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Fortune.com: Blame Tech Diversity On Culture, Not Pipeline

FrnkMit writes: Challenging a previous Code.org story on tech diversity, a Forbes.com writer interviewed 716 women who left the technology field. Her conclusion: corporate culture, and the larger social structure, is the primary cause for these women leaving the industry and never looking back. Specific issues include a lack of maternity policies in small companies, low pay which barely covers day care, "jokes" from male coworkers, and always feeling like the "odd duck." In reality, there are probably many intertwined causes: peer pressure at the high-school and college level, female-unfriendly geek culture, low pay, a lack of accommodations for pregnant/nursing mothers, the myth of "having it all," stereotype threat, and repeated assertions that women aren't biologically suited to writing software and therefore there's no problem at all.

7 of 342 comments (clear)

  1. Not where *I* work. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Informative

    We have two female programmers on our team of 10 devs (total). They are paid equivalently to the males, receive the same training opportunities, and each holds expert status in some region of our offerings. The men do not joke about about them (I would know, being one of the male devs and all, I would hear it). If that kind of thing started up it would be nipped in the bud......as it was a few years ago when we hired, then shortly thereafter fired, a guy who turned out to be outright misogynistic.

    I am not denying the trend in the industry, I am just pointing out that there *are* places that refuse to hire unprofessional jerks, and will treat all their employees with respect.

  2. Re:Most women are INSANELY good at tech... by itzly · · Score: 4, Informative

    There's plenty of design work at the lower levels where you don't need to know what appeals to the masses. In fact, that's going to be most of the work. Squeezing an extra 0.1 dB of sensitivity out of the RF receiver path, for instance.

  3. Re:Maternity Leave. by Livius · · Score: 3, Informative

    In civilized countries they already do.

  4. Re:Maternity Leave. by amyckono · · Score: 3, Informative

    My husband gets paternity leave, so yes, some companies are very into equality. He works for a large, global company, so maybe some of those European practices have rubbed off. It's funny because most people see the company as an evil slave-driver, but their policies are actually rather enlightened.

  5. Re:Bullshit. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Informative

    This is now mostly just sour grapes on the part of women. I should know, I'm a woman who went into tech almost 40 years ago. Things have improved so vastly over those years that it's become clear to me that we women are the ones holding ourselves back now.

    Why do I say this? Because it seems like all we're doing is complaining these days. We even ridicule our own kind just as much as the men apparently do. Hell, I still get exasperated looks from younger women who can't believe I would get a job with computers... and not because they're worried about sexism. I even get dirty looks from girls who think that me joking around with men diminishes me, without even realizing that I've just met the men halfway, and they've responded in turn to accommodate me (no one ever seems to care about that part of the equation).

    No, the real problem is that not enough women are willing to get tech jobs. If you want to change a culture you have to change the culture, not wait for it to change for you. Men and companies have played a tremendous part in changing themselves over the years, and now it's time for women to stop blaming others and pick up the slack themselves. Come on sisters, some of us have been fighting this fight for decades. Time to join Rosie in numbers, or just drop the charade that we would, if only we could.

    Girls in tech, if you think you have it bad, think about all the crap I went through back in the day in addition to what you're dealing with. And I'm not exactly the most tomboyish adrenaline junkie out there, I'm just a gal who looked past societal gender roles and decided that I'd like a decent wage working with computers, because they were actually pretty interesting. If I can do it, so can you. If you don't want to "suffer" the lowest levels of sexism in the field to date (and lots of other male-dominated fields) that's fine, but don't just pretend it's someone else's fault that the field isn't changing as quickly as you'd like it to.

  6. Re:Low pay? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Informative

    And speaking as a murse, you can expect lower pay since there are disciplines you are verboten to work in unless you are gay, so there are gaps in your experience. Hell, there is sweet clinic position I am disallowed to work simply because I am male (oh noes, sexual impropriety, except the last three people who were fired for that have all been female). And no use complaining that it is sexual discrimination, especially when your employer is the government and sets the rules (really, you should read the handbook that justifies this, stating female patients would be more comfortable with other female nurses, but no same consideration given to male patients. Unless they are Muslim. Then it becomes a religious issue).

