Followup: Library Board Unanimously Supports TOR Relay

Wrath0fb0b writes: Last week, the administrators of the Kilton Public Library in New Hampshire suspended a project to host a Tor relay after the DHS sent them an email asking them to reconsider. At a board meeting yesterday, the exit node was reinstated by unanimous vote. Board member Francis Oscadal said, "With any freedom there is risk. It came to me that I could vote in favor of the good ... or I could vote against the bad. I’d rather vote for the good because there is value to this." Deputy Police Chief Philip Roberts said, "We simply came in as law enforcement and said, 'These are the concerns.' We wanted to inform everyone so it was an educated decision by everyone involved." Deputy City Manager Paula Maville added, "This is about making an informed decision. Whatever you need to do, we’re here to support that."

Comments

perfect title

[Anonymous Coward]

the relay exit node : ]

Ban People

[Anonymous Coward]

People can be good or bad, I suggest we ban people.

All hail our robot overlords.

Re:Ban People

[sims 2]

We could always ban computers since crime is worse if its done with a computer than in person.

That would help right?
https://torrentfreak.com/is-ru...
http://yro.slashdot.org/story/...

Them computers be evil!

Re:Ban People

[Falos]

COMPUTAS IS OF THE DEVIL. YOU HEA' ME? THE DEVIL, BOBBY SIMS.

filter filter filter filter filter filter filter filter filter filter filter filter filter filter filter filter

all good?

[thoromyr]

So they really weren't that concerned about having an open tor relay? When they invoked OMG terrorists! children! it was just so the board would make an informed decision? Sorry, but for them to claim no stake in the outcome belies their attempt to shut it down.

Not that their response is bad, it just isn't all that believable. Now, if they had said, "I'm disappointed, but at least they made an informed decision" it would come across like they actually believed in what they told the board. This makes it seem like they are acknowledging the fud didn't work.

It reminds me of a story a prof told me about a student who went in to argue about a grade, unsuccessfully. When the student left a friend in the hall asked, "did he buy it?" and the response was "nah." Just like here, didn't really have anything invested in it, and wasn't perturbed when the story didn't get traction.

Re:all good?

[Anonymous Coward]

Most of what you mention was in the commentary of the previous article, not the article itself.

"The use of a Tor browser is not, in [or] of itself, illegal and there are legitimate purposes for its use," Neudauer said, "However, the protections that Tor offers can be attractive to criminal enterprises or actors and HSI [Homeland Security Investigations] will continue to pursue those individuals who seek to use the anonymizing technology to further their illicit activity."

All the hysteria was in the comments, and sinister motives applied to the police out of personal hatreds rather than the evidence of the story.

Re:all good?

[gstoddart]

You know the scary thing ... in just how many cities would the board have bought into the FUD, decreed that they can't do something which supports terrorists, and then get duped into saying it should be left off?

They really did want the outcome of making them all too scared to leave it.

I'm betting the fucking DHS has come powerpoint slide decks to teach law enforcement how to make these sound scary in order to suppress them ... because the DHS et al have decided it will just be easier if they can make those pesky freedoms go away. Just like they have slide decks explaining how to commit perjury with parallel construction.

Make no mistake, this is part of a deliberate campaign to use FUD to do what they can't do legally. Defend and uphold the Constitution my ass ... these people are fully into suppress, distort, and lie mode.

You can't protect someone's rights be eliminating them, no matter how delusional you are about why you're doing it.

Re:all good?

[thoromyr]

I'm not suggesting they didn't want the outcome, but they don't seem to have been invested in it. Just like the student in my example would've liked a higher grade, but as he had no case he wasn't going to actually *fight* for it. But see what he could get with minimal effort? Sure.

Maybe as time goes on they'll turn up the heat on Tor. Probably will, unless they can find an effective way to defeat it.

Re:all good?

[gstoddart]

You give them a lot of benefit of the doubt .. much more than I do.

They knew they had no legal basis to pursue this. They had no legal basis to demand it or fight for it. Because it's not illegal.

This is the soft approach by which they insinuate all of the bad things which could happen, and hope the current climate leads to the library board saying "holy crap, look at this".

This is fairly scary, as it means that the spy agencies and law enforcement are working to subvert legal rights in a fairly shadowy way. And my conclusion is to trust them less and less with every passing week.

