Slashdot Mirror


Ask Slashdot: Best Software For Image Organization?

Wycliffe writes Like many people, I am starting to get a huge collection of digital photos from family vacations, etc. I am looking for some software that allows me to rate/tag my own photos in a quick way. I really don't want to spend the time tagging a bunch of photos and then be locked into a single piece of software, so what is the best software to help organize and tag photos so that I can quickly find highlights without being locked into that software for life? I would prefer open source to prevent lock-in and also prefer Linux but could do Windows if necessary.

45 of 259 comments (clear)

  1. Simplest is best by amightywind · · Score: 4, Interesting

    mkdir, find.

    --
    an ill wind that blows no good
    1. Re:Simplest is best by Wycliffe · · Score: 4, Informative

      Not sure why this is modded down. This was actually my first idea. The problem with this
      is that it effectively only allows one "tag" i.e. /2004/vacation/good/ /2004/vacation/bad/
      The only way to have multiple categories would be with a bunch of symbolic links which
      might not be too bad if there was a simple program to handle it. The other idea would be
      to actually store the meta data inside of each photo. That way the meta data shouldn't
      be lost if I'm forced to move to a different program assuming the new program can read
      the metadata.

    2. Re:Simplest is best by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      I second this vote for using the file system to organise your images. This post may give me away to some of my friends, but I create folders using this template:

      [YYYY-MM-DD] Descriptive Name of Trip or Event

      This allows me to have multiple groups of images on a given day, say a lunchtime function and a dinner party.

      For groups that span multiple days I do this:

      [YYYY-MM-XX] Descriptive Name of Multi-Day Event

      If I go on a big trip then what I do is create sub folders with the date (using the same format) for each event or grouping or experience that I captured.

      If I have a folder of photos and want to make a small sub-selection. I make a folder called "pick" and put them in there. I may also do a low-res copy of that folder (and call it "web pick") and then I can email them easily to friends. I don't bother with links or any other garbage, 50-500MB of duplication doesn't matter a damn, and the backup software has de-duplication so doesn't care either.

      Finally, I've done this for almost 15 years and it's basically worked perfectly for me and I have a fantastic collection of photos going all the way back.

      Sorry, this the actual finally. Be very wary of *any* automated system based on a database or tagging system. The problem is that while initially they may seem awesome and great time savers, you will ultimately want to group [at least some of] the photos based on social, aesthetic and political assessments, and no automatic system can ever handle that.

    3. Re:Simplest is best by twitnutttt · · Score: 2

      I have maintained basically this exact same system for all my photos since 2000. It's easy since photo loading software will automatically organize by date for you, and then you just add the event description to the folder name. The only failing is when I am too lazy to add the event description and just end up with a lot of folders that are only dates. Sometimes, I will add a little description (AKA tag) to individual image files that are of particular noteworthiness to me. (E.g., pictures that are suitable as "profile" pics).

    4. Re: Simplest is best by twitnutttt · · Score: 2

      Organize into folders chronologically first! Add other keywords to the folder names and you can search on those to dynamically extract groups. But trying to pre-group in advance will cause you nothing but headaches... Picture on a trip with grandma in Hawaii. Does this go in "trips" or "grandma"? No, it goes in: "2013-03-04 trip to hawaii with grandma".

    5. Re:Simplest is best by azav · · Score: 2

      Even though the new Mac OS systems are pretty ugly UI wise, you can add tags to each file. This might be what you want.

      If not, you can have a program that simply creates a hierarchy of each of your files within a folder and gives a unique ID to each file and folder within your top level.

      Make a checksum on each file and apply that to the record for each file.

      You can then find the file or folder again if you move it from one folder to another.

      You can then create tags and apply them to the record for each file.

      Also, since you have added checksums for each file, you can rebuild your library if you mistakenly move, delete or undelete a file since running a checksum on each file will create the same checksum. This will allow you to scan all the file records and map any lost record to the proper lost file. Also, as a set of backups, you can simply export this list of file references, checksums and tags.

      If you have a bunch of tags, then you can search through all folders for all like tags.

      So, you can use the Mac OS and add tags too your files, or you can put something like this together and use on other OSes that don't allow you to add tags to your individual files.

