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Tech Unemployment Rising In Some Categories (dice.com)

Nerval's Lobster writes: The technology industry's unemployment rate crept up to 3.0 percent in the third quarter of 2015, according to the U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics (BLS). Although that represents an increase from the second quarter, when tech unemployment stood at 2.0 percent, it's nonetheless lower than the 5.2 percent unemployment rate for the U.S. labor market as a whole. Despite that relatively low rate, however, many technology segments saw an accompanying rise in joblessness. (Dice link) Web developers, for example, saw their collective unemployment rate hit 5.10 percent, up from 3.70 percent in the same quarter last year. Computer systems analysts, programmers, network and systems administrators, software developers, and computer & information systems managers likewise experienced a slight rise in unemployment on a year-over-year basis.

23 of 182 comments (clear)

  1. H1B, L1B, etc Doing their job by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Great it's all going according to plan.

  2. And now you know ... by John+Jorsett · · Score: 5, Insightful

    ... why we need all those H1B visas: to bring tech unemployment more in line with US unemployment overall. Unemployment inequality affects us all.

    1. Re:And now you know ... by leed_25 · · Score: 2

      It is a strange thing that not one of the presidential candidates has even mentioned the H1B visa program.

    2. Re:And now you know ... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Informative

      Trump has many times, explaining how it takes jobs from US citizens. He has taken backlash from the media and other candidates for that position, but his poll numbers raised when he doubled down on that statement.

    3. Re:And now you know ... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative

      Not true. Trump has come out against it as it currently stands, and has an elegant solution: require H-1Bs be paid more than market wages. That way, it's only cost-effective to hire an H-1B if you honestly need them.

    4. Re:And now you know ... by oh_my_080980980 · · Score: 4, Informative

      Bernie Sanders has.

    5. Re:And now you know ... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

      Also Bernie Sanders.

      Sanders and Trump are the way to go. They're running as R and D, but they're very much opposed to the One Party.

    6. Re:And now you know ... by NostalgiaForInfinity · · Score: 2

      require H-1Bs be paid more than market wages

      That's effectively already the rule; H-1B workers need to be paid at least "prevailing wage", which in practice makes them more expensive than American workers. Furthermore, the DOL makes prevailing wage determinations.

    7. Re:And now you know ... by radarskiy · · Score: 4, Informative

      Actual position of Bernie Sanders: http://www.washingtonpost.com/...

      "What I do not support is, under the guise of immigrant reform, a process pushed by large corporations which results in more unemployment and lower wages for American workers...."

      "Furthermore, as someone who was led to believe that what economics was about was supply and demand, if you need workers in a certain area, you need to raise wages. I have a hard time understanding the notion that there's a severe need for more workers from abroad when wages for these jobs rose only 4.5 percent between 2000 and 2011. You see stagnant wages for high skilled workers, when these companies tell you that they desperately need high skilled workers. Why not raise wages to attract those workers?"

  3. Shoddy Workmanship by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Web developers, for example, saw their collective unemployment rate hit 5.10 percent

    Doesn't surprise me. The declining quality of most modern websites would suggest that the industry has simply stopped hiring professionals altogether.

    1. Re:Shoddy Workmanship by BarbaraHudson · · Score: 2

      I've seen on /, many times a public corporation in the US, by law, has to use the cheapest developer possible, otherwise they will be sued for not maximizing their profits.

      There is no such law. People like to repeat this because it "sounds logical." Even government contracts reserve the right not to accept the lowest, or any, bidder.

      --
      "Transparent" is a shit show that trades on every stereotype going. A man in drag is NOT a transsexual.
  4. 5% unemployment is healthy by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative

    5% unemployment is close to a natural level in a healthy market. The fluctuation around tenths of a percentage points is mostly noise.

  5. Seems fitting ... by Qbertino · · Score: 4, Interesting

    It is, by very definition, our job to make ourselves superfluos.

    Example: I hardly code anymore.
    Part of my job constists of setting up WordPress with generic and special plugins. By now mostly automated so that a fresh project can be done by a PM with no clue about web-technologies in less that 10 minutes.

    My job now consists of writing requirements, talking to the tech people of our customers and checking the possibilities and the occasional CSS/JS/jQuery and/or PHP Hack to add some obscure special feature to a fresh or existing install. Plus I take care of backups - mostly automated too - and let the bosses know when it's a bad idea to approach project X with strategy Y instead of Z.

    Stuff that I do alone today needed 10-15 people 15 years ago. And I only still have work to do because LAMP, WP and all that other stuff is a historically grown technology mess from 2 decades ago. My coding part of the occupation is one smart crew and one MIT licences new-gen web-cms away from becoming totally pointless.

    We all know it:
    The tech-advancement curve is logarithmic.
    The robots are coming and they're taking most of the jobs.
    Our's aswell.
    The smart people have been predicting this for years. This isn't news at all.

    Let's just hope that those at the helm don't screw it up and we all can enjoy an utopia rather than some bizar cyberpunk corporate socialism nightmare.
    I personally am looking forward to a 15 hour workweek with still enough to eat and live from. ... I'm down to 25 hours/week already and it feels great.

    My 2 cents.

