Slashdot Mirror
Siemens Sends Do-Not-Fly Order For Pipistrel's All-Electric Channel Crossing
An anonymous reader links to Flyer's coverage of a squabble that seems to feature the aircraft giant Airbus aiming bad sportsmanship in the form of corporate pull against much smaller light aircraft maker Pipistrel, thereby "squashing the ambitions of light aircraft maker Pipistrel to be the first to fly an electric aircraft across the English Channel." Though Pipistrel acquired the flight permissions it anticipated needing in connection with its announced ambition to cross the channel, they've been grounded by allegedly underhanded means: Siemens, which supplies the electric motor used in the craft which was to make the journey, contacted Pipistrel to prohibit over-water flight with that motor (partly German). U.S. Pipistrel dealer Michael Coates believes he knows why (as quoted by Flyer): "Airbus managed to flex their muscle with Siemens who are supplying motors to Pipistrel and have the Pipistrel motor agreement immediately terminated," he said. "The Airbus E-Fan project does not use Siemens motors but it does have Siemens stickers over the side of their aircraft.
Maybe this was just some lawyer deciding they wanted to avoid liability from someone using a motor which isn't rated for that?
Lost at C:>. Found at C.
I mean, what is going on here?
“He’s not deformed, he’s just drunk!”
Doesn't a manufacturer need to issue an Airworthiness Directive through the applicable regulator for it to override a permit for said applicable regulator? Is this different with experimental category aircraft or is this just a matter of civil law and not aviation regulation?
Uh, wasn't there someone flying around the world in a solar plane or something? Going across the Channel seems like really tiny potatoes.
Apparently someone was planning to fly across the English Channel today and they were stopped by someone planning to make a similar flight on Friday. One presumes that there is a reason why someone should care, but neither article says why. Reading between the lines, it appears that one or both of these battery powered planes is now certified for sale. Perhaps this is the first time you've been able to buy an electric plane with enough range to fly a round trip across the channel?
That isn't the big question. Oddly, neither of the articles answers the big question that all of slashdot is wondering about. The authors don't even seem to be aware that there is a question.
How the hell did the motor manufacturer prevent the flight?
Looks like the motor in question was a loaner, probably an engineering sample. The quoted letter directly demands that it be returned, presumably because the loan agreement allowed them to recall it at any time. I'd expect a different quote if it was an appeal to the aircraft licensing authority.
See that "Preview" button?
Siemens claims they don't want their reputation risked by using the motor this way, and threaten to go to the press over it.
Both UK & French authorities have signed off that they find the safety aspect acceptable.
I can't see how this can do anything but harm Siemens' reputation, and the sudden day-of-departure withdrawal of consent stinks a long way.
Some say Siemens is a very risk-averse & conservative company, and it is this that is driving their "better safe than sorry" attitude..
I don't buy it, and neither should you.
I know it is a bit late, but maybe we should be flame-baiting news headlines with "Siemens electric motors incapable of flying over water, teams goes with company X". I wonder how fast Siemens makes a retraction?
Siemens may be making a legitimate request, but the way they went about it does make you wonder?
Jumpstart the tartan drive.
They have nothing to lose. Either do our and risk Siemens not selling you any more motors, or not do it and never need to worry about buying motors again. This isn't a legal cease and desist.
I know I will never buy another aircraft motor from Siemens if this is how they act...
Big is king and small is shit.
I will stop buying things from Airbus. That'll show 'em!
We don't see the world as it is, we see it as we are.
-- Anais Nin
Didn't work with Google and my robotics stuff in 2010, why would it work now.
Liberty - Security - Laziness - Pick any two.
Okay, Pipistrel is going to have to deliver the engine back to Siemens. What if the way they choose to do that is by flying it from France across the Channel to a Siemens facility in England?
Airbus is so far behind Pipistrel that they can compete only by playing dirty!
Airbus will be doing only one way trip while Pipistrel planed to make a return trip.
I work for Siemens, so posting anon.
Risk averse is so minimalistic, it doesn't even come close.
Recently, to totally prevent Innovation, all semiconductors used now must be pre-approved.
By an MBA with no clue, no less. :)
Their US Medical operations are in crash and burn mode, and have been cut adrift.
They are arbitrarily reclassifying systems built to last for 10 years to be good for 15 years. :)
This will not end well for them; the rats are already swimming away.
This is the real truth, and apparently Siemens is helping them do it.
