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Martin Jetpack Closer To Takeoff In First Responder Applications

Posted by samzenpus on from the when-you-have-to-get-there-in-a-hurry dept.

Zothecula writes Last year's redesign of the long-awaited Martin Jetpack was accompanied by plans to begin commercial sales in 2014, starting with emergency response services and individual sales to follow thereafter. The release date for the first responder Jetpack has since been revised to 2016, a prediction bolstered by the fresh announcement of a partnership between Martin Aircraft Company and US company Avwatch to develop air-based, first responder solutions for the US Department of Homeland Security and Department of Defense.

55 comments

  1. Consumer Warning by Freshly+Exhumed · · Score: 3, Funny

    Do Not Use Indoors

    --
    I deny that I have not avoided attaining the opposite of that which I do not want.
    1. Re:Consumer Warning by fustakrakich · · Score: 1

      Why not?

      --
      “He’s not deformed, he’s just drunk!”
  2. Not a jet pack by erice · · Score: 4, Informative

    Despite appearances, there is no "jet" or "rocket" engine. It is a pair of ducted fans driven by a four cylinder gasoline engine.

    It isn't a pack either. The weight of the machine is borne by a large frame that the pilot steps onto.

    It is really an odd sort of helicopter. It looks really cool and it is much more compact than a normal helicopter but it is not a jet-pack.

    1. Re:Not a jet pack by weiserfireman · · Score: 2

      I am trying to figure how this could be used by the Fire Service, in a first responder role.

      1. It doesn't look like it has the weight limit to do bucket drops for wildland firefighting
      2. It doesn't look like it has the weight limit to haul very much equipment
      3. It doesn't look like it could do any rescue
      4. At best, it looks like someone could scout the perimeter of a fire. For $200k, that is an awful expensive scout

      I see cops wanting this, but not the fire service

    2. Re:Not a jet pack by Radical+Moderate · · Score: 2

      Fire departments do a lot of EMT work. This would be a great tool for getting a medic to an injured person in rugged terrain. But aside from that, I'm not seeing it either. And your medic will need to be well-trained in flying this thing, or he'll need a medic. Training is expensive, combined with the cost of buying this thing the market for these seems pretty limited.

      In short, I don't see sales of this jet pack taking off.*ducks*

      --
      Never let a lack of data get in the way of a good rant.
    3. Re:Not a jet pack by jklovanc · · Score: 1

      This would be a great tool for getting a medic to an injured person in rugged terrain.

      As long as the following conditions exist;
      1. There is sufficient open flat ground for the rather large machine to land.
      2. The machine has the weight capacity to to carry the operator and all life saving equipment.
      3. The "rugged terrain" is within 15 km of the station. While the machine has range of 30km it has to get back to the station. Sure one could truck the machine closer to the accident but then a helicopter would probably be faster.

    4. Re:Not a jet pack by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      And your medic will need to be well-trained in flying this thing, or he'll need a medic.

      Especially when you bear in mind that "rugged terrain" can easily mean steep mountain slopes or forests, where safely landing will be a nightmare if not outright impossible, at which point isn't it easier and a lot more functional to just send a helicopter which can winch the EMTs down and the patient up?

      If you can fly one of these to a patient you can fly a helicopter there; a jetpacking EMT can only treat using the gear their jetpack can carry, the jetpack can't carry a patient *and* pilot at the same time and even if it could, the pilot would be too busy flying to keep an eye on the patient. A helicopter with a bigger payload, separate pilot/EMT crew and a winch fixes pretty much all of these issues. This thing also only seems to have a maximum range of 20 miles.

      Really neat as a concept, but not really at the practical stage.

    5. Re:Not a jet pack by The+Grim+Reefer · · Score: 1

      It is a pair of ducted fans driven by a four cylinder gasoline engine.

      I didn't see anything in the link that stated it was a 4 stroke engine. Do you have another link? This seems like a great application for a 2 stroke engine to me.

    6. Re:Not a jet pack by The+Grim+Reefer · · Score: 2

      I just looked at the "technical specifications" on their website. Near the bottom it lists the fuel and oil as gasoline and 2 stroke oil. It doesn't state the engine is actually a 2 stroke. But it most likely is.

