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Don't Help Your Kids With Their Homework

Hugh Pickens DOT Com (2995471) writes "Dana Goldstein writes in The Atlantic that while one of the central tenets of raising kids in America is that parents should be actively involved in their children's education — meeting with teachers, volunteering at school, and helping with homework — few parents stop to ask whether they're worth the effort. Case in point: In the largest-ever study of how parental involvement affects academic achievement researchers combed through nearly three decades' worth of longitudinal surveys of American parents and tracked 63 different measures of parental participation in kids' academic lives, from helping them with homework, to talking with them about college plans, to volunteering at their schools. What they found surprised them. Most measurable forms of parental involvement seem to yield few academic dividends for kids, or even to backfire — regardless of a parent's race, class, or level of education. Once kids enter middle school, parental help with homework can actually bring test scores down, an effect Robinson says could be caused by the fact that many parents may have forgotten, or never truly understood, the material their children learn in school. 'As kids get older—we're talking about K-12 education — parents' abilities to help with homework are declining,' says Keith Robinson. 'Even though they may be active in helping, they may either not remember the material their kids are studying now, or in some cases never learned it themselves, but they're still offering advice. And that means poor quality homework.'" (More, below.) Hugh Pickens continues: "The study did find a handful of parental behaviors that made a difference in their children's education such as reading aloud to young kids (PDF) (fewer than half of whom are read to daily) and talking with teenagers about college plans. 'The most consistent, positive parental involvement activity is talking to your kids about their post-high school plans, and this one stood out because it was, pretty much for every racial, ethnic and socio-economic group, positively related to a number of academic outcomes—such as attendance and marks,' concludes Robinson. 'What this might be hinting at is the psychological component that comes from kids internalizing your message: school is important. '"

30 of 278 comments (clear)

  1. Um, right. by HotNeedleOfInquiry · · Score: 4, Funny

    'Even though they may be active in helping, they may either not remember the material their kids are studying now, or in some cases never learned it themselves, but they're still offering advice. And that means poor quality homework.'" You mean like correcting the blatant errors in the grade school science texts?

    --
    "Eve of Destruction", it's not just for old hippies anymore...
    1. Re:Um, right. by Ardyvee · · Score: 5, Insightful

      To be honest my mom never understood some of the things she helped me with. What she did was read the textbook, see what I was having issue with, have me explain to her what I was trying to accomplish and how, and if she still didn't have an insight, she would tell me to ask somebody else. She knew her limitations (perhaps because her education is high school, and a bad one).

      --
      I don't care if I'm wrong. I only care about everyone obtaining something from the discussion.
    2. Re:Um, right. by Tamran · · Score: 5, Insightful

      You mean like correcting the blatant errors in the grade school science texts?

      This is exactly on point! Sure, having discussions and making students think deeper may affect their quiz/exam scores. However, there are countless examples of how these exams are no more than simulations of real life and how being able to respond to new situations creatively is the true measure of intelligence (sorry, I'm too lazy to bring any references but surely a Google search will reveal countless cases).

      I now teach university undergraduate engineering classes after working in the industry for many years. What I now realize is that the people typically in this role have never worked as an Engineer and have NO CONTEXT to what they're actually teaching. With no context, how can these people be fair at assessment? In reality, either the product ships or it doesn't. But exams often become about solving some tricky problem that is from an 1800's analytical paper. Not to say these case studies aren't relevant, but the point is the objectives of education SHOULD BE some skill set as opposed to scoring high on some exam.

      All that said, I believe the criteria used to make the conclusions in the summary are way off base and also lack context. Parents, don't stop debating with your children about what they're learning. People should balance questioning everything they are told with heuristics and best practices in order to "get things done." Test scores be damned if we can't even assemble lawn furniture at the end of the day.

    3. Re:Um, right. by modmans2ndcoming · · Score: 2

      I don't know if that is Common Core's fault. Idiots implement the standards and think they make it easier for kids.The high standards are good, the poor implimentation in many districts is not.

    4. Re:Um, right. by HornWumpus · · Score: 2

      All of my Engineering profs had extensive industry experience. My understanding at the time was that Engineering schools had a long tradition of not employing professors without at least 5 years in industry. Granting that was decades ago. I have a hard time believing things have changed that quickly.

