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US No-Fly List Uses 'Predictive Judgement' Instead of Hard Evidence
HughPickens.com writes: The Guardian reports that in a little-noticed filing before an Oregon federal judge, the US Justice Department and the FBI conceded that stopping U.S. and other citizens from traveling on airplanes is a matter of "predictive assessments about potential threats." "By its very nature, identifying individuals who 'may be a threat to civil aviation or national security' is a predictive judgment intended to prevent future acts of terrorism in an uncertain context," Justice Department officials Benjamin C Mizer and Anthony J Coppolino told the court. It is believed to be the government's most direct acknowledgment to date that people are not allowed to fly because of what the government believes they might do and not what they have already done. The ACLU has asked Judge Anna Brown to conduct her own review of the error rate in the government's predictions modeling – a process the ACLU likens to the "pre-crime" of Philip K Dick's science fiction. "It has been nearly five years since plaintiffs on the no-fly list filed this case seeking a fair process by which to clear their names and regain a right that most other Americans take for granted," say ACLU lawyers.
The Obama administration is seeking to block the release of further information about how the predictions are made, as damaging to national security. "If the Government were required to provide full notice of its reasons for placing an individual on the No Fly List and to turn over all evidence (both incriminating and exculpatory) supporting the No Fly determination, the No Fly redress process would place highly sensitive national security information directly in the hands of terrorist organizations and other adversaries," says the assistant director of the FBI's counterterrorism division, Michael Steinbach.
The Obama administration is seeking to block the release of further information about how the predictions are made, as damaging to national security. "If the Government were required to provide full notice of its reasons for placing an individual on the No Fly List and to turn over all evidence (both incriminating and exculpatory) supporting the No Fly determination, the No Fly redress process would place highly sensitive national security information directly in the hands of terrorist organizations and other adversaries," says the assistant director of the FBI's counterterrorism division, Michael Steinbach.
Tell me Mr Anderson, what good is a phone call if you can't speak?
Sure, feel free to walk to whereever you want to go.
SJW n. One who posts facts.
for racial /religious profiling
"Land of the free", indeed... I'm quite amazed how you Americans put up with all that.
Secret Laws and Rules do not create national security, they are the threat to national security. The problem is, without a clear set of rules, it's a law that is open to abuse towards whomever those who are in charge don't like. Secret laws & courts are what shows you that instead of caring about protecting it's citizen, the government is using it to further their own ends.
We can NOT have freedom when we have secret laws & courts.
Be seeing you...
They have hard statistical evidence that most likely terrorists are muslims. But because all the terrorist sympathisers and appeasers will start calling islamaphobia (like they did over the FBI most wanted list) they want to keep this secret.
In other news, during criminal procedures the prosecutor will no longer be obligated to present evidence the defendant is guilty of a crime before incarcerating them.
"If the Government were required to provide full notice of its reasons for placing an individual in prison and to turn over all evidence (both incriminating and exculpatory) supporting the incarceration determination, the incarceration process would place highly sensitive criminal justice information directly in the hands of criminals and other adversaries, like the American people," said some fuckstick.
We don't have a state-run media we have a media-run state.
So let me get this straight these people are so dangerous that they can't fly yet aren't dangerous enough to be brought in for questioning, gotten off the streets for the safety of the general public, and are likely not under direct surveillance? I am a bit confused here.
And before someone mods this troll that was sarcasm. I also happen to believe that if the administration were to reveal their "State Secrets" it would be something like the emperor has no cloths.
Time to offend someone
The Constitution was designed to LIMIT the power of the Federal Government. It has been extended in ways that also limit the power of State governments (14th Amendment, for example).
There are people in the world to whom POWER is everything. You can frequently identify them by looking at a ballot in an election - you run for office not to "serve" the public, but to "master" them. Yes, "civil servant" is pretty much equivalent to "civil master" in most situations...
In other words, never trust a politician - he/she didn't run for office for the pay, but for the perks (getting to tell other people what to do)....
"I do not agree with what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it"
So are US citizens regarded as a terrorist organization or just "Other Adversaries" now? Silly me, I thought we were the bosses of the government. Been reading that Constitution too much. It'll warp your brain.
No, the information *would not* be placed directly into the hands of terrorists. The information need only be provided only to the defendant's lawyer, an officer of the court, who could be cleared to receive it, and promise, under threat of prosecution, not to divulge it to the defendant.
This is crap, just like the no-fly list, and the TSA searches. I'm sure there are people too dangerous to fly. But there can't be many of them. And if you're a regular American citizen, who hasn't been convicted of a crime, the Government should have to explain to you why they're restricting your ability to travel by air. If they can't explain it to you, you should be allowed to fly. To do otherwise comes awfully close to violating your rights under the fourth amendment tothe Constitution.
And our elected representatives are a bunch of pussies for not standing up and saying that.
We cannot have freedom when we have any laws at all.
Freedom is not the ability to do whatever you want whenever you want. Never has been. That is anarchy which is not the same thing. Freedom is FAR more complicated than the absence of laws. Freedom is not just absence of restrictions on you but also absence of things being done TO you. A complete absence of laws for you necessarily means a loss of freedom for me because there is nothing restraining you (or me) from removing other people's freedom. Societies cannot exist without rules, both formal and informal and yet freedom under reasonable definitions of the term still exists.
If there is no law against slavery is the slave-owner free? The slave certainly isn't. But with laws against slavery we can fairly describe both people as free so the absolutist definition of freedom only existing when there are no laws simply makes no sense.
Reasons for the searches, no-fly-list etc.? Money? Control? Something else?
Theater. The appearance of doing something about the 'problem'. I've also heard of it being a disguised jobs/welfare program.
I don't read AC A human right