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How English Beat German As the Language of Science

HughPickens.com writes German was the dominant scientific language in 1900. Today if a scientist is going to coin a new term, it's most likely in English. And if they are going to publish a new discovery, it is most definitely in English. Look no further than the Nobel Prize awarded for physiology and medicine to Norwegian couple May-Britt and Edvard Moser. Their research was written and published in English. How did English come to dominate German in the realm of science? BBC reports that the major shock to the system was World War One, which had two major impacts. According to Gordin, after World War One, Belgian, French and British scientists organized a boycott of scientists from Germany and Austria. They were blocked from conferences and weren't able to publish in Western European journals. "Increasingly, you have two scientific communities, one German, which functions in the defeated [Central Powers] of Germany and Austria, and another that functions in Western Europe, which is mostly English and French," says Gordin.

The second effect of World War One took place in the US. Starting in 1917 when the US entered the war, there was a wave of anti-German hysteria that swept the country. In Ohio, Wisconsin and Minnesota there were many, many German speakers. World War One changed all that. "German is criminalized in 23 states. You're not allowed to speak it in public, you're not allowed to use it in the radio, you're not allowed to teach it to a child under the age of 10," says Gordin. The Supreme Court overturned those anti-German laws in 1923, but for years they were the law of the land. What that effectively did, according to Gordin, was decimate foreign language learning in the US resulting in a generation of future scientists who came of age with limited exposure to foreign languages. That was also the moment, according to Gordin, when the American scientific establishment started to take over dominance in the world. "The story of the 20th Century is not so much the rise of English as the serial collapse of German as the up-and-coming language of scientific communication," concludes Gordin.

21 of 323 comments (clear)

  1. WWII proably didn't help much either by NotDrWho · · Score: 3, Insightful

    ...unless you're willing to hold your nose on where you get your rocket scientists.

    --
    SJW's don't eliminate discrimination. They just expropriate it for themselves.
    1. Re:WWII proably didn't help much either by rwa2 · · Score: 3, Interesting

      And yet the funny / ironic thing is the Werner von Braun orchestrated a surrender of his team to the US instead of the rapidly advancing Russian forces due to religious reasons... he would prefer the German rocket scientists fall into the hands of Christians instead of atheists.

      The ensuing space race / cold war could have turned out much differently.

    2. Re:WWII proably didn't help much either by LWATCDR · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Not really von Braun did more as political figure than as an engineer. The Thor, Atlas, and Titan had very little input from von Braun and Polaris and Minuteman had zero.
      I doubt that religion had much to do with it. I am sure avoiding being slaves in Russia had a lot more to do with it.

      --
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    3. Re:WWII proably didn't help much either by pegdhcp · · Score: 3, Funny

      Yes otherwise Soviets would be first to send a satellite into the orbit and a human to the space. Also USA would be in need of Soviet rockets to send their astronauts to the ISS as of now... Ah, wait, I was trying to see what is happening in an alternate reality and suddenly a paradox occurred I guess.Sorry guys...

    4. Re:WWII proably didn't help much either by Hognoxious · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Bollocks. It's just a coincidence that two different ways of making a choice lead to the same outcome.

      It's like arguing that x^2 and 2x are the same because it happens to work if x == 2.

      --
      Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
  2. German illegal? by deadweight · · Score: 4, Insightful

    German was *illegal*?? WF? All the current "this politician has totally undermined the constitution in ways never seem before" crap must come from people with short memories.

    1. Re:German illegal? by ShanghaiBill · · Score: 4, Insightful

      FYI, most people weren't even born in 1923 when it was overturned.

      People should be able to use books, or the internet, to learn about things from other eras. The point is that claiming "things are worse than ever" is pretty silly in a country where it used to be common for people to own slaves.

    2. Re:German illegal? by Hadlock · · Score: 4, Informative

      My grandparents are 82 and I only learned last year (at age 30) that they both speak fluent German.They changed the spelling of their last name and learned English due to social pressures. This was in a predominantly German-speaking rural Texas community surrounded by other German-speaking communities*, I can only imagine how badly speaking German was stigmatized in urban academic circles. This is a real thing.
       
