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NSA Scraping Buddy Lists and Address Books From Live Internet Traffic

Charliemopps writes that the Washington Post reports "The NSA is collecting hundreds of millions of contact lists from all over the world, many of them belonging to Americans. The intercept them from instant messaging services as they move across global data links. The NSA is gathering contact lists in large numbers that amount to a sizable fraction of the world's e-mail and instant messaging accounts." According to the leaked document (original as a PDF), the NSA is intercepting some chat protocols and at least IMAP, and then analyzing the data for buddy list information and inbox contents.

20 of 188 comments (clear)

  1. Raspberry Pi to the rescue! by Noryungi · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Host your own email server on a Pi. Encrypt everything. Go back to Fidonet or even to snail mail.

    I am in the process of doing just that.

    --
    The right to offend is far more important than the right not to be offended. (Rowan Atkinson)
    1. Re:Raspberry Pi to the rescue! by rasmusbr · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Great idea, now all we need is to found a nation based on Raspberry Pi ownership and/or the ability to host your own servers for email and other communication, outlaw communication with foreigners, and then we should be all set!

      The world could really use someone or some corporation with lots of resources and no ties to government to fund, and fund indefinitely, an effort at remaking the internet from the ground up. I just can't think of who or what that someone is.

      Trying to do it yourself is pointless.

    2. Re:Raspberry Pi to the rescue! by N0Man74 · · Score: 3, Informative

      As long as you don't transfer your data through sneakernet stored on your phone in the 44 states that allow this without a warrant...

      http://truth-out.org/opinion/item/18983-police-can-search-your-phone-without-a-warrant

    3. Re:Raspberry Pi to the rescue! by Wycliffe · · Score: 3, Interesting

      >
      > In fact, given that routing tables grow exponentially, is it even theoretically possible for a full peer-to-peer Internet scale mesh to work?
      >

      If current routing tables can't scale then maybe a different type of routing table or a different solution entirely is needed.
      For instance if every router was location aware and knew it's geographic location and the geographic location of the place it was
      trying to reach it could send the encrypted packet in the general direction with the knowledge that each node would get it
      one step physically closer to it's destination. Large hops is still a problem but large hops is really only a problem with stuff
      that needs to be close to real-time. For email this isn't really much of a problem as even a 5-10 minute delay or longer isn't
      really a big deal.

  2. Foreigners by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I am so sick of hearing this idea that just because I am not a citizen of the USA then somehow I have less rights to privacy.

    1. Re:Foreigners by Noryungi · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Then do something about it and stop using US-based web services.

      --
      The right to offend is far more important than the right not to be offended. (Rowan Atkinson)
    2. Re:Foreigners by MickyTheIdiot · · Score: 3, Insightful

      You have *less* rights to privacy than a USA citizen? In this case of privacy is there a number less than zero?

      The USA citizen that has no special associations is a peon, pal. We're in the same boat.

    3. Re:Foreigners by Noryungi · · Score: 3, Insightful

      I guess your privacy zero when the Secret Police comes up to your door to arrest you in the middle of the night.

      This has happened before, in Europe and in many other countries around the globe.

      Funny thing is, the Secret Police was often financed, equipped and trained by the CIA.

      --
      The right to offend is far more important than the right not to be offended. (Rowan Atkinson)
    4. Re:Foreigners by Aguazul2 · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Then do something about it and stop using US-based web services.

      Also European and Australian ones, in fact any web services that are in a country where there is an NSA-affiliated tap point, or where your traffic crosses one of those countries. In fact, if you are a 'foreigner' best disconnect completely and go live in a cave -- but not one dug by the CIA because then you're a terrorist and we will send drones.

    5. Re:Foreigners by s122604 · · Score: 5, Funny

      You sound angry. I'm glad my NSA is keeping tabs on you, who knows what you are capable of.

    6. Re:Foreigners by IamTheRealMike · · Score: 4, Informative

      The article explicitly says this does not appear to be based on the co-operation of US providers but rather international fibre taps - presumably placed or operated by compliant intelligence agencies that are merely extensions of the NSA. The US might be a ringleader in this activity, but other countries have out of control security services as well. After a long period of political silence in the UK we finally got some discussion this week, after senior cabinet members who served on the national security committees admitted they had no clue anything like that was happening. Cameron's response was priceless, he said the agencies would have told them about it if they'd asked!

    7. Re:Foreigners by Sockatume · · Score: 3, Interesting

      The US government doesn't have any special obligations with regards to not stabbing every non-American in the world with a pencil, but that doesn't mean that it's acceptable for them to do so.