Because the shit they're willing to do in order to make an end run around Constitutionally protected rights is reaching the point where you have to start asking if these guys aren't the real enemies of the state ... not 5 years ago it would be easy to dismiss that as crazy talk.

These days? Suddenly it's not so crazy.

Re:all good?

[flink]

You know the scary thing ... in just how many cities would the board have bought into the FUD, decreed that they can't do something which supports terrorists, and then get duped into saying it should be left off?

You might be surprised in the other direction. Librarians have a pretty strong tradition of standing up to this kind of crap. The ALA has been speaking out against the section 215 of the PATRIOT act (the one used to justify mass metadata collection) since day 1 because it could be used to snoop on people's library records.

Re:all good?

[thoromyr]

Its pretty clear that our intel community* ignores the constitution where ever possible and considers all americans to be (at best) one step away from terrorism (especially anyone discussing matters like this). So I'm not really giving them the benefit of any doubt -- just slightly surprised that they act like they had no irons in the fire after going OMG evil! The normal response to any resistance is to double down, but here they seem to have just shrugged their shoulders. "Did he buy it?" asks one, "nah" says the other.

* not to be confused with the individuals that comprise it. It is a mistake to even think that the "average" member reflects the community. That simply isn't how group dynamics work. So just because the community sees the constitution as an annoyance that does not mean a significant number of the individuals do. I say this because it is all too easy to conflate the two, but it should never be forgotten that the community is made of up individuals.

Re:all good?

[tlhIngan]

So they really weren't that concerned about having an open tor relay? When they invoked OMG terrorists! children! it was just so the board would make an informed decision? Sorry, but for them to claim no stake in the outcome belies their attempt to shut it down.

Not that their response is bad, it just isn't all that believable. Now, if they had said, "I'm disappointed, but at least they made an informed decision" it would come across like they actually believed in what they told the board. This makes it seem like they are acknowledging the fud didn't work.

It reminds me of a story a prof told me about a student who went in to argue about a grade, unsuccessfully. When the student left a friend in the hall asked, "did he buy it?" and the response was "nah." Just like here, didn't really have anything invested in it, and wasn't perturbed when the story didn't get traction.

Well, they were concerned, that's why they shut the relay down when the DHS sent them that note. They turned it off, and put it up for a vote by the board, and since they're librarians, they did research.

(Librarians are awesome).

So they did their research, and they went all in knowing it can be used for bad, but it can also be used for good. And the "good" outweighs any concern they can be helping pedos, terrorists and other "bad people".

So yes, they went all in, informed themselves of the issues and concerns, and decided that the freedom it provides outweighs the negatives.

These people aren't dumb. They actually research the issues themselves and make an informed decision.

Re:all good?

[david_thornley]

Yup. Immediately after the PATRIOT act made it legal to demand library records, the ALA issued a strong recommendation that libraries destroy all records of who checked out what immediately after the item was returned. Don't underestimate librarians.

Re:all good?

[Falos]

That is awesome. Which is all there really is to say on the matter.

I wonder if there's deadman/canary ideas we should thank them for.

Re: all good?

[Anonymous Coward]

Actually their attempts to shut it down belie their claims of no concern. The actions are true. The claims are exposed as lies by their actions, not the other way around.

Re:all good?

[CRCulver]

The ALA has been speaking out against the section 215 of the PATRIOT act (the one used to justify mass metadata collection) since day 1 because it could be used to snoop on people's library records.

While the ALA is the largest professional body for librarians in the United States, it doesn't speak for all librarians. There have been many ordinary librarians and library boards across the country who have opposed the ALA's privacy efforts in the last 15 years (or even further back), identifying it with a partisan political cause that they don't share.

Re:all good?

[Anonymous Coward]

My mother was a librarian when John Hinckley shot President Reagan. The Secret Service showed up and demanded all his library records. She said "No. A) You need a court ordered search warrant, B) We don't have an electronic circulation system (this was 1981), everything is stored on microfilm and we don't have enough staff to search for those records. Come back when you have a warrant and bring your own staff."

Eventually they did come back with a search warrant. That's the way it's supposed to work.

Librarians don't like censorship or invasions of privacy. And yes, they are awesome because of that.

Re: all good?

[Anonymous Coward]

Some, likely most don't. My high school librarian loved it - her personal crusade was taking a magic marker to any books in her charge she deemed inappropriate ("ungodly" I think was the word she used).

