City Sued Over Smart Meter-Related Patent (chicagotribune.com)

← Back to Stories (view on slashdot.org)

City Sued Over Smart Meter-Related Patent (chicagotribune.com)

Posted by samzenpus on Wednesday December 2, 2015 @01:15PM from the time-to-pay dept.

New submitter wb8nbs writes: Florida patent troll Atlas LLC has filed a suit against the municipality of Naperville, Illinois (paywalled). Atlas claims infringement of their patent on wireless communication where a hub node controls remote node responses. In 2011-2013 Naperville, which owns the local electrical utility network, installed Smart Meters on nearly all customers in its serving area, a move that was bitterly opposed by a small group of residents. The Naperville Smart Meter network uses Zigbee protocol to return readings to their fiber optic collection network. The Atlas suit could have long range implications to the Internet of Things, but it appears they have sued and lost a similar case in Florida.

60 comments

Min score:

Reason:

Sort:

Pay in blood by the_povinator · 2015-12-02 13:24 · Score: 1

The Bob Dylan song lyrics seem apropos as a response to this type of lawsuit:
I'll pay in blood.. but not my own.

--
The .sig is dead, and I believe I had a hand in killing it.
Move the case to the city courthouse and see how by Joe_Dragon · 2015-12-02 13:27 · Score: 1

Move the case to the city courthouse and see how far it goes.
if the IoT loses, i'm for it by turkeydance · 2015-12-02 13:32 · Score: 1

enemy of my enemy and all that
Which side am I supposed to be on?!? by tlambert · 2015-12-02 13:36 · Score: 2, Interesting

Which side am I supposed to be on?!?
On one side, we have Smart Meters, which are evil, and intended to provide differential rates do that the electric utility can pay you less for the solar you generate than the non-solar you consume, so they get paid the same amount, as when you didn't have solar, and it saves their antique business model...
On the other side, it's a patent troll, engaging in rent seeking on something they pobably acquired in a bankruptcy, and who produces nothing useful to society at all, and is just a drag on innovation in general...
WHICH SIDE?!?!?!?!
I'm so confused....
1. Re:Which side am I supposed to be on?!? by Dereck1701 · 2015-12-02 14:32 · Score: 1
  
  The hypocrisy of it all is quite astonishing. A decade or so ago utilities were screaming that they needed to implement peak metering because of the added costs of handling increased demand. Recently they've been pushing for higher overall rates because, *gasp*, energy usage is down because of energy efficient appliances, efficient lighting, home solar and off peak load balancing (water heaters, special AC units, etc). Sadly I'm not surprised that they lied to increase profits, but that they so unabashedly changed directions to justify a new round of rate hikes.
2. Re:Which side am I supposed to be on?!? by penguinoid · 2015-12-02 14:45 · Score: 2
  
  Which side am I supposed to be on?!?
  Whenever you hear "patent troll", substitute in "patent reform activist". So a "patent reform activist" is promoting solar power while demonstrating the brokenness of the patent system.
  
  --
  Don't waste your vote! Vote for whoever you want, unless you live in a swing state it won't matter anyways
3. Re:Which side am I supposed to be on?!? by langelgjm · 2015-12-02 14:49 · Score: 4, Insightful
  
  Smart meters aren't evil.
  Differential rates for solar power the customer generates versus electricity consumed from the utility don't really require smart meters, either, at least not the kind commonly deployed. Plus, the vast majority of homes and businesses where smart meters are being deployed don't generate their own power, so it's silly to suggest this is the intention for deploying them.
  Actual reasons for deploying smart meters include better demand monitoring and management, fast and accurate outage reporting so that service can be restored more quickly, and better customer service - since you as a consumer can now find out exactly how much you're using and when.
  I had a smart meter when I lived in Connecticut, and I loved it. I wrote a script to log in to my utility's website and get my daily consumption data, so I could track my consumption over time and make energy-conserving decisions. We also had natural gas, but in my best month I was able to lower consumption to 186 kWh, about a fifth of the US average.
  I now live in New Jersey, and our so-called 'ratepayer advocate' is rabidly anti-smart meter because she doesn't want to permit any increase in utility bills, even to pay for infrastructure investment. It took Hurricane Sandy to convince her to allow some infrastructure improvements that PSEG had been asking for a long time, but still no smart meters.
  
