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Deep Learning Identifies Wet Road Hazards From Sound Input (thestack.com)

An anonymous reader writes: Researches have used recurrent neural network architecture to develop an audio-interpretation system that can understand how wet a road is, using techniques more commonly employed in speech recognition and music analysis. Every year 384,032 persons are injured and 4,789 persons killed through wet roads, and it's a problem that also threatens to hamper the usefulness of self-driving cars, which are likely to either become dangerous or prohibitively cautious in the absence of good information about the safety of road surfaces.

60 comments

  1. It's more people than that by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Every year 384,032 persons are injured and 4,789 persons killed through wet roads

    That's just the US. But hey, y'know, no-one else counts right?

    1. Re:It's more people than that by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2

      It's not the wet roads that kill/injure people - it's inappropriate driving.

    2. Re:It's more people than that by bickerdyke · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Don't know for sure, but elsewhere people would probably just notice that the road is wet after a rainfall and drive accordingly?

      How many of those 384,032 people sued because no one put up a yellow "Caution! Wet Floor" sign?

      --
      bickerdyke
    3. Re:It's more people than that by Z00L00K · · Score: 3

      Wet roads comes in many variants, from the simple thin layer that only lowers the friction a little to deep trenches and pools that catches the cars and throws them offtrack and then to the black ice with a wet surface that looks just like an ordinary wet road but has almost no friction at all and causes really dangerous situations because the road can transit from being just wet to being black ice in an instant.

      --
      If builders built buildings the way programmers wrote programs, then the first woodpecker would destroy civilization.
    4. Re:It's more people than that by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      it's not wet roads that kill people. it's the sudden stop at the end.

    5. Re:It's more people than that by JaredOfEuropa · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Not just that: a wet road after a mild shower doesn't have to be a problem in spring or fall, but the exact same shower in summer after a long dry spell can turn the road into a slippery slide, when the rubber and other crap that's been accumulating on the surface gets wet.

      --
      If construction was anything like programming, an incorrectly fitted lock would bring down the entire building...
    6. Re:It's more people than that by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Wet roads comes in many variants, from the simple thin layer that only lowers the friction a little to deep trenches and pools that catches the cars and throws them offtrack and then to the black ice with a wet surface that looks just like an ordinary wet road but has almost no friction at all and causes really dangerous situations because the road can transit from being just wet to being black ice in an instant.

      Yes indeed. Another variety is the first brief rain after a dry spell. Accumulated dirt and oil will mix with water to make a very low-traction surface until washed off by heavier rain. It's decidedly not a wet road / dry road binary. You can learn to read a wet road surface - e.g., wet asphalt that shines is very slick.

      Snow/ice also has extreme variation. Cold (as opposed to just below freezing), dry, hard-packed snow can provide amazingly high traction - you can drive semi-normally. Wet ice (rain falling on a frozen road surface) has a Cf of effectively 0.

      And then there are the idiots who lock the brakes when the car starts to slide...

    7. Re:It's more people than that by RandomFactor · · Score: 1

      Significant road penetration by humans is quite rare.

      --
      --- Mercutio was right.
    8. Re:It's more people than that by tinkerton · · Score: 5, Interesting

      Concrete an rough tarmac can be very predictable. Dirt, water, it just always grips. Smooth tarmac can easily get slippery even when dry.

      The thing is drivers are more and more reduced to slow video game drivers. They just point the steering wheel. The net result is less accidents but the decrease in skill is dramatic. So is the decrease in attention i think. So the improvement in safety is partially cancelled because 'all other things being equal' does not apply.

    9. Re:It's more people than that by avandesande · · Score: 3, Interesting

      It is from the oil on the road that floats when it rains after a long dry spell. It isn't nearly as big a problem as it used to be, I think in general new cars tend to be less leaky. You would be amazed at the amount of research that has gone into gaskets.

      --
      love is just extroverted narcissism
    10. Re:It's more people than that by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Hear, hear. This is yet another example of 'nobody is to blame' for 'accidents', when the vast majority are caused by arrogant, selfish, aggressive drivers...

    11. Re:It's more people than that by Culture20 · · Score: 1

      A wet road in the fall is more dangerous than a road with spots of snow in winter. The leaves turn very slippery, close to ice. And no salt will melt them.