    7. Re:Not a jet pack by xaotikdesigns · · Score: 1

      While the machine has to get back to the station, it doesn't need to fly there, and even if it does, more fuel could be brought in or the thing can be thrown on the back of a truck and hauled out of the woods. Likewise, this isn't supposed to bring in an entire operating room, it just needs bandages, some medication, and a few other items. They aren't trying to fix a broken leg here, just stop the bleeding or stabilize you long enough for the people that can get you out of there to arrive.

      --
      XDInd
    8. Re:Not a jet pack by The+Grim+Reefer · · Score: 3, Informative

      Sorry for replying to myself twice. But It was listed under the Engine section. It's a 200 HP 2 liter 2 stroke. and weighs 132 pounds. That would be one hell of a fun engine to have in a 1000 lb sports car. Or one for each wheel at that size. Except it needs to be overhauled every 100 hours of use. Probably less than that for ground use though.

    9. Re:Not a jet pack by DerekLyons · · Score: 1

      Fire departments do a lot of EMT work. This would be a great tool for getting a medic to an injured person in rugged terrain.

      But the grandparent's point's two and three still apply - a medic sans equipment and supplies isn't much better than no medic at all, and you still need to get the patient evacuated. And all that assumes you know where the injured person is in the first place...

      This jetpack really does look like it's mostly a solution in search of a problem.

    10. Re:Not a jet pack by pr0fessor · · Score: 1

      I thought it would be able to bypass traffic and get a first responder on the ground in a much shorter time even in an urban environment, when 3 or 4 minutes could be the difference between life or death. They may not be able to evacuate an injured person but they should be able to attempt to stabilize an injured person. {the article doesn't really mention lift capacity but I imagine it would have to be able to take some basic supplies}

    11. Re:Not a jet pack by tlhIngan · · Score: 1

      But the grandparent's point's two and three still apply - a medic sans equipment and supplies isn't much better than no medic at all, and you still need to get the patient evacuated. And all that assumes you know where the injured person is in the first place...

      Well, he can carry basic supplies.

      In a lot of cases, you just need a trained responder there ASAP while you dispatch a regular ambulance. Said ambulance can take easily 15-30 minutes to arrive even in an urban environment. The jetpack responder can be there within a few minutes, and being administering first aid.

      I mean, what's the point of learning to do CPR if you see someone collapse? You're likely not carrying medical supplies so you can't really help the guy by doing anything other than CPR. Yet, the CPR can keep the guy alive long enough so when emergency services arrives, the guy is actually alive rather than dead.

      Same goes with AEDs. Why do we wish for them everywhere?

      Minutes count, and if you can get the passer by to do some basic first aid for the jetpack responder to arrive who can do more advanced first aid while waiting for the ambulance. Plus, some physically heavy activities like CPR require a crew because it's tiring. Most people probably can't continue for 15 minutes waiting for emergency services. Having a medic as a relief is invaluable.

    12. Re:Not a jet pack by ArsonSmith · · Score: 1

      It's a jet pack, it will advance the tech used in first responders by making them have to rescue people from new and interesting places.

      --
      Paying taxes to buy civilization is like paying a hooker to buy love.
    13. Re:Not a jet pack by gl4ss · · Score: 2

      the use cases would be extremely, extremely limited.

      guess that's why they had to sign up homeland security to pay the bill with foot in mouth.

      if there's so little time that you can't get to the place by walking, from where you launch this, it's unlikely you can bring this thing near enough.

      if there's so little space around that you can't drop from a copter, unlikely that you can land this thing(cliff edge in the middle of a steep cliff or something - and really that's a quite rare case).

      if there's so bad visibility that you can't use the copter, it's unlikely you can use this.

      the only logical actual market for this thing is the personal relaxation extreme sports market.

      because really, it's just not something that you could keep in your usual kit with you 100% of time and will need regular maintenance and most of all it still needs a pilot.

      but anyhow, as it is it is pretty much just another +2 years addition to another jetpack, flying car etc project.

      --
      world was created 5 seconds before this post as it is.
    14. Re:Not a jet pack by Jesrad · · Score: 1

      I still wonder how hard it would be to just use a pair or triplet of AMT Titan microjet engines to make an actual jetpack ? That's the smaller-is-better approach "Jetman" has followed, with success.