    You can expect the same jeers and jibes about your capabilities from your female co-workers, and you can expect to be called on to deal with the obese and violent patients or otherwise lift anything heavier than a stack of papers. You are also tagged to cover for everyone else's maternity leave or sick child call-ins, meanwhile it takes a near act of congress to take you own leave for an eye operation while your co-workers get medical leave for a boob job (I am not making this up).

    You are also expected to police the work environment for any signs of sexual harassment, but you are shit out of luck to get the same consideration from your female staff. Oh, and you can expect to have your budget slashed so a room can be remodeled for any nursing mothers to operate their breast pumps (apparently a private bathroom is degrading) while needed repairs to the call light system is put on hold.

    On the plus side, nearly all the supervisors are male since even female nurses find them less capricious and easier to deal with. But this is obviously a sure sign of a glass ceiling.

    Welcome ladies to being the odd man out. It isn't any easier over here.

  7. Re:Bullshit. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

    Despite caring being perceived as a normal and natural expression of one’s humanity as a complete person, whether as male or female, “men are viewed as sexualised in predatory ways in our culture” (King, 1998, p. 76). For example, one expression of care, notably hugging, is regarded ambivalently in the wider society: “Society allows men to hug children at home. But outside of home, men don’t hug children or other men. They hug women” (King, 1998, p. 79). This ambivalent attitude toward men expressing care in physical ways (hugging, hand holding, permitting a person to sit on their lap) means that men who choose to work in elementary classroom contexts with children are monitored. Male teachers seen by others as performing atypical gender-identified behavior for men are marginalized and treated with suspicion (King, 1998).

    Source: Hanson, P., & Mulholland, J. A. (2005). Caring and Elementary Teaching: The Concerns of Male Beginning Teachers.

    In this study, the author used ethnographic and focus group interviews to examine the lived experiences of men who teach in the primary grades. Several themes arose from the men's narratives. First, the men are under closer scrutiny than their women peers regarding contact with the children. Second, there is considerable ambiguity regarding the kind of “male role model” the men feel they are expected to portray. Third, there is a sexual division of labor that reinforces the image of men as having different teaching styles than women teachers. In response to the cumulative effects of these phenomena, the men must adopt compensatory behaviors causing them to unintentionally reproduce traditional forms of masculinity.

    Source: Sargent, P. (2000). Real Men or Real Teachers? Contradictions in the Lives of Men Elementary Teachers.

    One of the common reasons given for this, including within the Male Teachers' Strategy, is that many men have a fear of false paedophilia accusations. The response of Education Queensland is to suggest setting up a support framework for teachers who are accused of sexual misconduct. While false claims of sexual abuse are devastating to those accused, there is little in this strategy that will help to develop challenging attitudes to the creation of this fear. The fear is most pervasive when men move in to non-masculinized areas of the curriculum and/or schooling sector. For example, when men move into early childhood their motives are often questioned (King, 2000, p. 9; see also Murray, 1996; Smedley, 1998; Sumsion, 1999). Such work is constructed within patriarchal societies as women's work and is devalued. The consequence of this is that men who want to teach young children risk being positioned as deviant, abnormal or lacking. That is, they are at risk of being seen as gay, 'effeminate' or a paedophile.

    The risk that men pose to children in early childcare, and other educational settings, however, is an important topic that should not be trivialized (see Skelton, 1994; Cameron et al., 1999, chapter 7). There has been a significant amount of feminist political work carried out to get the issue of child sexual abuse on to the political agenda (see, for example, Kelly, 1988; Scutt, 1990; Segal, 1990). This work has seen the development of a number of institutions and legislation designed to protect children-in Queensland the Child Protection Act 1999 is one such law. It would be unfortunateif much of this work was undone in an attempt to attract more male teachers into the system. Rather, what is needed is not so much greater protection for men accused of sexual abuse of students, but rather a more thoughtful response. This would acknowledge that particular men, practising specific masculinities