  --
  "Anyone who [rips a CD] is probably engaging in copyright infringement." - David O. Carson
4. Re:Which side am I supposed to be on?!? by Anonymous Coward · 2015-12-02 16:17 · Score: 1
  
  Both utilities and consumers need to realize that their new business model is distribution, not production. Actually production was never the model for public utilities; their real business model was getting cheap loans (to build power plants and infrastructure), and pay them off with cash flow from consumers. The power plant was basically an excuse to borrow money. Nearly all of the costs for power plants and power lines, etc. is in the initial construction, making it extremely difficult and complex to establish what the per-watt-hour cost of electricity should be. Basically if nobody used any electricity, the power utility would still have the huge loans (bond issues, typically) to pay off, and would still have to maintain the lines etc. So the periodic dance with the public utilities commissions is basically how to account for the loan payments, plus the amortized cost of repairs and maintenance, vs. the estimated amount of electricity that consumers are likely to use. This is an equation with a lot of variables that are impossible to know ahead of time. You're basically trying to determine the fair price for a huge initial purchase, spread across 30 years of varying usage. Price/demand curves pay into this as well.
  Today, an increasing number of alternative sources of electricity are becoming available. The public utility still has to pay off those huge loans - they're typically on 30 year or longer schedules, and that's fair. But they do still have to maintain the infrastructure, and employ people to come out and repair lines etc. The amount you get paid for your solar power _must_ be equivalent to the power coming out of the power plant, not the power coming into your house, otherwise you're basically getting the entire infrastructure for free. Feel free to disconnect from the grid, build your own battery backup system, and amortize the whole cost of the thing over the 10 year lifespan. (I know people who actually have done this. It's quite doable, albeit rarely practical in a modern setting unless you're 1/2 mile or more from a power line.) This will almost certainly cost you more than just buying electricity from the power company.
  The old business model by the way is remarkably similar to software - the marginal cost to produce a copy of Microsoft Windows is essentially zero - in fact the production of manuals and DVDs is pushed off to the PC makers, and Microsoft only actually produces the shiny sticker.
  As an aside, today's power companies are being forced to act as extensions of liberal governments' wet dreams. I recently received, for free, replacement of all of my incandescent light bulbs, addition of a whole lot of insulation in my attic, foam sealing of every air-leaking gap in my house, and a complete set of new sealing gaskets for the four doors to my house under the Mass Save program. This program, mandated by the State of Massachusetts, is paid for by - you guessed it - the electric company, otherwise known as my neighbors' rate payments. The State also requires the electric company to buy (IIRC) 20% of all its electricity from 'renewable' sources including solar and wind power, at a substantially higher price than it pays for 'regular' power. The company is not allowed to pass this increased cost on to the consumer directly; but it actually of course does, as a general price increase. Last year's electric rate increase was about 25%. These are classic examples of how governments love to 'do good' with Other People's Money. I like Zuckerberg's recent example better.
5. Re:Which side am I supposed to be on?!? by mikael · 2015-12-02 16:50 · Score: 1
  
  The final ruling of any court case establishes a ruling that affects all similar lawsuits in the future.
  Next time it could be PatentTrolls LLC suing startup LinuxDeveloperStudios for enabling the remote control of holographic USB projector systems.
  
  --
  Vintage computer adverts: http://www.vintageadbrowser.com/computers-and-software-ads
6. Re:Which side am I supposed to be on?!? by mikael · 2015-12-02 16:52 · Score: 2
  
  That was before solar, wind came along and home-owners being able to sell energy back into the grid. Once supply exceeds demand, the utilities are no longer able to make their bumper profits when demand exceeds supply. Not even when they are trying to shut down the cheapest energy suppliers such as coal, buying up the surviving companies and selling the coal to China (Peabody Coal).
  
  --
  Vintage computer adverts: http://www.vintageadbrowser.com/computers-and-software-ads
7. Re:Which side am I supposed to be on?!? by Applehu+Akbar · 2015-12-02 16:57 · Score: 1
  
  "I now live in New Jersey, and our so-called 'ratepayer advocate' is rabidly anti-smart meter because she doesn't want to permit any increase in utility bills, even to pay for infrastructure investment. It took Hurricane Sandy to convince her to allow some infrastructure improvements that PSEG had been asking for a long time, but still no smart meters."
  In my town, the hippie chick lobby is against smart meters because the ones we use in Arizona report in using the cellular data system. This is "radiation" in their view, and will cause everyone to grow extra toes or something. I have had one for two years, and I'm still waiting for my superpowers.
8. Re:Which side am I supposed to be on?!? by Darinbob · 2015-12-02 19:49 · Score: 2
  
