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Learn About FIRST's New Embedded Linux Controller (Video)

Posted by Roblimo on from the rocking-and-socking-more-powerfully-than-ever dept.

Our interviewee today is Mike Anderson, an adviser to FIRST (For Inspiration and Recognition of Science and Technology) Team 116 at Herndon High School in Virginia. He's here to tell us about the new embedded Linux controller FIRST is using this year. It is apparently a bit short of documentation at this stage, so team 116 and others have been posting what they learn at Chief Delphi, which is 'the' FIRST online discussion forum (and fun to read to keep up with all things FIRST). We've talked about FIRST before. We've taken you to FIRST competitions, and looked behind the scenes at the building of a FIRST robot, and will no doubt keep covering a selection of FIRST activities in the future.

26 comments

  1. FIRST by sdguero · · Score: 3, Funny

    I thirst to be FIRST!

    1. Re:FIRST by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      What a lucky post to be first on

    2. Re:FIRST by marcello_dl · · Score: 1

      bad luck Brian:
      posts first post
      every other post in the discussion is also a FIRST post.

      --
      ---- MISSING MISCELLANEOUS DATA SEGMENT --- [sigdash] trolololol
    3. Re:FIRST by JimMcc · · Score: 1

      Yes, but his was the first first post, which for first posts was a first.

  2. Story translation by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Our interviewee today is Mike Anderson, an adviser to FIRST (For Inspiration and Recognition of Systemd in Technology) Team 666 at Herndon High School in Virginia. He's here to tell us about the new embedded Linux controller FIRST is using this year, fully powered by Systemd of course. It is apparently a bit short of documentation at this stage and I don't quite ever know what's going on because it refuses to give me readable log files, so team 666 and others have been posting what they learn (usually nothing) at Chief Pottering's personal Yahoo groups page, which is 'the' FIRST online discussion forum (and fun to read to keep up with all things Systemd). We've talked about FIRST before. We've taken you to FIRST competitions, and looked behind the scenes at the building of a FIRST robot full driven by Systemd since forking the Linux kernel, and will no doubt keep covering a selection of FIRST activities into the infinite future.

    1. Re:Story translation by whitroth · · Score: 1

      Ah, yes, non-readable logs, because they're Poettering's brilliant idea of binary logfiles that require a special tool to read....

                        mark

  3. Help! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I got loaded last night at the LUG and I shat cum this morning. Is this normal?

    Btw, cool vid!

  4. BIll Clinton by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Bill Clinton

  5. Hopefully reduce input lag by ArylAkamov · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I hope this is a bit faster than the older system, I remember there being quite a long input lag a few years ago. Perhaps they'll put some effort into building a proper playing field as well.

  6. Entertainment for rich kids by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

    FIRST is obscenely expensive. I was asked to judge a regional last year. I was stunned to learn how expensive it is to participate. The entry fee is $6k. That buys a basic parts kit. Throw in tools, the rest of the parts and other expenses and it's a minimum of $10-20k to play. The winning teams have workshops that cost nearly a million dollars (e.g. water jet cutters, CNC mills, etc). It's mostly just RC robot wars.

    1. Re:Entertainment for rich kids by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      That's why a good part of a successful FRC team is a media/communications effort that reaches out to companies and individuals for sponsorships (monetary or in-kind). I understand the "for rich kids" part, but how can you justify calling it "entertainment?" What you see at the events is the result of three months' hard labor -- which in itself is a result of the rest of the year's planning and education.

    2. Re: Entertainment for rich kids by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      It is obscenely expensive, fun maybe for the kids, and success is definitely skewed towards the wealthy. That and from what I keep seeing, the mentors are more than likely to have stepped over the line, making what is produced much more of their work than the kids.

    3. Re:Entertainment for rich kids by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      It's true that the top 1% of teams are like that, and that they win the most. But for every team like that, there are 100 more that are made by students from average backgrounds that get by on fundraisers and help from local businesses. I participated (well over a decade ago) and our school was in the poorest part of the district, in an area most would consider a "ghetto". I guarantee you no one on the team was rich. Our sponsor donated money and time of their engineers and gave students an opportunity to see a path in life many may not have even considered otherwise. A big part of the program is the scholarships and internship opportunities that are available to participants. $10k is not that much when it is spread over 15-30 students that make up an average team. A lot of high school football teams spend way more then that, and that money comes directly from the school instead of being raised by sponsors.

