Slashdot Mirror


Neurons Can Be Changed From One Type To Another, Communication Paths Rewired (harvard.edu)

schwit1 writes: A newly published study from Harvard biologists [here's a link to the paywalled paper's summary] shows how neurons can be dramatically changed from one type into another from within the brain and how neighboring neurons recognize the reprogrammed cells as different and adapt by changing how they communicate with them. Building on earlier work in which they disproved neurobiology dogma by "reprogramming" neurons — turning one form of neuron into another — in the brains of living animals, Harvard Stem Cell Institute researchers have now shown that the networks of communication among reprogrammed neurons and their neighbors can also be changed, or "rewired."

31 comments

  1. "Well, sure" by smittyoneeach · · Score: 3, Funny

    "Well, sure," said a brainwashing industry spokesman.

    --
    Get thee glass eyes, and, like a scurvy politician, seem to see things thou dost not.--King Lear
    1. Re:"Well, sure" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Or, "I'm not sure," said another from a time not too long from now, thanks to this discovery.

    2. Re:"Well, sure" by JustAnotherOldGuy · · Score: 2

      After they rewired my brain I immediately realized that this was a wonderful thing and that everyone should do it right away!!

      ("Don't be afraid of brain slugs," says man infected with brain slug._

      --
      Just cruising through this digital world at 33 1/3 rpm...
    3. Re:"Well, sure" by FatdogHaiku · · Score: 5, Funny

      "Well, sure," said a brainwashing industry spokesman.

      Brainwashing is such a pejorative term...
      We prefer Non-consensual Attitude Adjustment.
      You'll like that better tomorrow...

      --
      You have the right to remain sentient. If you give up the right to remain sentient, you will be elected to public office
    4. Re:"Well, sure" by Hartree · · Score: 1

      "Non-consensual Attitude Adjustment"

      I thought that was another term for rubber hose cryptography.

    5. Re:"Well, sure" by FatdogHaiku · · Score: 1

      "Non-consensual Attitude Adjustment"

      I thought that was another term for rubber hose cryptography.

      For that the term "percussive data recovery" may be more accurate...
      You don't have to beat someone to change their mind, especially if you can really go in and CHANGE their mind!

      --
      You have the right to remain sentient. If you give up the right to remain sentient, you will be elected to public office
    6. Re:"Well, sure" by KGIII · · Score: 2

      Actually, as strange as this sounds, I watched a documentary where they put a thing with mechanical nubs on it into people's mouths. The mechanical piece was attached to a camera (black and white only - for contrast) and the images where then displayed by manipulating the nubs which sat on the user's tongue. With some practice (just a couple of weeks, as I recall) people were able to "see" using the nerves in their tongues.

      This was somewhere around 10 years ago - when I watched it, as I recall.

      --
      "So long and thanks for all the fish."
    7. Re:"Well, sure" by RichZellich · · Score: 1

      Well, I guess if we can't figure out how to program computers to work like brains, we'll just program brains to work like computers.

  2. Let me be the first by JustAnotherOldGuy · · Score: 1

    Let me be the first to say "uh oh", not because I think it's a bad thing (I don't, I think it's an amazing discovery) but because right now some fuckface ad exec is rubbing his sweaty little hands together wondering how he can implement this to sell more fucking widgets.

    And his counterparts in the government are doing the same thing, albeit with different aims in mind.

    --
    Just cruising through this digital world at 33 1/3 rpm...
    1. Re:Let me be the first by Ol+Olsoc · · Score: 1

      Let me be the first to say "uh oh", not because I think it's a bad thing (I don't, I think it's an amazing discovery) but because right now some fuckface ad exec is rubbing his sweaty little hands together wondering how he can implement this to sell more fucking widgets.

      And his counterparts in the government are doing the same thing, albeit with different aims in mind.

      So you guys figure that these new brain cells are going to be pre-implanted with thoughts or something? I RTFA and will probably be marked as a troll for violating the Slashdot code of ethics by doing so, but seriously - making new cells, implanting them in a person, and having other cells recognize and accept them isn't at all likely to ever result in mind control.