      *Texas has it's own recognized dialect of German, look it up on Wikipedia

      --
      moox. for a new generation.
    3. Re:German illegal? by Jason+Levine · · Score: 3, Informative

      The history of the US is filled with great moments, but also with horrible moments. There's also the Japanese internment during WW2 and the Ludlow Massacre where striking workers and their families were killed by company militia and National Guard troops.

      --
      My sci-fi novel, Ghost Thief, is now available from Amazon.com.
    4. Re:German illegal? by bobbied · · Score: 5, Interesting

      The USA has not always walked worthy of the document that started it all (The Declaration of Independence) but we are generally progressing towards the realization of it's principles.

      Did we have slaves? Initially, yes. However, we did fight a bloody civil war in the 1860's and managed to abolish it in our laws. Tens of thousands of lives, both white and black where lost in this war. The USA paid in blood to do right.

      Did we illegally arrest and hold Japanese Americans during WWII? Yes, but we have recognized that it was wrong and done what we can to restore what was lost.

      Did we take territory from Mexico during a war? Of course, during the war we actually took ALL of Mexico, seems to me we gave a lot of it back and I'd bet that the people who live there now wish we had kept it all. Also don't forget that this war was to protect the disputed areas called Texas which had already declared it's independence and then joined the Union in 1845. Territory that had gone though multiple country's hands, including France, Spain before Mexico ended up with it. But this war was initiated by Mexico's attacks, and when the USA totally defeated Mexico, we gave most of it back to them.

      Civil rights laws have (as a matter of law) established equal rights for all Americans. We may not have lived up to that ideal, but it is ILLEGAL to discriminate based on race or gender. Any failure to meet that ideal needs to be subject to legal action and dealt with in the courts.

      How all this says that the USA is a bad place is beyond me. Are we perfect? No. But we are advancing closer to the ideal expressed in our founding document. "We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness." We need to keep advancing on the ideal set forth in the Declaration of Independence and should not abandon our past by declaring the USA a lost cause. Because it will only truly be a lost cause if we give up.

      --
      "File to fit, pound to insert, paint to match" - Aircraft Maintenance 101
    5. Re:German illegal? by bobbied · · Score: 3, Interesting

      One small correction... We returned a LOT of Mexico, but not MOST of it after the war. The USA kept 55% or so but the land was seen as worthless, having little water. However, in the treaty that ended the war we did pay some of their debts and damages. Also, any citizens of Mexico where offered relocation from the territory if they wanted to stay in Mexico. If they stayed, they where given immediate US citizenship including the right to vote.

      --
      "File to fit, pound to insert, paint to match" - Aircraft Maintenance 101
    6. Re:German illegal? by bobbied · · Score: 3, Insightful

      There are two sides to every conflict. However, in this case it is clear that Mexico "fired the first shot" as it where, by engaging their military outside their country and attacking a US patrol in Texas, killing 16. War was declared on both sides and the conflict lasted about 18 months with the total capture of ALL of Mexico by the USA.

      I'm sure the Mexican view is quite different, given that they still had not recognized the independence of Texas, but their surrender and subsequent sale of additional land to the USA makes the border between our two countries pretty much a settled issue at this point. Those who complain about it now are misguided and unfairly maligning the USA's actions.

      --
      "File to fit, pound to insert, paint to match" - Aircraft Maintenance 101
    7. Re:German illegal? by cjsm · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Also don't forget that this war was to protect the disputed areas called Texas which had already declared it's independence and then joined the Union in 1845.

      American settlers in Texas, with U.S. support, declared independence from Mexico to protect slavery, which was illegal in Mexico. Nothing noble about that.

      Did we take territory from Mexico during a war? Of course, during the war we actually took ALL of Mexico, seems to me we gave a lot of it back

      We let them keep half their country? Aren't we special! I guess if Russia took all of the Ukraine and gave half of it back, they'd be wonderful too.