No, this was not in the Bible Belt.

Re:all good?

[Anonymous Coward]

I remember when USA PATRIOT was first passed, my hometown library immediately posted notices on all the entrances saying, "No, we have not received a section 215 records request." I remember when those notices conspicuously disappeared.

Re:all good?

[Big Hairy Ian]

I wonder if DHS will make the same request to the NSA who host thousands of TOR exit points

Re:all good?

[meta-monkey]

Really? If it was truly just "informative," which it looks like, I think they may just be doing due diligence. If your boss said "hey I heard about this TOR thing, want to set up a relay on our corporate network?" it would be a good idea to say "by the by, TOR is used for both good and bad things. Are you sure this is something you want to be a party to?"

Hosting a TOR node is not a no-brainer. You do not know what's going through your relay. Your specific node at some point almost certainly will be used to traffic child pornography. Your specific node at some point almost certainly will be used to help dissidents battle an oppressive regime. Does the good outweigh the bad? That's a choice one has to make, but an uninformed person might think TOR is only used for good, or only used for evil.

Personally I use the TOR browser daily, but I don't know if I could in good conscience host a relay. I'd probably want to talk to my priest first.

Re:all good?

[meta-monkey]

I also don't think DHS were necessarily being bad guys here, either. They acknowledged there are uses of TOR for good and for evil. However, they don't know what the library board knows. An uninformed person might think TOR is used only for good, or only for evil.

If your mom wanted to host a TOR node, you would tell her "you sure you know what you're doing, right? That'll be used both to help dissidents fight an oppressive regime, but also to help pedos traffic child porn."

As you said, the librarians did their research and made an informed decision. Good for them. But I think DHS making sure they were making an informed decision is a reasonable action.

Re: all good?

[Anonymous Coward]

Why wasn't she reported and fired. 1) destruction of property && 2) she's suppressing information.

I think any school (non religious) would can her ass.

Re: all good?

[Anonymous Coward]

The spooks could care less about an informed decision. They only showed one side of the equation. Showing slides saying how bad tor is and how it can be used for the terrorist, the pedos, etc. they wanted the library to shut it down, not make an informed decision. You are giving them way to much credit. These people only see the bad and want to stop it by any means. And yes that includes spreading FUD.

This.

[Anonymous Coward]

Brightened my day. A choice to encourage freedom amongst a sea of poor, restrictive and dangerous choices taking away our freedoms.

chalk another one up for the librarians

[GungaDan]

Those folks stand up for freedom.

Re:chalk another one up for the librarians

[Anonymous Coward]

right on

Re:chalk another one up for the librarians

[Anonymous Coward]

Yes, these are brave librarians. I'm definitely going to write to them and thank them for standing up for us when they're in prison.

Re:chalk another one up for the librarians

[QuietLagoon]

Absolutely. Librarians are awesome in what they do and what they stand for.

Re:chalk another one up for the librarians

[Krishnoid]

And one for the New Hampshirewo/men -- 'Live Free or Die', indeed.

Re:chalk another one up for the librarians

[Anonymous Coward]

Yes, it's too bad all those folks from Massachusetts have mostly destroyed the state.

Re:chalk another one up for the librarians

[Anonymous Coward]

NJ is not far away from them.

Re:chalk another one up for the librarians

[meta-monkey]

Make sure to send the email via TOR.

Lesson learned?

[OhPlz]

This can't be. Most of the people that posted comments about the previous article swore that freedom was dead and that the people were all sheep. How could this have happened?

Re: Lesson learned?

[bill_mcgonigle]

because we got off our asses and created a groundswell of public support for it, which enabled the people who could do the right thing and wanted to do the right thing to do the right thing.

When it's David vs. Goliath, and then an army shows up to back David, the odds improve dramatically.

Online tools are invaluable but people who just complain online all day never change anything.

Be the change you want to see in the world.

Re: Lesson learned?

[OhPlz]

The sarcasm was more about the knee-jerk comments suggesting that the town was going to surrender to DHS and that New Hampshire wasn't living up to its motto. You're right though. Hashtags and comments alone aren't likely to create the change you're looking for. I'd also add that positive change is more likely to happen at the local level as in this instance than at the federal level. And that's alright.

Re: Lesson learned?

[OhPlz]

If you read his other comments.. he did actually take action.

