Slashdot Mirror


Mars (One) Needs Payloads

mbone (558574) writes Mars One has announced that their first, unmanned, lander, targeted for 2018, needs payloads. Along with their 4 experiments, and a University experiment, they have two payloads for hire: "Mars One offers two payload opportunities for paying mission contributors. Proposals can take the form of scientific experiments, technology demonstrations, marketing and publicity campaigns, or any other suggested payload. 'Previously, the only payloads that have landed on Mars are those which NASA has selected,' said Bas Lansdorp, 'We want to open up the opportunity to the entire world to participate in our mission to Mars by sending a certain payload to the surface of Mars.'" The formal Request for Proposals for all of this is out now as well.

42 of 77 comments (clear)

  1. Lego Mindstorms Projects by MillionthMonkey · · Score: 1

    If there's one thing Mars doesn't have enough of, it's Legos.

    1. Re:Lego Mindstorms Projects by bill_mcgonigle · · Score: 1

      If there's one thing Mars doesn't have enough of, it's Legos.

      I thought it was Moms it was out of? Better idea, though: let's find some of the A/C's here and see if they fit.

      --
      My God, it's Full of Source!
      OUTSIDE_IP=$(dig +short my.ip @outsideip.net)
  2. just... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

    Lichens, moss, fertilizer and a dispersal mechanism.

    1. Re:just... by yanyan · · Score: 1

      Yes, this one! Throw in other, more complex plants and spread them around. Awesome idea.

    2. Re:just... by ecotax · · Score: 1

      Plus some microbes of course, maybe throw in some tardigrades. It just might be enough to start life 2.0, which would be a nice backup and a great achievement.

      Now that we're reasonably sure Mars is barren, I really don't get NASA's "let's not pollute it" attitude anymore.

      --
      "Money is a sign of poverty." - Iain Banks
    3. Re:just... by Z00L00K · · Score: 1

      Poppy seeds, if nothing else grows then they can at least have some fun.

      --
      If builders built buildings the way programmers wrote programs, then the first woodpecker would destroy civilization.
    4. Re:just... by RockDoctor · · Score: 2

      Now that we're reasonably sure Mars is barren

      Who is this "we" who are reasonably sure that Mars is barren? It sure doesn't include me. OK, I'm not a specialist biologist emphasising study of the 5 points which we've measured on Mars (and found lacking in life forms which we recognise, I'll grant), but I am a geologist with a better than normal understanding of the variability of rocks and the habitats that they represent to life forms. People I was at university with have worked on (and published) on some very peculiar terrestrial organisms from deep oil wells, and that represents just a few percent of the potentially habitable volume of this planet. And remember : so far we're only looking for life forms that have metabolisms and physiologies which function broadly similarly to ours.

      If we had (say) 10 independent OOL (Origin Of Life) events (say, in different stellar systems), and in our couple of decades of experimentation Mars didn't have a trace of any of those systems, then I might agree that a few decades of searching would be sufficient. But since we still really have NO IDEA what the actual range of effective solutions to the questions of metabolism and physiology are, for this initial case I'd vote strongly in favour of waiting for a generation or ten. Say, until we've got a plan to decontaminate the planet which is as achievable (in the next ten human generations) as terraforming the planet.

      (Though I'm a fan of SF, when I'm talking about terraforming Mars, I'm talking about a real plan, not a hand-wavey SF-quality plan. For example, it would be nice to know where you plan to get the 4*10^18kg (approx) of water that you'd need to put a 100m of water onto 30% of the surface (assuming you want some sort of vaguely terrestrial climate, and you're going to use a significant amount of water for things like agriculture). More to the point, how are you going to get to that level of space-faring expertise without concluding that living in asteroid belts is just plain easier than terraforming even quite terrestrial planets like Mars? Build the environment that you want, rather than having to tear down an existing environment and then build the environment that you want.)

      --
      Birds are not dinosaur descendants;birds are dinosaurs, for all useful meanings of "birds", "are" and "dinosaurs"
  3. Payloads to send to Mars? by cold+fjord · · Score: 3, Funny

    'We want to open up the opportunity to the entire world to participate in our mission to Mars by sending a certain payload to the surface of Mars.'"

    Justin Bieber? Miley Cyrus?

    --
    much of left-wing thought is a kind of playing with fire by people who don't even know that fire is hot - George Orwell
    1. Re:Payloads to send to Mars? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      I'd donate to a kickstarter campaign to send Justin Bieber to Mars.

