Slashdot Mirror


NetworkManager 1.0 Released After Ten Years Development

An anonymous reader writes: After ten years of development focused on improving and simplifying Linux networking, NetworkManager 1.0 was released. NetworkManager 1.0 brings many features including an increasingly modernized client library, improved command-line support, a lightweight internal DHCP client, better Bluetooth support, VPN enhancements, WWAN IPv6 support, and other features.

38 of 164 comments (clear)

  1. NetworkManager by NotInHere · · Score: 4, Informative

    One of the few unix command line tools whose command begins with a major letter.

    1. Re:NetworkManager by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

      You can control NetworkManager from the commandline, but most people are familiar with its GUI.

    2. Re:NetworkManager by fustakrakich · · Score: 5, Funny

      Why isn't it just a thin wrapper on systemd?

      Oh, that's cold, man!

      --
      “He’s not deformed, he’s just drunk!”
    3. Re:NetworkManager by fnj · · Score: 4, Insightful

      All you have to know about the NetworkManager abortion is that you can disable the service and remove the package. Then the operating system's own network configuration files, dhclient and everything, like, actually work as intended and documented.

    4. Re:NetworkManager by skids · · Score: 2

      My best guess as to why they would mess with that is they wanted to fix a few issues where the standalone DHCP clients were not re-negotiating when they needed to, and of course they wanted to do it over DBUS. The alternative fix would have been to work with DHCP client projects/maintainers to add pluggable DBUS control interfaces to those, but when given the choice between that and mission creep, mission creep wins these days. Unless they just decided to use the systemd DHCP client they put in there for use booting containers, and that is what is being referred to.

      The other hard components to wrangle are pptpd/pppd/l2tpd (convincing them to hang up when they should, and getting them to promptly relinquish their device node so rules written against ppp0 don't have to be yanked back out and reinstalled when it changes to ppp1 after a tunnel rebuilds.) I wonder how long until they roll their own of those instead of helping improve them.

    5. Re:NetworkManager by thegarbz · · Score: 5, Funny

      Yes and then you just use the commandline to handle failover of network interfa.... eh no.
      Well you can use the commandline to automate the connection to preferred wireles.... no?
      What about moving between netwo...

      Ahh fuck it I'm re-installing NetworkManager. A turd of a system service with a turd of a user interface is better than busting open the command line every time I do something as mind mindbogglingly complicated on my laptop as plugging in a network cable.

      It may have its warts, but it does what it says on the box. It simplifies network management in a time where networks are not a single solid stable connection to the host. You wouldn't want it on a server, but you wouldn't want to be without it on pretty much any other use case.

    6. Re:NetworkManager by kthreadd · · Score: 4, Informative

      Modern NetworkManager releases also include a handy tool called nmtui which is basically the GUI implemented in curses. Nmcli can sometimes be a bit unintuitive so it's a good thing to have around.

    7. Re:NetworkManager by kthreadd · · Score: 2

      You wouldn't want it on a server, but you wouldn't want to be without it on pretty much any other use case.

      NetworkManager should be fine on most servers. While the project used to be focused on desktops and laptops there's nothing non-serverish about it.

    8. Re:NetworkManager by Eric+Green · · Score: 5, Informative

      Yes, NetworkManager should be fine on most servers. Unless you want to use network bonding. And VLANs. And bridges. Nevermind bridged VLAN's (yes, those are a thing) on top of 802.3Ad bonds. And ... and... well, 90% of the other functionality that is offered by the Linux networking stack. NetworkManager works fine for managing the 10% of the network stack that is used 90% of the time. For the other 10% of the time, it is an abortion that should be taken out back of the barn and shot like a rabid dog. And this other 10% that NetworkManager won't do is 99% of why people pay me big bucks to make Linux do what they need it to do, since you will not get high performance networking out of a server using the limited functionality provided by NetworkManager. As in, the servers I work with generally have at least half a dozen gigabit NICs and two 10Gbit NIC's. NetworkManager won't get me 1/10th of what I need to put these servers into the midst of a large network for use in server consolidation, and is utterly useless once we start talking about Open vSwitch and other such SDN components.

      So sure, if you're a sandwich shop putting a $500 server under the cash register, or you are a teenage college student setting up a video sharing network for your bro's in the flop house you board in, NetworkManager will work fine for you. For those of us doing anything more complex, it is a useless abomination and the first thing done when bringing up a new server image is "chkconfig NetworkManager off ; service NetworkManager stop". (Or the AbominationD equivalents thereof).