The library workers aren't in any danger. The state would step in if the feds were to ever try and go after them. There was a lot of push back in NH against the TSA, as an example. The state reminded everyone that it's perfectly okay to video record TSA agents that are behaving improperly and that law enforcement was not to interfere with those recordings, and if requested, to assist. We still have a strong state government, and it's perfectly happy to push back against the feds when necessary.

Re: Lesson learned?

[meta-monkey]

Somebody has to raise the hue and cry, though. It is your civic duty to troll the intarwebs.

Thanks guys

[Anonymous Coward]

Just thanks

Send Them a Thank you Note

[terbeaux]

KILTON LIBRARY

80 Main Street
West Lebanon, NH 03784

Ban pencils

[ZipK]

You can write in code with a pencil. Please reconsider pencils.

"Support the Library !!!"

[bill_mcgonigle]

That's what we'd holler to cars driving by as we rallied to support the fine folks who had taken the initial steps at the Kilton Library (you might recognize my name from the article - OK nm it's slashdot). Do read this story to get a better sense for what this sort of street-level activism is like (and how enjoyable it can be).

More pics and a great interview with the librarians on the event page:
https://m.facebook.com/events/...

Re:"Support the Library !!!"

[unrtst]

I think that's great. I really really do. Of course, there's a "but" coming... those numbers on the FB invite page don't look very positive :-(
615 invites
13 maybe
16 went

Regardless, congrats on the outcome!

The good news that no one reports

[gurps_npc]

Crime is down, war is down, pollution per person is down, government taxes are down, and basically 90% of the measureable evils humans have discovered are all going down. But we don't hear about that because things that don't happen or happen less is never news.

Glad to hear some of the good news, where people stand up for privacy rights.

Re:The good news that no one reports

[Anonymous Coward]

Actually, crime is up dramatically.

Re:The good news that no one reports

[sims 2]

Sales tax is 9.9% here and the gas tax that pays for the roads is going to go up nationwide shortly. (yes roads are important)

We have eliminated many many diseases to the point that we are now seeing some of them again only because some idiots won't vaccinate their children because they have never heard of polio.

On that note do you think we should teach about the current vaccines and the diseases they prevent? The only one I am aware of that they teach you about in school is the smallpox vaccine. It was so successful that people aren't even vaccinated for it anymore. But for some reason we have never been able to repeat that success.

Crime varies a lot based on where you live.

War? I live in the USA we are in at least 2 wars right now. That's up from 0 pre 9/11 but I assume you are saying that since we are down from 3 wars we are doing better.

Pollution the epa is actually doing a lot of good things overall even though they have broken a lot of things on the way (cfl's,diesel exhaust fluid, low flow toilets, low flow sinks, low flow showers and some how managing to making screwdrivers illegal) most what they broke has been fixed overtime with better designs new equip does not require diesel exhaust fluid, toilets can be low flow and still flush now, sinks and showers need to be built closer to the hot water source for the delay to be reasonable. Cfl bulbs are awful but the new led bulbs will match them in price soon and work so much better although the led's currently still have wattage limitations I expect them to fully replace flourescent bulbs within the next 10 years.

If the government had not mandated the changes would be made we would still be buying the cheap up front incandescent bulbs not realising the long term energy cost
cfl and led bulbs would not be as far along because the gov't artificially created a market and demand for them. low flow appliances would still be a niche product.

Re:The good news that no one reports

[Anonymous Coward]

Actually, crime is up dramatically.

False: Read your own article:
"The homicide toll across the country — which reached a grim nadir in 1993 when more than 2,200 murders were counted in New York City — has declined in ebbs and flows for much of the last 20 years, noted Alfred Blumstein, a professor of urban systems and operations research at Carnegie Mellon University in Pittsburgh. Several U.S. cities – including Los Angeles, Phoenix, San Diego and Indianapolis – have experienced a decrease in the number of murders so far this year.

Blumstein said the current surge in murders in some big cities could amount to no more than a blip.
"
Actual violent crime (not music downloads :p ) is down about 70%

Re:The good news that no one reports

[Anonymous Coward]

Not quite as bad as you think: http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/scare-headlines-exaggerated-the-u-s-crime-wave/

Re:The good news that no one reports

[LWATCDR]

True. I can say as a greybeard that the good old days sucked except for the manned space program. The 70s where terrible.