    2. Re:Payloads to send to Mars? by Tablizer · · Score: 1

      but we don't want to start an interplanetary war

    3. Re:Payloads to send to Mars? by cold+fjord · · Score: 3, Funny

      If it did start a war it would almost certainly be short. I'm inclined to believe that Martians would immediately surrender under a bombardment like that.

      --
      much of left-wing thought is a kind of playing with fire by people who don't even know that fire is hot - George Orwell
  4. Take my wife... by nytes · · Score: 1, Funny

    please

    --
    -- I have monkeys in my pants.
  5. Microphones by Electricity+Likes+Me · · Score: 3, Interesting

    I would really like to land a couple of microphones on Mars.

    Some high bandwidth (beyond human hearing) stuff, and some human hearing range stuff. I'd love to know what Mars sounds like.

    1. Re:Microphones by winphreak · · Score: 1

      Streaming live ambiance from the surface of Mars would be interesting. It's still eerie to me to see photos of the surface, simply because of the colors and shades present in the sand. It's (bad joke) out of this world.

      --
      "I'm a well-wisher, in that I don't wish you any specific harm."
    2. Re:Microphones by Ford+Prefect · · Score: 4, Informative

      A microphone has already been landed on Mars - unfortunately there was a risk of data corruption if the camera hardware it was attached to was turned on, so the microphone itself never got switched on...

      --
      Tedious Bloggy Stuff - hooray?
    3. Re:Microphones by antdude · · Score: 1

      So, turn off the camera to use the mic(rophone)? :P

      --
      Ant(Dude) @ Quality Foraged Links (AQFL.net) & The Ant Farm (antfarm.ma.cx / antfarm.home.dhs.org).
  6. Mars (One) Needs Payloads? by grep+-v+'.*'+* · · Score: 1

    Me.

    --
    If the universe is someone's simulation -- does that mean the stars are just stuck pixels?
  7. I want to send a carved rock by the_Bionic_lemming · · Score: 4, Funny

    If I had the money to buy the mission, I'd send a carved rock to be deployed that would indicate that either John Carter or I owned Mars, and that we would have to sword fight for ownership.

    My guess is that John Carter never made it to Mars, but if he did and and If I had to I could arrange a meeting place and nuke the entire site from orbit. Itâ(TM)s the only way to be sure. Cause I suck at sword fighting.

    --
    _ _ _ Go for the eyes Boo! GO FOR THE EYES!
  8. Are these people qualified for anything? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Informative

    Scanning through the Mars One "About Us" page, I see a bunch of people with MAs and blather about their "boldness" and "entrepreneurial spirit". They even list their concept artist and marketing team. Where are the PhDs in aerospace engineering and physics?

    1. Re:Are these people qualified for anything? by itzly · · Score: 2

      oblig Dilbert reference: http://search.dilbert.com/comi...

  9. Rover? by globaljustin · · Score: 1

    if MarsOne was in any way legit, nations and orgs would be lining up to get these payloads...Russia, China, ESA, NASA, MIT, UCLA, India, not to mention private companies including mining companies

    i'd put a rover up to test preselected areas...

    -OR-

    have a rover -AND- a craft that detaches in orbit or before that goes an explores a pre-select asteroid

    i saw someone suggest "Lego Mindstorms" above...that's where this is at...really...it'll be like a Raspberry Pi thing they select

    --
    Thank you Dave Raggett
  10. Animals by Tablizer · · Score: 1

    Let's send up chimps like we used to.

  11. Re:A DNA Payload by Tablizer · · Score: 5, Funny

    of my semen!

    it's already on Uranus

  12. Payloads? Here's what I would like to see. by wierd_w · · Score: 4, Interesting

    The kinds of payloads I would like to see delivered to mars are exactly the kind that the international planetary society would come out of their skins over.

    Waterbears, antarctic algea, and things of that nature.

    Those are lifeforms that could concievably survive indefinatly on mars. (waterbears can live, totally exposed, in the vacuum of space.-- Antarctic algeal forms are able to live in extremely saline conditions just within the first few millimeters of moist rocks, in blisteringly cold temperatures, and engage in active photosynthesis. Together, it is concievable for a highly simplistic, but stable biosphere to be cultivated/initiated on mars.)

    http://antarcticfacts.weebly.c...
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/T...

    In terms of scientific aparatus-- I would be interested in seeing how stationary wind turbines fare on the red planet. There is no surface vegitation of any kind to restrict or stop basically constant howling winds there, however the low atmospheric pressure may mean that while the wind is blowing with gusto, it packs little "punch". As far as I know, there is little data on the total energy yeild of wind energy on mars-- For a colony, wind energy would present a very attractive option over solar, which would be significantly less total energy per cubic meter than what is attainable on earth, especially when one considers the inefficiency of solar to begin with. Data on how much energy is reasonably able to be extracted, so that ideally sized generation systems can be designed, and data on rates of wind blown particle erosion on those devices would be of considerable value.

