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Why PBS Won't Do Android

bogaboga writes "You might be wondering why the U.S. Public Broadcasting Service doesn't have a compelling Android footprint. I was wondering too; until they provided the answer. They say, 'Simply put, it’s too complicated for us to even consider an Android app for the first version; we’ll continue to support those viewers with mobile web. ... As we’re focused on the tablet for this project, we’re only designing for the larger screen sizes. But even there, there are a wide range of sizes and aspect ratios. It’s possible to build flexible sizing for these screen layouts, just as we do for the range of desktop web screen sizes. But the flip side to these wide variations is that in a touch experience, ergonomics plays an important role in the design. Navigational elements need to be within easy reach of the edges of the screens since people often are holding their tablets. If the experience is not fine-tuned to each variation the experience would suffer.' They also cite fragmentation. I'm left wondering whether they didn't find support for various screen sizes on Android developer website. Their budget is undoubtedly limited; are their concerns legit? What companies and organizations have developed Android applications that are good to work with on various screen sizes?"

18 of 331 comments (clear)

  1. The perfect is the enemy of the good. by jedidiah · · Score: 4, Insightful

    This mentality is not uncommon. Someone will see that there might be a problem somewhere and conclude that because they cannot have their vision of perfection, that they simply won't try at all. Consider this a victory for all of those screetching fanboys. They have achieved their desired result: FUD.

    It doesn't have to be perfect. It needs to be useful.

    --
    A Pirate and a Puritan look the same on a balance sheet.
    1. Re:The perfect is the enemy of the good. by extra88 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      In that case their mobile web presence has the Android devices covered. It's not perfect but it is useful so why make a native app?

    2. Re:The perfect is the enemy of the good. by BasilBrush · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Because user expectations of native apps are higher than those of web apps.

      Users accept when top level UI elements of a web app scroll. They don't accept that with a native app. When was the last time you saw a native app scroll it's primary menu off the top of the screen for example. Most web apps do.

    3. Re:The perfect is the enemy of the good. by Randle_Revar · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Personally, I wish all mobile apps for websites would die horribly. Mobile web works, and works pretty much everywhere.

    4. Re:The perfect is the enemy of the good. by timeOday · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Calling an API to get the screen size is the easy part; making a good layout is the hard part. There was a time when everybody thought information and presentation should be separated, and layout should be left to algorithms. Well, that idea failed. MS Word dominated TeX; "Write once, run anywhere" Java applications supporting the PC and handhelds with the same interface were duds; "Mobile Web" split off from the original (PC) Web, and "apps" split off from Mobile Web. To suggest the issue is limited to "incompetent" devs at PBS is just silly.

    5. Re:The perfect is the enemy of the good. by RCL · · Score: 5, Insightful

      People will eventually learn to treat Android devices the same way as PCs. Nobody is voicing concerns regarding variety of PC resolutions (or even number of monitors), nobody suggests testing on thousands of "PC devices" out there. Android is the new PC.

    6. Re:The perfect is the enemy of the good. by murdocj · · Score: 4, Insightful

      But in the case of PCs, the variation is from "plenty big enough" to enormous. You can aim at the lowest common denominator on the PC and it's fine, and if the user has more real estate, great. On phones, you really have to take advantage of the space the machine gives you.

    7. Re:The perfect is the enemy of the good. by DerekLyons · · Score: 4, Insightful

      (Confusion between firmware vs. os version, etc. Keep in mind we are game devs not programmers.)

      The mind boggles, not only that a place developing games for computers has no programmers on staff - but that they fail to see this as a problem. Worse yet, they think that programmers *are* the problem.

  2. So, rolling their own, with no experience then... by icebike · · Score: 4, Insightful

    This sounds like they have zero experience in application design, much less for mobile devices, and never learned a thing about hardware abstraction, and are trying to micromanage the interface. Sounds like they even skipped web design, and are coming directly from the printed page mind-set.