      --
      The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
    2. Re:Let me be the first by JustAnotherOldGuy · · Score: 2

      So you guys figure that these new brain cells are going to be pre-implanted with thoughts or something?

      I can't speak for the others here, but I was mostly just going for some yuks. :)

      Although, to be honest, it would not surprise me in the least if some marketing weasel saw this news story and had the reaction I outlined, lol.

      "Wow, what if there was some way to use this to sell more ChocoBars? Hmmm...."

      --
      Just cruising through this digital world at 33 1/3 rpm...
    3. Re:Let me be the first by The+Real+Dr+John · · Score: 1

      This is not really much to be concerned about in any way. They put a gene into the brains of mouse embryos, and got the brain cells in a specific part of the brain to develop differently than they would have normally, without the gene put in. Not a surprising finding. It is not something you could do to a person, and it isn't going to be used for anything other than research purposes. They aren't going to try and do this to people, since changing the developmental fate of neurons during development this way won't do anything useful.

      --
      A brain is a terrible thing to waste... Mind? That's debatable.
  3. The Cure by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

    This is the beginning of the cure for severe autism, the symptoms of a extensive brain damage and such, and of course a step towards useful machine-brain interfaces.

    1. Re: The Cure by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I hearhigh dose lead supplements work very well too.

  4. The Penrose soul by Applehu+Akbar · · Score: 1

    Roger Penrose conjectures that the human soul, the secret sauce that would prevent any AI from becoming fully human, resides in a quantum connection with the microtubules in neurons. How would the neuronal plasticity envisioned here impact that?

    1. Re:The Penrose soul by narcc · · Score: 1

      No, he doesn't.

    2. Re:The Penrose soul by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      How does the soul "hook into" the brain. Are there particular points in the brain where the connections are made? We know 30% of the brain is dedicated to vision, and another 10% to audio, both working with perceptual pyramids. These areas are dedicated to recognition; a musician will recognize music sheets, notes, melodies, riffs, tunes, tempos as well as the type of sound of every instrument. Would that information be stored in the soul as well, or does it just store a journal of all actions made? If that were the case, it would need to hook into the hypothalamus, which records sight, and generates emotional responses.

    3. Re:The Penrose soul by ceoyoyo · · Score: 1

      The quantum microtubule hypothesis has been pretty thoroughly disproven. Penrose doesn't think so anymore either.

    4. Re:The Penrose soul by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      And anyway the Buddha clearly explained "there is no soul." That was around 2500 years ago.

      Awareness is something that actually happens in the real universe. "Soul" is imaginary, and exists only to convince people that they will somehow survive their own death. A soul is supposed to be something that is not made of matter but somehow interacts with matter and is somehow the real you (whereas all your matter is not). There is no evidence for such a thing, nor does any explanation of it make sense.

      The Christian concept of the soul has an amazing horror story thrown in as well: anyone who doesn't adhere to the religion winds up with their soul being tortured in a pit of fire forever, with God Himself making sure the soul can never escape. Some of the best horror writers of our day are still having a hard time topping that one!

    5. Re:The Penrose soul by Applehu+Akbar · · Score: 1

      It's Penrose's hypothesis, not mine, so you will have to ask him.

  5. Dogma=The science is settled by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The deniers were undeterred and everybody benefits.

  6. The mind (just like the body) is PLASTIC... apk by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    See subject: I've said it before here on /. - & if you "workout" your brain, just like the body, it gets stronger... Academia for myself personally was the BIGGEST PROOF of it for me (once I found something I really loved in computing, seeing it changing the world, MOSTLY for the better & as a 1st string NCAA Lettering Athlete in the sport of Lacrosse for a national champ... I did the MOST changing for the better in that timeframe imo).

    * :)

    (Conversely, however - IF you abuse it, you destroy it too...)