    12. Re:It's more people than that by Mirar · · Score: 1

      People just get so angry when bad driving is identified by sound.

    13. Re:It's more people than that by mikael · · Score: 1

      Yes, they speed up to get off the wet patch of road.

      --
      Vintage computer adverts: http://www.vintageadbrowser.com/computers-and-software-ads
    14. Re:It's more people than that by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      >And then there are the idiots who lock the brakes when the car starts to slide...

      Assuming nothing is in front to hit (or there are no avenues of avoidance) and you're on snow, this is actually the correct course of action.

      I only mention this because you mentioned dry, hard-packed snow.

    15. Re:It's more people than that by bickerdyke · · Score: 1

      +5 Intresting? Come on..... at least I'm admittint to be trolling. I'll gratefully accept the +1 funnies though.

      --
      bickerdyke
    16. Re:It's more people than that by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Everyone else has decent public transportation.

  2. looking up fairytail ending on alphabet.com by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    some moaning & further overmedicating is anticipated?

  3. Killled by wet roads? by fred911 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    " Every year 384,032 persons are injured and 4,789 persons killed through wet roads" should read:

      Every year 384,032 persons are injured and 4,789 persons killed through wet roads and their inability to grasp the concepts of friction and velocity.

      Or: ...are killed because of their piss poor driving skills.

    --
    09 F9 11 02 9D 74 E3 5B - D8 41 56 C5 63 56 88 C0 45 5F E1 04 22 CA 29 C4 93 3F 95 05 2B 79 2A B2
    1. Re:Killled by wet roads? by chthon · · Score: 1

      My experience with other drivers is that they choose a certain way of driving under normal circumstances, and then do this also when it is wet, raining, pouring or foggy.

    2. Re:Killled by wet roads? by RogueyWon · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Indeed. About five years ago, my then-next-door neighbours' son was seriously hurt (and left with long-term life-changing injuries) in a crash a few months after passing his driving test. He wasn't breaking the speed-limit at the time - he was bang on 40mph on a road with a 40mph limit - but he had tried taking a bend that he should have been slowing for even in good road conditions without slowing - just after a short, sharp rain-shower when the road was extremely slippery. Result - he went off the road and into a tree at 40mph.

      I think part of the issue is that a lot of the advances in car technology that have made motoring safer and easier under most conditions have also served to insulate drivers from the reality of what they are doing; controlling a powerful, heavy metal object whose connection to the road comes through four small strips of rubber.

      Here in the UK, you can legally learn to drive from age 17. Learning and passing a test generally requires several months (we have arguably the toughest driving test in the world, which is unsurprising as we also have more cars per mile of road than any other country on Earth). One trick I've recommended to parents a number of times over the years is that they might want to consider, as a "treat" for their newly-driving offspring, one of those "rally days" you can pay for, which includes a few hours instruction in loose-gravel driving, plus the opportunity to try it out for several hours.

      Based on both personal and observed experience, there is absolutely nothing as effective as throwing a car with no power steering, no traction control and no ABS around a loose gravel surface at teaching the driver just how scary some of the forces he or she is playing with can be. Doing 40mph on tarmac in a modern road car feels positively sedate under most circumstances. Doing 40mpgh in a rattling bare-bones car on a surface which provides very little grip feels very different. An intelligent 17 year old should be able to carry that knowledge across into driving on wet tarmac.

      And no, video games, no matter how realistic, are not a substitute. You need to feel the weight of the car and the power of the engine through the steering column, or the lesson just doesn't work.

    3. Re:Killled by wet roads? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Every year 384,032 persons are injured and 4,789 persons killed through wet roads and their inability to grasp.

      Why not stop there :)

    4. Re:Killled by wet roads? by quintessencesluglord · · Score: 0

      Eh, everyone is a perfectly competent driver until right before a crash. To demand not only perfect identification of road conditions (you've never been taken by surprised by a patch of black ice?), but near perfect responses to vehicle dynamics isn't realistic regardless of exemplary or poor driving skills. Even race car drivers still crash.

      Adding to the information a driver has beyond autonomous cars can only be a good thing.

      http://icyroadsafety.com/

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?...

      One of the things that struck me in the vid is the relative speed of the cars that crash to the cars that proceed safely isn't that much. Way too easy to misjudge.