    My god, people, go out and hire an app developer, they are a dime a dozen, and every two bit Newspaper, TV station, TV-Network, football team, Grocery Chain, Department store, and gossip site has an app. They can be cookie cutter-ed from existing apps in less than a couple weeks by people who do this for a living. Stop hiring, and write a contract. Apps like these aren't that hard.

    --
    Sig Battery depleted. Reverting to safe mode.
  3. I understand their pain by Shifty0x88 · · Score: 5, Insightful

    As an Android and iOS developer, it is tough to support all possible screen sizes, aspect ratios, hardware specs and versions of Android. Sometimes not having a newer version of Android(>= 4.0) you miss a lot of features that people come to expect and your code is riddle with backwards compatibility stuff just to support Gingerbread, or worse(ie: Donut).

    Of course, it doesn't help that Google just made the Action Bar part of the backwards compatibility package, after all of this time not supporting it and saying just use the Sherlock library, which has it's own share of complications and headaches.

    With videos it's even harder, my new phone only records in *.3gp files(for video, Razr Maxx HD), which means you have to have more transcoding on the backend to make it available to others.

    And then you have the Note and Note 2 which are just mini-tablets and not really phone sized anymore. And the lack of support in Android(which iOS has btw) to figure out if you are on a phone or not, really hurts the user experience.

    The cost is great, and the hassle is hard to justify, so with a fixed budget I am not surprised they aren't developing for it just yet.

    And think even with the fragmentation going on the iOS land, they still only have like 5 screen sizes to worry about (in the tablet area), so you can really tweak the user-experience on each version of the iPad/iPad mini to make the most of the real estate and hardware. Plus they all share a common base with most of the features already there, so it makes it easier to program for, and less backwards-compatibility stuff in your code to mess with and support

    1. Re:I understand their pain by hsmith · · Score: 4, Insightful

      It is always a hoot to read these type of stories. You have the "zomg it isn't that hard" folk come in and tell us all how easy it is. write once, run everywhere! - it is painfully obvious they haven't written an Android App beyond "Hello World."

      Weren't we all promised that back when Java was up and coming and how well did that work?

      But, those like you that have done both (and myself) realize how much of a fricking pain Android is to develop on. You can even have the same exact phone with different carriers and experience different issues. I don't know why Google doesn't restrict the rights to license the Android name more, to only phones that implement the APIs exactly as they should on the phone.. It is an absolute pain to debug Android issues.

      Writing Android Apps is a breeze, I enjoy it. It is an issue when you go to QA them that you run into issues...

    2. Re:I understand their pain by rhysweatherley · · Score: 4, Insightful

      As an Android and iOS developer, it is tough to support all possible screen sizes, aspect ratios, hardware specs and versions of Android. Sometimes not having a newer version of Android(>= 4.0) you miss a lot of features that people come to expect and your code is riddle with backwards compatibility stuff just to support Gingerbread, or worse(ie: Donut).

      And none of this would be a problem if PBS would simply publish the specification for whatever JSON/XML/etc back end they are using to transmit information to the clients about shows and episodes, and use standard RFC-compatible video formats and streaming protocols with no DRM or other nonsense.

      Why would it not be a problem? Because the next day the app stores would be full of "SparkleVideoPlayer now supports PBS!" updates for all of the existing streaming video apps and their loyal users. Or if my screen size, aspect ratio, blah, blah, blah is not supported, I can write my own app!

      I can understand why the commercial TV outfits want to control everything - they think it's the only way to poison the experience with ads. But why are public broadcasters like PBS, BBC, and Australia's ABC doling the same thing? It's idiotic - the solution to "how do I support a million devices" is simple: "publish the spec so that the taxpaying public can write their own apps".

  4. Re:So, rolling their own, with no experience then. by formfeed · · Score: 5, Insightful

    This sounds like they have zero experience in application design,
    ... and are trying to micromanage the interface. .

    Most likely:
    no
    and yes

    Sounds to me like designers talking. People who come from graphic design or ad-agencies and now do web design / interface design.

