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Cops 101: NYC High School Teaches How To Behave During Stop-and-Frisk
HughPickens.com writes Kate Briquelet reports in the NY Post that Principal Mark Federman of East Side Community HS has invited the New York Civil Liberties Union to give a two-day training session to 450 students on interacting with police. "We're not going to candy-coat things — we have a problem in our city that's affecting young men of color and all of our students," says Federman.
"It's not about the police being bad. This isn't anti-police as much as it's pro-young people ... It's about what to do when kids are put in a position where they feel powerless and uncomfortable." The hourlong workshops — held in small classroom sessions during advisory periods — focused on the NYPD's stop-and-frisk program and how to exercise Fourth Amendment rights when being stopped and questioned in a car or at home.
Some law-enforcement experts say the NYCLU is going beyond civics lessons and doling out criminal-defense advice. "It's unlikely that a high school student would come away with any other conclusion than the police are a fearful group to be avoided at all costs," says Eugene O'Donnell, a former police officer and professor at John Jay College of Criminal Justice. NYCLU representatives told kids to be polite and to keep their hands out of their pockets. But they also told students they don't have to show ID or consent to searches, that it's best to remain silent, and how to file a complaint against an officer. Candis Tolliver, NYCLU's associate director for advocacy, says was the first time she trained an entire high school. "This is not about teaching kids how to get away with a crime or being disrespectful. This is about making sure both sides are walking away from the situation safe and in control."
Some law-enforcement experts say the NYCLU is going beyond civics lessons and doling out criminal-defense advice. "It's unlikely that a high school student would come away with any other conclusion than the police are a fearful group to be avoided at all costs," says Eugene O'Donnell, a former police officer and professor at John Jay College of Criminal Justice. NYCLU representatives told kids to be polite and to keep their hands out of their pockets. But they also told students they don't have to show ID or consent to searches, that it's best to remain silent, and how to file a complaint against an officer. Candis Tolliver, NYCLU's associate director for advocacy, says was the first time she trained an entire high school. "This is not about teaching kids how to get away with a crime or being disrespectful. This is about making sure both sides are walking away from the situation safe and in control."
How not to get your @ass kicked when you get pulled over by the police - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v...
Keep the Classic Slashdot.
... teaching the cops how not to alienate the people?
Some law-enforcement experts say the NYCLU is going beyond civics lessons and doling out criminal-defense advice.
Which is apparently necessary.
The ugly truth about NYC is that it would be ungovernable without a very large and powerful police force because it's an extremely diverse and class stratified city. Studies have repeatedly shown that trust people between strangers deteriorates as a function of the increased diversity of a population. Does this mean minorities and such are "bad?" Of course not. What it means is that a city which is basically a miniature United Nations is going to be likely held together by an iron fist in a velvet glove, not shared customs and values which often lead to conflict resolution without getting the state involved.
Advice I got from a cop: Most cops are great guys and a few are psychopaths with guns. The best place to fight it out is in court where they won't be able to shoot you and get away with it ;)
Civics classes have been sorely missing from school curriculums and this is exactly the kind of civics information people need.
I have NEVER seen a civics class where how do behave during a police stop was anywhere on the curriculum. I think it is incredibly depressing that something like this is even remotely necessary. And sadly it actually does seem to be necessary. These kids are basically being taught (for good reasons) how to behave safely in the face of institutional racism. Learning how to behave during a stop and frisk should never be necessary. Ever.
Add in some basics on personal freedoms and rights, civic duties, local government, and taxation and you've got an educated populace.
Knowing your rights and knowing how to (safely) go about asserting those rights in front of some racist thug with a gun and a badge are VERY different things.
It sounds like cops hate anyone who is not a cop.
Hate is probably the wrong word for most cops but it would be fair to say cops don't trust anyone who isn't a cop. Cops tend to (understandably) have an us versus them world view and see everyone's actions as those of a potential suspect. Apply a bit of low grade racism and you have a real problem with police distrusting a minority population and the minority population growing to distrust the police.
"It's unlikely that a high school student would come away with any other conclusion than the police are a fearful group to be avoided at all costs," says Eugene O'Donnell, a former police officer and professor at John Jay College of Criminal Justice.
Then the lessons are effective and teaching exactly what they need to teach.
There are a good deal of "common sense" things that haven't seemed to soak into younger generations. Things that someone born in the 70's, 80's and 90's would likely have been exposed to and had been "taught" to some degree or another. The Police force has changed. The same cop may not patrol the same neighborhood 4 or 5 days a week. When they did, they got to know the neighborhood. They knew it's people, who "belonged" there and who didn't. Many lived not-too-far away and lived in a similar neighborhood. The Police and the people understood one another, had common ground. It seems that balance has changed.