      --
      - Zav - Imagine a Beowulf cluster of insensitive clods...
  2. lightroom darktable by blackest_k · · Score: 4, Interesting

    my first thought was lightroom but darktable is free runs on linux( OSX too) and will also generate a database of your images.

    For image processing you would also want a 1GB or better graphics card to take advantage of GPU processing, not that you are really interested in that, other people maybe.

    1. Re:lightroom darktable by amplesand · · Score: 2

      I was intrigued by your description and made an "aptitude search darktable" on my Debian system. It sure sounds like a nice piece of software I could have used for my gazillion photos.

      To my utter surprise, the software "darktable" was already installed, and, I had apparently tagged two images the late summer 2013. I had no recollection of that... But, an "aptitude search sparetime" gave me the answer. I didn't have that.

      The software may well be excellent, but, make sure you have both, the software and the spare time.

  3. Google Picasa 3 by sundru · · Score: 5, Informative

    Google Picasa 3 , I find this has a little bit of everything i need except duplicate file management.

    1. Re:Google Picasa 3 by Pikoro · · Score: 3, Informative

      Under the Tools menu, there is an Experimental sub-menu. Select "Show duplicate files". Then I just deleted everything that shows up. Seems to work just fine. It's not automatic or anything, but it works.

      --
      "Freedom in the USA is not the ability to do what you want. It is the ability to stop others from doing what THEY want"
  4. Automatic rating by Clifton+Beach · · Score: 2

    Just post them all on "Hot or not"

    --
    42 hidden comments
  5. Software doesn't really matter by Zocalo · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Unless you have some really workflow/hardware your source images are going to be in either JPEG, your camera's proprietary raw format, or both. JPEG supports a standard method of tagging via EXIF directly in the image that includes a "Rating" tag that any tool is going to use. If you are tagging raw files then make sure that you write out the tagging information into .XMP "Sidecar" files. This is an Adobe defined "standard" based around XML files, but it's extremely portable and just about any image editor/tagger that supports .XMP files will follow the core Adobe standard tags, including the ones for rating images, and since it's XML you'll always have access to the tag data if the worst should happen and to roll your own tools if need be. As long as you choose software that supports one or both of those formats, then you'll be fine and about as futureproof as it's possible to be.

    --
    UNIX? They're not even circumcised! Savages!
    1. Re:Software doesn't really matter by rongten · · Score: 2

      Hi there,

      For archiving purposes, it is best to never touch the original files. It helps when you have thousands of files and during the years you have made backups on different places/disks.

      When you consolidate (because either you consolidate or you lose your photos/memories) if you have photos that differ only for the exif tags is a nightmare to understand which photos are ok and which are not.

      Always prefer programs that do not touch your photos. I recently found that one of the programs I used in the past for an old camera (2002-2005), when rotating the images was nuking the exif data.. Still need to find which one it was.. and damn it to hell.

      Now it would be great to do .xmp of jpegs, but last time I tried (a few months ago) I did not manage to make it work with shotwell (there is only an option to alter the file metadata.. the horror..).

      In my case, to consolidate the photo collection, I have the originals in different folders (tematic, cronological etc. etc) and then I create some symlinks in a directory called "history". Here a work in progress