    They usually want to micromanage the rendering. Because it has to look exactly as designed. Not just an interface with four buttons, but four buttons spaced in a perfectly pleasing way, perfect white space to text ratio, and please no substitute font! (Oh no, just the idea of that makes my black turtleneck crinkle.)

  5. Reality is not FUD by SuperKendall · · Score: 5, Insightful

    they are also repeating their FUD

    No, it's that after actually examining real technical issues they found the FUD was not FUD at all, but a reality based concern where web apps on Android was the only feasible approach given the funds they had.

    I am surprised more companies don't go the web route to support android - responsive design helps address the broad scale with many small increments, and Google has focused a ton on Chrome speed improvements over the ability to update older systems with newer development frameworks.

    --
    "There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
    1. Re:Reality is not FUD by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Personally, I wish more places stayed with websites instead of apps. I don't want to download an app for every place I could just visit on the web.

  6. Re:Back up... Why would PBS write an app? by pspahn · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Oh, nonsense. I've been watching PBS shows online for what, eight years now? The quality of their programs are top notch.

    If you watch, for instance, a recent episode of Nature, there will be a quick 15 second ad at the beginning, and another 15 second ad somewhere around the halfway point. That's it. That's a hell of a deal considering the amount of ads that are played on Hulu (a paid-for service) dwarf what are shown on PBS, and they're all for Viagra to boot.

    Does PBS nag a little bit sometimes to try and persuade users to donate? Sure, of course they do, but the best persuasion is the quality of their programming. Frontline, Nova, and Nature are probably three of the best programs in the world.

    --
    Someone flopped a steamer in the gene pool.
  7. Re:So, rolling their own, with no experience then. by BasilBrush · · Score: 5, Insightful

    My god, people, go out and hire an app developer

    I'm a mobile app developer of 16 years standing, and programmer for more than 30 years. And I'm with him and not you. You don't know what you are talking about.

    Sure it's easy to make a good desktop app with a arbitrarily resizable interface. And it's easy to make a poor mobile app with a arbitrarily resizable interface.

    But the best mobile apps ARE designed for fixed size screens. That's because the screen size is small compared to the size of the minimum UI element (dictated by the size of a fingertip. Quite simply screen space is at a premium. Not only does the optimum specific arrangement of UI elements vary, the optimum UI hierarchy varies. Screen designs are best when a designer considers the specific sizes. Auto layout is a always a compromise, and one that gets worse the smaller the screens in question,

    They can be cookie cutter-ed from existing apps in less than a couple weeks by people who do this for a living. Apps like these aren't that hard.

    The answer here is that your standards are low. That's why you think auto-layout is good enough. His opinion differs not because he knows less than you, but because his standards are higher.

  8. Re:Mobile apps and screen sizes, legit problem by droopycom · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Tiny screen? Tiny buttons. Tiny text.

    Big screen? Big buttons. Big text.

    That's a really stupid design concept.

    Ideally, on touchscreen devices:
    - The right size for buttons is about the size of my finger (Which is fairly constant for most humans)
    - The right location for buttons is where my finger can reach it easily. (Again, fairly constant for most humans)
    - The right size for text is so it's readable. (That can be quite variable for many humans, and also depend on screen resolution and technology)

    If I have a bigger screen, I want to display more information, rather than display the same amount of information in a bigger text.
    Also if the designer is really dumb and scale everything to full screen, then aspect ratio is messed up and the pictures look weird

    Web sites are sometime hard to use on phones because it's hard to click on links, which are buttons the same size as text. My eyes have better definition than my finger. Phone apps that are not optimized for tablets are wasting the tablet potential.
    Running an phone app on a desktop machine is usually a terrible experience.

    Apple didnt solve that problem any more than Android, they just have less of it. But they do have that same problem for iPad vs iPad mini. Some apps are harder to use on mini because buttons and texts were sized for the big ipads.

    Websites can usually achieve useful compromises.