  You seem to misunderstand smart meters. Differential rates are only one small thing they can do which is used by only a small number of utilities. If they have differential pricing for solar, they will do it whether or not they have smart meters. The old 50's era meters are never coming back, they were very inaccurate. The newer meters have extra features, more things are measured (voltage for example, you'd be surprised how many neighborhoods have the wrong voltage), and they can discover if there are problems early and be proactive. The old method was amazingly stupid; they would have no idea at all how and where their electricity was being used except for a once a month reading (and they won't go read it if it's snowing, raining, you have a mean dog, etc, so they will estimate instead). Smart meters showed up once the utilities had to be more accountable, were encouraged/required to conserve electricity, had to justify rate increases before a PUC, etc.
9. Re: Which side am I supposed to be on?!? by BigZee · 2015-12-02 21:45 · Score: 1
  
  Your comments would carry a bit more weight if you didn't insult the people you disagree with.
  The problem here is that there probably are some legitimate reasons to be concerned whilst others you can probably ignore. There is no doubt in my mind that the energy providers will ultimately find a way to exploit smart meters to their advantage. For me, I hope that I will improve my efficiency and increase my self sufficiency through improved insulation and home generation such that the providers will become increasingly irrelevant. Granted this is not something everyone can achieve although I imagine most would aspire to it. However, the hope is that a prevalence of alternatives plus a diverse market will keep the providers in check.
  Being worried about RF radiation is probably nonsense but I've seen it tends to be a common policy of those who want to convince people that there is an overwhelming reason to oppose something. Not just one or two arguments but a significant list of reasons, many of which are untrue.
10. Re:Which side am I supposed to be on?!? by drinkypoo · 2015-12-02 23:22 · Score: 1
  
  Smart meters aren't evil.
  They're not evil, they're just shit.
  
  Differential rates for solar power the customer generates versus electricity consumed from the utility don't really require smart meters
  Yes, that's reason one smart meters are shit. They are unnecessary.
  
  Plus, the vast majority of homes and businesses where smart meters are being deployed don't generate their own power, so it's silly to suggest this is the intention for deploying them.
  Right, it's a lie. The problem is, so is your next reason:
  
  Actual reasons for deploying smart meters include better demand monitoring and management, fast and accurate outage reporting so that service can be restored more quickly, and better customer service - since you as a consumer can now find out exactly how much you're using and when.
  Here's the problem with that idea. The actual "smart grid" initiative is about way more than smart meters. They're also adding intelligence to the wires, so they can monitor them. There's no real use in being able to monitor power consumption on a per-house basis in realtime, because they can't actually do anything on a per-house basis in realtime. Everything they need to know can be measured at the poles. If a subscriber loses power completely, they will let you know anyway. A subscriber won't be able to use excessive power because of their equipment, and if they do they'll probably bypass the meter anyway. All the information they need for load demand following is available at the substation — which is in fact the smallest unit they can switch in realtime — and actually requires no additional hardware whatsoever. They already know how much current a link is carrying. What they don't know is what its current carrying capacity is at any given time, because they don't know its temperature. That is changing, and it is actually the most important part of the smart grid.
  
  and better customer service - since you as a consumer can now find out exactly how much you're using and when.
  All they have to do is provide a time pulse output, which on traditional meters is provided by putting a less-reflective spot on the rotating disc, and a small and inexpensive device can calculate this for you without any privacy considerations.
  When you add to this the fact that smartmeters 1) tend to fail in the power company's favor while the old meters tended to fail in your favor and 2) have been known to literally explode (both of these facts can be trivially looked up, but they have also been all over the news in the past) the fact is that smartmeters are unnecessary shit that isn't really going to help anything.
  
  --
  "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
11. Re: Which side am I supposed to be on?!? by Applehu+Akbar · 2015-12-03 01:13 · Score: 2
  
  A legitimate concern about smart meters could be privacy. Because a smart meter can take multiple readings during a day, rather than one manual reading a month, it gives the utility a lot of information about users' personal habits. In fact, smart meters are part of Smart Grid, a utility initiative to incorporate medium-scale renewables into their systems. The idea is that if a utility is going to have to deal with generated inputs that change minute by minute, it needs to have the same fine-scale information about its loads.
  The next step in Smart Grid is going to evoke national controversy: a smart meter that can selectively turn on and off each user's major appliances. If renewables are ever going to be a major element of the power grid, this next generation of smart meters will have to be deployed. When we lobby for small renewable sources, this is a consequence that most of us did not anticipate.
  Meanwhile, the New Jersey ombudsman's objection is at least to a plausible scenario. The hippie-chich objection is to something purely imaginary.
12. Re:Which side am I supposed to be on?!? by BitZtream · 2015-12-03 01:30 · Score: 2
  
