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Google Takes Over NYC's Free WiFi Project

Posted by Soulskill on from the ok-google-get-me-some-wifi dept.

dkatana writes: Google's new Smart Cities venture Sidewalk Labs announced the purchase of Intersection, the new company behind the LinkNYC project. nGoogle wants to speed up the developing of free internet access to New York residents and visitors, as a way to gather more information about their activities. Users of the pylons will provide the company invaluable data about their habits, places they visit, and browsing activity.

As part of the original LinkNYC plan, Intersection is scheduled to start deploying the new ad-supported, locally manufactured, WiFi 'pylons' this fall, reaching all five boroughs of the city. It will be the largest and fastest free municipal WiFi system in the world. After that, the company plans to start rolling out similar initiatives in other U.S. cities, but details have not been made public yet.

68 comments

  1. Soon Google will know everything about us all by NotDrWho · · Score: 2

    And double plus good it will be!

    --
    SJW's don't eliminate discrimination. They just expropriate it for themselves.
    1. Re:Soon Google will know everything about us all by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      In related news, the internet speed of US citizens drops as Google shunt more tracking data of more people over it and delivers more adverts to them.

      I wonder if the NSA has secretly bought google to be their "civilian tracking system"

  2. I hope it rolls out in more cities by psergiu · · Score: 3, Funny

    I hope it rolls out in more cities until it reaches mine.

    Google can extract whatever habitual information he wants from my VPN connection over their free WiFi.
    I'll make sure to stream data from /dev/urandom while i'm not actively using the connection, so they can have more information about me.

    Thank You Google !

    --
    1% APY, No fees, Online Bank https://captl1.co/2uIErYq Don't let your $$$ sit in a no-interest acct.
    1. Re: I hope it rolls out in more cities by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Um, cool?

      Instead your VPN provider gets to know everything about you. And I bet they're a lot smaller than Google. At least with google you get lost in the noise.

      And just because they say they don't keep logs or everything is properly encrypted doesn't mean a damn thing when the NSA decides a terrorist might be using your VPN.

    2. Re:I hope it rolls out in more cities by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      So google knows your location.

      Seems like they can still manage to target you with ads at that point...

      Picture if you will a bill board (that broadcasts wifi) that knows you are approaching because of your BSSID, they know you go to the italian restaurant, and that you spend several hours a day there... They billboard changes as you approach to advertise a new italian restaurant that just opened up around the corner.
      Further more they'll know if you go to that new restaurant because you are constantly broadcasting data ... and they'll be able to tailored ever more effective ads based on your REAL world experiences.

      Google knows there is only so much ad revenue on the internet, but moving into real world ad revenue is a way to expand...

    3. Re: I hope it rolls out in more cities by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      And I would want this... Why? Cheep as fuck man...

    4. Re:I hope it rolls out in more cities by flashsag · · Score: 1

      I see you're not using Android 4.4 devices, which have a VPN bug that prevents any useful connection to a VPN.

    5. Re:I hope it rolls out in more cities by nine-times · · Score: 1

      I'll make sure to stream data from /dev/urandom while i'm not actively using the connection, so they can have more information about me.

      Great! I can't wait for our public communications infrastructure to be saturated by your random bits because a few jackasses are afraid that someone might catch on that they're looking at porn.

    6. Re:I hope it rolls out in more cities by psergiu · · Score: 1

      It's not "our public communications infrastructure", it's Google's.
      Or are you working for Google by any chance ? :-)

      --
      1% APY, No fees, Online Bank https://captl1.co/2uIErYq Don't let your $$$ sit in a no-interest acct.
    7. Re: I hope it rolls out in more cities by psergiu · · Score: 2

      This is /.
      People here are supposed to know how to configure their own VPN servers.
      But i see that for some people it's too hard to even create an account, so they post as ACs ;-)

      --
      1% APY, No fees, Online Bank https://captl1.co/2uIErYq Don't let your $$$ sit in a no-interest acct.
    8. Re: I hope it rolls out in more cities by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      How dare you - insensitive clod. I speak for all of us ACs

    9. Re:I hope it rolls out in more cities by psergiu · · Score: 4, Interesting

      1) Random BSSID generator at every reconnect.