    APK

    P.S.=> Unfortunately, in my time, I've run into heroin addicts (most destroy themselves or die) - many the past 2-3 yrs. mostly in the line of business I'm in mainly (consulting or contracting in computing on the side) - 1 is in recovery & doing fine for 5++ yrs. & he told me of how it "reprograms the brain" (This makes sense in the 'bad way' from above & as far as how it changes them mentally - it's ALL THEY LIVE FOR when they're still 'hooked on smack') but not in a good way - they forget about having goals & dreams to shoot for (not needle shooting either) - it's sad (they were once someone's little boy or girl, you know?)

    ... apk

    1. Re:The mind (just like the body) is PLASTIC... apk by BarbaraHudson · · Score: 0

      And this is why we should treat the people who have drug addictions as having a treatable illness, and not as criminals. Addictions pretty much rob people of the ability to exercise free choice. I guess it doesn't matter if it's a monkey on your back or a gun to your head ...

      --
      "Transparent" is a shit show that trades on every stereotype going. A man in drag is NOT a transsexual.
    2. Re:The mind (just like the body) is PLASTIC... apk by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Actually there's a concept in drug treatment called neuroplasticity, where the person can actually alter his or her brain structure by various forms of conditioning and mental exercises. Meditation also is said to accomplish this.

  7. Re: Nice by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Sorry dude but nobody alive today in the US experienced slavery. Stop being the victim that you never were. The only way to move on is to move forward. If you keep acting the part of the victim nothing will improve. Protest against the current wrongs of today. Change has happened and will continue to happen. Our world keeps getting better. Would you prefer to have lived 60 years ago or now? Imagine how much better life will be for your great great grandchildren.

  8. "Dogma" overturned ? We never learn ... by fygment · · Score: 1

    For decades and decades the consensus was that neurons don't change. The overwhelming MAJORITY of researchers believed that to be true. If it had mattered, government policies would have been aligned with that overwhelmingly supported belief. Because that's what all the science and scientists said was the truth.

    But it wasn't ...

    Funny thing about 'dogma', nobody realises it's dogma while it's happening.

    We the lay public, see this announcement as science progressing. Three decades ago, well we would not even have been treated to the idea. So what ideas are being suppressed now?

    --
    "Consensus" in science is _always_ a political construct.
  9. Re: Nice by BarbaraHudson · · Score: 1

    Actually, some people who come from other countries have indeed experienced slavery. It's pretty much everywhere, even in the western world.

    These numbers might seem high, but the UN estimate of 27 to 30 million is still an awful lot of people. White slaves DO exist. And India, with 14 million, easily beats out China with 3.2 million and Russia with 1 million. Strange how the world's largest democracy is also has the world's largest population of slaves. Even on a per capita basis, India is far worse than Russia and China.

    --
    "Transparent" is a shit show that trades on every stereotype going. A man in drag is NOT a transsexual.
  10. Re: Nice by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The problem is not race, or slavery, it is money. This is a problem that capitalism creates. Person x has no ideas at all and 1 million dollars and person y has a brilliant idea and has 10 dollars. Person x invests their 1 million dollars in a and makes 100 million dollars. Person y spends the 10 dollars he has so he does not die of starvation, and has zero money to make his brilliant idea a reality. He takes his idea to a patent attorney that wants 10,000 dollars that he does not have. Yet, somehow he manages to scrape up the money. He takes is idea to 100 different angel investors, they shoot him down and steal his idea, changing it just a little bit with canned techniques to make it "better". They give the idea to one of their kids and give them all the funding they need to start a business. The business does very poorly, due to poor management. Then along comes person x who buys the business. Person x becomes a multi-billionaire. Person y dies of starvation due to the massive debt he took on.

    That is capitalism for you. What a wonderful system we have created.

  11. Re: Nice by BarbaraHudson · · Score: 0

    What in the world does what you posted have to do with the comment I replied to or my reply? Oh, right, NOTHING.

    The original poster wrote: "Sorry dude but nobody alive today in the US experienced slavery."

    I replied with a link that showed the US has an estimated 60,000 people living in it as slaves right now (human trafficking, women being promised jobs as "dancers" and being forced int prostitution and drugs, etc.)

    This has nothing to do with capitalism - slavery has existed under every type of economic model.

    --
    "Transparent" is a shit show that trades on every stereotype going. A man in drag is NOT a transsexual.