  On one side, we have Smart Meters, which are evil, and intended to provide differential rates do that the electric utility can pay you less for the solar you generate than the non-solar you consume, so they get paid the same amount, as when you didn't have solar, and it saves their antique business model...
  Let me show you the multiple ways you're a nut job, and pay attention because the best one is last ...
  They don't get to give you different rates because you're using solar, so your conspiracy theory is bunk. They (in every state I've lived in) are legally mandated to buy back power at the rate they sell it at, so changing the price doesn't really help them.
  So if they lower it during the day, then businesses pay less for power and you make less back on your solar power, but the power company makes far less because the change in price from your dinky little solar operation is nothing compared to the millions of people consuming power in businesses during the day ... which they'll lose WAY more on due to any decrease they come up with in order to 'stick it' to solar power users.
  It actually loses them more money than their 'antique' business model ... which, btw, they've been doing since before you were born or solar powered electricity was even a glimmer in someones eye ... so its pretty hard to draw the conclusion that they differential rates are based on if you have solar or not ...
  And then draw in that the smart meters in question are just making it so they don't have to have a meter maid come read the meters ... If you wanted to just rip people off for solar, a simple clock would be effective enough and have it not only count total KWH, but do rating at the time of usage to account for lower prices during the day
  And the best for last part:
  Electricity costs MORE during the day, when you would be generating solar power, not less. Electricity is cheaper at night (in most areas) ...
  But hey ... don't let reality make you look stupid, you're doing fine on your own.
  You're only confused because you're a paranoid nut job.
  
  --
  Persistent Volume manager for Kubernetes - https://github.com/dwimsey/openshift-pvmanager
13. Re:Which side am I supposed to be on?!? by NJRoadfan · 2015-12-03 01:39 · Score: 1
  
  Smart meters are coming to PSEG territory "soon" based on what I've heard. They have already deployed them in Long Island shortly after taking over LIPA's grid. Maybe the NJBPU should get around to dealing with all the scammy alternative energy re-sellers that flooded the marketplace after deregulation. http://www.nj.com/business/index.ssf/2014/06/nj_third-party_energy_provider_charges_overcharging_consumers.html
14. Re:Which side am I supposed to be on?!? by Anonymous Coward · 2015-12-03 01:50 · Score: 0
  
  The final ruling of any court case establishes a ruling that affects all similar lawsuits in the future.
  
  No it doesn't. A higher court can ignore any ruling made by a lower one.
15. Re: Which side am I supposed to be on?!? by FlyHelicopters · 2015-12-03 02:21 · Score: 0
  
  The next step in Smart Grid is going to evoke national controversy: a smart meter that can selectively turn on and off each user's major appliances.
  Yea, uhh... no, just no...
  Get off the damm Internet and go talk to mothers and ask them if it is ok if the utility can turn off their dishwasher and clothes washer any time they like, that is a non-starter.
  Ignoring the point that you really shouldn't be turning those off mid cycle, people are not going to want to move to such a model.
16. Re: Which side am I supposed to be on?!? by Archangel+Michael · 2015-12-03 04:02 · Score: 1
  
  Your comments would carry a bit more weight if you didn't insult the people you disagree with.
  Actually, insulting people is the norm in politics these days. Everyone from the Far Left to the Far Right and the hucksters in the middle (see Trump) insult the people they disagree with. And it works very well for the kneejerk low information voter types.
  
  --
  Agent K: A *person* is smart. People are dumb, stupid, panicky animals, and you know it.
17. Re:Which side am I supposed to be on?!? by bugs2squash · 2015-12-03 05:17 · Score: 1
  
  ..."will cause everyone to grow extra toes or something. I have had one for two years"...
  So there's some truth to the toe growth rumors then
  
  --
  Nullius in verba
18. Re: Which side am I supposed to be on?!? by Ichijo · 2015-12-03 06:56 · Score: 1
  
  The next step in Smart Grid is going to evoke national controversy: a smart meter that can selectively turn on and off each user's major appliances.
  
  If it were possible, I would program my A/C to raise (or the furnace to lower) the thermostat by a degree or two when rates are high, and to lock out the washer and dryer and dishwasher until rates fall, and likewise lower the water heater temperature slightly. Maybe even program the lights to dim and the computers to go into power saving mode. What's so controversial about that?
  
