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In Florida, Secrecy Around Stingray Leads To Plea Bargain For a Robber
schwit1 writes The case against Tadrae McKenzie looked like an easy win for prosecutors. He and two buddies robbed a small-time pot dealer of $130 worth of weed using BB guns. Under Florida law, that was robbery with a deadly weapon, with a sentence of at least four years in prison. But before trial, his defense team detected investigators' use of a secret surveillance tool, one that raises significant privacy concerns. In an unprecedented move, a state judge ordered the police to show the device — a cell-tower simulator sometimes called a StingRay — to the attorneys. Rather than show the equipment, the state offered McKenzie a plea bargain. Today, 20-year-old McKenzie is serving six months' probation after pleading guilty to a second-degree misdemeanor. He got, as one civil liberties advocate said, the deal of the century.
6 months probation is about right for what he did anyway. I can't believe they're clogging prisons with petty criminals like this then turning violent criminals out because of over crowding. A BB gun as a deadly weapon? They're turning the legal system into a farce with that kind of bullshit.
Call your congressman and ask them why they're using illegal surveillance tools to let criminals get away.
-1 disagree is not a modifier for a reason. -1 troll, flaimbait, redundant, overrated are NOT acceptable substitutes.
This. There should not be an incentive for pleading guilty. One should never have their freedom taken away merely for inconveniencing the system.
And, if they were so keen not to reveal their kit, couldn't he have refused to bargain all the way, waiting for the judge to insist at each stage that this equipment be exposed? Or is the judicial system too broken to throw out a case where a prosecutor has deliberately changed the charge because it refuses to follow the judge's instructions on the initial charge?
I'd still rather take the deal bankers got when they effectively stole billions and we gave them more money.
He's a petty thief The police are violating the constitution, and completely ignoring the rule of law. For all intents and purposes the cops are the judge, jury and executioner, with a badge and gun.
The police were able to avoid a trial, which is one of the major ways that the legal system has been subverted. The penalties are so draconian that even innocent people plead guilty, because if they don't they will be held forever.
Here's a current example from Montana.
That's right. Life in jail for showing fake nipples three times. Of course they backed off on it, but the fact that this was even considered shows how corrupt the law has become.
Why is Snark Required?
Congratulations, you just reinvented the concept of "outlaw". The original idea was that law protected the law abiding. Those who broke the law had the aegis of the law removed and thus anyone could harm the outlaw in any way without legal repercussion.
Interestingly, originally courts required that defendants recognize their authority before the court could try them. Defendants who refused to do so were subjected to various coercions. The coercive method of choice was "pressing".
Here's one bad mother fucker who refused to submit to the state... read his last words: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Giles_Corey
In other legal news from the great State of Florida, the Charlotte County Sheriff’s Office has been caught recording defendants' privileged conversations with their attorneys, and, on occasion, providing said recordings to prosecutors.
Hey, other countries get along fine without civil rights. Who needs 'em, amirite?
http://www.winknews.com/2015/0...
Actually - you can.
Sticking a gun to somebody's head and demanding things from him is robbery. If the things happen to be illegal that's a seperate crime of which he is guilty, but it doesn't make YOUR crime okay.
That logic is a recipe for rampant vigilantism. Sure I shot twenty people down in the past year your honour, but they were all criminals, teenagers smoking doobies !
Unicode killed the ASCII-art *
Because they are unwilling to disclose the use of these devices it is possible that
a very long list of prosecutions will be undone including this plea should the information
see the light of day.
There is some reason to believe that a court order to demand the police retain all records could be justified.
It is not clear if the records can be released but this and other actions with these tools implies the legal footing
is not clear and that the tool is astoundingly broad and effective in what it gathers.
I might note here that it has been recently disclosed that the keys to SIM card codes
have apparently been stolen by one or more TLA. http://www.ign.com/articles/20...
One article gave a four year window to this key theft perhaps more.
If these devices are sold and if these stolen keys are involved it gets interesting.
Truth is stranger than fiction, but it is because Fiction is obliged to stick to possibilities; Truth isn't. Mark Twain.
Hopefully the guy's learned his lesson. Pulling a BB gun on a drug dealer seems like a pretty good way of getting yourself killed.
I'm trying to teach myself to set people on fire with my mind... Is it hot in here?
Because the uses are highly illegal, nearly certain to intercept the calls of law abiding citizens, and absolute proof that they intend to become big brother as soon as they can.
Because they dont want to give anyone standing to force the issue into a court they cant withdraw from. You cant sue if you dont have standing. They want to keep the tool without allowing it to be vetted by the justice process.
Good-bye
6 months probation is about right for what he did anyway. I can't believe they're clogging prisons with petty criminals like this then turning violent criminals out because of over crowding. A BB gun as a deadly weapon? They're turning the legal system into a farce with that kind of bullshit.
Actually a BB gun can seriously injure someone. I was hit with a BB once (accidental) mind you, hitting me on my knuckle. That dig itself in bad. I do not want to think what it could do to an eye.
== the following below are generalizations of what the law says, counting variations across different jurisdictions within and outside the US ==
By law, a "deadly weapon" is not just a weapon that can kill for certain, but that has the potential to cause a serious injury that can lead to death. A BB to the eyeball at short range can do that. So can a rock being thrown to someone's face. In some jurisdictions around the world, a professional boxer's hands can be considered deadly weapons given that, unlike other people within their respective weight classes, professional boxes can kill someone with a punch to the temple.
The fact that using a BB gun has the potential to seriously injure someone makes its use a 3rd degree assault (potential to injury + recklessness). Use it to commit a crime and that shit by default ups it up to 2nd or even 1st degree depending of the circumstance.
Moreover, the law (as it should be) takes into consideration the state of mind of a potential victim. If the victim seriously thinks he is in physical danger, that is enough to bring a 3rd degree assault charge, even if the assault never takes place. This is more so if the person is put into a state of being scared of his well being or life while being subjected of a crime (then it goes to 2nd or 1st degree).
The person would have to know pretty well that the weapon is a BB gun and not a real gun. It is unreasonable to expect a person in a state of fright to recognize the two. If this were the case, one could argue I could attempt robbery with a fake gun (or a gun without rounds in it) and then claim in my defense that I did not use a deadly weapon. I hope I don't think I have to explain this one any further.
I disagree with you that 6 months probation was enough. This wasn't a harmless crime, and this person is a criminal.
I agree that we put petty criminals to jail too often. But armed robbery is not petty crime.
Breaking into a house when no one is there, and stealing a TV is. Cutting a bicycle chain to steal it, that is petty crime. Shoplifting is a petty crime. Selling bootlegged DVDs or dope is.
Armed robbery, subjecting a victim to a state of being afraid of his physical well being, that is not a petty crime.
What I'm really curious, and what I'm really afraid, and the real question of importance is: what the hell were the authorities so afraid to disclosed that they opted to drop charges and offer a plea. There is something absolutely wrong going on here if they have to cover that shit like that. That is the stuff we should we worried about.
Wish I had mod points. The plea bargain system usurps the intent of laws. At a min it leaves the public wishing there was a law against X,Y, and Z, and it has turned into an extortion game called Throw the Book at You (tm).