    5. Re:Killled by wet roads? by Viol8 · · Score: 5, Insightful

      "Even race car drivers still crash."

      Race car drivers are paid to take their vehicles to the limit of control. Normal drivers are told not to on many occasions but a lot just don't listen.

    6. Re:Killled by wet roads? by cdrudge · · Score: 1

      we also have more cars per mile of road than any other country on Earth

      or not

    7. Re:Killled by wet roads? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      obvious problem with your analysis - pretty sure not 100% of those people were the ones that made the mistake.

    8. Re:Killled by wet roads? by RogueyWon · · Score: 1

      Unless I'm reading something wrong, that does indeed show the UK top of the list (with Germany a narrow second)?

    9. Re:Killled by wet roads? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If he was driving 40mph on a curve posted as 40mph in the rain he was exceeding the recommended speed. The posted speed is for dry roads. I came upon a vehicle being towed from a road ditch on a curve with snow on the road. The driver of the car informed me that she was not speeding, she was driving at the speed posted on the sign. She honestly didn't know that that speed is for dry roads. People drive unsafely on dry roads on a daily basis. These bad habits are engrained, then when the road conditions deteriorate these same bad habits cause vehicles to go in directions the drivers don't want. These same poorly trained drivers then typically fail to be able to regain control of their vehicles resulting in accidents ranging from fender benders to those that threaten life. Perhaps schools should have driving simulators that allow students to safely learn how to drive on roads that are less than perfect as well as to properly regain control of their cars should they encounter a situation which leads to a temporary loss of control. (Ice patch, snow/slush on road, hydroplaning, etc.)

    10. Re:Killled by wet roads? by wildstoo · · Score: 1

      Scroll down the page. UK is #20.

    11. Re:Killled by wet roads? by fullmetal55 · · Score: 1

      "Or or killed by OTHERS' piss poor driving skills" the best driver in the world can get t-boned at an intersection by someone who is driving like an idiot..

    12. Re:Killled by wet roads? by mikael · · Score: 1

      An ice covered country road with a camber is the worst - couldn't go faster than 5mph before the car starts slipping towards the drainage ditch.

      --
      Vintage computer adverts: http://www.vintageadbrowser.com/computers-and-software-ads
    13. Re:Killled by wet roads? by cant_get_a_good_nick · · Score: 1

      Race car drivers are paid to take their vehicles to the limit of control.

      there was a CART race at Texas Motor Speedway where they got so fast, over 235MPH, the G forces were so strong, a couple of the drivers blacked out. Not passed out, but they didn't remember driving. Scary stuff. CART eventually thought best of it and cancel the race.

      Sadly, a lot of people were pissed at the drivers, and that anger, anger at erring for drivers' safety, ended up killing CART to where they merged back with the Indy Racing Leage (IRL).

    14. Re:Killled by wet roads? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      most of those countries have more cars per kilometer of road

    15. Re:Killled by wet roads? by cdrudge · · Score: 1

      And your point is?

    16. Re:Killled by wet roads? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Indeed. About five years ago, my then-next-door neighbours' son was seriously hurt (and left with long-term life-changing injuries) in a crash a few months after passing his driving test. He wasn't breaking the speed-limit at the time - he was bang on 40mph on a road with a 40mph limit - but he had tried taking a bend that he should have been slowing for even in good road conditions without slowing - just after a short, sharp rain-shower when the road was extremely slippery. Result - he went off the road and into a tree at 40mph.

      I think part of the issue is that a lot of the advances in car technology that have made motoring safer and easier under most conditions have also served to insulate drivers from the reality of what they are doing; controlling a powerful, heavy metal object whose connection to the road comes through four small strips of rubber.

      Here in the UK, you can legally learn to drive from age 17. Learning and passing a test generally requires several months (we have arguably the toughest driving test in the world, which is unsurprising as we also have more cars per mile of road than any other country on Earth). One trick I've recommended to parents a number of times over the years is that they might want to consider, as a "treat" for their newly-driving offspring, one of those "rally days" you can pay for, which includes a few hours instruction in loose-gravel driving, plus the opportunity to try it out for several hours.