    1. Re:Payloads? Here's what I would like to see. by photonic · · Score: 1

      As you said, the low density of air at Mars might be a problem. The theoretical maximum power that can be harvested with a wind turbine is P = 1/2 * rho * A * V^3. Some numbers from Nasa show that the density rho is about 1% of the value on Earth, and an average speed of 10 m/s (around 5 Beaufort) is also not exceptional. Finally, you will need a relatively big mechanical device, which is hard to build light and reliable, since it has to survive a rocket launch.

      --
      karma police: arrest this man, he talks in maths; he buzzes like a fridge, he's like a detuned radio. [radiohead]
    2. Re:Payloads? Here's what I would like to see. by arglebargle_xiv · · Score: 1

      Could is suggest Asa Dotzler as a payload? I'm sure most Firefox users would happily chip in to send him there.

    3. Re:Payloads? Here's what I would like to see. by DerekLyons · · Score: 1

      Neither of your payloads need to go Mars. For the first, all the requisite conditions save gravity can be simulated here on Earth. (And if you must simulate gravity, it will be far cheaper to send a centrifuge to LEO.) For the second, all the requisite data is available and merely awaits someone with a computer and some spare time to write the simulation.

      And that's real science is done - small scale tests and simulations first to determine if it's even worth it to try larger scale experiments. What you propose is how a fifth grader, or the Mars One staff, thinks science is done.

    4. Re:Payloads? Here's what I would like to see. by wierd_w · · Score: 1

      Who said anything about the first being an experiment?

      The experiments you proposed (in a test lab, and in LEO) have already been conducted, which is why I suggested THOSE PARTICULAR ORGANISMS. At this point, the only remaining experiment to see if those organisms could indeed survive in that environment is to send them to that environment and see. However, I did not really intend it as an experiment, I intended it as a precolony groundwork initiative. As I said, a simplistic biosphere could be created, which would radically assist a fledgling colony site.

      AND, as I stated initially, it is also the kind of thing that would make the international planetary society come out of their skins, because it would contaminate the purity of mars irrevocably. (then again, MarsONE in general would do that also.)

      As for the latter, There's a reason we are still sending spectrometers and chemistry labs to mars. We can simulate the albedo and density of martian regolith, and to a limited extent, we can also simulate the mean bulk chemical constituents, but that does not mean that the regolith simulants produced in a lab will have the same engineering properties of real martial regolith. Such things as the shape of the particles, the reactivity of saline particles in the regolith, and interactions with seasonal dry ice formations on wind diverting surfaces all pose significant engineering challenges to long-term constructions on Mars, which you have so blithely hand-swept away as being answerable with simple models. Here's a hint, we have known about waves and wave mechanics for years, but we still build and use wave tanks, and still do tests in oceans for experimental ocean craft. Theoretical models only can give you what is permissible by the model's constraints. REAL science is conducted against REALITY, not models.

  13. Tommy Ramone by statemachine · · Score: 1

    Perfect opportunity. He would've loved the idea.

  14. BS! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Informative

    Why do news sites keep posting these scammers press releases?! This project is such stupid, pandering bullshit.

  15. What lander ? by itzly · · Score: 2

    The Mars One web site is awfully sketchy about the details. If I had a multi million dollar payload, I'd like to see some more details of the design, especially if they're promising to take heavy payloads to the surface.

  16. Attention something something clowns by tgv · · Score: 4, Insightful

    When are people going to stop paying attention to these clowns? How are they going to launch in 4 years without having working prototypes right now, nor a lot of money? Or are they going to sell 100M mugs in the coming months?

  17. Vote Them Off The Planet by TheLink · · Score: 2

    1) Make a reality TV show: Vote Them Off The Planet
    2) Vote people off the planet with one way and return categories. whether for real or not doesn't matter, but if for real you can have the option for people to only do the one way when they want to pay for the return leg.
    3) Profit!

    --
  18. Huh what? by Spy+Handler · · Score: 1

    A Mars landing will cost hundreds of millions, even if these experiment payloads are small. How exactly are they gonna come up with that kind of money? Skimming through TFA didn't reveal any details.

    Is this like, put out a bunch of press releases to get publicity, then hope Paul Allen or some other billionaire will fund it? Because the kind of budget they will need is a wee bit out of Kickstarter territory.