      --
      Send mail here if you want to reach me.
    9. Re:NetworkManager by fisted · · Score: 3, Informative

      One of the few unix command line tools whose command begins with a major letter.

      Sorry, but there's nothing unix about NetworkManager.

    10. Re:NetworkManager by thegarbz · · Score: 2

      It *should* be fine. But I'm wondering what benefit it brings? NetworkManager was born from a need to simplify network management and automate handovers between networks. These aren't typical scenarios on a server which likely has a fixed network connection and a fixed network setup.

    11. Re:NetworkManager by Antique+Geekmeister · · Score: 3, Informative

      > All you have to know about the NetworkManager abortion is that you can disable the service and remove the packag

      It's unfortunately built into most installers toolkits, so it's difficult to avoid completel, and more tools have unnecessary dependencies on it. So deleting it can lead to re-installing it

      With RHEL based sysysstems, at least, the simplest way to block it is to put "NM_CONTROLLED=no" in the "/etc/sysconfig/network. That helps ensure it stays disabled, until, and unless you specifically select it for any network port..

    12. Re:NetworkManager by WoodstockJeff · · Score: 4, Informative

      "With RHEL based sysysstems, at least, the simplest way to block it is to put "NM_CONTROLLED=no" in the "/etc/sysconfig/network. That helps ensure it stays disabled, until, and unless you specifically select it for any network port.."

      If NM is installed, even telling it to not control a network interface is insufficient to keep it from interfering with that interface. Just a week ago, I installed a new NIC in a server, configured it manually with NM told to leave it alone. 12 hours later, the server disappeared from the network. It didn't crash, it just disconnected, because NM decided to take over control of the NIC.

      Why? Because I had not put the MAC address into the configuration. Seems NM will ignore NM_CONTROLLED=no if you don't tell it the MAC address. So my fixed-IP server suddenly became a dynamic-IP workstation, with DNS pointing to the wrong network and a different gateway.

      So, no, I'm not going to leave NM installed on any machine that is NOT moving around the country using WiFi.

    13. Re:NetworkManager by Immerman · · Score: 2

      And these are normal activities for an average home user who just want's to be able to watch cat videos at whatever hotspot they happen to be connected to?

      The point of tools like this is to simplify things for people who don't know or care about the details - the technological 99% if you will. If you actually know what you're doing there are absolutely far more powerful tools available, should you have the need for them. But would you really want to inflict those eldritch horrors on your grandmother? (the one who has trouble using email, I'm sure the leet hacker one wrote her own tools from scratch.) Or really, on anyone else you end up playing unpaid tech support for?

      --
      --- Most topics have many sides worth arguing, allow me to take one opposite you.
    14. Re:NetworkManager by LordLimecat · · Score: 4, Insightful

      As someone who is deeply familiar with networking but only vaguely familiar with Linux's arcane ways of configuring its network-- which apparently change drastically depending on such things as:
        * whether you want it to be per-session (ifconfig)
        * or persistent (/etc/DependsOnYourDistro/someFiles)
        * whether it should actually persist with the interface rather than how the kernel decides to allocate /devs to the actual interface
      and so on-- I am quite happy to see NetworkManager. THere is no reason that setting up a bonded or tagged interface should be more complicated than saying it verbally, or why I should have to fall back to CLI in order to do that.

      Heres a fun tip: not everyone wants to be a full-time Linux admin devoted to a particular breed of distro. Some of us have a job in supporting a very wide array of systems, and the less arcane black magic we need to learn for each individual system the better. Historically Linux's networking has been AWFUL, as just a few years ago it was considered normal for a box's IP-to-interface mapping change on reboot because apparently its logical that the OS randomly assign interface IDs to physical interfaces, and there were roughly a hundred different methods and places to configure all of the various networking pieces (resolvers, mac addresses, firewall, bonding, vlans, device/interface mapping).

      It boggles my mind that there are people who think that complexity for complexity's sake is a good thing. CLI is wonderful for batch operations that you do every day. GUI is wonderful for things you will do once a month, and dont want to use mental bandwidth for remembering a command.

