Slashdot Mirror


Boeing 777 Crashes At San Francisco Airport

Asiana Flight 214 from Seoul crashed while landing at San Francisco Airport today. Early reports suggest the plane was unstable as it touched down, which led to the tail of the plane breaking off. There are no official casualty reports yet, but passengers were seen walking off the plane. Preliminary estimates say one or two dead and 75 being transported to area hospitals. (Others are reporting two dead and several dozen injured.) Eyewitness report: "You heard a pop and you immediately saw a large, brief fireball that came out from underneath the aircraft," Anthony Castorani said on CNN. "At that moment, you could see that that aircraft was again starting to lift and it began to cartwheel [Ed: he likely means spinning horizontally, like a top]. The wing broke off on the left hand side. You could see the tail immediately fly off of the aircraft. As the aircraft cartwheeled, it then landed down and the other wing had broken." The media has estimated about 290 people were on board the plane. The top of the cabin was aflame at one point, but it's not known yet whether that affected the passengers. "Federal sources told NBC News that there was no indication of terrorism." Some images from the news make it look like the plane may have tried to touch down too early, hitting the seawall just before the runway.

13 of 506 comments (clear)

  1. Photo by Black+Parrot · · Score: 4, Informative

    http://thinkprogress.org/wp-content/uploads/2013/07/SFO_crash-e1373139561971.png

    Shows it upright, with at least one wing still attached.

    --
    Sheesh, evil *and* a jerk. -- Jade
  2. Re:"Crashes in"? by sarysa · · Score: 4, Informative

    Just to elaborate even more (edit function please), anyone who lives around SF and flies knows that the airport is 10 miles south of the city. So an airplane crashing within city limits would be extremely bizarre. Very little air traffic is actually routed through the city...in fact I think most planes that fly overhead are ads for car insurance companies and tires during baseball games.

    --
    Charisma is the measure of someone's ability to lie with a straight face.
  3. Survivor Story by XiaoMing · · Score: 4, Informative

    Samsun Exec. David Eun survives, posts pic. Then proceeds to teach CNN some manners.

    1. Re:Survivor Story by XiaoMing · · Score: 4, Informative

      Then proceeds to teach CNN some manners

      They wanted to talk to him about the crash and he said he didn't want to divert attention away from the crash. I'm not even sure what that means.

      If you've watched any of what passes for "news" at all today, it's full of talking heads speculating on every possible thing, from the myriad of ways people could have died (ranging from blunt trauma to smoke inhalation because gee fucking golly, the plane carries so many people it must have taken forever to get everyone off and who knows what happens to your lungs in that type of environment!) to just who's fault it could have been that it went down in the first place. And that's all from aerial helicopter footage and an interview with an idiot who used to in some way work with traffic control.

      Now can you just imagine what would happen if they got even the slightest tidbit of first-hand information? Oh wait you don't have to, there are half a dozen 5-star "informative" threads on here already discussing just why the plane's wing was or wasn't sheared off while doing some kind of barrel roll a-la Starfox64.

      So yeah, when this guy posts as much information as he feels confident doing, including a very uplifting and hopeful picture immediately after the crash showing survivors leaving what looks to be a mostly intact plane, and then doesn't feed the media's desperate attempt to capitalize on the situation any more than they already have been, I am kinda grateful.

  4. No, the wings didn't break off by Animats · · Score: 4, Informative

    The tail broke off, not the wings. And the aircraft didn't "cartwheel". There are many good pictures of the wreckage. The wreckage is sitting on the ground alongside the runway, right side up, wings intact, on its belly. The tail assembly is completely detached from the plane. Much fire damage to the top of the fuselage, which is puzzling.

    There are pictures of the passengers evacuating, including, inevitably, one of the passengers who just evacuated taking pictures of the plane.

    Too early to discuss causes. Reports indicate the plane landed short in an nose-up attitude, but it's too early to say why.

  5. Re:No Cartwheeling by Solandri · · Score: 4, Informative

    Pictures show the aircraft sat on the ground with the tail missing and the forward roof burnt out but it certainly did NOT cartwheel or bits would be scattered down the runway.

    There are actually bits of debris on the runway starting almost with the rocks separating the runway from the bay. The integrity of the fuselage says it did not cartwheel (objects this big don't move in one piece like the movies - they'll disintegrate with just moderate lateral forces). But the debris trail and missing tail suggest it came down at a high angle of attack hitting tail-first possibly from a stall (in a regular landing you hit landing gear-first), then hit the ground hard enough to collapse its landing gear and skid off the runway. The jagged yellow partial dome you see at the tail end of the fuselage is the plane's aft pressure bulkhead - the end of the pressurized section of the fuselage. So nobody was in the tail portion which broke off.