      --
      John McAfee 'It was like that time I hired that Bangkok prostitute; to do my taxes, while I fucked my accountant'
    5. Re:Um, right. by sconeu · · Score: 4, Funny

      But either you'd never be able to open the book, or you'd never be able to close it!

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    6. Re:Um, right. by mindwhip · · Score: 3, Informative

      Mine didn't really understand the problems but always got me to explain what I was trying to do, why and how. The act of me explaining taught me to think through things and ultimately solve them myself, one big lesson that works for a lot more than maths.

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    7. Re:Um, right. by s.petry · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Mostly this, but a bit more since you are missing something I feel is a much larger issue. Common core is the latest example of people not learning concepts so that they can understand the world, but making students memorize and "come close" to answers that someone feeds them.

      Case and point. My son in Elementary school was forced to memorize multiplication tables because it was required (in a bit more than a decade that may have changed, but it was required from the 1950s). The kids were not taught the fundamental concept of what multiplication is, or how it worked. I sat him down and showed him the concept and told him to not use "times" or "multiply" when doing his homework. Instead, I told him to use "groups of" which made perfect sense to a 7 year old. He never had to memorize the table and aced math, but not because government mandated materials and methods worked, but because I taught him what the concepts the school didn't.

      Those types of lessons occurred constantly. Many teachers know the forced methods are broken and fight against it. Teachers often ignore the forced work and methods and their kids get smarter, though in certain areas of the required tests scores can drop.

      It's not simply a matter of having people with real world knowledge teaching. There is very much an issue of the curriculum and required methods being wrong.

      TFA makes me very concerned, because talking to friends I'm not the only one that has taught my kid concepts that schools do not. This seems to be very common, and sending a message out to people to stop teaching their kids is questionable at best. I have a feeling that the statistics were not so much related to parents helping with homework as much as parents doing the homework for the kid (which we know happens) and of course those types of questions would easily skew results.

      --

      -The wise argue that there are few absolutes, the fool argues that there are no probabilities.

    8. Re:Um, right. by Jane+Q.+Public · · Score: 4, Interesting

      "Test scores be damned if we can't even assemble lawn furniture at the end of the day."

      Even more: test scores be damned if the answers are wrong or the methods taught are nonsensical.

    9. Re:Um, right. by qpqp · · Score: 3, Insightful

      OMG, WHAT THE FUCK is THIS? I'm sincerely hoping that by the time my kids get to school, this bunkum will have vanished from the respective curricula.

    10. Re:Um, right. by Solandri · · Score: 2

      To be honest my mom never understood some of the things she helped me with.

      Maybe her parents didn't help her enough with her homework?

      I joke, but I'm half-serious. This seems to be a self-fulfilling prophecy. Parents don't help with with homework, kid never really understands the material, grows up to be another parent who doesn't help with homework. From a control systems standpoint, there are probably two stable points in this system - above a certain threshold helping with homework helps and reinforces that behavior in future generations, and below that threshold helping with homework hurts and reinforces that behavior in future generations. The trick is to figure out a way to get most people above that threshold, rather than giving up and consigning everyone to live below that threshold.

    11. Re:Um, right. by Xylantiel · · Score: 2

      I agree. Go look at common core, don't assume you know what it is. A lot of the "criticism" of common core has nothing to do with what is actually in common core. I have looked at the teaching of multiplication and it does some things that seem "weird" but are clearly intended to teach students number concepts, not just rote memorization. Now whether the elementary teacher figures that out is a totally different ballgame - since they may not have a firm number concept themselves and therefare they may not even understand what is being taught or know how to explain it to parents.

    12. Re:Um, right. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Case and point. My son in Elementary school was forced to memorize multiplication tables because it was required (in a bit more than a decade that may have changed, but it was required from the 1950s). The kids were not taught the fundamental concept of what multiplication is, or how it worked.

      False dichotomy. The problem is the latter - you kid's school didn't taught the concept of multiplication, not the former.

      What should be done is to do both - the concepts first, then memorize the table.