  --
  Any sufficiently unpopular but cohesive argument is indistinguishable from trolling.
19. Re: Which side am I supposed to be on?!? by laurencetux · 2015-12-03 07:37 · Score: 1
  
  the problem is when SOMEBODY ELSE decides that
  1 your fridge is using to much power (shut off the freezer part and raise the temp to "bacteria PARTTEH!!! levels in the fridge)
  2 Your ac/heater is using to much power ( the outdoor temp is 50 degrees plus minus comfort levels FOAD no relief for you)
  3 you now can use your washer between 1 am and 2:15 am your drier is usable between 7 am and 9:30 am
  or a DAESH hacker decides to ramp your heater up to runaway levels in the middle of the night (because of course they are going to be able to fiddle with the settings also)
20. Re: Which side am I supposed to be on?!? by Anonymous Coward · 2015-12-03 08:19 · Score: 0
  
  The next step in Smart Grid is going to evoke national controversy: a smart meter that can selectively turn on and off each user's major appliances. If renewables are ever going to be a major element of the power grid, this next generation of smart meters will have to be deployed. When we lobby for small renewable sources, this is a consequence that most of us did not anticipate.
  F U D!
21. Re: Which side am I supposed to be on?!? by EETech1 · 2015-12-03 20:04 · Score: 1
  
  It would be cool if the grid world turn off my air conditioner when a cloud went through.
  As the clouds make a drop in the solar input, the closest loads are shut down to compensate while long term adjustments are made to the power plants.
22. Re: Which side am I supposed to be on?!? by Applehu+Akbar · 2015-12-04 01:49 · Score: 1
  
  Putting in a sensor to do that would be your job, not the grid's. The grid sees power and loads over a wide area, and responds to changes over distances far larger than a single house. If it's windy in South Dakota this morning, Smart Grid might turn all the AC units in Arizona down by two degrees, absorbing the excess. Later in the hot part of the day with calm air in SD, the AZ air conditioners would be set higher to lighten the load.
23. Re: Which side am I supposed to be on?!? by langelgjm · 2015-12-05 07:35 · Score: 1
  
  First of all, load management systems for consumers are almost always voluntary and opt-in.
  Second, I've never heard of a consumer load management system that dealt with dishwashers and washing machines - first, because these typically are minor power consumers compared to heating and air conditioning, and second, because yes, you shouldn't interrupt them mid-cycle.
  It's not like demand management shuts down your entire house. That's more like a rolling brownout, which is precisely what demand management tries to avoid.
  Maybe you're thinking of variable rates, which encourage people to use energy intensive devices when the rates are lower - like starting your electric dryer, which is a large consumer, when you go to bed at night, rather than at 3 PM in the middle of July.
  It's amazing to me how people who have absolutely no idea how electricity works or how it is generated and delivered suddenly become experts on everything from RF radiation, privacy and security of IT systems, energy efficiency, and utility infrastructure.
  
  --
  "Anyone who [rips a CD] is probably engaging in copyright infringement." - David O. Carson
24. Re: Which side am I supposed to be on?!? by FlyHelicopters · 2015-12-05 19:12 · Score: 1
  
  Maybe you're thinking of variable rates, which encourage people to use energy intensive devices when the rates are lower - like starting your electric dryer, which is a large consumer, when you go to bed at night, rather than at 3 PM in the middle of July.
  Yea, but I'm not interested in having to remember when to run my clothes dryer, and that is the point...
  People want to do what they want, when they want, without worrying about time of day use...
  But the really cool thing is going to be something like Tesla's battery system. You can set THAT to timeshift power use during the day and a smart grid that controls batteries to allow people to run their stuff whenever they want may well be successful.
  The only major hitch is that to really work we need three things:
  1. a whole crap load more wind and solar than we have today, as in an order of magnitude more (very expensive, but doable)
  2. a large percentage of people setup with such a system, perhaps 20% or more of homes (and that'll be expensive)
  3. a much larger long range power grid that crosses far more political and legal boundaries than today (doable, if we get off our butts and make it happen).
  All of the above is technically possible, it'll be political and economic reasons that stop it, not technical ones.
  The trick is to setup a system that allows Joe and Jane Consumer to turn on their crap any time they like. You probably don't need more than 12 hour time shifting of power, 24 hours at the most, if you have the above three things.
  ---
  Side note: If you wish to replace the 39% of the power generated in the US by coal in 2014, then we need to build about 200 new nuclear reactors. Wind and solar should be built as well and those are fine, but the reality is that you aren't going to replace 39% of current total power generation with wind and solar any time soon. Likely not within a timeframe that is going to matter.
  Sadly, the only way to build 200 new nuclear reactors in a timeframe that would matter would be to nationalize them, have the US Navy build and run them (they have a long track record with nuclear, most of it very good) and sell the power in an auction process. This would remove miles and miles of red tape, simply make it a national security issue (which it is) and get moving on it. Left to the current process, clearly this won't happen.
patent / trade mark trolls are the bad side ofDMCA by Joe_Dragon · 2015-12-02 13:45 · Score: 1