      --
      Maybe we deserve this world ?
    15. Re:Not a jet pack by hackertourist · · Score: 1

      You can get various fun cars powered by motorbike engines these days. Several based on the old Lotus 7 (e.g. Westfield, Tiger) are in your 200 bhp/1000 lbs ballpark. Tiger do or did 2-engine versions (2WD, with one driving each rear wheel or 4WD, one per axle). You can even get a 2.8 litre V8 which is 2 Hayabusa blocks on a common crankshaft; with a supercharger if you wish. Hartley builds the engine, used by Radical and Ariel.

    16. Re:Not a jet pack by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      # of cylinders != strokes

      FFS.

    17. Re:Not a jet pack by The+Grim+Reefer · · Score: 1

      Yeah, I noticed that after posting, but didn't want to reply a third time to my own post.

  3. Oh lordy! by fustakrakich · · Score: 3, Informative

    You'd better listen to the noise. You definitely won't need a sireeen.

    --
    “He’s not deformed, he’s just drunk!”
    1. Re:Oh lordy! by cruff · · Score: 1

      Yes, the neighbors will love it when you take off in yours for work at 7 AM. It would be damn cool, though.

  4. first responder call... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

    911 DISPATCH: 911 What is your emergency?
    Person: There are 2 people here who need an ambulance!
    911 DISPATCH: OK We're sending over a First Responder!
    Person: OK
    WHOOSH...CRASH AHHHHHH!!
    Person: There are 3 people here who need an ambulance!

    1. Re:first responder call... by judoguy · · Score: 1

      No joke, unfortunately. A buddy of mine used to manage an air ambulance service for a large hospital. Mostly went alright, but every now and then the copter would go down. They flew at night sometimes, in mountainous terrain sometimes and in all kinds of weather. It was all too easy to hit a ridge or tower. Don't have to hit 'em hard either. A little unexpected nick of a tower or tree limb snag can be catastrophic.

      --
      Peace is easy to achieve, just surrender. Liberty is much harder get/keep.
  5. So...a leaf blower? by xxxJonBoyxxx · · Score: 2

    >> ducted fans driven by a four cylinder gasoline engine

    Yeah...the guy who blows the leaves off the parking lot has one of these too.

    1. Re:So...a leaf blower? by xaotikdesigns · · Score: 1

      A really big leaf blower

      --
      XDInd
  6. Disruptive If We Say So Ourselves by DumbSwede · · Score: 2

    "The Martin Jetpack is a disruptive technology, much like the helicopter was when first developed, with substantial capabilities which will be very complementary to our solutions we can offer our customers," says Avwatch

    Uhhh, I don’t think so. This is like an extremely small helicopter, there is little I can see it doing a helicopter couldn’t. What few things it might be able to do a copter couldn’t, remote control drones will soon be able to do.

    I don’t think the 60’s jetpack dream will ever be truly realized.

    --
    Letter To Iran
    1. Re:Disruptive If We Say So Ourselves by jeffmflanagan · · Score: 1

      >I don’t think the 60’s jetpack dream will ever be truly realized.

      I'm surprised to find the concept dates back to the 20s, although I had never seen one until viewing media from the mid-60s.
      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jet_pack#Andreyev

    2. Re:Disruptive If We Say So Ourselves by ArcadeMan · · Score: 1

      Anyway, jetpacks are old news now. What we want is whatever gear Lena Oxton is wearing.

      --
      Get free satoshi (Bitcoin) and Dogecoins
    3. Re:Disruptive If We Say So Ourselves by xaotikdesigns · · Score: 1

      Remote control drones could bring an EMT out into the middle of a forest where there isn't enough space to land a helicopter?

      --
      XDInd
    4. Re:Disruptive If We Say So Ourselves by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Landing is for chumps

      http://www.aviationspectator.com/files/images/HH-60-Jayhawk-helicopter-064.preview.jpg

    5. Re:Disruptive If We Say So Ourselves by DumbSwede · · Score: 1

      Strange, I thought I'd seen those basket lift contraptions used for years. Guess they quit making them.

      You say the emergency area is farther than 20 miles round trip? Too bad, a helicopter would never be able to go that far either I guess.

      --
      Letter To Iran
    6. Re: Disruptive If We Say So Ourselves by xaotikdesigns · · Score: 1

      There are places where even lowering a basket can be dangerous or difficult. I'm not saying every park service needs one, but it could have its uses.

      --
      XDInd
    7. Re: Disruptive If We Say So Ourselves by DumbSwede · · Score: 1

      (been on vacation)
      Sorry to have been snarky.