      2) In fact, i would very much like to see relevant & useful ads. Right now, almost none of the ads i see are useful for me.
      Example: I bought a car last month. Now half of my ads are about car sales. Thank you very much - i already have the car, i don't need another. I would like to see ads about accessories and add-ons for my new car. But noooo. New cars only.

      I wish there was a page in the Google profile settings where you can enter keywords for the ad engine so the displayed ads are for something useful i could really click on. (claiming prior art)

      Continuing the car example - i'll happily tell Google about my cars, the mileage & last service dates - i would not mind seeing ads about: Your 20xx Kia needs a oil change in the next 2 weeks, how about going to "Nearby Service Company" - oil change & tire rotation for only $number using coupon code GOOGLEOWNSYOU

      --
      1% APY, No fees, Online Bank https://captl1.co/2uIErYq Don't let your $$$ sit in a no-interest acct.
    10. Re:I hope it rolls out in more cities by nine-times · · Score: 1

      First, you seem to be missing the point in that your suggested behavior is the behavior of an asshole. This is why we can't have nice things.

      But besides that, this news story is about Google taking over LinkNYC, a project to provide free, public municipal WiFi to the NYC. So yeah, we're talking about public infrastructure, even if Google will be the contractor tasked with building and maintaining it.

    11. Re:I hope it rolls out in more cities by psergiu · · Score: 1

      Ok,

      Then instead of random data, i'll just open a Torrent client to seed Linux & BSD distros and other free software.

      You cannot win, your free wifi bandwidth will be reduced to acoustic modem dialup speeds anyway. :)

      And please RTFA & TFL - it's not public infrastructure, the city will rent out locations for the pylons in exchange for $$$ - like any billboard. Only that those billboards will have touch-screens and Google-provided WiFi.

      "Through Titan's advertising network, Link could bring $500 million in ad revenue to the city over the next 12 years, according to Mayor Bill de Blasio's office."

      --
      1% APY, No fees, Online Bank https://captl1.co/2uIErYq Don't let your $$$ sit in a no-interest acct.
    12. Re:I hope it rolls out in more cities by nine-times · · Score: 1

      it's not public infrastructure, the city will rent out locations for the pylons in exchange for $$$ - like any billboard.

      So they're selling ad space on the side of the equipment-- what's your point here? This is a scheme for providing municipal WiFi. Does the road stop being "public infrastructure" because billboards are setup alongside it? Does the subway stop being "public transportation" because there are ads in it?

      Go crawl back in your troll hole.

    13. Re:I hope it rolls out in more cities by chihowa · · Score: 2

      In fact, i would very much like to see relevant & useful ads. Right now, almost none of the ads i see are useful for me.

      You would very much like to see relevant & useful ads, or you would very much like to stop seeing irrelevant & useless ads?

      Because while the latter is true for me and most of the people that I know, the former is not quite so popular and doesn't necessarily follow from the latter. A much more palatable way to see fewer irrelevant & useless ads would be to stop seeing so many ads altogether. The more Google's hand touches things, the less likely that is to ever happen.

      --
      If you want a vision of the future, imagine a youtube comments section scrolling - forever.
    14. Re:I hope it rolls out in more cities by kqs · · Score: 1

      I would like to stop seeing irrelevant & useless ads, and I would like the websites I use to continue getting enough money to operate.

      If I see no ads, then I get one wish but not the other (more important) one.

      If I see relevant & useful ads, I get both wishes. Sure, I'd rather see no ads, but if the cost is "lose many websites I like", then the price is way too high.

      I am curious why you think that getting rid of google would decrease the number of ads you see? It seems like on google sites I see a few ads and a lot of content, while on other sites I cannot find the content behind the flashing, auto-playing, screen-covering ads.