      It's true that the teams with the most resources win at the highest level, and in areas with a lot of tech/manufacturing companies it can become a bit elitist (like Silicon Valley or Michigan) but winning is not the primary goal of the program. There can only be one winning alliance at the end of the day, and in any competitive sport the team with the better equipment, resources and funding often wins. If you had a football team, and you didn't win the championship, was it wasted effort to play? Is it wasted to have tried? The benefits of your practice are still there. FIRST is about getting kids exposed to the fact that you can have an amazing life full of challenge and satisfaction using your brain to solve problems in the STEM fields. I volunteer at some events, and a lot of the volunteers and mentors are people who work in STEM and love going to work every day, and want to share that with young people who may think their best opportunities are things like "becoming a pro basketball player".

    4. Re: Entertainment for rich kids by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      All in all, from the teams I have seen and worked with, the expenditures are well below expenses for other extracurricular sports activities at schools regardless of the specific schools wealth. This is one of the best programs out there that gives students a chance to work on college level senior design projects in high school.

         

    5. Re: Entertainment for rich kids by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The only reason you think the kids aren't building these things is because you haven't talked to them. The most winning teams are almost universally the most student-driven organizations -- just like the most winning high school football teams their consistency comes from deliberate organizational behavior not the individual work of hero. I was the programming mentor for a team this year and I literally never checked anything into the repro; at best I pointed at something on a screen and made a recommendation, or emailed some example code. All while building a design that I recommended against. If that's not student-lead I don't know is.

      Expensive I have to give you. Though it's worth pointing out that I've made it to state-level finals with a team from a school with a 50% daily attendance rate (i.e. $0 for things list FIRST, sometimes not even a room) that doesn't require any financial or other support from students or their families. We don't even have a policy about it; we are funded almost entirely by grants and sponsorship arrangements that the students from the team apply for/negotiate directly. Which, BTW, is officially part of the system; one of the aspects of engineering is economics, and there are direct awards for teams with exceptional achievements in those sorts of "soft skills" categories.

    6. Re: Entertainment for rich kids by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You talk about stepping "over the line", but there is no line here. FIRST encourages professional engineers to work *with* students as peers. Yes, there are some teams where students have to "earn the right" to work on the robot with the mentors, and there are some teams whose culture is that no mentors *ever* touch the robot. Every team is different, and they are given the latitude to run the team how they want. The team I've been involved with tries to maintain a good balance by keeping mentors involved hands-on but also trying to keep most of the work done by the students. The reason is that we think this is a unique opportunity for these kids to work alongside an engineer. Seeing how we go about identifying problems and solving them is something no other organization or activity I know of can give high school students.

    7. Re:Entertainment for rich kids by miller701 · · Score: 1

      Have you looked into BEST? I volunteer for that at the hub and regional level and according to the FAQ it's free for teams.

  7. FIRST Alum. by Nabeel_co · · Score: 1

    As someone who competed in FIRST as a kid, I'm glad that they are still pushing things forward.

    It was an incredible experience.

  8. Which competitions? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Which competitions will this be used for?

    I assume FIRST Robotics will use it.

    I assume that FIRST Lego League will not use it.

    What about FIRST Tech Challenge?

    --A head robotics coach, about to start FTC for the 2015-2016 year.

    1. Re:Which competitions? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      this one is just for First Robotics
      First Tech Challenge uses an android-based cell phone and some add-ons

    2. Re: Which competitions? by BeaverCleaver · · Score: 1

      I think Lego EV3 uses embedded Linux... Does that count?

      --
      sustainable living
  9. Not like it used to be... by Leuf · · Score: 1

    Back in my day all you had was a couple cordless drills for power and a remote control. I thought it was an engineering competition, not a programming contest.

    1. Re:Not like it used to be... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I don't care how beautiful your UI is, you're still gonna need to build a robot to win this thing. And not just any robot -- one that can perform the required game piece interactions and with non-trivial design constraints like a 6-week announcement-to-conclusion season and a strict weight limit.

      / Also unclear on why programming can't be part of engineering

  10. fuck videos by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    dice eat a dick straight up