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German Wikipedia Has Problems With Paid Editing — and Threats of Violence
metasonix (650947) writes "As German journalist Marvin Oppong learned recently, there are a number of people who work to make articles about certain corporations and trade groups on German Wikipedia 'look better.' And when Oppong published his discoveries, one reaction was an openly violent threat, aimed at him, posted on de-WP's 'Kurier' noticeboard. Just as with English Wikipedia, it is apparently a 'terrible crime' to criticize German Wikipedia, even when Jimbo Wales's 'bright line' rule on paid editing is being violated. Unlike English WP, the Germans will threaten to 'curbstone' people for saying it."
Wouldn't it be more appropriate to give the Wikipedia link for Marvin Oppong (English?
Have you read my journal today?
German wikipedia sucks. Just sayin'.
One person said something mean in a comment thread. Shocking! This is not the climate of the family-friendly internet I grew up with!
Seriously, a death threat is only relevant if it was specific and realistic threat.
NB: The message above might reflect my opinion right now, but not necessarily tomorrow or next year.
Wikipedia: when you want to say you fact checked , but you don't have time to do it properly.
Happiness in intelligent people is the rarest thing I know.
Ernest Hemingway
I'm sorry, but you can find threats of violence on the English Wikipedia, and other less blatantly unsavory conduct, which is even worse in its way, since it's not so easy to reject.
Threatening violence is easy enough to recognize. Other forms of manipulative conduct can be harder to spot and more difficult to expunge.
s/the Germans/some assclown on his iphone at a berlin pub/
Good people go to bed earlier.
Okay not being a German national, what is meant by "threaten to 'curbstone' people"?
A curbstone where I live is the part of the street that is at the edge and channels water...
> "Germans will threaten to 'curbstone' people for saying it"
Pick your punchline:
1. I'm gonna have to look that up on Wikipedia.
2. Well, that's an improvement over a gas chamber anyway.
3. I found a curbstone in Elder Scrolls Online and was wondering wat it was for.
(-1: Post disagrees with my already-settled worldview) is not a valid mod option.
It's not like the Germans to employ Gestapo tactics like this.
That said, his signature specifically states, "Disclaimer: all mail to this address is answered by volunteers, and responses are not to be considered an official statement of the Wikimedia Foundation. For official correspondence, please contact the Wikimedia Foundation by certified mail at the address listed on https://www.wikimediafoundatio...."
The german Wikipedia has more a problem with Blockwart-Administrators. I guess on the english version it's the same with "administrators".
Everyone understands what the term means, why it is there, but you cannot edit it in anywhere, they will exterminate it asap.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blockwart
Wikipedia kills itself, I had edits in the article about "Lightsabers" (well, just the german one) reverted where I made the sentences read better (nothing else and the originals were clunky). If people spend time on reverting sentences in articels on lightsabers (german version) because someone changed how the sentence looks (no matter if it is a tad better or a tad worse) you can count that as sign something is REALLY broken within the system.
I know what it means but I can't even think of a German word equivalent. I would have to resort to describing its meaning in German using at least one long sentence.
" Unlike English WP, the Germans will threaten to 'curbstone' people for saying it."
Yeah because all german are like that. *eyeroll*. Or alternatively one or two scums doing it for paid money saw the danger of their revenue evaporating, or even more likely, one or two idiot thought it to be fun to threaten that guy.
C. Sagan : A demon haunted world:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0345409469/
visit randi.org
Original German: "Ein geistiger Tiefflieger, er soll aufpassen, dass er nicht mit dem Kinn am Borstein hängen bleibt".
Translation: "A mental low-flyer (i.e., low-flying plane), he has to take care that his chin doesn't snag the curb".
The statement is that this guy's head / brain is flying so low that any obstacle become insurmount-able, even the curbstone. It's a big stretch to see this as a threat of violence.
krauts
I'll start to worry about the German Wikipedia when a swastika appears on the main page and the those who threaten to curbstone other editors resort to more Gestapo tactics. Then we'll know that they have fully returned to their old ways. Until then, I won't lose any sleep.
It's really quite a simple choice: Life, Death, or Los Angeles.
I didn't claim that there IS no word - after all, there's a word for everything - only that I didn't know. I don't think it matters much that/if there is a word when few people know it. Even with your Wikipedia link, I most certainly have never ever heard the word "Randsteinbeißen" in my life. Worse: I am not even aware that "Randstein" is a word. For me that's supposed to be "Bordstein". Conceptually "Randstein" makes sense ("egde stone", for the English speakers), but I've never heard it before.
> interestingly, the German Wikipedia seems to be the only one that has an article on this.
I think this should tell us something ;-)
So, to summarize:
1) it appears from the threads on this post that many Slashdotters find it acceptable for corporate paid editors to mess openly with Wikipedia articles.
2) and, it's similarly perfectly acceptable for anonymous Wikipedia editors to threaten people who uncover these schemes.
3) plus, Oppong is black, and the threat involved "curb stomping", a very ugly act of violence that white "skinheads" are fond of doing to their enemies. As Oppong noted, it was seen being done (by a white racist, to a black man) in the film "American History X". So acts of skinhead violence are A-OKAY on Wikipedia, because "oh well, people make violent threats on Wikipedia all the time".
I'm getting the impression that soon it will be socially acceptable for Wikipedia's cultlike fans to commit acts of real-world violence against their critics, plus any journalists who uncover Wikipedia corruption. Why?
This quote is more than an overgeneralisation. To me it's definitely on the verge of open racism.
You doubt? Just replace "Germans" with "Arabs"...
Herve S.
First, metasonix, as you get so agitated about this and looking at your posting history, can we assume you are Marvin Oppong himself.
Second, as has been pointed out here as well as in the comments to the article you cite for the threat (which only gives your ... uh ... Marvin's shortening of the threat instead of the full line), the full line in question is
"Ein geistiger Tiefflieger, er soll aufpassen, dass er nicht mit dem Kinn am Borstein hängen bleibt."
Translation (thanks to an AC) "A mental low-flyer (i.e., low-flying plane), he has to take care that his chin doesn't snag the curb".
Being German I understand the second part - as others have - as amplifying the - admittedly - insult of the first part, but definitely not a threat of violence. And you seem to understand it the same, because why else would you cite the second part out of context?
Also, the whole comment from giftzwerg (in German) ending in the insult seems to criticize not the publication of the misuse but your proposal to solve it (independent supervision council without editing rights) as non working (due to the lack of admin rights). I.e. he seems to criticize you as too weak. Does not sound at all like a paid shill threatining you after his exposure as you make it sound.
So while you might have a point with some Wikipedian authors following commercial interest, trying to exagerate the case it by makeing up a threat IMHO weakens it serverly.
The 'threats of violence' thing appears to be a naive misunderstanding of German, if not an intentionally sensationalist one: have a look at the comment by user "Required" following the article, which explains the original German idiom.
The actual "curbstone" quote in question is:
"Ein geistiger Tiefflieger, er soll aufpassen, dass er nicht mit dem Kinn am Bor[d]stein hÃngen bleibt."
It's not a threat to curbstomp anyone, but a colorful insult that loosely translates as "someone with such a low-flying intellect, they have to watch out for curbstones lest they hit their chin on one". Indeed, Google auto-translates it as:
"A spiritual low-flying aircraft, he should be careful that he does not hang with the chin on the curb."
Caveat Emptor is not a business model.
essentially the mods are dickheads and there is a debate about every 2nd article if it meets the importance criteria as if they had to fit the whole think on a single floppy and need to save bytes.