    15. Re:NetworkManager by LordLimecat · · Score: 2

      At least in CentOS and RHEL 7, NetworkManager does VLANs and Bonding and bridges in about 2 clicks. Add interface, choose bonding | VLAN | bridge, and go.

      bridged VLAN's (yes, those are a thing)

      Set up your VLAN interfaces, bridge them. Not seeing the issue.

      And ... and... well, 90% of the other functionality that is offered by the Linux networking stack.

      90% of the other functionality isnt relevant 90% of the time. The point of a GUI is to offer the most common options, and from my usage of NM, it does that admirably.

      So sure, if you're a sandwich shop putting a $500 server under the cash register, or you are a teenage college student setting up a video sharing network for your bro's in the flop house you board in, NetworkManager will work fine for you.

      What about a network engineer who has better things to do than spend more time researching the syntax for setting up tagging on a single node than it took to set up the switch infrastructure?

    16. Re:NetworkManager by 3.5+stripes · · Score: 2

      Around here, his 3 digit Slashdot ID would be enough, and then some..

      --


      He tried to kill me with a forklift!
  2. what's wrong with ifconfig? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Really, why do we need anything more than ifconfig and ethtool?

    1. Re:what's wrong with ifconfig? by Narcocide · · Score: 5, Funny

      Those are too simple and reliable. For Linux to compete with mainstream operating systems it needs more complexity and more bugs.

    2. Re:what's wrong with ifconfig? by Narcocide · · Score: 3, Funny

      Probably, and probably also pulseaudio.

    3. Re:what's wrong with ifconfig? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      So systemd will be bundling Network Manager?

      I don't know if it's an out-and-out requirement, but the two packages are very clearly in the same camp.

      I stay *far* away from systemd, Network Manager, and PulseAudio. I'm trying to avoid using things like udisks, upower, and Pol(icy)?Kit.

      captcha: crimes

    4. Re:what's wrong with ifconfig? by nyet · · Score: 2

      Don't forget avahi, which reliably causes shutdown to take o^n time (vs number of network interfaces and ipaliases) to shut down

    5. Re:what's wrong with ifconfig? by hobarrera · · Score: 3, Insightful

      On Linux? To connect to WPA2 networks (including WPA2+802.1X). That's an everyday scenario for a pretty much every laptop user.

      Sure, you can also do it via cli (with more tools than just those you mentioned), but, do you remember all the steps? Can you teach them to your mum? Can you automate it?

    6. Re:what's wrong with ifconfig? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

      Sure, you can also do it via cli (with more tools than just those you mentioned), but, do you remember all the steps?

      Why remember them? Dump the commands into a script and just run it.

      Can you automate it?

      No, of course not, because command line tools are the absolute worst for automation. </sarcasm>

      That said, if you're dealing with wireless, I'd suggest using wicd instead of either. Less shitty than NetworkManager, less complicated than command line, and it has multiple front-ends including gtk, qt, ncurses, and CLI. I started using it years ago because NM tended to break horribly and every few updates it would lose the ability to connect to hidden APs. Meanwhile, has always "just worked" and has been completely forgettable, which is probably the best compliment that kind of software can earn.

    7. Re:what's wrong with ifconfig? by Cley+Faye · · Score: 2

      For desktop users.
      Most "not power" user simply want their computer to access "the internet" and don't care much about anything in between. NetworkManager does just that: plug the ethernet, you get a working connection. Input a wifi password in a simple, straighforward input dialog, and it works.
      I don't know if it was designed explicitely for this usage, but it work wonderfully there. In other scenarios... not so good. On a dev system, or a server, you'll want to remove it. Bet let's not forget the desktop users :)

  3. apt-get remove ... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Interesting

    So, I want dnsmasq dynamically configured to use special name servers, in addition to and not in lieu of my regular name servers, when, and only when, a certain openvpn tunnel is active, as opposed to other openvpn tunnels I also have. Is this, after a decade of work, feasible using NetworkManager's normal built-in GUI interface? Or does it still cater to only straightforward DHCP wired and wireless use cases, ignoring anything move involved, as it has always done?

    I thought so.

    Dear distro makers; continue to anticipate the needs of those of us that cannot tolerate the limitations of NetworkManager and need to purge the thing from our systems. Specifically, ensure that it can be removed without being told the kernel depends on it, or some other ridiculousness. Thank you.

