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Probe Into NSA Activity Reveals Germany Spying On Germans
cold fjord writes The Local (DE) reports, "The Bundesnachrichtendienst (BND), Germany's foreign intelligence service, spied on some citizens living abroad, a former lawyer for the spies told MPs on Thursday. Dr Stefan Burbaum ... said that some Germans were targeted as "office holders," a legal loophole the spies used to circumvent the law that protects Germans citizens from being spied on by its own intelligence agency. ... the German spies argue that a citizen working for a foreign company abroad is only protected in his private life, not in his professional communications ... "The office holder is the legal person," Burbaum said. ... "This construct of an office holder is just as absurd in practice as it appears in the law," Konstantin von Notz of the Green party said. Further, foreigners' communications conducted abroad are not protected, even if they are in contact with German people or work for a German company. MPs ... criticized the BND's ability to operate in a "lawless zone" when it came to spying on foreigners. ... the BND regularly retains traffic which it had not received specific permission to investigate which it collects during such trawls. In this way, access acquired under the "G10 law" becomes a "foot in the door" to otherwise closed-off sources of data, Burbaum said." The parliamentary investigation was initiated by reports that Chancellor Merkel's phone was being tapped by NSA, but later it was found that at least five countries were tapping Merkel's phone.
They (BND) created several new theories:
a) Space Theory: German law does not apply in space, so their satellites (or those from agencies of "friends") are not bound by the constitution.
b) Function Owner Theory: When someone is acting within his/her capacity as a function owner, he is no longer a person protected by the constitution.
c) The Meta Data Theory: Meta data does not contain privacy protected information.
Thanks to Snowden this mess came to light. This now needs to be cleaned up. All three approaches will be shot down, with or without the governments approval.ï
Most parliamentarians agree, that the intelligence services practically beg for a shorter leash. Power struggles and party politics will delay it, but they will get it.
He with nothing to hide does not exist.
Gaming companies have dealt with issues like this for many years whereby players will attempt to engage in "rules lawyering" to get around the letter of the game's rules in order to exploit loopholes to essentially cheat to win. Game companies dealt with that by including a catch-all to simply say that if what you're doing is clearly and obviously designed to bypass the rules or exploit loopholes to gain an unfair or unintended advantage, you get punished.
Legislatures could learn a lesson from this. For each law written, write in a catch-all such that clear and obvious attempts to circumvent the law by exploiting loopholes in the wording brings about similar or the same penalties as violating the law itself. For laws designed to control groups, such as intelligence services, ensure that everyone involved bears the punishment of violating the law. In other words, get the guy who ordered it, the guy(s) who disseminated the orders, and everyone who carried out the orders. Then also include strong whistleblower protections and rewards for reporting the worst abuses. When everyone from the top of the organization to the bottom has their ass on the line and when enough carrots are dangled in front of the guys doing the grunt work, stuff like that will unravel in a hurry. I love my job for numerous reasons. Would I risk 20 years in prison for it if the higher-ups decided to start doing illegal stuff? Not a chance.
-- "Government is the great fiction through which everybody endeavors to live at the expense of everybody else."
Private property is control, numbnuts. I am surrounded by a wealth of resources, natural and man-made, none of which I'm allowed anywhere near, nor am I allowed any say in the use of. Property's a coercive concept for everyone except the owner. I'm not saying this is a bad thing, but that the whole rhetoric of market = freedom / democracy = control is laughably loaded.
Under social democracy, there are more resources and institutions under democratic control - particularly those guaranteeing a basic standard of dignified living for all humans, such as a national health service - which means I am more likely to be able to both make input and reap benefit.
(And I know you didn't actually mean "socialism", which is worker control of the means of production. Loads of successful businesses are cooperatively owned and democratically run already, and I can be almost certain that this hasn't impinged on your delicate American freedoms.)
The 'feature' is that this is treated as a nasty surprise, and somehow hypocritical or in poor taste. It's otherwise expected, or even exaggerated.
That said, the one huge change that has likely given generally-wealthy-and-developed-western-democracies a (probably temporary) massive boost in relative spying scariness is the move to electronic surveillance, and the move of the citizenry to electronic media and devices on which to spy.
When most intelligence gathering is human intelligence, or fairly low sophistication manual bugging/document theft/break-ins/etc. a visibly authoritarian system where secret police intimidation and coercion are routine, assorted invasive practices are fully legal or impunity is so strong that they might as well be, and so on, is most helpful for surveillance purposes.