Re: The good news that no one reports

[Anonymous Coward]

Good News: Small Town democracy trumps some-dumb-guy at DHS. (Who is that masked man, anyway?)

Bad News: The good news behind the research correlating the drop in violent crime to the successful regulation of lead in the environment is always under threat from conservative, 'free market' ideologues who cling to the tired, defrauded notion that regulation is bad and all marginal tax reductions to the wealthy result in 'job creation' and therefore trickle upon the less fortunate.

Good News: Trump is thumping mainstream Republicans with their own ridiculousness.

Bad News: The vast majority of political reporting in the U.S. lacks the substantive perspective necessary to inform an inqusitive electorate, should one ever spontaneously develop.

Re:The good news that no one reports

[mhotchin]

Smallpox was eliminated because the only host was people - there was no external reservoir to re-infect the population. Alas, not true for almost all other diseases - for example, rabies in bats and foxes. Often the disease has only minor or even no effects in these other hosts, making it even harder to eradicate.

Re:The good news that no one reports

[sims 2]

Afaik everything covered by the MMRV vaccine is human only measles, mumps, rubella, varicella and of those afaik only varicella is problematic to eliminate as it creates lifetime human carriers. Polio is another notable human only disease.

I really thought that we would have eliminated another world wide by now. It can be done it should be done and we have the ability. I hate to think its just stupidity but I can't seem to find any other reason.

Rabies while still quite dangerous is thankfully very limited in its infection vectors to the point that the vaccine is not typically even given unless traveling to an area where exposure is likely or exposure has already occurred.

As you said rabies has a rather large number of hosts some of which fly this makes total elimination very difficult.

One of the things I worry about is since they (mmrv and polio) are still out there they can still mutate into a version the vaccine doesn't prevent we are very lucky they have a low mutation rate unlike the flu which they have to guess at every year.

What I hope to see in the future are viral vaccines I suppose there would be moral implications there but I feel if people were stupid enough to spread the disease for the last several thousand years they shouldn't be complaining about spreading a vaccine although I expect they would.

I understand samples of smallpox do need to be kept for research but I hope they are well protected as it would be a huge setback if it were to ever come back.

We have been able to do some amazing things here in the last century but people are starting to forget...Maybe they should mention more of these in school?

Live Free or Die

[nadaou]

Give Me Liberty Or Give Me Death
Patrick Henry, March 23, 1775.

No man thinks more highly than I do of the patriotism, as well as abilities, of the very worthy gentlemen who have just addressed the House. But different men often see the same subject in different lights; and, therefore, I hope it will not be thought disrespectful to those gentlemen if, entertaining as I do opinions of a character very opposite to theirs, I shall speak forth my sentiments freely and without reserve. This is no time for ceremony. The question before the House is one of awful moment to this country. For my own part, I consider it as nothing less than a question of freedom or slavery; and in proportion to the magnitude of the subject ought to be the freedom of the debate. It is only in this way that we can hope to arrive at truth, and fulfill the great responsibility which we hold to God and our country. Should I keep back my opinions at such a time, through fear of giving offense, I should consider myself as guilty of treason towards my country, and of an act of disloyalty toward the Majesty of Heaven, which I revere above all earthly kings.

Mr. President, it is natural to man to indulge in the illusions of hope. We are apt to shut our eyes against a painful truth, and listen to the song of that siren till she transforms us into beasts. Is this the part of wise men, engaged in a great and arduous struggle for liberty? Are we disposed to be of the number of those who, having eyes, see not, and, having ears, hear not, the things which so nearly concern their temporal salvation? For my part, whatever anguish of spirit it may cost, I am willing to know the whole truth; to know the worst, and to provide for it.