      #!/volume1/homes/admin/local_programs/bin/bash
      #set -x
      EXT="jpg JPG jpeg JPEG"
      #DEBUG="echo"
      num=0
      for exte in $EXT
      do
      for file in $(find . -name '*'.$exte| grep -v history); do
      echo "doing $file"
      OCDATE=$CDATE
      OCHOUR=$(echo $CHOUR | awk -F'.estim' '{print $1}')
      INFO=$(exiftool $file | tr '\n' '#')
      PROBLEM=$(echo $INFO |tr '#' '\n' | grep "^Make")
      [ -z "$PROBLEM" ] && echo "Problem with $file. Skipping" && continue
      CDATE=$(echo $INFO |tr '#' '\n' | grep "Media Create Date" | awk '{print $5}')
      [ -z "$CDATE" ] && CDATE=$(echo $INFO |tr '#' '\n' | grep "Create Date" | awk '{print $4}')
      [ -z "$CDATE" ] && CDATE=$(echo $INFO |tr '#' '\n' | grep "Date/Time Original" | awk '{print $5}')
      [ -z "$CDATE" ] && CDATE=$OCDATE
      [ -z "$CDATE" ] && echo "error inquiry file" $file && continue
      CHOUR=$(echo $INFO |tr '#' '\n' | grep "Media Create Date" | awk '{print $6}')
      [ -z "$CHOUR" ] && CHOUR=$(echo $INFO |tr '#' '\n' | grep "Create Date" | awk '{print $5}')
      [ -z "$CHOUR" ] && CHOUR=$(echo $INFO |tr '#' '\n' | grep "Date/Time Original" | awk '{print $5}')
      [ -z "$CHOUR" ] && num=$(expr $num + 1) && CHOUR=${OCHOUR}.estimation_$num
      [ -z "$CHOUR" ] && echo "error inquiry file" $file && continue
      TYPE=$( echo $INFO |tr '#' '\n' | grep "File Type" | awk '{print $4}')
      YEAR=$( echo $CDATE | cut -d':' -f1)
      MONTH=$(echo $CDATE | cut -d':' -f2)
      DAY=$( echo $CDATE | cut -d':' -f3)
      FNAME=$(echo $CHOUR | tr ':' '-')
      FNAME=${FNAME}.$TYPE
      DDIR=history/$YEAR/$MONTH
      DEST=${DDIR}/${DAY}-${FNAME}
      [ ! -d "$DDIR" ] && $DEBUG mkdir -p $DDIR
      if [ ! -L "$DEST" ]; then
      $DEBUG ln -s ./../../../$file $DEST
      else
      TGT=$(readlink $DEST)
      [ "$TGT" != "./../../../$file" ] && echo "Error whith $file and $DEST" && exit 1
      fi
      done
      d

      --
      Zed: Nothing is ever easy
    2. Re:Software doesn't really matter by abell · · Score: 2

      If anybody wants to implement such a system from scratch, I would advise against modifying the image files, since that makes deduplication and backups harder (you backup a file, than tag one copy and now have two different files).

      Building on some ideas I'm using in a backup software I'm working on (please take a look and give feedback if you have some time to spare) I would suggest associating tags and exif info to an hash value of the image files. This way, getting info about a file would be: read file -> compute hash -> retrieve info on that hash.

      For quick lookups from hash to file, you can have another table storing the paths where the file with the given hash was seen.

      So, table 1 (image metadata) would look like:

      d012f68144ed0f121d3cc330a17eec528c2e7d59 | holiday 2013
      d012f68144ed0f121d3cc330a17eec528c2e7d59 | dog running
      d012f68144ed0f121d3cc330a17eec528c2e7d59 | vote:5
      ...

      while table 2 (hash to file lookup) would look like:

      d012f68144ed0f121d3cc330a17eec528c2e7d59 | /home/user/pictures/2013/IMG_123.JPG
      ...

      This way, metadata (table 1) is in a simple and future-proof format, provided you don't modify the original files, which I think is a bad idea anyway. Besides, this doesn't impact your ability of organizing pictures in folders whatever way you like. The only issue can be the need to refresh table2 every now and then.

      Just my 2c...

    3. Re:Software doesn't really matter by crath · · Score: 2

      You're exactly on the money!!! What's needed is a cataloging app that keeps the canonical data store in sidecar files. Picasa is "almost" there. In recent versions it writes most of its data to .picasa text files (an open data format). This provides future portability because another app can read those .picasa files and the image files to rebuild the database. Hopefully, Google will continue to expand Picasa so that it writes all info to .picasa files as well as keeping a local database current. The local database provides excellent app performance, and the sidecar files provide for future portability when Google decides to walk away from Picasa--which they inevitably will.

    4. Re:Software doesn't really matter by jrumney · · Score: 2

      I use Shotwell, and it definitely has an option to write the metadata to files, so you can recover it later or from another program. The database is necessary for search - you don't want it to have to open each file one by one to find the image you are looking for.

    5. Re:Software doesn't really matter by Dutch+Gun · · Score: 2

      Personally, I definitely want metadata to be stored in the image file itself, because if you do it any other way, there's always a risk of losing that association. I feel you're setting yourself up for a disaster if you use a hash, because the moment anything touches that file for *any reason*, poof, that metadata is now gone. You're highlighted the huge weakness in your system, but then created a tautology by saying "but modifying the original files is a bad idea anyway". It's only a bad idea if you've got a fragile system that depends on the exact file hash to reference critical metadata.