If it's not going to go back to something like that, then our youth probably do need to be "taught" how to interact with these authority figures who aren't from their neighborhood, don't know them from the drug-dealer down the street. Until we sort out how to make the Police more local to any place it protects, make them feel like neighbors, then we're not doing the right thing unless we teach the youth how to properly interact with Police, without disrespect for either party. Remember: In the same way a Fireman runs into a burning building; this Officer is going to be running towards the gunfire if there's trouble, not away from it like the average youth on the street.
Bottom Line: If our Police aren't going to also be our neighbors, in our neighborhoods, then we need to re-learn out how interact with them.
Awk! Pieces of eight. Pieces of eight. Pieces of seven... ERROR: General Protection Fault. [Paroty Error.]
The more productive method would probably be external oversight that actually has teeth instead of internal wrist slapping followed by a high five.
This is my signature. There are many like it, but this one is mine.
I really don't understand how you can come to this conclusion without harboring some seriously racist ideas yourself. Unarmed black kids are getting killed by the police all over the country. That is not an acceptable outcome. The school can't fix the interaction from the side of the police officers, but they can teach kids how to respond in those situations so that the risk is minimized. How can that be anything but good?
Some law-enforcement experts say the NYCLU is going beyond civics lessons and doling out criminal-defense advice.
So wait, we're assuming that they're all criminals to begin with?
"Anyone who [rips a CD] is probably engaging in copyright infringement." - David O. Carson
Of course, if you have nothing to hide you have no need for knowledge other than "Do what we tell you to do. We're always right.
Nope.
Obama got his peace prize for not being George Bush.
However it does seem that he got it under false pretences, as he seems to be George's harder working brother.
Watch this Heartland Institute video
Their first concern is to not get shot in the head. Teaching kids that they need to obey lawful orders and recognize unlawful ones is the right approach. If your rights are violated you deal with it later, not when a nervous person holding a gun is telling you what to do.
This. Specially for inexperienced teenagers who, for whatever fucksake reasons (biological maturity, society, etc) might (will) lack the social, communication and cognitive skills for de-escalation and negotiation that adults (should/typically) have.
Consent and litigate later, or know how to not consent without getting killed. OTH, if a 200+lbs person in a position of power wants to strangle a 100lbs handcuffed crying teenager on the back of his patrol car, there is nothing that kid can do.
^^^ And I say this because I witnessed it on a park right in front of my house. I was sitting on a bench in front of my house near a tree when a patrol car stopped there (some investigation going on, whatever.) The car parked, the officer, a gorilla of a man, got out of the driver's seat, went to the back and started chocking the shit out of this kid.
He stopped when his partner nodded to him that there were people (me) watching. They took off, God knows where.
I'm not making this shit up, and this was with my house in one of the supposedly nice, upper middle class neighborhoods in South Florida. Just imagine the type of crap that occurs in less affluent neighborhoods.
See, that is the problem with Miranda. What you say can be used against you. Why can it not be used for you? The police should not be there to try to put you in jail. If you are innocent, the evidence they collect should be allowed to be used to keep you out of jail. Right now the way it works is they collect evidence for and against, and the prosecutor will simply not bring up the evidence which exonerates you. They do have to share that with your lawyer, but it is up to your lawyer to bring up the evidence which exonerates you. Basically the prosecutors train of thought is, "This guy is probably innocent, but I can probably get him convicted if I run the case in such and such a fashion". That is completely the wrong attitude.
If you are not allowed to question your government then the government has answered your question.
"It's unlikely that a high school student would come away with any other conclusion than the police are a fearful group to be avoided at all costs,"
That's EXACTLY what the police are these days and if you claim otherwise you are either a pro-police and pro-police state shill or hopelessly naive about the current state law enforcement and Criminal Justice inAmerica that is more focused on creating criminals so they can imprison people and confiscate property than keeping people safe. I myself am a white guy in my early 40s and have had Criminal Justice delivered unto me. My crime? Stepping outside to my home after a few drinks to talk to a police officer regarding a public disturbance. I was immediately cuffed without cause, hauled off to jail and when I asked why I was arrested, I was choked, stomped on, pinned down by 4 officers and suffocated till I nearly passed out from asphyxiation. I am now facing criminal charges for "public intoxication" and "obstruction of justice". And have to spend several thousand in legal costs to defend myself in court. A very high price to pay for trying to be a good samaritan. So yes -- fear the police And for fucks sake, avoid them at all costs.