I have but one lamp by which my feet are guided, and that is the lamp of experience. I know of no way of judging of the future but by the past. And judging by the past, I wish to know what there has been in the conduct of the British ministry for the last ten years to justify those hopes with which gentlemen have been pleased to solace themselves and the House. Is it that insidious smile with which our petition has been lately received? Trust it not, sir; it will prove a snare to your feet. Suffer not yourselves to be betrayed with a kiss. Ask yourselves how this gracious reception of our petition comports with those warlike preparations which cover our waters and darken our land. Are fleets and armies necessary to a work of love and reconciliation? Have we shown ourselves so unwilling to be reconciled that force must be called in to win back our love? Let us not deceive ourselves, sir. These are the implements of war and subjugation; the last arguments to which kings resort. I ask gentlemen, sir, what means this martial array, if its purpose be not to force us to submission? Can gentlemen assign any other possible motive for it? Has Great Britain any enemy, in this quarter of the world, to call for all this accumulation of navies and armies? No, sir, she has none. They are meant for us: they can be meant for no other. They are sent over to bind and rivet upon us those chains which the British ministry have been so long forging. And what have we to oppose to them? Shall we try argument? Sir, we have been trying that for the last ten years. Have we anything new to offer upon the subject? Nothing. We have held the subject up in every light of which it is capable; but it has been all in vain. Shall we resort to entreaty and humble supplication? What terms shall we find which have not been already exhausted? Let us not, I beseech you, sir, deceive ourselves. Sir, we have done everything that could be done to avert the storm which is now coming on. We have petitioned; we have remonstrated; we have supplicated; we have prostrated ourselves before the throne, and have implored its interposition to arrest the tyrannical hands of the ministry and Parliament. Our petitions have been slighted; our remonstrances have produced additional v

Yay Librarians!!

[gstoddart]

If you enjoy having your civil liberties and access to uncensored information .. thank a damned Librarian.

For literally decades they've found themselves on the forefront defending your rights saying "hell no we won't do that" against people who want to burn books, or outlaw various things which shouldn't still be up for debate.

That DHS felt the need to sew a little FUD and bring in the local cops to stir up the bullshit and lies is pathetic. That the library board has sent a big "fuck you" is awesome -- because someone needs to stand up to the fascists and assholes who are constantly trying to say that certain freedoms are just too dangerous to have.

It is literally true that without Librarians fighting to defend these things we might no longer have them. Either from moralizing old bitties, or assholes in government, these rights are often under attack.

Go Librarians, and thank you.

Re:Yay Librarians!!

[Asmodae]

Smart people who love books.

Librarians are awesome. Secret Superheroes indeed

Re:Yay Librarians!!

[Anonymous Coward]

I'm sure the government will turn the screw somehow. A library that refuses to obey law enforcement, even if it's a casual request, is a liability. There's more than one way to skin a cat though. All they have to do is find a choke point in the financial pipeline and apply a little pressure. Few people have the budget to keep a library open if the government wants to starve it out of existence.

Want to fund it with donations? The government can apply pressure to Visa and Mastercard as well y'know. They did it with Wikileaks.

No request from law enforcement is ever a "suggestion". They don't work that way.

Re:Yay Librarians!!

[thoromyr]

You aren't right though. They do not manually maintain the "No Fly" list, that would be too much effort. They recently admitted that the rules for inclusion are arcane, arbitrary and they can by no means admit to them. Assuredly, anyone who speaks out against the tyrants will be included, for they have adjusted their rules such that it will be inevitable. But there is no personal malice here. No one checked the votes and assigned each party to a "naught" or "nice" outcome.

Nay, the results are objectively determined by secret machinations programmed in the depths of a stygian nightmare. When the bureaucrat calls you forth and summons you to your hidden doom far from the public view it will not be for some sentimental reason, no feeling or emotion on his part. Rather, it will be an entirely sane and rational decision that, for the greater good of the Republic, you be no longer permitted to take part in it.

Re:Yay Librarians!!

[TheGratefulNet]

Librarians are awesome. Secret Superheroes indeed

conan-the-librarian says: you touch that tor node and it will be the last thing you ever do!

Re:Yay Librarians!!

[Anonymous Coward]

Why that? If 10,000 libraries did this, that'd be something, but with one... just tap the internet connection to the library. Can't be that hard if they wanted.

Re:Yay Librarians!!

[Anonymous Coward]

"sow" FUD, not "sew". :)

Re:Yay Librarians!!

[fustakrakich]

We can show our support by being more careful who we elect into office. Saying 'thanks' doesn't mean much if you vote for people who would have them fired or arrested for resisting.

Re:Yay Librarians!!

[TheGratefulNet]

the actual algorithm used looks very similar to a combination Brazil movie scene and Will Wonka's chocolate factory.

midway, everyone on the project was sacked and the titles had to be completed at high expense and at the last minute.

Congrats NH

[r-diddly]

That's why it says "Live Free or Die" on the license plates.