      I think there's a reason that the XMP standard goes through great pains to embed metadata inside the image files themselves rather than resorting to external sidecar files, which is typically considered a last resort and a very poor alternative solution. If you use the image's own embedded metadata as the original and authoritative source, then you can rebuild your database from scratch automatically, no matter what you've done with your image files, or how you've folded, spindled, or mutilated them.

      De-duplication is trivial if you use proper tools which compare visual features and don't rely on exact matches. Also, I don't consider the backup issue to be significant, because if you make a change to the file's metadata, then I want that file re-backed up, because I consider it to have been changed. However, since you're not changing the actual image data when you change metadata, any decent diff program should only store a small delta to represent the change.

      --
      Irony: Agile development has too much intertia to be abandoned now.
  6. Keep It Simple by pubwvj · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Keep It Simple
    This is something you want to work for decades.
    Don't get fancy.
    Don't use image organization software that will stop being supported or become useless with an OS update that kills off legacy software.

    Just name your files well.
    Establish a format for naming.
    Organize images in directories / folders.
    Use the operating system search feature.

    K.I.S.S.

    1. Re:Keep It Simple by itzly · · Score: 4, Funny

      Just name your files well.

      Mine are all called DSCNxxxx.JPG.

    2. Re:Keep It Simple by ubrgeek · · Score: 5, Funny

      But those are all from your trip to Disney in China, right?

      --
      Bark less. Wag more.
  7. systemd is the best I've found. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Funny

    systemd is the best file compression software I've ever found. It got installed on my Debian computer recently. Now all my files on that computer are effectively 0 bytes in size, because I can't access them at all because my frigging system won't even boot.

  8. Re:By Kids Ages by Arkh89 · · Score: 2

    On a side note : IMO, You should have started indexing your kids at 0...

  9. Re:Digikam by dotancohen · · Score: 2

    I came to suggest Digikam. If it the absolute best free photo manager for any platform. It supports geo-tagged photos, a slew of editing functions in a dedicated editor, automatic camera download and renaming, tagging, blah blah blah.

    --
    It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong.
  10. Anything that's OS independent? by Dadoo · · Score: 3

    As long as we're on the subject, I'd like to know about such software, too, but I'd like something that's OS independent, and stores images locally. My mom has an enormous collection of family photos, dating back to the early 20th century, that I'd like to catalog while she's still around. It would be nice if she could do the annotations on her Windows machine, while I organize everything on my Linux machine. Ideally, we could copy the images and associated data back and forth using a CDROM or USB key.

    --
    Sit, Ubuntu, sit. Good dog.
    1. Re:Anything that's OS independent? by ihtoit · · Score: 2

      LAMP it with a Mediawiki service (go cloud or local). No need to back-n-forth with any usb key, just drop a shortcut on her desktop and make her an account, it's just a case then of upload the picture, create a page for it with the metadata on it, job done.

      My images are organised on a mediawiki stack, paged by date. it works fucking brilliantly. Text search on what I type on the page next to each image, boom motherfucker.

      --
      Political debates have me rolling my eyes so much I think I got optical whiplash. I should sue. - Foamy The Squirrel
    2. Re:Anything that's OS independent? by fu-ku-jitsu · · Score: 2

      vvvP: http://vvvp.sourceforge.net/ Open source. Linux, Mac and Windows.

  11. Cataloging write-only archives by namgge · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Based on my experience as an executor, you should pick the best one or two photos from each significant occasion, record the date, location and the people (forename and surname) it shows in a plain text file and trash the rest. Fortunately chronological order is both the easiest and best way of organising such a collection. Don't bother keeping pictures that don't have clearly recognisable people in them because it's only these that will be of any interest in future.

    Then, when you die your kids will inherit a nice collection of ca 100 family photos complete with enough information to make them interesting and give them a context.

    Namgge

    1. Re:Cataloging write-only archives by Harlequin80 · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Please GOD don't do this!

      If you want to create a best of album to pass on to your kids then by all mean to that. But don't trash the rest! Storage is cheap so there is no reason you shouldn't keep everything. One of the best finds I ever had from my great grandparents was a suitcase full of old photos taken around the turn of the century. Most of them were of random life, and even though I didn't know who the people were it was a fascinating insight into how they lived. It was only 110 years ago but I found the differences incredible and much more relatable in photo form then in a book.