    --
    We suffer more in our imagination than in reality. - Seneca
    1. Re:Seems fitting ... by Oxygen99 · · Score: 2

      Pfft. I don't think automated software development is coming any time soon. At least not for any business problem of any complexity. I received a specification document from a government department the other day. It specifies that certain values in an XML request are mandatory but not required. Now, I know that probably means the request will fail if those values aren't supplied but that, even if they are supplied, they won't be used. Or that they will be used under certain undocumented circumstances. Maybe.

      Good luck getting any automated tool to understand that without going Skynet on our ass.

      --
      I had a dream, bright and carefree, but now there's doubt and gravity
    2. Re:Seems fitting ... by ranton · · Score: 2

      I think your comments are right in line with the post you responded to. You are claiming that dealing with requirements will keep humans employed, and he was saying how better technology has reduced his job to mostly dealing with requirements.

      --
      -- All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing. -- Edmund Burke
  6. Economy is Bad by avandesande · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Shipments of storage and computers are down- almost always preceding a recession.

    --
    love is just extroverted narcissism
    1. Re:Economy is Bad by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Honestly, its not a recession. Governments used that term to boost morale. In truth it's a depression. When close to a third of the country is not in the workforce, shit is bad, real bad. Meanwhile, H1Bs and L1Bs are first to be hired, American Citizens last.

    2. Re:Economy is Bad by __aaclcg7560 · · Score: 2

      The youngest baby boomer today is 51-years-old. The labor participation rate will continue to decline over the next 20 years. The real fun begins in 2035 when retirees outnumbers workers and two-thirds of the federal budget goes to Social Security and Medicare. Taxes will have to go up to pay for everything else and keep the Me Generation in comfortable retirement.

  7. Can't be taken seriously. by ErikTheRed · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Whenever somebody uses the U3 unemployment numbers for any purpose that doesn't involve sarcasm or irony, their thoughts are not to be taken seriously. Literally the only purpose of mentioning U3 is political propaganda - the calculation methods divorce it completely and irrevocably from any potential honest use in discussing employment rates.

    --

    Help save the critically endangered Blue Iguana
  8. Which "unemployment rate?" by Type44Q · · Score: 2

    The technology industry's unemployment rate crept up to 3.0 percent

    So these are the unemployed, or the unemployed still eligible to receive unemployment?

  9. Re:Technology != computers by oh_my_080980980 · · Score: 2

    Computer systems analysts, programmers, network and systems administrators, software developers, and computer & information systems managers likewise experienced a slight rise in unemployment on a year-over-year basis. So yeah computers.

  10. Could just be cyclical, or the bubble popping by ErichTheRed · · Score: 3, Insightful

    In the first dotcom boom, and now the social media/app boom, these same trends started appearing towards the end of each up-cycle:
    - Massive hiring of anyone who could spell HTML, barely manage a server farm, or cobble together an application starts dropping.
    - Computer science enrollment at universities hit all time highs. (The subsequent bust reverses this trend.)
    - The tech news gets wackier every day, as even the dumbest ideas are getting VC funding, IPOing or getting acquired by a huge corporation.
    - Job hopping increases, especially towards the top of the boom. (This also explains the voluntary resignation increases.) This is just people hopping for the next crazy salary increase or extra perk, and it decreases during the bust as people are happy to be working.

    I've managed to stay employed continuously through 2 of these cycles, and I'm hoping my luck holds out. I think the key is simple -- don't suck at your job. :-) I'm not claiming to be a genius or rockstar by any means (and I think the rockstar moniker is stupid,) but I have had a solid track record and very good work experience grounded in fundamentals. Each of these booms has produced a legion of people who are semi-competent but not exactly suited for the job, and they have all been drawn in by the money. Remember paper MCSEs and certification bootcamps? This boom is all about apps, so it's code academies now -- 9 weeks and you're a rockstar developer writing the latest iPhone sensation!

    I think the spikes in unemployment can be explained partially by the boom fizzling, but the systems and network administrator increase is likely due to the cloud shift. Not everything is suited to a public cloud, but enough places will see a benefit in moving their stuff that offsets the control they have in locally owned systems. Again, I think (hope, that is, since I'm in systems engineering) that solid people will be retained either as architects or sysadmins in complex environments. What I do think will start to go away is the hyper-specialists like DBAs of one flavor of database, or VSphere administrators, or SAN/storage guys. As more companies try to get away from proprietary stuff, or shift things offsite, that insanely deep knowledge of EMC, VMWare, Cisco, etc. to the exclusion of everything else is going to be less sought after. Someone who can glue all the parts together regardless of who owns them or where they are will still be able to find work. Hopefully. :-)

    1. Re:Could just be cyclical, or the bubble popping by ErichTheRed · · Score: 2

      "I've known many people who didn't suck at their job but got laid off anyway. "

      Agreed, and I've been in situations like this. Luckily, I've worked at places where things like this start creeping in slowly and you can see the writing on the wall long before they get around to kicking you out. Part of being smart about your career these days is avoiding unemployment at all costs, because unemployed people are damaged goods in employers' minds regardless of the reason. Like you mention, I've known a few people who just got caught out at the wrong time, didn't suck at their jobs, and had a really rough time finding work again because of the layoff.

      Unless it's something insane like a year's salary (and you have lots of savings and no debt,) it's never a good idea to wait around for severance pay. The difficulty of getting back into the workforce, even with a solid history, is way higher than if you already have a job.