Re:Congrats NH

[Anonymous Coward]

I've always liked that about my state. It tends to err on the side of freedom to do dumb stuff (no helmet laws for motorcyclists for instance, no seatbelt laws for adults, etc.). We like to thumb our noses at the nanny state to our south. Leave us alone we say, and we'll accept the consequences. (However that's not the direction we've been heading for the last decades.)

Re:Congrats NH

[amxcoder]

Except for gun control laws, and the whole "assault weapon" registration thing a couple years ago. At least a lot of the people stood up to that, but it still passed and went into effect.

Re:Congrats NH

[wyHunter]

That's because many, many people from Massachusetts, the North Korea of North America, have moved there.

Re:Congrats NH

[Anonymous Coward]

I live right next door in Vermont, and its a fallacy that NH is a free state. Compare VT and NH gun laws (a barometer of freedom IMO). Its not even close, and Vermont is as liberal as it gets as far as a state govt. Or how about property taxes? That tells you the scope of how big NH govt is (and shame on you if you argue they have no sales tax so they need to make it up with property). Just because its not as big as some other states doesn't mean its free.

Re:Congrats NH

[wyHunter]

I lived in North Korea to the south for a decade and it's so-so. Vermont DOES have constitutional carry but now at least NH has open carry with no issues. And they have a "shall issue" license. Income taxes/property taxes/ sales taxes -- you have to get tax revenue somehow I suppose. And property taxes typically mean if you're more well off and have a fancier house you pay more. You have the wing nuts in Vermont, unfortunately, especially that gun grabber from Chicago who is desperately trying to make Vermont like Illinois.

An example of a chilling effect

[Anonymous Coward]

The police chief makes it sound like he's just informing, but since he is also enforcing, it is hard to imagine it not coming across as a chilling effect.

Reminds me of the lines from Fletch

Detective #1: You have the right to remain silent. You have the right to have your face kicked in by me. You have the right to have your balls stomped by him.

[Detective #2 blows Fletch a kiss]

Fletch: I'll... waive my rights.

After all, they were just "informing" him

Not an exit node

[Anonymous Coward]

The original article never mentions an exit node, but merely a relay node. A relay node merely transfers encrypted data between the entry and the exit nodes. A relay node does not connect to either the Tor client, which the entry node does, or to the final destination, which the exit node does.

Some people are hesitant to run an exit node because it may connect to illegal sites which may invite reprisals from their ISP or worse, but a relay node will normally not raise any flags, except for excessive traffic, which can be controlled by the one running the relay node.

HTH

Re:Not an exit node

[thoromyr]

Normally I don't mod AC's up, but this one should be (I even have mod points but I already posted...).

TFS is wrong (why am I surprised) because it clearly states that it is an "exit" node, but TFA is equally clear that it is a *relay* node. Maybe that's why the police/dhs didn't fight this harder, but it doesn't change the fact that they opposed a mere relay node.

FWIW, I think libraries *should* host exit nodes. A very appropriate place for them as they have a long tradition of upholding privacy, including against government incursions. But it is also easier to get an exit node taken down through association with criminal acts. Though the people in TFA have it right: a city doesn't shut down roads simply because some people choose to drive drunk. Or the fact that they are used as escape routes by bank robbers. Or facilitate interstate crime by transporting stolen goods.

Just because a resource can, and is, being used for nefarious purposes is not reason to shut it down. Somewhere well north of 90% of all email is spam or phishing. It may be frustrating, but we don't shut down mail servers.

Re:Not an exit node

[UnsignedInt32]

FWIW, I think libraries *should* host exit nodes. A very appropriate place for them as they have a long tradition of upholding privacy, including against government incursions. But it is also easier to get an exit node taken down through association with criminal acts. Though the people in TFA have it right: a city doesn't shut down roads simply because some people choose to drive drunk. Or the fact that they are used as escape routes by bank robbers. Or facilitate interstate crime by transporting stolen goods.

And does it even make any difference whether they run Tor exit relay or not to begin with, while library patrons using public wi-fi there can be as bad as Tor users in this respect? Libraries I've been so far didn't have any sort of captive portal, let alone authentication that limits access to library users. I don't know if that's the case with this particular library, though.

I have about 100 or books

[Anonymous Coward]

Does that mean I can run a tor exit node now? If not, what is the threshold? I love hypocrites.

Re:I have about 100 or books

[Anonymous Coward]

Nothing but your fear of the government is stopping you from running your own exit node.

