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Google Unable To Keep Paying App Developers In Argentina

An anonymous reader writes "Google has sent letters to app developers registered in Argentina saying they won't be able to accept payments on developers' behalf after June 27th. 'The change applies to both paid apps and apps that use in-app purchases. The move appears to be related to new, restrictive regulations the Argentine government has imposed on currency exchanges.' According to the Telegraph, 'The new regulations required anyone wanting to change Argentine pesos into another currency to submit an online request for permission to AFIP, the Argentine equivalent of HM Revenue & Customs. To submit the request, however, you first needed to get a PIN from AFIP, either online or in person. Having finally obtained your number, submitted your online request and printed out your permission slip, you could then present it at the bank or official cambio and buy your dollars. Well, that was the theory. In practice, the result was chaos. ... damming the flood has come at a huge cost to the economy, especially since the currency restrictions were coupled with another set of regulations that effectively imposed a near-total ban on any imported goods.'"

18 of 169 comments (clear)

  1. Nicely done Cristina by mmarcottulio · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Cristina Kirchner, destroying Argentina since 2007.

    1. Re:Nicely done Cristina by alantus · · Score: 5, Informative

      Venezuela has had a similar currency exchange regulation system for 10 years now.
      The limits are ridiculous:
      - 400$ for traveling abroad, the paperwork has to be submitted 20 days in advance
      - 400$ for internet shopping *per year*
      - credit card usage abroad has a different limit depending on the destination and duration. On average 100$ per day, the paperwork has to be submitted 30 days in advance

      Basically the government wants to control everything, not only for businesses but also individuals, and it does a crappy job at both. The end result is investments going elsewhere and the economy suffers.

      The country has never before been in such a bad shape. Since Chavez took office, the Bolivar lost its value by 992%. This is in the country with the second biggest proven oil reserves in the world, and an oil price of more than 100$.

    2. Re:Nicely done Cristina by MightyMartian · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Yes but... look Malvinas!

      --
      The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
    3. Re:Nicely done Cristina by alexander_686 · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Yes, but it implies a very high rate of inflation. And it matters if you are trying to import anything – like toilet paper, where there has been a recent run.

    4. Re:Nicely done Cristina by Kevin+Fishburne · · Score: 3, Insightful

      My wife and her family (the latter still stuck there unfortunately) second your emotion. Reminds me of a colloquial definition of insanity that Einstein guy said once. Socialism seems like a great idea on the surface, but for whatever reason it continues to fail and is generally trumpeted by the incompetent and corrupt (sorta like capitalism, but with a greater fail coefficient).

      --
      Buy your next Linux PC at eightvirtues.com
    5. Re:Nicely done Cristina by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

      We are currently experiencing heavy scarcity on products. I can't find soap, toilet paper or powder milk.

      Welcome to socialism. -- Central Europe here, handing over to you the reins of history.

  2. Argetina today equals Brazil of 25 years ago by alexgieg · · Score: 5, Informative

    Here in Brazil we had this kind of policy in the middle '80s. It brought incalculable damage to our economy and to our global competitiveness, together with hyperinflation and other such funny stuff. We finally abandoned this idiocy in the beginning of the '90s and haven't looked back since. Too bad South American countries in general are firm believers in the "But We Are Special!" School of Economics and don't like to do basic stuff such as looking around to see what worked and what didn't to then decide on policies. Argentina is going to suffer a lot in the following years until its government learn the lesson.

    For other troubled countries to then disregard, after all, they're special too!

    --
    Conservatism: (n.) love of the existing evils. Liberalism: (n.) desire to substitute new evils for the existing ones.
    1. Re:Argetina today equals Brazil of 25 years ago by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

      I'd love to tell you more about the meaning of "kind of"

      It starts with "Don't be a pedantic idiot and consider a broader view"

    2. Re:Argetina today equals Brazil of 25 years ago by alexgieg · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Does that happen now in Brazil?

      It happened back when we didn't have a stable currency. Then we adopted policies which created a stable currency and it stopped. Amazingly, the US dollar is a stable currency. See a trend there?

      There is no problem for dolar imports, we have no permission to remove dollars from the system not otherwise.

