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NASA Money Crunch Means Trouble For Spitzer Space Telescope

Scientific American reports that an ongoing budget crunch at NASA may spell doom for the Spitzer Space Telescope, the agency having "taken stock of its fleet of orbiting astrophysics telescopes and decided which to save and which to shutter. Among the winners were the Hubble Space Telescope, the Chandra X-Ray Observatory and the Kepler planet-hunting telescope, which will begin a modified mission designed to compensate for the recent failure of two of its four stabilizing reaction wheels." Also from the SciAm article: "Until JWST comes online, no other telescope can approach Spitzer’s sensitivity in the range of infrared light it sees. The Senior Review report noted that Spitzer had the largest oversubscription of any NASA mission from 2013 to 2014, meaning that it gets about seven times more applications for observing time from scientists than it can accommodate. ...'The guest observing programs were very powerful because you get people from all over the world proposing ideas that maybe the people on the team wouldn’t have come up with,' [senior review panel chair Ben R.] Oppenheimer says. 'But it’s got to be paid for.'"

21 of 107 comments (clear)

  1. Hollywood way by Greg666NYC · · Score: 2, Funny

    Anybody still remember this Hollywood movie "Apollo Moon landing" ? Isn't cheaper to use Hollywood again?

  2. Budget Perspective by NoKaOi · · Score: 5, Insightful

    In 2014, for example, the total astrophysics division funding was about $1.3 billion

    Or about 5 days cost of the Iraq/Afghan wars, or 1/50th the cost of the F-22 program, or 1/33 Larry Ellison's net worth, or 1/58th of Bill Gates' net worth, or 1/2 the cost of a single B-2.

    1. Re:Budget Perspective by mmell · · Score: 2
      Yup, that's where our priorities are. And before the flames begin, let me say that here in the US we have the best government money can buy. I truly believe that; we're all very proud of ourselves here.

      Besides, what's more important - bombing people who are not like us or exploring space? I think history has shown the answer (hint: even when we spent more on our space program it was only to beat them commie Ruskies to it after they put a satellite and a person into orbit).

    2. Re:Budget Perspective by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Better hope that you don't suddenly need more B-2s

      Don't need any of them. Nor the B-1. I don't think the B-1 was ever used - except for scaring the shit out of the Soviets.

      The B-52 is the bomber of choice.

      I loved COSMOS (ep.11) last week and how the civilizations, like ancient Sumaria, who valued military conquest ended up destroying themselves.

      It's a lesson from history we should take to heart.

      See, all these wars we're fighting are slowing eating away at our economy - along with a few other factors like: offshoring, automation, and aging populace. Although, it is quite apparent that our way of life is a life of war - endless war it seems - and war mongering societies do not last very long and peaceful ones are the societies that thrive.

      Most of us here are Trekkies or do like the idea of the society depicted in those series. The only way to get there is to stop this primitive non-sense of wars, tribalism and religion - religion is just another form of tribalism; also worshiping an Iron Age god in the 21st century is just ridiculous.

      Just some thoughts at 4:55AM where I am.

    3. Re:Budget Perspective by KingOfBLASH · · Score: 2

      You obviously don't play enough Civilization. You can win the game much earlier if you go for the world conquest win instead of the science win.

      Duh.

    4. Re:Budget Perspective by Martin+Blank · · Score: 2

      The B-1 was used in Iraq first during Operation Desert Fox and later during the 2003 invasion, and was also used in Kosovo and Afghanistan. The B-52, while still a very good bomber, is showing its age. While the Air Force still has it in the plans for another 30 years or so, it's not what you want to use should you have to go up against any serious air defenses, as they have to be neutralized first. Boeing has proposed several modernization ideas including new engines that would improve fuel efficiency and reduce maintenance requirements, but the cost of that is more than the Air Force wants to pay. They're planning for a new bomber to replace all three existing bombers starting around 2030-2035.

      And the B-1 never really scared the Soviets. Before the final one was delivered, the Air Force realized that it couldn't compete with Soviet air defenses.

      --
      You can never go home again... but I guess you can shop there.
    5. Re:Budget Perspective by PolygamousRanchKid+ · · Score: 3, Insightful

      . . . how about the money and news coverage for Kim Kardashian's wedding . . . ? The general public just isn't interested in science and space.

      Sad, but true. If the general population isn't interested, Congress has no incentive to fund it.

      --
      Schroedinger's Brexit: The UK is both in and out of the EU at the same time!
  3. Re:Of course by mmell · · Score: 3, Insightful
    Would you prefer Muslim population control and climate change denial?