      Based on both personal and observed experience, there is absolutely nothing as effective as throwing a car with no power steering, no traction control and no ABS around a loose gravel surface at teaching the driver just how scary some of the forces he or she is playing with can be. Doing 40mph on tarmac in a modern road car feels positively sedate under most circumstances. Doing 40mpgh in a rattling bare-bones car on a surface which provides very little grip feels very different. An intelligent 17 year old should be able to carry that knowledge across into driving on wet tarmac.

      And no, video games, no matter how realistic, are not a substitute. You need to feel the weight of the car and the power of the engine through the steering column, or the lesson just doesn't work.

      Or just drive an old car?

      Bad suspension, spongy brakes. You'll feel scared going 40mph. You'll feel every bump on the road and you'll be scared of speed (and lights and cars in front of you). Throw in some old tires and you'll feel the tires back tires slipping and slides on every turn.

      This just seems like rich kids problem that get new cars when they finish learning to drive. For the ones whose first car was a shitty used car, we don't need to go to a fancy "rally days".

  4. Spying by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Is this just another excuse to install mics in every car? We already have backup and other cameras. Welcome to the surveillance society.

  5. Why Deep Learning? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    So how much worse would a manually seeded pattern correlation filter have worked for this? When you drive through water, the sound produced is quite distinctive and seems reasonably clearly correlated with the amount of water being displaced by the thread. I haven't looked at this signal in matlab, but is it really such a complex one that it is a prime candidate for deep learning algorithms?

    I guess I just think it is easy to say 'deep learning' and then everyone thinks AI is just around the corner, when the reality is that many deep learning implementations are barely as good as tuned filters right now. Of course this is how you need to start the research, and if this has really been produced by a generic algorithm that was not tuned then that is cool, but these sorts of stories don't inspire me that transformational AI is close at all.

  6. On a related note... by jcr · · Score: 1

    Many years ago, I remember hearing about a project to identify mechanical problems by audio recognition. The idea was that a computer could listen to an engine and tell whether a cylinder was misfiring, for example. I wonder whatever came of that?

    -jcr

    --
    The only title of honor that a tyrant can grant is "Enemy of the State."
    1. Re:On a related note... by drinkypoo · · Score: 2

      Many years ago, I remember hearing about a project to identify mechanical problems by audio recognition. The idea was that a computer could listen to an engine and tell whether a cylinder was misfiring, for example. I wonder whatever came of that?

      I can't speak to what you were talking about, but every modern car has piezo microphones bolted to the block used to listen for misfires, called knock sensors. When you combine their output with that of the crank and cam position sensors, you can determine which cylinder is misfiring.

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    2. Re:On a related note... by Lab+Rat+Jason · · Score: 1

      That's the principle that a knock sensor operates on... so I'd say in some regard it's definitely a technology in use. Don't know if that's what you were referring to but all cars have had knock sensors for the past 20 years or more.

      --
      Which has more power: the hammer, or the anvil?
    3. Re:On a related note... by jcr · · Score: 1

      That sounds like it, but I recall it was also supposed to listen for things like bearings going bad, loose belts, etc.

      -jcr

      --
      The only title of honor that a tyrant can grant is "Enemy of the State."
  7. So it learned to pick up high frequency noise by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I fail to see how this is news. Wet roads produce a lot of high frequency 'noise' rather than dry roads that have little to no noise (unless maybe on certain types of gravel)

    This sounds like the net simply managed to distinguish HF noise from LF noise.

  8. An easier solution by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Just ban driving on wet roads. Problem solved, because bans, prohibition, and regulations work.

  9. Every year? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    "Every year 384,032 persons are injured and 4,789 persons killed through wet roads..."

    No, these numbers are ten-year averages. It's highly unlikely that precisely the same number of people are injured and killed, every year.

    1. Re:Every year? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Nope, those are quotas. The Department of Transportation is responsible for sending people out to make sure the quotas are met each year.

      The ones that are killed are just statistics, but the ones who are injured get pissed off when you tell them you were just doing your job, watering the roads to cause injuries. That creates a lot of economic activity for doctors, lawyers, people posting crazy stuff on slashdot, etc.

  10. Double and triple counting by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    If an accident happens, the accident is attributed to a SET of causes and then statistics claim each on of those clauses separately as causal.

    So you have a crash, and it was unavoidable (e.g. random mechanical failure). Suppose you were speeding at the time, had a beer in you, maybe the radio was playing. Then that crash won't only be flagged as caused by the mechanical failure, it will be added to the {speeding} set, the {even low alcohol causes accidents} set, and the {radio is distracting too} set.