Sad, really.
Truth isn't Truth - Guliani
What?
Is the engine getting scared over the water?
Does it shiver?
It's not a darn hover board, is it?
4wdloop
Where's that fucking killer asteroid? We need that now. The Earth needs a reset.
may have caused a DQ for the Airbus attempt to set an official record for the first electric flight channel crossing.
It seems Pipistrel might challenge based on this:
http://www.fai.org/downloads/fai/code_of_ethics
So the only issue is a sticker on the side of the craft that says siemens? sounds like an issue easily solved with a sharpie or duct-tape. Call it a cover-up if you will.
I will not buy another Airbus airplane!
Apparently these losers don't even own the motor they are using. Stupid. Nevertheless ...
Fly the goddam thing anyway. Fuck Siemens. What can they do? Send a stiff protest and proclaim their assholery to the world even worse than they have done by letting this escalate to slashdot as it is?
http://www.siemens.com/entry/cc/en/
http://www.airbus.com/tools/contact-webmaster/
Not all press is good press ;-)
Yours truly,
Ali Khamenei
Have gnu, will travel.
"these losers" as someone called them won a million dollar award from NASA. These losers were contacted by siemens and helped them build that engine. These losers make planes for LITERALY 50 less funding then airbus. Their plane CAN fly across the channel AND back. Their plane can ALREADY be purchased and will FOR SURE cost 3 or more times LESS than anything airbus produces(their plane is not in production). These losers are pioneers in the field of electric planes.
Had to write this because the owner of the company is a really down to earth dude who's ambition is innovation and not money. Unlike airbus.
Siemens motor controllers may be replaced with inexpensive software. Siemens DC motor controllers can be replaced with inexpensive embedded controllers AC controllers are trickier but doable, any EE can do it. Research it, you know I'm right. The time is ripe to get the necessary payback happening Please go crazy and have loads of fun.
First to post an open source design for a Siemens-compatible AC motor controller wins a larting tool.
When all you have is a hammer, every problem starts to look like a thumb.
Americans tend to be more open than Europeans, at least within the EU where you have to navigate a minefield of different national/culural sensibilities. An NSA-like scandal wouldn't be possible in Europe or would die down quickly. So within the context of a less open (or more discreet, depending on your perspective) society, private corruption is practically the same as well-publicized corruption, aka lobbying.
Even a ten-year-old kid can build their own electric motor, what do they need Siemens for?? And aren't their hundreds of electric motor manufacturers in the world? It's like saying "I have nothing to drink b/c I can't drink Coke". -- The idiocy!!
This was is the comments (Translated):
Suppose, on the flight is really happening thing, motor setting out, no longer works, aviator falls on oil tankers, ....
Oil tanker explodes - sinks and have coasts for years lubricant
So let's think before jumping, eh?
“He’s not deformed, he’s just drunk!”
Oh, but you have no qualms about flying on a boeing, which subsidized much of its civilian sales by sucking in US taxpayer money from the military, such as the B-52 (who was ever so efficient in vietnam)....
Pipstrel didn't plane at all.
did i miss the sarcasm tag?
Planes generally don't just fall out of the sky during level flight if the motor/engine dies.
Whatever happened to the doctrine of first sale? Yes, I know that's about IP, but the same principle surely applies here: "I bought the f***ing motor, I'll do what the f**k I like with it!"
(Obviously there's legitimate grounds for the government to stop them flying over your house if there's an unreasonably high risk that the plane will drop out the sky, but over the sea?)
Yeah, they just became unplaned.
Patents Drive Free Software as Hurricanes Drive Construction Industry
Yep, its not a helicopter.
There is one clear explanation though: they discovered their motor makes people want to destroy oil tankers when damaged. Something to do with the caustic smoke effecting the brain.
Fly and don't crash, stick to those corporate types who think they own the earth.
http://www.pipistrel.si/news/e...
Hi!
The German article leads to the letter from Siemens, written in English:
> https://www.pilotundflugzeug.de/download/siemens/Siemens_letter_to_Pipistrel.pdf
Seems like the motor was just a loan and flying over water was specifically not agreed apon in the terms and conditions.
But what's actually worse: Siemens terminated the loan and want's to have the motor back, immediatly!
Informing Pipistrel that flying over water violates the loan terms is on thing, but terminating the loan immediatly is another. I would recommend Pipistrel to look for another supplier and never look back!