    Guess it doesn't matter which side of the aisle you're on - somehow or other, space exploration just seems to drop right out of the equation, doesn't it?

  4. Endorse James Webb. Do NOT even mention Sptizer. by thesandbender · · Score: 3, Interesting

    The vast majority of US Representatives and Senators do not understand the distinction between the Spitzer and James Webb Missions. Nor should they, there primary job is taking care of local and internal politics here. However:

    If a lot of people call/email/write in saying "Save Spitzer", they'll have their assistants do some research and run the numbers. Unless one of those assistants is a space/astronomy junkie, the result will come back the same for all parties. Spitzer is "up there" and "doing science".... James Webb costs more and is risky (it hasn't even launched yet)... so back Spitzer. It's the politically "safe" move.

    Personally, I don't want to see that happen. If we have to sacrifice Spitzer (and even other projects) to get James Webb... so be it. Astronomy is, after all, all about the very long game.

  5. What exactly would the funding cover? by tlambert · · Score: 3, Insightful

    What exactly would the funding cover?

    It seems that a private consortium could operate the instrument, given its oversubscription ratio, and thereby have enough funding to run both the subscription selection process and the ground station equipment (or build their own), and that the real problem here is that NASA is in between the people who want to use the instrument and the instrument itself, and are using it as a means to blackmail outrage out of the people who want to use the instrument, in order to obtain more funding for NASA.

    Am I missing something? Why, other than they have the code keys, is NASA involved, once the instrument is up there in orbit, so long as there are parties willing to pay the freight for the ground stations in exchange for observation slots? I know it's a little harsh to turn around and say "NASA, you're fired as caretakers of this instrument", but is that any less harsh than shutting it down so that no one has use of it, unless they get the funds they want?

    1. Re:What exactly would the funding cover? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Informative

      lol.

      You do not understand how these telescope missions are funded, or, apparently that it costs millions simply to keep a space telescope running once it is up. The scientists who want to use Spitzer do not, and can not, pay for it out of pocket. There are no parties willing or able to pay for anything related to telescope operations, other than NASA itself. The oversubscription indicates its scientific usefulness and relevance, not some economic market model potential.

      In fact, it is the other way around. Astronomers get the observations "for free" after stringent selection, and then *get extra money from NASA* to be able to analyze the data. I.e., most of the bureaucracy and red tape is already taken out and much of the funding goes directly to the end user. This is a standard and efficient model.

      NASA is not therefore "in between the people who want to use the instrument and the instrument itself", it is funding all operational costs of the telescope+instruments, maintaining the data archive, providing technical support to users, *and* provide them with funding to analyze the data.

    2. Re:What exactly would the funding cover? by DerekLyons · · Score: 2

      Am I missing something?

      Pretty much everything.

  6. How about by rossdee · · Score: 2

    getting some funding from some billionaire or corporation, and they get to have their name on the telescope rather than a former governor of New York or an olympic swimmer...

  7. I am not from the US by fufufang · · Score: 4, Interesting

    I find it extremely sad that the US has recently lost the ability to conduct human spaceflight. I also find it extremely sad that the funding for NASA is still under threat. I don't know what to say really... I hope the future exploration of mankind doesn't depend on countries with questionable human right record like Russia and China.

    1. Re:I am not from the US by AmiMoJo · · Score: 2

      I hope the future exploration of mankind doesn't depend on countries with questionable human right record like Russia and China.

      It always has. The US only developed its space programme so quickly because it wanted better ICBMs and got into a somewhat imaginary race with Russia to the moon. I'm not saying its a bad thing, only that conflict with Russia was the major driving force.

      The only way I can see NASA being well funded again is if China starts sending people to the moon. They don't have to land, just orbiting should be enough to light that fire.

      --
      const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
      SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
    2. Re:I am not from the US by Solandri · · Score: 2

      Manned space flight still takes up a huge chunk of NASA's budget. $3 billion for ISS operations alone in 2014, a lot more than the $1.3 billion allocated to astrophysics (from what I can tell, roughly half of that $1.3 billion is development of the JWST).

      Anyhow, the U.S. didn't lose manned spaceflight capability because of budget problems at NASA. It lost it because our Senators inserted too many provisions requiring NASA to use certain designs and/or parts contractors. It was engineering design by accounting committee in the worst possible form. NASA, rightly IMHO, balked and refused. The engineers in this country are capable of great things, but not when Senators take the engineering decisions out of their hands and force the design to be based on who contributed most to political campaigns, rather than on sound engineering principles.