patent / trade mark trolls are the bad side of DMCA like laws.
And the cycle continutes by Anonymous Coward · 2015-12-02 14:01 · Score: 0

First it was "On a computer". Then it was "On a Smartphone" and now apparently it is "On a meter".
these trolls are very annoying by jonsmirl · 2015-12-02 14:02 · Score: 1

US 5371734 A
Expiration Date: 1/29/2013
Going after Napierville for a installing a technology they simply bought and started installing a year before this junk patent expired.
They've already sued and lost by chromaexcursion · 2015-12-02 14:09 · Score: 1

This is a troll, through and through. Atlas must die.
Naperville didn't manufacture the meters, or any of the other equipment which might infringe on a patent. They need to counter sue for legal fees and 3x damages for frivolous legal claim.
1. Re:They've already sued and lost by Anonymous Coward · 2015-12-02 14:34 · Score: 0
  
  Next they'll sue everyone who has a smartmeter on their house, but offer to settle out of court for $100. That'll make them a few trillion nationwide.
2. Re:They've already sued and lost by Anonymous Coward · 2015-12-03 06:53 · Score: 0
  
  It doesn't matter whether Naperville manufactured them. They are using them. Using an infringing device is infringement. Period. Patent Law is crystal clear on this.
OK I looked this up. by hey! · 2015-12-02 14:16 · Score: 4, Informative

Here is the complaint: https://www.unitedstatescourts.org/federal/ilnd/318734/1-0.html.
Here is the patent in question: http://www.google.com/patents/US5371734.
Basically the patent describes a time division wireless networking scheme in which certain nodes orchestrate transmission and receiving time slots assigned to adjacent nodes. The claimed benefits of this scheme amount to these: bandwidth can be allocated to nodes dynamically, and nodes can extend battery life by turning off their receivers when it's not their turn to receive data. I have no strong opinions as to whether the networking scheme as so vaguely described in the patent is original enough to be patented, but the complaint is a different matter. It appears that Atlas IP LLC appears claiming that any system in which devices are polled and in which the devices may not be transmitting or receiving at any time infringes on this patent. If that is what the patent means, then clearly it's too obvious to be "original".

--
Post may contain irony: discontinue use if experiencing mood swings, nausea or elevated blood pressure.
1. Re:OK I looked this up. by viperidaenz · 2015-12-02 14:54 · Score: 2
  
  That, and the patent is expired.
  They bought an expired patent then went around looking for people that may have infringed before it expired.
2. Re:OK I looked this up. by Anonymous Coward · 2015-12-02 22:48 · Score: 0
  
  Here is the complaint: https://www.unitedstatescourts.org/federal/ilnd/318734/1-0.html.
  Here is the patent in question: http://www.google.com/patents/US5371734.
  Basically the patent describes a time division wireless networking scheme in which certain nodes orchestrate transmission and receiving time slots assigned to adjacent nodes. The claimed benefits of this scheme amount to these: bandwidth can be allocated to nodes dynamically, and nodes can extend battery life by turning off their receivers when it's not their turn to receive data. I have no strong opinions as to whether the networking scheme as so vaguely described in the patent is original enough to be patented, but the complaint is a different matter. It appears that Atlas IP LLC appears claiming that any system in which devices are polled and in which the devices may not be transmitting or receiving at any time infringes on this patent. If that is what the patent means, then clearly it's too obvious to be "original".
  Not this shit again.
  Why isn't ALOHAnet prior art?
3. Re:OK I looked this up. by Anonymous Coward · 2015-12-03 00:40 · Score: 0
  