      I'd bet that the people who live there now wish we had kept it all

      Mexico would be much wealthier country if we hadn't taken half of their territory. Not to mention the constant meddling of the United States in Mexican affairs. As Mexican President Porfirio Diaz said: "Poor Mexico, so far from God and so close to the United States!"

      --
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  3. death of German math by phantomfive · · Score: 5, Interesting

    I read Turing's Cathedral recently that discussed this exact topic (with relation to math). German was still very strong after WW1 (Godel, Von Neumann, Hilbert, Einstein, Schrödinger and even more if you include groups like Hungary and Poland who were strong in math but discussed it in German, which is where we got Ulam and Teller). Unfortunately for the Germans, a lot of those mathematicians were Jewish, and they left when they saw war coming. Most of Ulam's family that didn't leave were killed in the Holocaust.

    In the US, some foresighted individuals (like Veblen, Aydeloytte and Flexner at Princeton's Advanced Institute especially) made a huge effort to help the German scientists escape. So many top scientists did leave that the entire center of science moved from the German world to America.

    --
    "First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
  4. German science... by Savage-Rabbit · · Score: 3, Informative

    One can dump on the Germans as much as one wants but both during WWI and WWII they matched and in some fields outdid the allies in technology and scientific research despite these boycotts, despite the isolation and despite the stultifying effect that the Nazi regime had on parts of the German tech sector which says something about the caliber of German science, scientists and engineers. As late as the 1950s the chief designer of North American Aviation went to night school in order to learn German so that he might study German aerodynamics research more in more detail. This resulted in the complete redesign of the aircraft that was to be come the world beating North American F-86.

    --
    Only to idiots, are orders laws.
    -- Henning von Tresckow
  5. Re:Same old American Xenophobia by DNS-and-BIND · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Isn't it odd that no matter how much progress America makes, the Left is always ready with a cutting criticism? Even considering that up until recently, new immigrants were expected to assimilate into the existing society, instead of having exceptions made for them?

    Go ahead and try that bullshit anywhere else in the world. How welcoming is Egypt to new people? Nigeria? China? Thailand? Oh, but America somehow fails to live up to an imaginary ideal that NOBODY IN THE WORLD does, so that's wrong and we should hate Americans for that.

    --
    Shutting down free speech with violence isn't fighting fascism. It IS fascism!
  6. my rant... by bkmoore · · Score: 4, Funny

    My Herrschaft, German really is such a Biedermeier language and and doesn't fit with the current Zeitgeist. It has a gestalt that is more suited for 19th century expression. After the English-language Blitzkrieg that has taken over most pop culture, any german-language expression is seen as just a lot of flak from a karabiner. I guess we'll have to replace classical german terms such as Herz, Eigen-vector, E-Modul, with a more english ideal; cycles-per-second (so much for brevity). But German is such a beautiful language an sich. I really had my Aha-Erlebnis when I realised that german expressions were no longer associated with übermenschen traveling in U-Boots or flying in Luftwaffe planes. Now the whole world can enjoy rooting for German Wunderkinder on the national team, and at home recreate the best parts playing foosball. Maybe the French feel a bit of Schadenfreude at seeing the significant influence of german Gedanken in the english language. Maybe someday they'll be a putsch and French will take over, but for now, I'm counting on a german-language encore.

  7. Re:Same old American Xenophobia by king+neckbeard · · Score: 4, Interesting

    I would say that melting pot works better than multiculturalism, and it also happens at the genetic level. Most Americans are mutts, which isn't as common elsewhere AFAIK.

    --
    This is my signature. There are many like it, but this one is mine.
  8. Re: I am SHOCKED! by brainnolo · · Score: 3, Informative

    I am a native Italian speaker, but speak Russian, German and English daily. German is by no means the best language when it comes to being both precise and concise. The cup for that goes to Russian hands down. Both Germans and Russians express themselves very clearly and unambiguously (well, when they need to) but Russian sentences are shorter on average. Italian, on the other hand, is either ambiguous (relies on context a lot) or very verbose if you cannot allow yourself to be misunderstood.