  4. mask NM by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative

    The most important feature is that it can be disabled, masked and unistalled without loosing functionality, as oppposed to other new TM things that I can't get rid of that easily

    1. Re:mask NM by Mr.+McGibby · · Score: 2

      I don't think the OP was making that point. I think he was saying that it's not so tightly coupled with everything else that it can't be removed without losing all kinds of unrelated functionality. I think it was a reference to the systemd fiasco.

      --
      Mad Software: Rantings on Developing So
  5. Never heard of it by gweihir · · Score: 5, Insightful

    And I have been a constant Linux user since 1994. This cannot be too important.

    --
    Most ACs are not even worth the keystrokes to insult them. Be generically insulted by this and ignored otherwise.
    1. Re:Never heard of it by SeaFox · · Score: 4, Insightful

      The best software does its job quietly and doesn't need a bunch of attention from the user, allowing your to do your actual work.
      Something that seems to be lost on the makers of many other software projects, OSS and commercial.

  6. Re:Should be interesting by stoborrobots · · Score: 2

    Ran Debian with NM and KDE for the last couple of years as well. Purged it recently in order to remove systemd (NM depends on PolKit which depends on pam-systemd for login session management), and replaced it with WICD.

    WiCD is not quite as smooth as NM for usb modems, but for wifi and wired ethernet, it does the job.

  7. Re:It's totally superfluous by Yosho · · Score: 4, Interesting

    And these guys spent 10 years simplifying that?

    No, they spent 10 years simplifying things like scanning for wireless access points, detecting the encryption type, and storing credentials. Or setting up routing over Bluetooth. Or configuring and switching between different types of VPNs. Or bridging between multiple interfaces. And having a little icon in your system tray that you can right-click on to do it all.

    If the only thing you ever do is set a static IP for your ethernet card then you probably don't need it, but a lot of people do more complex things than that.

    --
    Karma: Terrifying (mostly affected by atrocities you've committed)
  8. Re: It's totally superfluous by bill_mcgonigle · · Score: 3, Interesting

    oh, does bridging work finally? I spent well over an hour with nmcli docs and on Google trying to setup bridges for each vlan I was using on an el7 machine and got nowhere close to working. Spent 5 min setting up redhat ifcfg- files and was done after yum uninstalling nm. It says that nmcli got some love in 1.0, and boy that's a good thing.

    --
    My God, it's Full of Source!
    OUTSIDE_IP=$(dig +short my.ip @outsideip.net)
  9. Re:It's totally superfluous by hobarrera · · Score: 4, Interesting

    > It's hard to see how one could simplify Linux networking. It requires one ip addr command to set an IP address and one ip route command to set a default route. And on IPv6 even those are unnecessary, it's automatic.

    And a dns, too. And the wireless network name. And the wireless network username+password.

    And then, I have to do it all again in two minutes when you walk out of range. And then again when you get home. And then again at a cafe.

    NM might not be the nicest of things, but it sure beats the hell out of running several commands every time I relocate myself/my laptop.

  10. I like NetworkManager, but.... by DerPflanz · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Since NetworkManager, day-to-day network use (be it WiFi, wired or whatever) Just Works. I like that.

    However, when (as a developer, hardware-tinkerer or network problem solver) you are plugging in and out cables, connecting devices, etc, it would be nice to have NetworkManager to be put on "mute" or something. Just keep my fixed IP on the correct devices and stop enabling and disabling connections. That's the only time I turn the service off.

    --
    -- The Internet is a too slow way of doing things, you'd never do without it.
  11. Re:Parent comment shows exactly what's wrong with by Carewolf · · Score: 2

    Well, you don't have to figth it. It will autoconfigure just fine after moving the cables. All you need to do is wait the 500ms it takes to do a new DHCP request and get the same IP adress again. If that is too long, you should probably be using a static configuration in the first place.

  12. Re:It's totally superfluous by drinkypoo · · Score: 2

    It presents the same problem as systemd. Take one problem, solving wifi connections, and then make a tool which unnecessarily manages all aspects of networking. dhclient manages to remain long-running and handle the DHCP operations for an interface, all that was needed was the equivalent wifi daemon. Once you step beyond the simplest configurations, Network-Manager has always become an impediment and not an assistant.

    --
    "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
  13. Re:just in time... by PincushionMan · · Score: 2

    The real WTF is that he's not kidding. Ubuntu says that systemd needs nm-online to function, and if it's not ready to go, they will replace it [NetworkManager] with something that will.