      But if the contraption can't lift both responder and victim out (like the basket can), then I really think this has limited use. I suspect the weight of two people and the geometry of the contraption make impractical for evacuation -- which is the most common rescue work I imagine.

      --
      Letter To Iran
  7. Not a disruptive technology by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

    with a limited range and load capability the small number of "rescue" missions it would be appropriate does not justify the cost. Except, they'll use taxpayer dollars.

    1. Re:Not a disruptive technology by green1 · · Score: 1

      You think any service that does rescue missions gets money for this sort of toy? not a chance. This will be used by DHS, Police, maybe even the TSA. But you won't see paramedics flying in one of these things.

    2. Re:Not a disruptive technology by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Can't wait to see the rates of civil forfeiture when this thing becomes available to buy for the emergency services in the US

    3. Re:Not a disruptive technology by sycodon · · Score: 1

      Maybe they can sell one of the Mine Resistant Anti-Armor vehicles.

      --
      When Fascism comes to America, it will call itself Anti-Fascism, and tell you to give up your guns.
    4. Re:Not a disruptive technology by ItsJustAPseudonym · · Score: 1

      Nah, if they sell the MRAP, how will they carry the Martin not-Jetpack to the scene of the event? I think they will buy an EXTRA MRAP for this thing.

    5. Re:Not a disruptive technology by ItsJustAPseudonym · · Score: 1

      "Occupy THIS, you bunch of hippies!"

  8. I can see it now by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    TSA agents dropping out of the sky like clouds taking a shit, looking for pants to put their hands down.

  9. How TF by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    .. is this thing even a consideration when the Williams X-Jet (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U-3Ql7G7qRc) ..has been sitting in a basement for the last 70 years.

  10. Of course cops want this by swb · · Score: 1

    I am sure somewhere there is a Federal Law Enforcement agency that already has plans to buy about two dozen of these things and establish a jet pack SWAT team.

    If its even halfway successful, expect every agency with a SWAT team to have one.

    1. Re:Of course cops want this by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      And if it's not successful, then only half the SWAT teams will buy one.

  11. It's too bad they stopped development on THIS... by jkg2 · · Score: 0

    ...back in the 80s, because if it were available today I would be VERY interested in getting one, as I imagine many others would be. I am not interested in the JetPack or flying car or anything else, because I think their form factor is inferior to the Williams Intl. X-JET design seen here in this product promotional video from the 1980s. https://www.youtube.com/watch?...

  12. Anybody remember Dallas Thompson by xaotikdesigns · · Score: 1

    This looks like a much safer vehicle to fly through the arctic and into the hollow earth.

    --
    XDInd
  13. Ubiquitous by sycodon · · Score: 1

    You would think that with the advent of drones/quad copters and the technology stabilizing and controlling them, that various manned vehicles such as this or even Moller's Skycar would be popping up all over the place.

    --
    When Fascism comes to America, it will call itself Anti-Fascism, and tell you to give up your guns.
  14. first responder call... by trazom28 · · Score: 1

    Think of it as job security. Sold to First responders - check. Sold to general public - check. General public uses it, crashes, and calls first responders - check!

    --
    {} ------ When I think of a good sig, I'll put it here
  15. Williams used a modified jet engine by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    You would need jet fuel to fly in it ,the cost is going to be higher. Moreover ,it's gud to have the ducted fan ,further apart from human like in Martin. Williams is like a witche's broomstick,u really Wundt want to fly sitting on top of a jet engine do you

  16. So.. a Drone but with a Man attached to it by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    All the more to get sucked into an aircraft engine.

  17. Williams X-Jet by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Why not this?

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Williams_X-Jet

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sl7N9aE9R1Y

  18. Martian Jetpack by MrKaos · · Score: 1

    This is what I saw, now I am disappointed it's just "Martin" - sigh!!

    --
    My ism, it's full of beliefs.
  19. UAV + people by tyroneking · · Score: 1

    Looking at one of the videos on the co's site, looks like it can be remote controlled and stabilised - seems like an ideal platform on to which to mount a police sniper and carry him/her to a target location to do the business. I guess it could lift as high a a helo so sound would not be too bad.

    1. Re:UAV + people by Alioth · · Score: 1

      Except snipers usually want to be stealthy, this machine makes an incredible racket.

      --
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