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Judge Orders Dutch Government To Finally Take Action On Climate Promises
New submitter Errol backfiring writes: Although the Dutch government has promised to make sure carbon emissions are lowered considerably, they have consistently failed to take action. Dutch climate group Urgenda and Dutch citizens have gone to court to force the government to take action, and the verdict (linked page is in Dutch) is that the government must reduce emissions by at least 25% compared to 1990 leves.
This 25% cut is seen as the minimum effort needed to keep the people safe from climate change dangers. 25% to 40% is the norm in international climate policy. The verdict is also important for similar climate groups in other countries.
This 25% cut is seen as the minimum effort needed to keep the people safe from climate change dangers. 25% to 40% is the norm in international climate policy. The verdict is also important for similar climate groups in other countries.
Yup, as another poster said: "cue libertarian outrage" alright.
This isn't pulled out of the court's ass. The Dutch government made promises and then tried to back out of them. Their own court has said, "No, you made binding promises, now keep them." Which is what most contract law is about, and what most sane courts enforce.
In no sane system does a court have the ability to pull legal obligations out of its arse, as it seems to have done here.
This is indeed a bad precedent. Judges should stick to judging, rather than usurping the responsibilities of the legislature. If this is not overturned by a higher court, the result will be further politicization of the judiciary, erosion of their independence, and ultimately a reduction in their power to perform their legitimate duties.
It's all about government control and increasing taxation, while giving backhanders to the oligarchs that control the planet.
I can't believe people are falling for it. And as to those "scientists", they cost less than a single lobbyist for a real cause. The govt tells them to keep the story running or they'll lose tenure and grants. You think they care about the people when they have income for life for doing as they're told a few days of the year?
You do realize that a scientist who actually disproves anthropogenic climate change would become filthy rich from the oil companies, right?
You know, given how much of Holland is below sea level (26%) ... you can kind of see that they might give a damn about rising sea levels.
Since when the hell is it shocking that a government has an "independent legal obligation towards their citizens".
As opposed to, what, an independent legal obligation to its fucking corporations?
This isn't an authoritarian dictatorship, it's a rejection of the stupid idea that government doesn't owe a duty of care and concern for its citizens. That's kind of the purpose of governments, despite all the delusional rantings to the contrary we see around here.
Lost at C:>. Found at C.
...the government can't just wave its arms and say, "Emissions be gone!" So the date gets here and the reduction isn't achieved, the court will do...what, exactly?
The Dutch government did not make legally enforceable promises to their own people. They made promises to other sovereign states. In other words, it is up to the other parties of the contract (the other countries) to force the Dutch government to follow through on the promises, not some activist judge.
In no sane system does a court have the ability to pull legal obligations out of its arse, as it seems to have done here.
In no sane economic system is anyone permitted to push the cost of cleaning up after them onto the rest of the world, but that's what we have here (on Earth.)
This is a very bad day for the Dutch people.
Why, because it's been determined that their government is beholden to them?
They are now officially an authoritarian dictatorship ruled by Judge Hans Hofhuis.
That is slightly funny, but nowhere near the truth. I smirked but did not lol, so you don't actually deserve even a +1 funny.
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
Nothing was pulled from the court's rectum. The ruling is based on Dutch human rights legislation, which implements the European Convention on Human Rights that they signed up to, and so which likely can apply in other European countries too.
The argument is that severe climate change will harm many people, violating their human rights. It's similar to how severe pollution by the state would violate their human rights, only over a longer period. Since the state must consider the human rights of all human beings (it's not like the US where only US citizens count, European human rights are universal) it must act to avoid violating those rights by altering the climate beyond a certain level.
const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
Here's a clue - corporations that damned large and powerful have already figured out how to profit from the whole AGW debate no matter which way it ends.
How? Well first off, they know full well that the world's appetite for plastics, kerosene, gasoline, and nearly all of their products will not slacken in the slightest, so they have plenty of time to adapt to any changes that may come. Meanwhile, these same companies are doing what large corporations all around the planet do: they Greenwash the hell out of their image, and pass the costs of doing so onto the consumer. Carbon tax? Hah! They've got that figured out as well, and again, guess who gets to pay for that? (hint: Not Them. It'll be passed on as a cost of doing business.)
To top all that off, you may want to look into who the biggest investors and shareholders in the Green Energy sector actually are... those same petroleum companies are right there, holding stock and encouraging the whole shebang, because they're more than poised to buy up the first one that actually makes enough headway to be a threat (mind you, not to squash the company, but to profit like hell off of it.) I wouldn't be surprised if many of these alternative energy enterprises are owned in whole or in part by a petroleum corporation, with the alt. energy company being a shell or 'independent' division. Again, no conspiracy or tinfoil involved; it's just a bit of pre-positioning for future profits.
You're more than welcome to disagree, but consider that these same corporations are looking decades ahead, and know full well that they have to hedge their bets against diminishing/expensive supply, rising political instabilities (read: Venezuela and the Mideast), and no-longer-rare governmental money-grab attempts. Only a total idiot would run his company any other way.
So tell me - given the fact that the eeevil petroleum corporations are happily and quietly positioned to profit from this thing no matter which way it goes, why do you think they would bother?
Quo usque tandem abutere, Nimbus, patientia nostra?
Well, the court says that: 1) Article 21 of the Dutch constitution requires the government to protect the environment; and 2) the government has signed treaties (which are legally binding) committing the Netherlands to reducing CO2 emissions. So arguably the court is just telling the government to obey the law. Which is not on the face of it unreasonable.
Now, it may not be a great idea if courts start setting specific emission targets, but the 25% is actually the bottom end of what the IPCC considers necessary. (The plaintiffs demanded 40%.)
If the executive branch of government breaks the law, they will be judged. The legislative branch has the power to change the law, but that requires a majority in both houses. The current Dutch executive branch does not have a majority in both houses, so they are shit out of luck. The elected government is formed by the two houses, so I guess I would say that the elected government is not entirely in sync with the executive branch here. There are many subtleties here that have to do with how Dutch government is constructed, but the situation is by no means outrageous. It seems that Trias Politica is working here.