These people deserve an award

[Anonymous Coward]

I don't suppose the EFF or some other rights agency hands out awards for protecting privacy rights, If they do the Library board should be nominated for one. Conversely the police department and the DHS should get an "award" for behavior to the contrary of a free and just society.

Don't mess with a librarian

[Anonymous Coward]

or a libertarian for that matter... or an angry Liberian.

Did they set aside funding for defense lawyers?

[Anonymous Coward]

Because they're going to need them when the FBI starts arresting staff for downloading kiddie porn.

Reasonable people?

[skaralic]

Both the Library Board and Police acted like reasonable and informed adults. I'm surprised it even made it to the news.

Re:Reasonable people?

[MrKrillls]

The most civil, on topic, least histrionic meeting I can remember. From the public to library board to the local police, everyone spoke briefly and seemed to be aware there exist a valid argument on both sides. Good decision.

National Librarian Day, April 16

[QuietLagoon]

National Librarian Day

Date When Celebrated : Always April 16

National Librarian Day celebrates and honors librarians. They are among the most knowledgeable people you know. When you visit your cavernous library in search of a particular book, or a specific research topic, they always quickly point you in the right direction. And, they do so with a smile.

...

Celebrate the day by sending a card to your librarian. Visit the library today, and make certain to say hello and "Thank you" to all of the librarians.

they tried nicely to threaten them,

[Anonymous Coward]

But in the end, they stood up and told'em to nicely and politely to fornicate themselves with a blunt object, repeatedly..
Moving past that, i wonder how current the informatiuon they were using to present and or action off of??
I wonder how much was really accurate?
I wonder if they used,
during an eclipse, when your on the toilet with the shower running, and your cat seems to be wiping it's tushie on the carpet like a dawg, then maybe the perfect storm will emerge causing this dire situation. (ya right)

You cant stop, or obsfucate whats right,,
here is a clear example..
(we wanted you to be informed) thats to fucking funny..
We told them to stop, and they told us to fornicate themselves with a blunt objects, repeatedly with a claim to anal battering/abuse.
Exploration of the process of pronouncing rectal muscles for pleasure, ya thats how they described it

Turn even library into a TOR exit node

[Anonymous Coward]

Why can't every library become a TOR Exit Node?

Go to your local library and start lobbying for them to become a TOR EXit Node too!

Live free....

[Anonymous Coward]

Considering their alternative choice was DEATH, it's isn't such a surprising a decision.

Wages are down, livable employment is down,

[waspleg]

freedom is down...

But they wore their best jackboots

[EmperorOfCanada]

I love how this defeated policeman (thug) is trying to play down his attempted violation of their rights through intimidation. I suspect his grandfather defended his actions when police chief saying, "We didn't run the black men out of town, we just gave them a one way drive."

Re:But they wore their best jackboots

[david_thornley]

Why do you think the police officer was trying to intimidate anybody? It's conceivable, of course, but from what I read there was no reason to think that the police officer did anything more than point out possible trouble. Not all police see their job as repressing freedom.

Heros

[Anonymous Coward]

Everyone that voted is my hero.

Blasted librarians!!

[fluffernutter]

We're in the Uber economy! NO ONE is supposed to have a sit down, explore al angles, and determine whether the positives outweigh the negatives! Your supposed to go ahead and do it! Who do these people think they are??

I'll bet they don't even get off the ground! They won't even make a million dollars! Success doesn't happen this way!

Educated Decision

[orlanz]

We wanted to inform everyone so it was an educated decision...

That would be hilarious if this whole topic wasn't so sad and depressing. A law enforcement agency wanted to educate a house of knowledge on IT technology.

Basically the cops said "OMG, do you know how dangerous what you are doing is!!?!" To which the library said "Yes, we know. You clearly don't, but we do."

Re:Educated Decision

[david_thornley]

I wouldn't be surprised if a police officer knew more than I did, even about aspects of topics I know a whole lot about. I think it likely that the police officer went through potential problems, and the library board considered them and decided they weren't significant enough to not have the node.

BULLLSHITTTT

[Anonymous Coward]

Deputy City Manager Paula Maville added, "This is about making an informed decision. Whatever you need to do, we’re here to support that."

"That's a nice library you have there . . .

[hduff]

It would be a shame if something happened to it . . ." -- DHS