  8. Re:cry wolf? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Informative

    No. NASA followed the ranking of facilities in the Senior Review report that were set by an external non-NASA advisory panel composed of prominent scientists.

    Although scientifically Spitzer was rated as excellent and unique, given its somewhat lower ranking in the report and the comparatively large cost of the extended mission, it is vulnerable to shutdown.

    NASA has said in the official response to the Senior Review: "The Spitzer project is invited to respond with a request for a budget augmentation to conduct continued operations with reduced operations costs. The response requesting a budget augmentation, if submitted, will be considered during the FY 2016 budget formulation process. If the Administration proposes additional funding for Spitzer in the FY16 Budget, the project will be able to seamlessly continue operations in FY15"

    So it is not done yet. This is not cry wolf, it is NASA putting pressure on Spitzer administrators to submit a modified slimmed down budget compared to the one originally proposed.

  9. Re:Endorse James Webb. Do NOT even mention Sptizer by Martin+Blank · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Are you aware that federal income taxes were collected long before the case (Pollock v. Farmers' Loan & Trust) that basically triggered the adoption of the 16th Amendment? They go back to 1861. The issue in Pollock was not that the income tax was unconstitutional (the income tax on wages was decided unanimously to be constitutional in 1880 and held to be an excise tax in Pollock), but that taxes on income derived from property (rental income, stock dividends, etc.) were direct taxes (as opposed to indirect taxes on wages) and so had to be apportioned by state populations. It then spent the next decade doing contortions trying to fit various taxes challenged after the Pollock ruling as excise taxes so as to not deprive the federal government of revenue from many other sources.

    The 16th Amendment merely allows taxes collected on all income, whatever the source, to not be apportioned by state populations, taking the issue out of the courts' hands completely. Repealing the amendment wouldn't end the income tax or the IRS, but instead justify a larger bureaucracy to ensure that income from direct taxes was apportioned properly, or else a rush to the courts to challenge pretty much every tax and a resumption of the judicial contortions to keep them in place.

    And you really should get up to date on your recent history. While I'm not sad to see Saddam Hussein gone, there were no unconventional weapons found, save for a few old artillery shells buried more than a decade before. He really had dismantled his programs, but tried to make it look like maybe he didn't in case Iran got the bright idea of starting a new fight.

    --
    You can never go home again... but I guess you can shop there.
  10. NASA: "forememost, to reach out to Muslims" by raymorris · · Score: 2

    NASA head Bolden told Al Jazeerathat when he became the NASA administrator, President Obama charged him with three things: "One, he wanted me to help re-inspire children to want to get into science and math; he wanted me to expand our international relationships; and third, and perhaps foremost, he wanted me to find a way to reach out to the Muslim world and engage much more with dominantly Muslim nations to help them feel good"

    So yeah, according to the head of NASA, the foremost mission of NASA under Barak Obama is to make Muslims feel good.

  11. Re:Of course by Martin+Blank · · Score: 2

    There's a probe called New Horizons on the way to Pluto right now, largely because we can't get decent pictures from here. Even with Hubble, the best we get is a fuzzy blob a few pixels in size.

    Then there's the Cassini mission that provided information about Titan that could not have been obtained without dropping a probe into its atmosphere.

    There was Galileo, which provided a wealth of knowledge about the Jovian moons that we could not have gotten by taking pictures from here.

    Magellan provided radar mapping of the surface of Venus that is completely obscured from view in visible light due to permanent clouds.

    And, of course, there is the science being done on Mars that requires a physical presence.

    --
    You can never go home again... but I guess you can shop there.
  12. Spitzer is more than worth the $15~ million a year by captn+ecks · · Score: 2

    NASA officially says - 'Without a budget boost from Congress or cost savings within the Spitzer project, money for the mission will run out Sept. 30 and NASA will decommission the telescope beginning this fall. Spitzer received $16.5 million to operate in fiscal year 2014, which ends Sept. 30. Helou said the initial proposal considered by NASA's senior review called for a reduced operating budget of $15.35 million in fiscal year 2015.'

    This over subscribed for observation time mission that cost billions to launch needs just $15~ million dollars to continue science for another year? And yet Congress authorizes funding for another aircraft carrier group that the Pentagon doesn't want with little debate.

    The New Horizons mission to Pluto is having trouble finding a follow on target in the Kuiper Belt and is looking for hard to get observation time on the Hubble. Couldn't the Spitzer be used for this purpose instead? Shutting down a functioning space telescope before its mechanical demise is fiscally and scientifically absurd.