  1) If you're using either full-on TDMA or PRMA, then the patent doesn't cover you, they disclaim it.
  2) If you're using CSMA-CA, the patent doesn't cover you, they disclaim it and this one clearly is OLD.
  3) These meters are using ZigBee.
  4) ZigBee uses 802.15.4 as the MAC and PHY layer.
  5) 802.15.4 uses a Slotted/Unslotted CSMA-CA MAC method.
  6) We won't get into the fact that the suit is filed about 1-2 years entirely too late, even if it was valid otherwise (which it isn't...)
  Wondering when they get sanctioned for filing frivolous lawsuits.
4. Re:OK I looked this up. by Anonymous Coward · 2015-12-03 01:17 · Score: 0
  
  The magic term in your post is "LLC", an LLC lets you do anything nefarious without being personally liable for any criminal or civil act. LLC needs to go away.
5. Re:OK I looked this up. by AntronArgaiv · 2015-12-03 01:56 · Score: 1
  
  sounds a lot like slotted ALOHAnet...
6. Re:OK I looked this up. by Locke2005 · 2015-12-03 07:15 · Score: 1
  
  I worked for a company (Validec, later sold to Remanco) that implemented a restaurant POS system for wireless terminals based on slotted ALOHA back in 1983... surely this was patented and counts as prior art? (The PC-based base station transmitted slot signals, after which wireless terminals could start broadcasting, meaning they all started broadcasting at the same time, allowing collision detection to be slightly more efficent. The system failed badly during training, as the trainer instructed 30 people to all press "send" at exactly the same time.)
  
  --
  I've abandoned my search for truth; now I'm just looking for some useful delusions.
7. Re:OK I looked this up. by AntronArgaiv · 2015-12-03 07:43 · Score: 1
  
  Great minds...
  "Those who don't remember the past are doomed to think they've invented something new." :-)
Flori-duh by Anonymous Coward · 2015-12-02 14:35 · Score: 1

Why is it all stupid shit comes from Florida?
Can't wait for this cesspool to be swallowed up the rising waters of the Atlantic.
1. Re:Flori-duh by Anonymous Coward · 2015-12-02 16:30 · Score: 0
  
  Why is it all stupid shit comes from Florida? Can't wait for this cesspool to be swallowed up the rising waters of the Atlantic.
  There is nothing wrong with Florida. Its Florida residents that are the problem and they won't be staying in Florida as the water rises. Enjoy your new neighbors in whatever state you currently reside in.
2. Re:Flori-duh by Anonymous Coward · 2015-12-02 16:52 · Score: 0
  
  In fairness, a Florida court struck down this patent troll's challenge to their claim against a Florida city's use of smart meters.
Nice tags you got there by jeffmeden · 2015-12-02 15:34 · Score: 1

Tagged itsnotits which clearly means the article has no tits at all. Skipping.
Re:patent / trade mark trolls are the bad side ofD by Anonymous Coward · 2015-12-02 16:47 · Score: 0

News flash: the DMCA has no redeeming value. It's all "bad side".
a patent's last breath.... by Anonymous Coward · 2015-12-02 17:49 · Score: 0

atlas has filed 10 suits based on this patent..... ALL AFTER ITS EXPIRY. (which was jan 2013.. first suit filed sep 2013)
the last three include city of naperville (tfa), excelon (parent of commonweath edison, also filed in chicago), and pacific gas and electric (aka pg&e to west coasters), filed in northern california.
apparently, after the bad luck in fishing for money out of the medical devices industry, they've cast one last net on two large power companies and one smallish city municipal utilities department.
Prior art? by jandersen · 2015-12-02 21:39 · Score: 1

Surely the patent for the meter belongs to somebody in France, where the metric system originated? And any way, must have expired in the meantime, so there, idiots!
And what is that about smart meters? Apart from the fact that no red-blooded American uses meters, except when threatened with a dirty, Communist Kalashnikov, what is so smart about meters? Do they change size according your needs?
Again I have to ask by Opportunist · 2015-12-02 22:06 · Score: 1

It is still illegal to simply shoot patent trolls? By now I'd have thought it has become akin to pest control.