      Yes, because adopting the economic doctrine of the 18th century (mercantilism) is smart. Here's a notion for you: there is no such thing as actually exchanging dollars for pesos. When someone who has dollars wants pesos that's for the sole purpose of purchasing stuff valued in pesos, When someone who has pesos wants dollars that's for the sole purpose of purchasing stuff valued in dollars. This means that the exchange of currencies goes like this: pesos go, meet dollars, and after a while return to Argentina where they belong; dollars go, meet pesos, and after a while return to the US, where they belong; meanwhile, stuff go from the US to Argentina and and stay in their new home, and stuff go from Argentina to the US and stay in their new home. In other words, currencies are tourists, goods are migrants. If you block one half of one side of the equation, you block the other half, and then the whole equation. The exchange of goods, which is what matters, stops both ways, and you're left with whatever exists within your country and no more. Your oligarchs, monopolies and cartels all thank you gladly, your population is left purchasing overpriced trash (but they all can work in exchange for said trash, woohoo!), and after a few years you're technologically broken.

      Have fun!

      --
      Conservatism: (n.) love of the existing evils. Liberalism: (n.) desire to substitute new evils for the existing ones.
  3. Re:Another currency? by kasperd · · Score: 4, Informative

    Couldn't they have offered to pay the developers in a different currency?

    Turns out they are sort of doing that. You just have to change which country the account is registered in.

    --

    Do you care about the security of your wireless mouse?
  4. We're from the government, and here to help you by ScentCone · · Score: 4, Informative

    Yay for protectionist, isolationist, centrally-managed, paternalistic government-crawling-up-your-pant-legs regulatory over-reach! So stimulating to the economy.

    And imagine the opportunities for bureaucratic mischief as more and more layers are added in between someone who has something to sell, and someone who wants to pay for it.

    When people complain about "big government," it's exactly this sort of (somewhat) unintended consequence and life-squashing administrative death by a thousand cuts that is really the concern. Too many byzantine rules and hoops to jump through, with too many low-level, unaccountable functionaries being gatekeepers in their own little fiefdoms. In the US, it looks like the IRS's increasing ugliness (to say nothing of what it will look like when they're policing everyone's individual compliance with ObamaCare requirements).

    Domestically, this is what's being referred to as the rise of the Fourth Branch. And it's deadly.

    --
    Don't disappoint your bird dog. Go to the range.
    1. Re:We're from the government, and here to help you by paulpach · · Score: 4, Interesting

      It is even worse in Venezuela,

      The government printed money like crazy which caused really high inflation. So how does the government fight inflation? they add price control, which causes scarcity, and currency control which kills imports. Here is a video showing people that got wind that there was corn meal, chicken and some other products in a supermarket

    2. Re:We're from the government, and here to help you by ElusiveJoe · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Governments exists solely for oppressing people, making sure they are "in line". There is no such thing as government that serves the people, by definition. It's the people which serve and obey the government.

  5. Summary is Crap by goruka · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I live over there. Here's what's going on, I'll try to explain it because even fellow Argentinians don't really understand:

    Argentina is a country that is very culturally different to the rest of Latin America, and even the world and likely the right place to look at when you want to see the results of a government being more involved instead of less. By the time of the second world war, Peron did a deep change to the country, created public health, public education (made public university free), public retirement funds, changed labor laws to highly benefit the employees (employeers must pay them many sort of benefits and can't fire them without paying compensation), etc.

    Peron tried to made it clear that he wasn't going towards fascism/socialism/communism, but his model was more of creating a capitalism with more social equity through the intervention of the government. Most of the "upper class" did naturally not like this and tried to fight this by financing coup d'etats by the military (It's a little more complex than, but that goes beyond what i'm trying to explain and there's plenty of material to read about dictatorships in Latin America).

    My point is that Argentinians are sort of "spoiled" and that has even been transmitted from generation to generation. There is this strange belief that everything that happens is the fault of the government, and that the government should take care of it.

    For example, beyond public health, retirement, education, etc. If you are homeless, the government will build you a house. If you are poor and your children can't study, the government will give you money to send them to school. If you are unemployed, you just receive money. Transport is dirt cheap because it's subsidized too, some products are price-fixed to be made more accessible and now the government is even making a line of clothes that is more cheaper and accessible.