    13. Re:Um, right. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      what a red herring you posted. how the fuck is someone supposed to learn how to multiply in reasonable time without memorizing the first 9 multiples of our numbering system???

      you say groups, but thats bullshit. there is no way your kid aced math courses when taking the time to add groups of x when there was a much better shortcut available. tables are a good thing, and i dont understand why you said they werent used and dont matter.

          if your kid used your additional tutoring to understand concepts that the curricula taught, then kudos to you, thats how its supposed to go, and perhaps their particular teacher did a shitty job of teaching the material.

      im not a big fan of our educational systems we have in place, but damn, how the fuck did you get modded insightful?

      slashdot/internet/people's intelligence is getting really shitty apparently. =*-(

      as an addendum, i agree that parents are the ones who should take the main role in teaching their kids. thank you for not pushing your responsibility off to the state =-)

    14. Re:Um, right. by berberine · · Score: 2

      My mom had to work nights as a kid, so I had to stay with my grandma. My grandma didn't help with my homework, but she always checked it after I was finished. She would put little pencil marks next to the problems that were wrong. she only helped when I couldn't figure out what I had done wrong.

      When it came to math, she was old enough that high school didn't really teach her more than basic Algebra, so she learned along with me. I always thought it was cool that she would sit with me and watch how I did problems and that I could explain Algebra and Geometry to her. I hated math so this made it more fun and I was a lot more willing to try to learn it even though math made me want to punch things.

      I have recently seen some Common Core math problems and heard some parents talking about it. I have to admit, I don't understand the reasoning at all behind some of the basic math that they're changing. I'm not sure if a lot of parents will ever be able to help their kids anymore.

  2. Or maybe.. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Parents help with homework, kids never learn how to solve problems by theirself.

  3. Kids stop listening at 12. by HornWumpus · · Score: 5, Informative

    You had better get any information you want into your kids head before puberty.

    After puberty, they lose the ability to listen to parents.

    --
    John McAfee 'It was like that time I hired that Bangkok prostitute; to do my taxes, while I fucked my accountant'
  4. Could it be.... by HotNeedleOfInquiry · · Score: 4, Insightful

    That the kids who did well without help didn't *need* help because they were smart self-starters? Yeah, maybe that's it.

    --
    "Eve of Destruction", it's not just for old hippies anymore...
  5. Common Sense by bill_mcgonigle · · Score: 4, Insightful

    If your kid is stuck on something, help him out.

    If you don't know how to help him out, then admit that. In any subject where the results are objective you can look at the practice section if you have any doubts about your ability to be helpful. If you're both stuck help him formulate the question(s) to ask the teacher, if he's having trouble doing that on his own.

    Don't do your kids' homework for them.

    Next article.

    --
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  6. Re:Always remember: by K.+S.+Kyosuke · · Score: 5, Funny

    I'm a Jew. I implore you to do exactly the opposite of what I tell you to do, in the strongest terms possible!

    (That should keep him occupied for a while...)

    --
    Ezekiel 23:20
  7. Exactly by l2718 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Homework -- self practice -- is where you actually learn the material. When parents do their kids' homework, the kids lose the opportunity to learn the material for themselves.

    This isn't to say that students don't need help. Rather, they need help thinking through the material instead of the "help" of being told the solution.

    1. Re:Exactly by lonOtter · · Score: 2

      Homework -- self practice -- is where you actually learn the material.

      I never bothered to do any homework, yet was far beyond any of the other students, who didn't understand why anything worked. That's because all the busywork assignments just had you doing the same thing over and over; they were just rote exercises, and didn't have anything to do with understanding.

      That is not true learning.

      --
      [End Of Line]
  8. Couldn't help my kid with Geometry by rsilvergun · · Score: 4, Interesting

    not because the material's hard, but because it builds and builds and builds. If you're not taking the course along with your kid you're not gonna pull it off.

    What I hate seeing is these schools giving 4+ hours of homework a night. It's damn near impossible to do all that. The US economy is crashing due to outsourcing and blind faith in Free Trade, and everyone's trying to figure out what to do that doesn't involve stuff that's politically impossible (like Tariffs and an end to Work Visas for people w/o a PHD and a large body of work). So far the solution seems to be to overwhelm children with tests and homework...