    So "wet roads" is unlikely to be "wet roads" but rather "generally driving faster than the viable road speed", or "badly drained piece of road that causes aqua-planing".

    There's no attempt to identify the primary cause, because double and triple counting is a useful lobbying tool.

  11. deep learning by carnivore302 · · Score: 1

    This deep learning stuff is going to be huge one day

    --
    Please login to access my lawn
  12. Speed Limit by avandesande · · Score: 0

    Unless there is extremely deep pools of water following the speed limit has enough built in safety factor to operate safely when it is wet.

    --
    love is just extroverted narcissism
    1. Re:Speed Limit by drinkypoo · · Score: 1

      Unless there is extremely deep pools of water following the speed limit has enough built in safety factor to operate safely when it is wet.

      In the really real world, there are often turns for which you have to decelerate from the speed limit in the best of conditions. How much you have to decelerate depends on the current road conditions. Maybe someday when your parents let you drive, you'll get this.

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
  13. Yet another reason to ban by MobyDisk · · Score: 2

    Every year 384,032 persons are injured and 4,789 persons killed through wet roads,

    Yet another reason to ban dihydrogen monoxide!

  14. How wet? by nospam007 · · Score: 1

    Here's some answers the artificial intelligence came up with:

    How Wet Is It? ....it's so wet, the term "Ark-Industrial-Complex" has just been added to the Oxford Dictionary. ....it's so wet, the moisturizer jar gets more full with each use. ....it's so wet, my ride-on mower is now a float-on. ....it's so wet, it *must* be a liberal conspiracy to undermine the credibility of climate change deniers. ....it's so wet, I saw a fish in a lifeboat. ....it's so wet, my in-laws are vacationing in England for three weeks to dry out. ....it's so wet, I can let my goldfish play out in the yard. ....it's so wet, I saw a duck in a rain slicker. ....it's so wet, the water bugs in my basement are building an ark. ....it's so wet, I'm swimming laps in the hallway. ....it's so wet, I saw a squirrel wrapping his nuts in Saran Wrap. ....it's so wet, my umbrella needs a raincoat.

  15. Because... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Blind drivers need to know how wet the road really is.

  16. ....wet? by Mirar · · Score: 1

    I wonder, what kind of roads and tyres are involved here?

    I can't remember having a problem with wet roads while driving in a way that wouldn't be seriously uncomfortable - unless there's a few inches of water on the road or I'm driving crazy cars (like that 700hp Cadillac test car with slicks that didn't want to move with or without traction control). Am I just getting way too good tyres?

    Unless the "wet" is frozen. But that's a completely different game.

    But if anyone builds me a car that warns me of black ice in advance, I'd like it.

    1. Re:....wet? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You've never hit a patch of road where there is a slight depression that is filled with water? I've had this happen to me on highways where the road is heavily worn from truck traffic and there is a bit of a rut in the outer part of the curve. Only the one side of the car hits it and those tires hydroplane a slight bit. If you don't try any sudden maneuvers, you'll usually just pass right through it, but a lot of people tend to flip out a bit when they feel a car hydroplaning. Substandard highways are good for this sort of thing, as are rural roads. Especially during a serious rainstorm where an inch of rain per hour or more is coming down.

      Traction control systems do help a lot with the hydroplaning situation, but sometimes, you just don't see it coming.

       

  17. Drive to the conditions by juniorkindergarten · · Score: 1

    It's really simple. Police say it until they're blue in the face. Drive to the conditions and slow down. Just because you have all wheel drive, traction control, anti lock breaks, auto breaking, etc. doesn't give you license to drive 20% over the speed limit when everyone is going 50% under because the roads suck. Of course there will be the kidiot whining that he rolled his new suv and the highway department didn't do its job. Wah.

    --
    "Every security scheme that is based on secrets eventually fails." - Steve Jobs
  18. Editorial by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Every year 384,032 persons are injured and 4,789 persons killed through [strike]wet roads[/strike] idiocy.

    FTFY.

  19. How does that compare to regualr driiving? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    With all the accidents that occur, how much more likely is accidents during wet conditions? Seems to me at least a few of those accidents would still occur if the roads were dry. Though this research does have implications for self-driving like described int he article.