    15. Re:I hope it rolls out in more cities by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Google can extract whatever habitual information he wants from my VPN connection over their free WiFi.
      I'll make sure to stream data from /dev/urandom while i'm not actively using the connection,

      Or you could, oh I don't know, show an above zero level of self control and refrain from using products/services that you claim to hate the very existence of.

      Rewarding companies for doing what you claim you don't want them doing is almost always counter-productive and works against your own best interests. A shocker, I know...

      While you're at it, might as well open all the slashdot front page articles over the past couple days and post at the root level about how you have no interest in said article and have no self control to simply scroll past them :P

    16. Re:I hope it rolls out in more cities by MobileTatsu-NJG · · Score: 1

      When I go to eBay I start seeings ads on Facebook for what I had just searched for. Think about that for a minute.

      --

      "I like to lick butts!" by MobileTatsu-NJG (#32700246) (Score:5, Informative)

    17. Re:I hope it rolls out in more cities by Obfuscant · · Score: 1

      And please RTFA & TFL - it's not public infrastructure,

      The radio frequencies being used are license-free publicly-owned resources. WiFi doesn't work by magic, it takes bandwidth in the radio spectrum.

      When you are streaming random numbers just to be using the bandwidth, you are interfering with other users. Even other users who are not using Google's access points.

    18. Re: I hope it rolls out in more cities by jcwayne · · Score: 1

      Wait...there's more than one?

      --
      Failure to follow this advice may result in non-deterministic behavior.
    19. Re:I hope it rolls out in more cities by kqs · · Score: 1

      You mean that advertising companies that put ads on both Facebook and eBay know how to look at referrer links? So they're sending you ads for something that you are interested in, rather than personal lube and adult diapers? (Unless that's what you searched for on eBay, of course.) Seems like a relative win. Sure, facebook without ads would be better, but then you'd have... no facebook, so as much as I personally dislike facebook, that would not be a win.

    20. Re:I hope it rolls out in more cities by MobileTatsu-NJG · · Score: 1

      So they're sending you ads for something that you are interested in, rather than personal lube and adult diapers? .. Seems like a relative win.

      So, just to be clear, you think it's okay for Facebook to collect information about your adult diaper fetish that you didn't explicitly give them. Correct?

      --

      "I like to lick butts!" by MobileTatsu-NJG (#32700246) (Score:5, Informative)

    21. Re:I hope it rolls out in more cities by just+another+AC · · Score: 1

      They will get your location data. They can leverage that to work out values for physical advertising in meat space.

      You will give them information whether you like it or not. ...and if I put on my tinfoil hat, someone is already snooping your "secure" VPN connection

    22. Re:I hope it rolls out in more cities by kqs · · Score: 1

      "Okay" is relative. I often wish the world were different, but given how the Internet works and how HTTP works, privacy is really hard. Given that, I don't waste time trying to put genies back in bottles.

      So I'm trying to make a world where I don't have to be ashamed of (and cannot be fired from my job for) a diaper fetish. Where I cannot be refused insurance if someone finds out I have an expensive illness. Where I can be any gender (or no gender) I want. Cameras on phones and on streets are never going away, so I want just as many cameras pointed at police and at corporations as they have pointed at us.

      Ads are not going away, so I'd rather the money they generate helps support the websites I like.

    23. Re:I hope it rolls out in more cities by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      seeing ads about: Your 20xx Kia needs a oil change in the next 2 week

      Dude...do you really need to have 20 Kias? And how will Google know which one needs the oil change without car specific monitors?

  3. It's all about the Fi by mtippett · · Score: 1

    Tin foil hat on. It came to me last week.

    Google has recently released Project Fi. A project/product (is project a codeword for beta now?) that will allow seamless transition between 2G/3G/LTE and *WiFi* for increased coverage and strength.

    Project Fi is bandwidth charged, independent of data link being used - so while the underlying carriers (T-Mobile & Sprint) may charge wholesale for data, google will effectively get the bandwidth at "Google WiFi" for free - meaning that the data charges are a lot more profitable when going past a Starbucks, in NYC, etc. Although unproven, google might actually have meaningful alternate revenue sources from this model.