    --
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  9. Probably not by J+Story · · Score: 2

    And yet, homeschooled kids tend to outperform their bricks-and-mortar peers. According to the study, homeschoolers do slightly worse when their parents are teachers. My own suspicion is that when parents do their kids' homework, the kids don't bother learning what they don't need to.

  10. Causation vs correlation by itwasgreektome · · Score: 2

    It is easy to confuse causation with correlation. Without an experiment, causation cannot be shown. Data suggests correlation only. To a person whose never taken a statistics course (a statistics course should be mandated for all students, would decrease people's gullibility), said data might look as though the parents that help with homework CAUSE poorer test scores. To someone who's used to seeing this causation fallacy, I see a possibility that kids who are doing poorly in school are more likely to be helped with their homework by their parents, and therefore it's the poor cognitive ability which CAUSES the parent to help, and the poor cognitive ability CAUSES the poor test scores.

  11. Establish good behaviors / patterns by dave562 · · Score: 2

    Helping with homework is such a broad subject that stretches from answering the occasional question, to doing the assignment for the kid. Based on my limited experience, the important thing to keep in mind is helping the child develop good behaviors. Show the child that doing homework is important by setting time aside every day for homework. Be engaged with the kid and communicate with them about what is going on at school. Give them some flexibility. "What order do you want to tackle your homework in?" "Do you want to go 30 or 45 minutes between breaks?" "How much of this semester long project do you want to get done this week?"

    Homework is less about mastering subject matter and more about developing good habits. Kids go to school "all day". Parents definitely work all day. Those are jobs. The people who excel in their professions are the people who put in the extra effort. Professionals who put in the extra effort usually do it because they are fortunate enough to enjoy their profession. Kids do not get that perk. They are stuck with the subjects they have to learn. A parent who comes home from work and "tunes out", implicitly communicates to the kid that doing so is acceptable behavior. The parent who comes home and helps the kid with homework sets the example that just because they've "put in their 8 hours", it does not mean that they are done with their responsibilities.

    Those of us who work in IT inherently set examples of strong work ethics, by being on call all the time. The challenge is to balance the work responsibility with finding time for the family. In most cases, having the discipline to not check emails for 2 hours while helping the kid with homework helps to establish healthy boundaries with employers as well.

    One last perk... it helps you get laid. Oddly enough, mothers are turned on by men who help their children succeed. Go figure.

  12. And for the exact opposite effect... Homeschool. by pubwvj · · Score: 3, Interesting

    If you want the exact opposite effect, homeschool your kids. This makes you far more involved in their education and lives plus they do far better than public school kids. One of the big benefits of homeschooling is that we don't have to have any arguments about what we're going to teach, no creationism vs evolution. We teach real science. We do real research. Homeschooling has been great, for us.

    YMMV so do what you please.

  13. How often do you pull out a calculator though? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Seriously, mental math is something that's always going to be useful as it's a way of developing math sense. Chances are that when you're checking out at the supermarket that you don't tally things up yourselves, but with mental math, you can estimate whether the bill is reasonable.

    What's more, if you're doing mental math regularly, it's both more accurate and faster than whipping out a calculator. And what's more, you always have that option, you can even write down the intermediary steps if you need to.

    As for the base-10 shortcut, it's not about that, it's about preparing the students for algebra. Being able to point back to this when teaching the associative and commutative properties is quite useful. ,

  14. Re:Do you know how to teach your chidren ? by Mathinker · · Score: 2

    > Those who wrote math text and teach math are not math experts. They are teaching experts. Their math may not be right.

    This makes no sense to me. Please explain. Do you actually believe it's better to more skillfully teach wrong facts compared to less skillfully teach correct facts? Or were you talking about things like, we would only confuse second graders with negative numbers, so when teaching them, we'll just implicitly assume that negative numbers don't exist.

  15. Re:Right, and it also depends on the person by kellymcdonald78 · · Score: 2

    Unless you mean Arithmetic Mean, then they are exactly the same thing