    1. Re: Huh what? by itzly · · Score: 1

      We are talking about opening up an entire new world

      It would be orders of magnitude easier to survive in the Gobi desert, and still I don't see a great rush to move in.

  19. Payback time by Lost+Penguin · · Score: 1

    Illudium Q-36 Explosive Space Modulator

    --
    I am the unwilling control for my Origin.
  20. B-Arc by rossdee · · Score: 1

    Lets start with Congress, they don't seem to be doing anything useful on this planet..

  21. "Marketing and publicity campaigns"? by Suffering+Bastard · · Score: 1

    Great, now we're going to start spreading our rampant advertising infection to other planets. Is there anywhere advertising can't go?

    --
    "Molest me not with this pocket calculator stuff."
    - Deep Thought
  22. Life on Mars by penguinoid · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I'm somewhat pleasantly surprised at the number of posts suggesting that we send living things to Mars, but also concerned that no one is suggesting some caution. Those who know a little about the history of bacterial discovery should know that it is fiendishly difficult to test for the presence of life, even here on Earth with organisms we are rather familiar with. Some bacteria we only know about because they showed up on DNA fishing expeditions, even though they've been under our feet the whole time. There could be bacteria under our feet we don't know about, if it either wasn't DNA/RNA based, or if it had sufficiently aggressive DNA/RNA hydrolysis enzymes, or had a sufficiently small geographic distribution.

    As I understand it, we're still at the point that if Mars can sustain life we can't ascertain whether it has any. (And if it can't sustain life, there's no point in sending some to die.) Even if there's no life on Mars, there's still the fact that we don't know much about what an abiotic planet looks like. Studying a properly dead planet will help us in our future search for life.

    Furthermore, I'm not certain we want to send photosynthetic organisms there for terraforming purposes, given that we need to increase greenhouse gasses like CO2 there to warm the place. (Also, we don't think the surface is survivable, and the sub-surface has less light -- so if we want surviving life, we should send chemotrophs).

    --
    Don't waste your vote! Vote for whoever you want, unless you live in a swing state it won't matter anyways
  23. "first, unmanned, lander, targeted for 2018," by exploder · · Score: 1

    I think you can fit at least two more commas in there.

    --
    Yo dawg, I heard you like the Ackermann function, so OH GOD OH GOD OH GOD
  24. Are you really that fucking stupid? by DerekLyons · · Score: 1

    The experiments you proposed (in a test lab, and in LEO) have already been conducted

    Not in partial G in LEO they haven't.
     

    As for the latter, There's a reason we are still sending spectrometers and chemistry labs to mars. We can simulate the albedo and density of martian regolith, and to a limited extent, we can also simulate the mean bulk chemical constituents, but that does not mean that the regolith simulants produced in a lab will have the same engineering properties of real martial regolith.

    Did you even remember what you wrote? The second "experiment" had to do with wind, not regolith.
     

    Here's a hint, we have known about waves and wave mechanics for years, but we still build and use wave tanks, and still do tests in oceans for experimental ocean craft.

    We use wave tanks to test things about waves that are very inconvenient or impossible to test at full scale. (Neither of these things have anything to do with your proposed experiments.) And yes, we still do tests in ocean for experimental craft, but they almost never have to do with the bits that can be tested in a wave tank because there's a bunch of bits that can't be tested in a wave tank. (And again, this has nothing to do with either of your proposed "experiments".)

    Here's a hint for you: You're a clueless moron who think that using big words means you're intelligent. You're wrong on that count - all it does is prove you're a parrot that can repeat things it has no capability of understanding.

    1. Re:Are you really that fucking stupid? by wierd_w · · Score: 1

      Not in partial G in LEO they haven't.

      Yes, actually they HAVE.

      Tardigrades in space:
      http://www.newscientist.com/ar...

      Algae in space:
      http://phys.org/news/2014-05-a...

      Did you even remember what you wrote? The second "experiment" had to do with wind, not regolith.

      Yes. I Do. Quoted below, with emphasis, because you apparently cannot read.

      Data on how much energy is reasonably able to be extracted, so that ideally sized generation systems can be designed, and data on rates of wind blown particle erosion on those devices would be of considerable value.

      Also, dune migration and wind blown particle accumulation is one of those things, like waves in a large ocean, that is very difficult to model. This is why data from the actual target environment is actually needed, and why I suggested it. The total theoretical energy is indeed calculable by formula using known data, which I nodded to when I asserted that the low atmospheric pressure posed a significant obstacle, but data collected from the other parts I mentioned, specifically in relation to the particle erosion behaviors for fixed mast objects designed to redicrect airflow, would still be of very significant value.

      Now kindly stop being an asshole.