    Regarding how it sounds, German is terrible but at least is generally easier to understand than English for a foreigner (some Americans seem to have a damn frog in their throat). Unless you made the mistake to speak to an old Bayern, then you might as well pretend to be deaf. Italian is generally pleasant (even the dialects) and Russian can be very pleasant, if spoken by a well educated person, or extremely rude and unpleasant if spoken by a gopnik.

  9. And what does this mean? by joh · · Score: 4, Insightful

    It means that Germans are able to read German stuff AND English stuff while many scientists from the US are just able to read English things.

    By the way, learning a second language as early and thoroughly as possible does something to you. It breaks the unconscious 1:1 connection between concepts and words and makes you understand that even the best language is just a poor crutch. There have been countless studies about that. It even helps a lot with not reacting by instinct to things you hear and read because you have learned to differentiate between words and meanings and helps you to grow a kind of conscious processing layer between them. I've learned to never trust the words of someone who knows only one language. Chances are that most of what he treats as thoughts are just unconscious reactions. Things like knowing that the word "freedom" has the same roots as the German "Frieden" ("peace" as opposed to "war") actually helps you with understanding the world instead of just parroting noises.

    Not so long ago you would never have been considered educated if you couldn't read and write at least two, maybe three or four languages. And I think there's more to that than just quantity. It's a bit like being able to see with two eyes instead of one, you gain the insight that there's actual a room in front of you and not just a picture. It adds a quality that is very hard to acquire when words, ideas and concepts are all the same to you in a totally unconscious way that you soaked up mostly in childhood (basically very much like an animal).

    So: I think that learning a second language may easily be the most important thing you can learn in the long run.

  10. Re:Germany had the last laugh... by AthanasiusKircher · · Score: 4, Informative

    I always thought this rule was invented to make it easier for typesetters to distinguish the end of a sentence from abbreviations. Were the two spaces ever actually typeset?

    No, not quite.

    Early typesetting practices up to the late 1600s or so varied considerably according to local style. By the early 1700s, the standard practice emerged that larger spaces were placed after punctuation by typesetters to mark the ends of important parts of a sentence (which would allow readers to parse the meaning easier). The standard ultimately adopted in much of Europe was putting an M-quad (a square spacer the size of an 'M' in the font) after a period, an N-quad (the size of 'N', about half an M-quad) after lesser punctuation like commas, and a normal spacer (now called a "thick space") after words, which traditionally was about 1/3 of an em.

    Note that these were the way a typesetter would begin to space a line, but most typeset matter was justified, which means various spaces in the lines had to be modified and squeezed or stretched, which might in some cases involve adding extra spacers in places. (The rules for which spaces to add width to were often quite complex, for those typesetters who wanted to obtain an optimal result.)

    When typewriters first came into use in the late 1800s, people tried to imitate proper typesetting as best as they could by using 2 or 3 spaces after periods, and sometimes 2 spaces after other punctuation. Ultimately, the standard typesetting rule of 2 spaces after a period came about as an approximation to proper typeset text in the late 1800s.

    In the period of roughly the 1920s to 1960s, a little war among publishers to decrease publication costs in books led to poorer cheap materials being used, as well as anything to minimize costs, so interword spaces got squeezed to 1/4-em in many houses, margins got smaller, line spacing decreased, etc. Obviously the large sentence spaces now looked out of place, so they were also reduced gradually to an N-quad and then just a standard interword space. (This was previously known as "French spacing" -- not as anything to do with the Germans, as asserted by the GP. It was practiced in the 19th century in a small number of French publishing houses.)

    Meanwhile, typists were (and are) some of the few to attempt to retain the old larger sentence spaces that imitated the way things had been done in typesetting in the 18th and 19th centuries.