    The high AOA suggests the pilot was pulling up trying to gain altitude (or at least decrease the rate he was losing it). Possible reasons are an engine problem (with inadequate thrust, pilot was trying desperately to glide a little further to make the runway) or some failure of the flaps (if they retract, they increase the plane's stall speed possibly causing the plane to drop out of the air). Or wind shear (sudden tailwind deprives the plane of lift and pilot pulls up to try to maintain altitude - unlikely given the weather). Or pilot error (was coming in too high and tried to bleed altitude too quickly, instead of declaring a missed approach and trying again), though the tail striking short of the runway makes this unlikely unless the pilot accidentally put the plane into a stall.

  6. Re:Open airplanes by tibit · · Score: 4, Informative

    Unfortunately, most airplane accidents and incidents are due to pilot error, ATC error and maintenance mechanic error (I think in this order). Problems with hardware or firmware that are unrecoverable in spite of following proper procedures are pretty damn rare. For example, AF447 was not directly caused by any hardware failing - it was due to the pilots not following procedures and good practice.

    --
    A successful API design takes a mixture of software design and pedagogy.
  7. Re:Pilot error? by tibit · · Score: 4, Informative

    I'm not aware of any passenger aircraft that has such a fly by wire system.

    Well, that's your problem, then, since autoland has been around for a while and I have been through a zero visibility autoland landing all the way down to the runway. On exiting the plane, I've asked the first officer if they did it manually or using autoland, she said autoland. It was a by-the-book landing, by the way, as far as I could tell. Very smooth.I could tell it was a bit of a crab landing since the nose swayed right as soon as the main gear touched down. So, it was autoland with side wind, too.

    --
    A successful API design takes a mixture of software design and pedagogy.
  8. Re:Pilot error? by TubeSteak · · Score: 4, Informative

    It is not used during take off or landing, and although either could be handled by computer, I'm not aware of any passenger aircraft that has such a fly by wire system. All of them are on the drawing board.

    Autoland systems were developed in the 40s and perfected in the 60s by the Brits.
    Developed for military purposes and then perfected for commercial purposes because England had endless problems with zero visibility due to their fog + pollution.

    Autoland systems are so accurate that a fudge factor was added in, since multiple aircraft will all land on the exact same patch of runway and destroy the surface.
    I can't say why you're "not aware of any passenger aircraft that has such a fly by wire system."

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Autoland
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Instrument_landing_system#Special_CAT_II_and_CAT_III_operations

    --
    [Fuck Beta]
    o0t!
  9. Re:Open airplanes by Jodka · · Score: 4, Informative

    This is the problem with non-free airplanes. If the blueprints had been free under a freedom preserving license I'm sure the problem that caused the hiccup had been found.

    . . . and the plane could have been printed on an off the shelf 3D printer . . .

    . . .and from the MakerPlane website:
    "MakerPlane is an open source aviation organization which will enable people to build and fly their own safe, high quality, reasonable cost plane using advanced personal manufacturing equipment such as...3D printers."

    --
    Ceci n'est pas une signature.
  10. Re:"Crashes in"? by osu-neko · · Score: 5, Informative

    For anyone confused by this comment, the original title of this article (before an editor stepped in and fixed it) read "Boeing 777 Crashes In San Francisco". The current title (at the time I'm posting this comment), "Boeing 777 Crashes At San Francisco Airport", is a much better description of the event without taking the mind in some horrific directions before giving the important details.

    --
    "Convictions are more dangerous enemies of truth than lies."
  11. Re:Pilot error? by Anaerin · · Score: 4, Informative

    The pilot HAD to manual land, the ILS system and PAPI glidepath height assistance for runway 28L (and 28R) at SFO is down, as reported in the current NOTAMs(Check for SFO)

    !SFO 06/005 (KSFO A1056/13) SFO NAV ILS RWY 28L GP OTS WEF 1306011400-1308222359
    !SFO 07/046 (KSFO A1326/13) SFO RWY 28L PAPI OTS WEF 1307062219

    That means he was relying on nav beacons and glidepath estimates to come in. Given that SFO's beacons are approx 1.2 miles apart, if he picked the wrong beacon to guild his descent he would have been too high, dropped steeper than usual to get down once he noticed the discrepancy, and didn't have the necessary power to flare and ascend at the end of the runway, so he tailstruck. That makes it pilot error, but confounded and mitigated by most (if not all) the regular guidance and assistance systems they rely on being out of commission.

  12. Re:Pilot error? by dgatwood · · Score: 4, Informative

    Citation: takeoffaviationweather.com. The relevant bits:

    KSFO

    28 NAVAID Instrument Landing System Runway 28L Glide Path out of service started about 1 month ago ending in about 1 month
    28 NAVAID Localizer Type Directional Aid Runway 28R Glide Path out of service started about 1 month ago ending in about 1 month
    28 NAVAID Instrument Landing System Runway 28R Glide Path out of service started about 1 month ago ending in about 1 month
    23 NAVAID Instrument Landing System Runway 28R Inner Marker out of service until Aug 22 23:59
    20 NAVAID Instrument Landing System Runway 28R Category 2/3 Not Authorized started about 1 month ago ending in about 1 month

    Emphasis mine.

    --

    Check out my sci-fi/humor trilogy at PatriotsBooks.