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Satellite Images Show Russians Shelling Ukraine
U.S. officials today made public satellite imagery which they say proves that Russian forces have been shelling eastern Ukraine in a campaign to assist rebel groups fighting Ukraine’s government.
The U.S. Office of the Director of National Intelligence, which released the civilian-taken satellite images Sunday, said they show visual evidence that Russia has been firing shells across the border at Ukrainian military forces. Officials also said the images show that Russia-backed separatists have used heavy artillery, provided by Russia, in attacks on Ukrainian forces from inside Ukraine.
One image dated July 25/26 shows what DNI claims is “ground scarring” on the Russian side of the border from artillery aimed at Ukrainian military units in Ukraine, as well as the resultant ground craters on the Ukrainian side of the border:
The side that apparently blew a 300-civilian passenger jet out of the sky because they're too dumb to know what a Boeing looks like is getting direct military support from a major regional power which just happens to have nuclear weapons.
And I thought my hometown of Detroit was fucked.
With the UK and Scotland, no politician's life depends on the outcome. Whatever happens with the Scottish referendum, the people in office now expect to eventually depart from office and enter some cushy retirement position.
With Russia, Putin cannot afford to back down from a display of military might: it keeps his support among the masses high, and intimidates other post-Soviet states like Kazakhstan, Kyrgyzstan and Tajikistan which he hopes to bring into his Eurasian Union. If Putin were to back down and support a peaceful resolution whose outcome might not satisfy Russian nationalists, he could find himself out of power. It's not a matter of him being done in by the West like a Saddam or Milosevic; that claim of Western conspiracy against him is just played for the cameras. The fact is that he's got enough enemies within Russian elite circles, he's pissed too many people off, that if his hold on power weakens, he'll certainly end up imprisoned or dead.
I bet you could not tell the difference between a civilian plane and a military plane flying at 30,000 feet over a war zone either.
I bet he can't tell them apart either, but I also bet he wouldn't fire a missile at it. *Firing a missile anyway* is the important thing here, not a failure to identify the aircraft.
Wreck their economy. It worked once and the way Russia acts it would work again, no doubt. Russia has only a GDP a little better than Italy and less than Germany, France or the UK. They are utterly weak and exactly because they know it they have to act like a bully. Russia is a dwarf trying to convince itself it is a giant by making others think it is.
The reason we're still "blathering about non-existant [sic] WMDS" is because "WMD" is a shorthand for "nukes". The yellowcake uranium evidence, the aluminum tubes that "were intended as components of centrifuges to enrich uranium", the quote "we don't want the smoking gun to be a mushroom cloud".
All of the WMD arguments for war were in the context of nukes, not chemical weapons.
So yes, you're technically correct - which is the best kind of correct - but you're also missing the point. None of the WMDs that we were warned about were found.
Not to mention if chemical weapons were a casus belli, just about every country in the world would be a legitimate target.
Last post!
Mid-east fighting, 2000 years and going strong. Yes, clearly not having peace there is Obama's fault...
I just don't get this bravado from some Americans that think we should be directly involved in every conflict around the globe. Ironically, all these global conflicts are a huge drain on the national treasury. Can't cut the budgets and join a few wars at the same time.
"Action without philosophy is a lethal weapon; philosophy without action is worthless."
* Gaza can send thousands of rockets targeting Israeli citizens and they won't even say a word.
Affects Americans right now? -- no. Is there a clear course of action in this conflict that will be best for America in the future? -- no.
* Iran can make nuclear weapons and they won't even say a word.
Affects Americans right now? -- no. Is there a clear course of action in this conflict that will be best for America in the future? -- no.
* Russia can take over Crimea and they get bashed harshly with... a speech.
Affects Americans right now? -- no. Is there a clear course of action in this conflict that will be best for America in the future? -- no.
*ISIS can take over Iraq and kill thousands and they won't say a word.
Affects Americans right now? -- no. Is there a clear course of action in this conflict that will be best for America in the future? -- no.
Now here's a bullet point that you didn't mention:
* Ubiquitous healthcare for Americans
Affects Americans right now? -- YES! Was it a clear course of action that will be best for America in the future? -- YES!
As an Eastern European, all I could tell you is: you're so very wrong.
NOBODY in Eastern Europe is believing the Russians. We all know better, after being under their boot for 45 years or so.
...gis sdrawkcab (usually not responding to ACs; don't bother posting as AC)
Putin is an idiot. He started playing games with Ukraine and never saw the long game.
Doubtful this evidence is fabricated. The US isn't going to fabricate evidence that can be corroborated by others independently. Its not like any of those images are too small for Google Earth. The EU, China, Japanese, and all even some commercial interests have satellites that can see the same thing. Now the US has told them where to look, others can see for themselves. Nobody (except maybe Pravda) has called BS on this.
But the Russians may be right about a US lead smear campaign..... This is all about sanctions by the EU, which is really all about who sells the EU Natural Gas. The US has some serious gas reserves that is itching to sell for good money. Hard to do if EU is purchasing from Gazprom.
But this is all on Putin. If he didn't provide the smear material, the US couldn't use it.
Don't forget all the ones with an Su25 being involved in shooting it down (haha).
I love how all these conspiracy nuts paint the US govt as some scheming Machiavellian mastermind, when the reality is that they keep getting caught unprepared with their pants down whenever some unanticipated international development happens.
Ahhh but the nutjobs will claim "that it is all part of the deception!"
You're jumping from Russia trying to annex Ukraine to Russia trying to invade Alaska. They're more likely to send the tanks rolling into Germany first, and they'll probably annex China long before then.
Russia vs Ukraine is like most of the wars the US has gotten into over the last 20 years - find some little country and push it around since it can't really do anything to hurt you back. Russia doesn't have the navy to threaten the US in a serious way in a conventional war, and the reverse is definitely not the case. There is little reason for Russia to get into a shooting war with the US, and certainly no reason for the US to get into a shooting war with Russia either.
I think the Europeans are making the bigger mistake here, but this is one big case of short-term thinking. Nobody wants to suffer the short-term loss to deal with Russia, and everybody is likely to take advantage of their neighbors if they try to do something about it. If the US cuts off all loans to Russia, the London banks will just step in to make a fortune in their place, etc.
And I cannot wait to learn who really shot down MH 17.
I usually don't take sides, but it must be the side who doesn't let anybody else approach and destroys the evidence?
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