    This is not fundamentally different than Xfinity's wifi sharing - except google is going for the Free WiFi in the Starbucks, NYC, etc. B2B is a lot more pragmatic, and a lot easier to enable.

    Now if only Project Fi worked in a phone that was in the $2-300 range, I'd probably give it a go. But the Nexus 6 is too big and too expensive. Hopefully the invite won't expire.

  4. Don't be evil? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    And even better, we'll get ads on free WiFi! I can't wait for this value added service! Go Google go!

    1. Re:Don't be evil? by MobileTatsu-NJG · · Score: 1

      And once it becomes useful... cancelled!

      --

      "I like to lick butts!" by MobileTatsu-NJG (#32700246) (Score:5, Informative)

  5. the title by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The title of the Article should have been, "Google wants to become Big Brother!", this would have been a much closer to the truth.

    1. Re:the title by cjjjer · · Score: 1

      Sorry but Social Media has beaten Google to it.

  6. gutting broadband in NYC? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Will this "Free WIFi" going to be good enough for all of the residents in NYC (within reach of it) to give up their broadband and leach off of the Free WiFi?

    1. Re:gutting broadband in NYC? by oldmac31310 · · Score: 1

      Betteridge.

      --
      http://www.acetonestudio.com
  7. It is no longer a "free" WiFi project by QuietLagoon · · Score: 2

    Users will be paying for it with google doing a wholesale collection of private data from those who use it.

    1. Re:It is no longer a "free" WiFi project by chemish · · Score: 1

      Users will be paying for it with google doing a wholesale collection of private data from those who use it.

      Does it surprise you that it isn't 'free'? Sorry to burst your bubble but it wasn't 'free' before and nothing ever is.

    2. Re:It is no longer a "free" WiFi project by funwithBSD · · Score: 1

      All your base belong to us!

      --
      Never answer an anonymous letter. - Yogi Berra
    3. Re:It is no longer a "free" WiFi project by oldmac31310 · · Score: 0

      I think you will find that it is 'all your base are belong to us'. Thank you and have a good lack of ability to quote correctly day.

      --
      http://www.acetonestudio.com
    4. Re:It is no longer a "free" WiFi project by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Current ISPs collect your private data AND charge you for it.. If you are going to ask for a citation, just stick with your benevolent and generous current ISP. With google, they just collect the data

    5. Re:It is no longer a "free" WiFi project by crtreece · · Score: 1

      Data analysis of traffic from user 59298: all we see is a stream of encrypted traffic to a known VPN provider.

      --
      file: .signature not found
    6. Re:It is no longer a "free" WiFi project by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Don't worry, there are some statistical analyses that can extract information from the size and timing of those VPN packets.

    7. Re:It is no longer a "free" WiFi project by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The problem isn't that it's not "actually" free, the problem is that people don't understand what's being collected about them or the ways it's being used.

      We already see people being charged different prices for online shopping based on their OS (some Mac users were being charged more) for example.

      Employers, insurance companies, and politicians are already using this information AGAINST you.

      So it's not the "free" part that's the problem, it's the FUCKING EVIL part.

  8. Subway...? by nine-times · · Score: 2

    As a NYC resident, I appreciate the idea of free WiFi. I especially like the idea of having some kind of free Internet access for people who can't afford it, since... really... it's getting more and more of a disadvantage to not have access. I think Internet access should be considered linked to issues of economic opportunity, of public safety, and of free speech rights (your freedom of speech is hindered by not having access to telecommunications infrastructure).

    But if I'm honest, the biggest thing I'd like to see for my own benefit is some kind of Internet access for the subway. Some subway stations get cell phone reception, depending on your carrier. Reception in the tunnels themselves is a bit of a rarity. Given that subway rides can take a couple of hours, it'd be nice to expect some kind of wireless access during that time.

    1. Re:Subway...? by tompaulco · · Score: 4, Insightful

      your freedom of speech is hindered by not having access to telecommunications infrastructure

      Nope, your freedom of speech is not dependent upon any particular means of expression. You can stand on the street corner and express your views, but nobody is required to buy you a megaphone, or internet access, or Reuters.

