parents are not prepared for. Likewise, the school has a responsibility to control the use of student information. if the school does not do anything, and student information is breeched, then that is a problem for the school.

As has been mentioned, the school asked the firm to stop using the restaurant and the the business did. End fo story. Part of the problem some may be having is that students pretty much expect to do anything they want, but really they can't. There are limits. My firm to tak over the quad quad and play music all day and night to sell cds. I am clearly providing a service. I am not sure if anyone would say that I should allowed to do this.

Re:Which part has the university's name

[Anonymous Coward]

With is the official preposition of Brown University. It's on the homepage and in all their official literature. Spicy is the fencing team's mascot, a Mexican matador with a bandolier of epees.

I really don't see how this could be any clearer.

Unlikely scenario

[ArcadeMan]

Brown University sues Crunchbutton.
Crunchbutton seeks external help.
UPS sues Brown University over the "Brown" trademark.
Brown University drops lawsuit against Crunchbutton, with public apologies.
UPS drops lawsuit against Brown University, with a note saying "We'll be watching. By the way your name is now Blue University".

Re:Unlikely scenario

[bryan1945]

Duke sues UPS over "Blue."

Re:For now it looks like they may have to

[MickyTheIdiot]

asshole. Edward von Gerichten is now on the phone with every brown bag manufactuer in North America threatening trademark infringement. It's cashing in on "their good name."

Re:ooookay?

[Beardo the Bearded]

What I'd like to know is what the hell is on the sandwich?

Not everyone is from Yale and Brown, whoever wrote the summary and article.

Super Critical Details Are Super Effective

[Anonymous Coward]

Critical facts missing form the summary: The restaurant and sandwiches are owned by the university. This is not about Brown as a trademark.

Rosenblatt says he complied with these demands. On Dec. 12, he wrote an e-mail back to von Gerichten, saying as much. But the lawyer wrote back the next day, saying he ,b>still saw Brown’s product listed on Crunchbutton’s Web page and that there were indications that the campus delivery service would resume (as well as a “defamatory” statement involving liver damage). Rosenblatt wrote back disputing that there was any indication that delivery of “Spicy With” would continue, and apologizing for what he called a joke (which he said was “made in poor taste”).

Meanwhile, in late February, Crunchbutton started working with a Providence restaurant, off campus, to sell and deliver the equivalent of a “Spicy With” sandwich— “except much fresher and tastier,” says Rosenblatt.

So, rather than simply complying and ending the story there. They chose to temporarily comply and make fun of the product and circumstance. This raised the lawyer's ire, rather than diffusing the situation. Crunchbutton then responded with a lame attempt of an excuse. As if that wasn't enough, they then tried to launch another product that (whether or not is actually infringing) is a clear attempt to circumvent rights that Crunchbutton already accepted by their prior faux claims of compliance.

It is clear by their actions that Crunchbutton is willfully attempting to "ingringe", which will not put them in a favorable light when judgment comes. The only real question is if they can prove that there is CLEARLY no infringement or rights being held.

Re:Super Critical Details Are Super Effective

[mbkennel]

"infringe" on what?

App was making it easy for people to order a sandwich from Brown's cafeteria. Somehow Brown thought that was offensive and something to be stopped.

App makers respond by making it easy for people to order a similar sandwich from a different restaurant not run by Brown University. University goes apoplectic, presumably offended that the app maker didn't go out of business immediately.

Re:Super Critical Details Are Super Effective

[chrismcb]

But what are they infringing on? They are selling Brown's sandwich. They are telling people they are selling Brown's sandwich. Brown is making full profit from selling that sandwich. First Sale says I can resale it. Fair use seems to imply I can indicate it was Brown's. So what is the actual problem?

Re:ooookay?

[cayenne8]

And what does "SpicyWith" have to do with Brown or Yale.....? Is the term supposed to mean something?

Recipes are not copyrightable

[maroberts]

They're simply a list of ingredients

So you're free to make a SpicyWith. (Unless they have a trademark on SpicyWith, which is again unlikely as descriptions are not allowed)

Spicy chicken sandwich with cheese

[Anonymous Coward]

It's a spicy chicken sandwich with cheese. "Spicy With" isn't actually the name, it's just something students shout at the grill cook to save half a second.

Re:Spicy chicken sandwich with cheese

[srmalloy]

Just as you would specify 'wit' or 'witout' for whether you wanted onions on your Philly cheese steak sandwich.

Re:For now it looks like they may have to

[sjames]

I would think they'd be more pissed at Brown logistics or UPS for implying that the school is a training center for truck drivers and deliverymen.

Speculation

[Synerg1y]

1. The lawsuit is based on the student entrepreneur's "feeling", a less credible source cannot possible exist.
2. What he did is called piggybacking, businesses will go to great lengths to prevent it, in this case the business was owned by the university.

Don't get me wrong, they could've let him continue on in good faith, but it was probably inconveniencing them somehow, or the lawyer's a real asshole.

Re:I propose a new sandwich ...

[maxwell demon]

suedo sue me a sandwich

$ man suedo

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