--
We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
Suing the wrong party by DoofusOfDeath · 2015-12-02 22:35 · Score: 1

The real lawsuit should be against the USPTO for granting every patent application under the sun, figuring the courts will sort it out.
Patent trolls by charrois · 2015-12-02 23:49 · Score: 1

The patent system in the US is so horribly broken. The original idea of patenting is to protect ideas that provide a benefit but aren't immediately obvious to people in the industry. Yet somehow, patent trolls are managing to get away with vague patents or ideas that are obvious or even already in common use before the patent is granted. And they don't even have to provide a realization of their idea any more - it's enough now to just patent a vague idea, let someone else figure out how to actually do it, and then sue the pants off them. Patenting is supposed to provide an environment allowing inventors to thrive - instead, it's gone completely the opposite way, stifling original thinkers who actually come up with creative ideas and preventing them to bring those ideas to market in fear of just getting sued by a patent troll. But what's even more sad is that everyone seems to realize this but nobody's doing anything about it. How can change happen?
Lost in Florida? Not so much by Anonymous Coward · 2015-12-03 01:39 · Score: 0

...but it appears they have sued and lost a similar case in Florida.
Suit was brought in Florida and the court threw out the case in summary judgement based on a technicality raised by the defendants. Atlas appealed and the court of appeals overturned the ruling, awarded costs ot Atlas, and sent it back to the lower courts. To wit:

CONCLUSION
For the foregoing reasons, we vacate the summary judgment of non-infringement and remand.
Costs awarded to Atlas.
VACATED AND REMANDED
Ref: http://www.cafc.uscourts.gov/sites/default/files/opinions-orders/15-1190.Opinion.10-27-2015.1.PDF
There's gotta be a better way by sirwired · 2015-12-03 01:46 · Score: 2

There should be a way to structure the patent laws so you can't sue somebody who bought a patented invention from somebody else. The idea that an end-user is fully liable for the development practices of an upstream company is ridiculous.
I realize such laws would be tricky to craft (an unscrupulous vendor could "buy" IP they don't own from a shell company or patsy), but the current way of doing things is resulting in far too many patent trolls pursuing mid-sized organizations that have enough money to make the suit worth it, but not so much they can actually afford patent litigation.
Maybe craft a law that if you want to go after end-users (instead of the organization carrying out the infringement), your maximum recovery will be a RAND licensing cost, and it better have some relation to how much you paid to develop/acquire the patented invention to begin with.
They have some pretty strict limits by sirwired · 2015-12-03 01:53 · Score: 1

The patent office has some pretty strict limits as to when they can actually reject a patent. As in, there are specific laws they must follow for something to qualify as "prior art" for a patent rejection, and only specific places the law authorizes them to go. As in, with the silly "Point a Laser Pointer at a Cat" patent... any idiot knows there are approx. 1B videos on YouTube about this. But internet videos aren't on the list. Nor are websites in general, unless said websites have an actual printed publication behind them.
Certainly Internet-based prior art can be used as an effective DEFENSE to a patent lawsuit, and can lead to the patent being revoked, but they cannot be used by the patent examiners in the initial evaluation.
Wrong person to sue by Anonymous Coward · 2015-12-03 03:43 · Score: 0

Who built the "Smart Meters"? Did the city do the R&D, build them and program them? I doubt it. They are just users.
If someone has a patent on the action of pistons, should you be sued for driving your car?
The Troll is just looking for someone who will settle rather than fight.
They should be fought and made to pay the legal bills and their lawyers made to pay triple damages.
1. Re:Wrong person to sue by Anonymous Coward · 2015-12-03 06:47 · Score: 0
  
  It doesn't matter who built them. Possession and/or use of an infringing device by anyone is an actionable offense.
  It says so right in TFA... but I guess you didn't bother reading it...
2. Re:Wrong person to sue by Locke2005 · 2015-12-03 07:03 · Score: 1
  
  Apparently you don't remember the SCO Group suing Linux customers... that's people that were using Linux, not people that implemented it! Unfortunately, the way the law SHOULD work and the way it actually DOES work are too completely different things.
  
  --
  I've abandoned my search for truth; now I'm just looking for some useful delusions.
Question by Locke2005 · 2015-12-03 07:00 · Score: 1

How did the patent meet the "non-obvious" requirement for a patent to be granted in the first place?

--
I've abandoned my search for truth; now I'm just looking for some useful delusions.
You're holding it wrong... by tlambert · 2015-12-03 15:02 · Score: 1

If it were possible, I would program my A/C to raise (or the furnace to lower) the thermostat by a degree or two when rates are high, and to lock out the washer and dryer and dishwasher until rates fall, and likewise lower the water heater temperature slightly. Maybe even program the lights to dim and the computers to go into power saving mode. What's so controversial about that?
You're holding it wrong...
Program your Tesla PowerWall(tm) to charge from the grid when the rates are low, and then feed the electricity back into the grid when rates are high.
Alternately, program it to charge from the grid when rates are low, and then operate your household off the grid when rates are low, and off the PowerWall(tm) instead of the grid when rates are high, until rates go back down.
In other words: game the power company the same way the power company wants to game you.