      I have just over 60gb of digital photos now. Many of them are crap. Another chunk are essentially duplicates where I have taken 20 photos to capture a moment. What we do is put together a highlights book for each year. We actually print them using a company that makes coffee book style books. It's a lot of work, sifting through the images, editing and cropping them and then finally putting them together in a 40-60 page book. But it is so worth it. We now have 13 of these books and we will start on 2014 shortly.

    2. Re: Cataloging write-only archives by Harlequin80 · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Jpeg has been the standard for years now, I doubt very much that it will become inaccessible anytime soon. And the best thing about digitised photos is the don't degrade like the physical versions. Proprietary mail storage files are not really comparable.

      The other nice thing about digital is that all it takes is a codec to read something. I don't need to dig out the old vcr etc.

      As for the old home videos, I made the concious decision about 5 years ago to transfer all of them to digital for exactly the reasons you outlined. So I spent days going through all mine and my parents videos and captured them on a pc. I also worked with my dad to scan every single photo and slide that he had. It took us 2 years and we went through 4 scanners in the process but they are now done. We also worked through them naming and dating them as best we could.

      And finally why would I have a reader for my first digital camera? I don't even own it anymore and I can't even remember what type of cards it took (I think it was CF). I have transferred them onto my NAS and will have reused the card multiple times. They're not like film canisters.....

      In the end there is no guarantee that my system will be readable in x years time. But using common standards, such as jpeg, and LTO tapes to back them up mean chances are they will be for someone who cares enough to look. In addition I print the yearly summary that exist in the physical world and requires no special interface to use.

  12. There's only one image organizing program by Applehu+Akbar · · Score: 2

    Adobe Lightroom. Nothing else even comes close, on OS X or Windows. It organizes sets of images on any combination of storage devices you want, including those disconnected-mostly archives that people with a serious number of photographs always eventually have. It has a tagging system to make searching easy. It gives you control of image metadata. It has most of the editing power of Photoshop with an intuitively easy interface, rather than one that has grown haphazardly bloatwise over the years like PS. It lets you archive everything in RAW if you wish. Editing is nondestructive, so you can peel off prior edits and re-edit an old image at any time. And yes, you can call your favorite external editor, including PS, when you need to do something really fancy.

    It's also the only Adobe product that is still reasonably priced and available as an installed program. The others now have to be rented on the company's cloud site.

  13. I use folders. by jtownatpunk.net · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Vacation
      |--->October 2011 - Caribbean
                          |--->10-27-2011 - Jamaica

    Transfers to/from any platform with a copy/paste.

    I keep slimmed down albums (nee: sets) on flickr where I (and others) can add notes.

  14. Print them all by julian67 · · Score: 5, Funny

    Print them all and put them in labelled shoeboxes.

  15. digiKam by Demonoid-Penguin · · Score: 5, Informative

    digiKam, free, runs on the major platforms, has the feature you've asked for and all the features you haven't asked for but, based on my experience, you will need.

    Quoting from:-

    A digiKam Overview

    digiKam is an advanced digital photo management application for KDE, which makes importing and organizing digital photos a "snap". The photos are organized in albums which can be sorted chronologically, by folder layout or by custom collections.

    Tired of the folder constraints? Don’t worry, digiKam also provides tagging. You tag your images which can be spread out across multiple folders, and digiKam provides fast and intuitive ways to browse these tagged images. You can also add comments to your images. digiKam makes use of a fast and robust database to store these meta-informations which makes adding and editing of comments and tags very reliable.

    digiKam makes use of KIPI plugins for lots of added functionalities. KIPI (KDE Image Plugin Interface) is an initiative to create a common plugin infrastructure for digiKam, KPhotoAlbum, and GwenView. Its aim is to allow development of image plugins which can be shared among KDE graphical applications.

    An easy-to-use interface is provided that enables you to connect to your camera and preview, download and/or delete your images. Basic auto-transformations can be deployed on the fly during image downloading.

    Another tool, which most artists and photographers will be familiar with, is a Light Table. This tool assists artists and photographers with reviewing their work ensuring the highest quality only. A classical light table will show the artist the place on the images to touch up. Well in digiKam, the light table function provides the user a similar experience. You can import a photo, drag it onto the light table, and touch up only the areas that need it.