      --
      No kidding!!! What do you say at this point?
  3. Re:Isn't it ironic by durin · · Score: 4, Insightful

    "I want the good guys to win."

    And you think the NSA and the US government are the good guys?

    Agh! The stupid! It burns!

    --
    Why, yes! I AM new here.
  4. Re:Isn't it ironic by lightknight · · Score: 4, Insightful

    You seem to assume that the choices are mutually exclusive: Soviet KGB-style interrogations and intelligence, or total Anarchy.

    I ask you, why did we even fight the Cold War, and win it, if we were just going to embrace everything at a later time?

    --
    I am John Hurt.
  5. Most transparent administration ever by GoChickenFat · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I guess "most transparent" actually referred to us and not the government.

  6. Re:Isn't it ironic by jigawatt · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I'm a Canadian, but I support the NSA, and the job it does to protect American (and indirectly) Canadian interests.

    "But it was all right, everything was all right, the struggle was finished. He had won the victory over himself. He loved Big Brother."

  7. Clapper... by surfdaddy · · Score: 3, Interesting
    Clapper was the guy who lied to Congress, saying that the NSA was NOT collecting data or spying on US citizens.

    What the FUCK has happened to this country?

    1. Re:Clapper... by bigtrike · · Score: 4, Informative

      For people who aren't aware:
      "I responded in what I thought was the most truthful, or least untruthful manner by saying no."

      http://www.nbcumv.com/mediavillage/networks/nbcnews/pressreleases?pr=contents/press-releases/2013/06/09/nbcnewsexclusiv1370799482417.xml

  8. Re:Isn't it ironic by Ogi_UnixNut · · Score: 4, Interesting

    I ask you, why did we even fight the Cold War, and win it, if we were just going to embrace everything at a later time?

    You are making the mistake of assuming that the cold war was fought between lovers of freedom, democracy and individual rights, vs totalitarian all controlling power hungry nut jobs.

    Truth of the matter is, both sides were all controlling power-hungry nut jobs, and the cold war was a fight over who gets to be the all-controlling big-daddy of the world.

    The problems with the Soviets is that they laid their system bare, they didn't bullshit. This is how life is, these are your rights, if you're a party member, or if you work to benefit the system, you will be rewarded with perks (Nicer houses, cushy jobs , nice car, sometimes even nice German/American ones).
    If you don't work for the system, but not actively against it, you are pretty much left to your own devices, live and let live, and all that.
    If you work against the system, directly or indirectly (or you piss off someone in power), then you can be arrested, tried, stuck in prison/work camp, or otherwise disappear.

    Now the western system, that was far more subtle. They told you you were free, they gave you the impression you were, that you could choose who ruled you, but fundamentally I don't think the systems were different, like so:
    If you work for the system, or to its benefits, you are rewarded with more tokens than most (currency) with which you can spend on bigger/nicer houses, or a nice foreign car, etc...
    If you ignore the system and go about your daily life, you are pretty much left alone. You earn your keeps, pay your dues, and you live you life.
    If you work against the system, directly or indirectly (or just piss off someone high up and well connected), you can be arrested, tried, put in a prison/work camp, or disappeared (via drone or otherwise). For minor misdemeanors they can just destroy you financially, which is another, less radical lever they have against you.

    Turns out, when push comes to shove, people are more willing to serve you if you give them the illusion of freedom, choice and power. One ideology was in your face, the other was in the background. Turns out this worked well for a long time, until the internet came around and made knowledge dissipation so easy, that people began to realise what their world really looks like.

    For some the revelations were not a surprise, for others it was a confirmation of what they suspected, but some are in shock about it all, and more are in denial about it.

  9. It shouldn't matter, but it does. by aclarke · · Score: 3, Insightful

    If this is the case, why is it that most of these articles use phrases like "many of them belonging to Americans"? If it doesn't matter, why is the point made? The answer, of course, is that it does matter. That is, it matters to American law. For reference, see https://www.aclu.org/nsa-surveillance-procedures and highlight the word "Americans".

    Speaking as a non-American, I think it shouldn't matter whether I'm American, Austrian, or Azerbaijani. We're all human and we all have the same rights. I find it offensive when I read these articles and there's always the "including Americans" tagged onto the article headline, like somehow it's OK if it's done to non-Americans. I realize it wouldn't be much different if any other country had been caught with their pants down. It's just that in this case it's the US (again).