      --
      If you are not allowed to question your government then the government has answered your question.
    2. Re:Subway...? by DutchUncle · · Score: 1

      I live near NYC and ride the subway weekly, and concur. But: Consider what we're asking for: we're in a metal box, rolling on metal rails, with a lot of high voltage and electric motors, UNDERGROUND . . . and we want radio reception. I'm amazed it works as well as it does! (Note - Some stations do have good wifi coverage, presumably installed because it has become part of the station infrastructure - not for critical sensors, I hope, but for information signs or advertising, and perhaps for video surveillance. )

    3. Re:Subway...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      In my limited understanding it would be costly to send Wi-Fi down subway tunnels, I think that concrete and rebar construction would absorb rather then reflect Wi-Fi requiring a repeater every time the tunnel turns and more often the normal along the straights.

    4. Re:Subway...? by nine-times · · Score: 1, Offtopic

      Your view is, to be honest, myopic if not willfully ignorant. Your "freedom of speech" is not specifically dependent on a particular means. However, saying, "You don't need to have access to the Internet in order to express yourself" is a bit like saying, "You don't need to have access to roads, trains, or planes in order to travel." Yes, I suppose that's true, but failing to have access to that travel infrastructure sure does hinder your ability to travel.

      It's also worth noting that the First Amendment specifies "Congress shall make no law... abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press". Now a lot of people assume that "freedom of the press" refers to "the press" as in "the fourth estate". However, at the time, referring to "the press" would also have implied simply, "the use of a printing press". This means that the amendment acknowledges that any "freedom of speech" is inhibited by denying access to the technology to disseminate your message.

      But let's set all of that aside, because I'm ultimately not talking about a US Constitutional interpretation, arguing that the Federal government is somehow obligated by the First Amendment to provide Internet access to all citizens. I'm not saying that. I'm saying that the "freedom of speech" is not a right granted by the Constitution, but an inalienable right of all people. All people should have the freedom and ability to voice their opinions and views. Regardless of any legal or Constitutional obligations, we have a moral obligation to avoid culturally segregating massive numbers of people, preventing them from speaking their mind in public forums, and preventing them from hearing the viewpoints of others.

      And in that sense, and to that end, I think it is a very good idea to provide public Internet access to those who can't afford it. Even if it's not a "free speech" issue in the sense of "The Supreme Court should rule on the Constitutionality of [whatever]", it's a "free speech" issue in the sense of "morally, these people should not be shut out of the conversation."

    5. Re:Subway...? by oldmac31310 · · Score: 1

      yeah right...NYC - I love it but it sucks so bad in so many ways...

      --
      http://www.acetonestudio.com
    6. Re:Subway...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I think the idea is that the subway car itself would be the (moving) hotspot.

    7. Re:Subway...? by oldmac31310 · · Score: 1

      Mostly because so many stations are close to the surface, in my experience. Much of NY subway is cut and cover and not far below surface level. More accident than design for the wifi, I think. NYC does not do 'nice things' for its residents. Every little bit has to be fought for, tooth and nail.

      --
      http://www.acetonestudio.com
    8. Re:Subway...? by nine-times · · Score: 1

      What you're listing are reasons why it's more difficult than providing wireless usually is, which is probably why it hasn't been done yet. However, it can be done. It should be done. We could debate how quickly and how extensively it should be done, but it should be done.

      Sort of like putting signs in the subway station that tells you when the next train is coming. I understand that there are some challenges, and it's great that they have it in a few stations now, but really it should have have been done several years ago.

    9. Re:Subway...? by desdinova+216 · · Score: 1

      well, clearly the simple solution from a technical standpoint would be to equip the stations and the subway cars.

    10. Re:Subway...? by Dragonslicer · · Score: 2

      Cell reception, at least with T-Mobile, works quite well in Boston's subways.

    11. Re:Subway...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If you actually feel you have something of value to say (which is what the idea of free speech protects) you'd at least put in the damn effort to find internet service. You're in NYC. I imagine it's as simple as step off the subway and walk down the street a block to a starbucks/McDonalds/whatever. Done.