When the intelligence gathering is electronic, you can get away with a much softer touch; but you need an extensively 'wired' citizenry in order to have something to spy on, and you need considerable amounts of technical expertise, money, and infrastructure.
While tech is just getting cheaper, and even absurdly squalid hellholes will probably have enough of it for a data-driven surveillance dystopia sooner or later, this did give a fairly massive relative bump in the spy power of 'nice' governments. Their attempts to replicate old-school Stasi stuff have been on smaller scales, and generally less effective(eg. NYPD vs. basically all the muslims in the eastern US, never mind that they are a municipal police force. The lawsuits they were many, the intelligence gains they were minimal, the whole thing was sort of an embarassment, and that was under the full power of the 9/11!!!! constitutional exception).
They've had much better luck taking advantage of the fact that a huge amount of the world's electronic activity flows through areas they have access to and, thanks to cheap consumer electronics, now a huge amount of the world's communication foreign and domestic, does as well.
He with nothing to hide should not have to fear for his privacy.
I'm not okay with the local Stasi installing bugs in my house. By the same token, I am not okay with them listening in on private conversations held over the phone or on the Internet. Even if it means a couple of terrorists go uncaught. Because what surveillance buys you is at best temporary security: a few high profile busts, and wrongdoers will find ways to evade that surveillance, which isn't all that hard.
If construction was anything like programming, an incorrectly fitted lock would bring down the entire building...
Republic: a state in which supreme power is held by the people and their elected representatives, and which has an elected or nominated president rather than a monarch.
Democracy: a system of government by the whole population or all the eligible members of a state, typically through elected representatives.
The two are not mutually exclusive. There are republican democracies, republican dictatorships, democratic monarchies, and dictatorial monarchies. It's amazing how many people don't understand these two words, and see fit to complain that people don't understand them.
It has nothing to do with "Western democraties", totalitarian regimes are spying and much more on their own citizen. Very stupid comment.
Achille Talon
Hop!
Unfortunately, our government (I'm german) is full of irresponsible, power-greedy fools. Local television has highlighted some of these problems repeatedly (like ministers who, not in 1970 but in the 200s need to decide about Internet regulations but don't even know what a browser is). Unfortunately, one of the things that changed compared to, say, 30-40 years ago is that they've replaced the state-paid experts in the ministries with lobbyists ^H^H^H "external advisors", who are not only experts in their fields (good), but also paid for by private corporations. That's right, the people advising our government get their salary not from the government, but from corporations.
I don't know if stupidity is a sufficient explanation, but our ministers including Merkel actually had encrypted mobiled phones offered to them by a special branch of the government responsible for securing the state IT infrastructure. They turned them down because it was more convenient to use market smartphones.
Personally, I think that act alone should be suffient to bring them all up for trial on aiding and abetting treason.
Assorted stuff I do sometimes: Lemuria.org
You are leaving out the collusion that all these Western "Democracies" have. The US's NSA provided data to UK's GCHQ and Germany's BND when they wanted it, and exchange each of those agencies provided data to the NSA that they wanted. In some cases they could not acquire data legally, so they intentionally circumvented the law by making these back room deals. I'd not take issue if this was against China or Russia who are traditionally enemies of the "West", they did this against normal Joe Shmoes in their own damn country.
Each of these countries has used the data for illegal means, such as shutting down free speech and rights to assemble. For example the US used this data to shut down groups like OWS, and the BND has used this data to shut down anti-NSA protests in Germany just last year. Each country has claimed rights to this data due to "OMFG Teh Terrorists!!1!!!" but none of them have used this data to our knowledge to catch a single terrorist or stop a single terrorist act.
As someone mentions above, the way to start forcing changes is to pull everyone from the chains of approval and start prosecuting. Offer whistle blower protection for people that were not the decision makers. Law makers may need to do some tuning, but that should not prevent action to stop the behavior.
-The wise argue that there are few absolutes, the fool argues that there are no probabilities.
It's amazing how many Americans seem not to understand the difference between direct democracy and representative democracy, nor the fact that democracy and republic are orthogonal concepts. You post makes as much sense as saying emacs isn't a text editor, it's a religion - just because it is one, doesn't mean that it isn't the other.
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