    The government spends a fortune in social help and taxes are high as the result. But it goes beyond that. The economic model is also designed to ensure that unemployment is really low. They do this by forcing people to spend their money and not keep it, so there is constant inflation and purchasing foreign currency is forbidden. By spending the earned money constantly, the local economy is always very active, restaurants are packed full, and everyone is using credits to buy stuff.

    The right wing media opposition to the government is strong and focuses on mainly on corruption and insecurity, to make people feel they are being constantly robbed and freak them out. However, people is employed and is earning decently nowadays so this has a limited effect, which gives place to the saying ("roban pero hacen", translated to "they might steal but they still do for the country") Even the media themselves know they can't mention anything related to a right wing point of view (less state intervention) or people will label them as traitors.

    So the big question is if economical stability by this means are worthy. Buenos Aires is a production powerhouse and generates a lot of income, but there is a large part of the population that would not be able to be sustained in a more open economy. As a result, the country is very closed do the rest of the world economy. The rest of the world isn't very healthy economically either.

    What's going on with Google is really nothing new. It's extremely hard for Argentinians to be entrepreneurs in this context, so we just open offshore companies in Panama, Delaware or other places and get paid there (otherwise we can't get get paid in us dollars or euros), then transfer our money to the country either illegally (black market price is higher), or legally (needed if you run a company and need to pay your employees). It's not impossible, just harder.

    1. Re:Summary is Crap by SEE · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Corrected version of above:

      Argentina is likely the right place to look at when you want to see the results of a government being more involved instead of less. Shocked by the Great Depression, like many other countries Argentina turned to a strongman. Once in power, Peron did a deep change to the country, and Argentina swiftly fell from being one of the wealthiest countries in the world to a basket case. Now, instead of being as rich per capita as the US or Switzerland (like it was in the 1920s), it's in the same economic class as Russia and Botswana.

      Despite this abject failure, the media can't point this out, because people will label them as traitors. It's extremely hard for Argentinians to be entrepreneurs in this context of unremediated Peronism, which has wrecked the Argentine economy.

    2. Re:Summary is Crap by GNUALMAFUERTE · · Score: 4, Informative

      THIS. I own a software company in Argentina. We used to design our own hardware too, and we manufactured overseas. We did some manufacturing and all of the assembling in Argentina. We were steadily moving towards more local manufacturing. The low Shenzhen prices made it hard, but we where making progress in that direction. All of a sudden, getting dollars and sending them overseas was more expensive and harder every month. Then the overreach of non-automatic licenses destroyed us (you have to request permission 90 days in advance to maybe get a limited import quota of certain items). In the meanwhile, the big hardware stores (Garbarino, Fravega, etc.) continued to bring all-chinese products into the country without issues, even those competing with our products. We had to shut down most of our hardware operations. We put more emphasis on our SAS products. We almost went bankrupt several times, in the end, we made it, but it left us weak and in debt. Some of that debt where taxes. They quickly froze our accounts and took their toll. We've paid most of it, and we're growing again. Well, until the government decides to change the rules in favor of the owners of this country again.

      I hear people accusing the Kirschner administracion of being socialists. This isn't fucking socialism, this is a systematic plan to destroy what's left of our economy, while spending more and more money every day on free lunches for the unwashed masses that keep voting for this fucking stupid cunt.

      I will be very fucking surprised if anything is left after this bastards are done with our country.

      --
      WTF am I doing replying to an AC at 5 A.M on a Friday night?
  6. Re:Another currency? by NFN_NLN · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Or just a field which said "bank account". Currency is not really an important factor.

    If you don't get paid in your bank accounts native currency they nickle and dime you on the exchange rate; so it does matter.

    I have multiple accounts at the same bank in different currencies. I direct funds based on the currency and do bulk exchanges ONLY if I need to and at a time when the rate is desirable.

  7. Pay them in Bitcoin. by beltsbear · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Problem solved.

    Seriously. It is better then having nothing and it is possible the dev could actually cash it in. Bigger devs could have an overseas bank account and get payment into that. Smaller devs could get products delivered to them internationally. It does not solve every problem, but it is better then no payment.