      If what you have to say isn't even that valuable your "free speech" is just pollution and we don't care.

    12. Re:Subway...? by OhPlz · · Score: 1

      Cell service in the subways is a curious thing. On the one hand, you can use your smart phones and other devices while riding. Yet on the other hand, the MBTA is constantly warning people against using expensive electronics on the subway because they're a ripe target for thieves.

    13. Re:Subway...? by OhPlz · · Score: 1

      Where is the subway car going to get its connection from?

    14. Re:Subway...? by khr · · Score: 1

      No, they're adding quite a lot of communications infrastructure to many stations in Manhattan. It's all visible overhead, and they publish articles about which ones they've done so far and which ones are scheduled next.

    15. Re:Subway...? by oldmac31310 · · Score: 1

      That may be so. But they have a long, long way to go before signals are anything more than patchy. Still, I don't particularly want people yammering like idiots on their phones while I try to snooze on the way to work.

      --
      http://www.acetonestudio.com
    16. Re:Subway...? by Vitriol+Angst · · Score: 1

      "Freedom of Speech" is nothing without access to information. If a person cannot get to the Internet, they are confined to commercial forms of information.

      In my opinion, if a person could only be informed by CNN, Fox and a Newspaper, they'd be better off not having an opinion at all.

      And have you TRIED dealing with any kind of public service or support system without the Internet these days? Paying utility bills?

      I think the concept some people have about going without the Internet is pretty old fashioned. You are shut out of a good portion of opportunity, access and "reality."

      --
      >>"ad space available -- low rates!!!"
  9. Insufficient data! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    You must construct additional pylons!

    1. Re: Insufficient data! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Better get them built before my Zergling rush!

    2. Re: Insufficient data! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Thanks for this. Read the comments just to see YOU MUST CONSTRUCT MORE PYLONS!

      Honestly, I have no idea how this wasn't the first comment. :/

  10. Didn't I Just See This Movie? by DumbSwede · · Score: 1

    Kingsman :)

    --
    Letter To Iran
  11. oh no by oldmac31310 · · Score: 1

    please no, no, no no.

    --
    http://www.acetonestudio.com
  12. How valuable is this to Google? by oldmac31310 · · Score: 1

    I have fuck all money and so buy very little of anything apart from food. Will my local supermarket be Googlified in some way? Will I find myself suddenly drawn to a different aisle? I take the subway back and forth to and from the same stops. Will Google influence how I do this? The current free wi-fi is to be ignored at best. Fuck this shit.

    --
    http://www.acetonestudio.com
    1. Re:How valuable is this to Google? by kqs · · Score: 1

      I have fuck all money and so buy very little of anything apart from food. Will my local supermarket be Googlified in some way? Will I find myself suddenly drawn to a different aisle?

      Not unless you've had wifi implanted in your spinal cord. (Maybe that's after the self-driving car is released?)

      I take the subway back and forth to and from the same stops. Will Google influence how I do this?

      Only if you use google maps to determine which subways stops to use. Which I did last time I was in NYC; it worked great! Rather than worrying about how I would get from hotel -> dinner -> entertainment -> hotel, I just followed the directions to the appropriate station; the only difficulty was figuring out which direction train I should take.

  13. Google Must Construct Additional Pylons! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Lord knows the subway is infested with Zerg.

  14. heh by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    the only thing they will learn about me is that I use a VPN

  15. Where's the controversy? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    nGoogle wants to speed up the developing of free internet access to New York residents and visitors, as a way to gather more information about their activities. Users of the pylons will provide the company invaluable data about their habits, places they visit, and browsing activity.

    /quote

    Seriously? Noone has a problem with this? No controversy, no calls of monopolising, or the privacy implications, no Internet Association for the Association of Internet calling out against this, no legal threats, patent violations, nothing?

    Has it gone so far that Google can just buy something like this, blatantly state it will be used to collect personal data & serve ads, and noone is even batting an eye?