    Note: it's not very stable if you insist on running it on Windoof. Very reliable on Linux, I haven't tried with OSX.

    Features

  16. Content Management Systems by thechemic · · Score: 2

    Drupal with something like the Node Gallery module would allow you to easily upload entire galleries, tag them all, quickly search through them, and even allow you to share them with the world with authentication if you choose.

    --
    Let's make like a bird... and get the flock outta here.
  17. Use Windows Explorer by Holistic+Missile · · Score: 2

    If you are tagging jpeg files, just use Windows explorer.

    Right-click on the file, and select 'Details'. The EXIF tags are shown and can be edited here. Title, subject, rating, tags, comments, etc.

    You can ctrl-select multiple files and edit the data that will be the same on all of them at once. For example, select all 50 photos from your vacation, and give them the subject 'Vacation 2014'. These tags are part of each file, and are indexed and searchable on Windows and OSX. I haven't tried it on Linux or FreeBSD yet, but I would imagine one of the various desktops' search functions will search (and index?) the tags.

    --
    When you're dead, you don't know you're dead. It only affects the people around you. Same thing when you're stupid.
  18. Re:I'm Working on Software To Do Just That by epyT-R · · Score: 2

    The software isn't meant to entertain you. It's meant to help organize photos. If you want to be entertained, check out the games section.

  19. Don't need photo-organizing softare by myid · · Score: 2

    You don't have to use software that was written for organizing photos. First figure out the attributes that you care about (ex: year, location, occasion). Then:

    Put the file names and attribute information into a spreadsheet. One row per photo. First column for the file name, then one column per attribute (year, etc.). Then you can search, sort and filter the spreadsheet, to find certain kinds of photos. If there are too many photos for one spreadsheet, split them up into several spreadsheets. (Ex: one spreadsheet each, for photos of your parents' childhood, from when you lived in New York, etc.)

    -or-

    Create folders named "parents childhood", "lived in New York", "Susan's high school graduation.", etc. Then for each photo about when you lived in New York, put a Unix link or a Windows shortcut file of that photo in the "lived in New York" folder. For each photo of Susan's high school graduation, put a link or shortcut into the "Susan's high school graduation" folder. (Of course, you might put links or shortcuts of the same photo into multiple folders.)

  20. Sharepoint by pastafazou · · Score: 2

    metadata, tags, keywords, content types, and more.

  21. Re:Image Organization by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    The OP asked for a software solution, and your response is that he/she needs to become a database and Python programmer. How clueless can you be?

  22. Re:digiKam by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

    That doesn't mention something I consider to be a great feature of digikam's tagging system: it can store it in the EXIF data instead of an internal database. Helps solve the submitter's lock-in avoidance and lets you use things like exiftool and some scripting to search for tags and perform arbitrary actions on matching files.

    It's likewise nice that the albums are sorted using the filesystem hierarchy in a human-readable way, rather than using some freakish database scheme

  23. Re:Image Organization by esldude · · Score: 3, Interesting

    I certainly agree with this sentiment. Guy wants software to use, not to create it himself. Advice like this is why people don't listen to you.

  24. Re:Image Organization by ihtoit · · Score: 2

    short answer: yes, it does.

    source: I process my brother's 5D cards.

    --
    Political debates have me rolling my eyes so much I think I got optical whiplash. I should sue. - Foamy The Squirrel
  25. Re:Image Organization by rtb61 · · Score: 2

    OK simplest software solution. Place all photos in one directory, the create links/shortcuts to those photos in different appropriately titled directories. Now create the appropriate directory structure so as to best access those images and retitle those links/shortcuts as appropriate. It can all be done with a typical file manager even though it is a long, slow process, absolutely no lock in at all, no changes at all to original image, just be careful when you think you are copying images that you are not just copying links/shortcuts ;).

    --
    Chaos - everything, everywhere, everywhen
  26. Re:Image Organization by fyngyrz · · Score: 2

    ...but it saves on random number generator cycles...

    --
    I've fallen off your lawn, and I can't get up.
  27. Re:pornview by djrosen · · Score: 2

    http://antidupl.sourceforge.ne...
    Works great Requires Windows and .NET