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"Happy Birthday To You" Set To Finally Reach the Public Domain

schnell writes: The New York Times reports that "the world's most popular song" is at last poised to be released into the public domain. From the story: "In September, a federal judge ruled that Warner Music, the song's publisher, did not have a valid copyright claim to 'Happy Birthday,' which has been estimated to collect $2 million a year in royalties. But what that ruling meant for the future of the song — and Warner's liability — was unclear, and a trial had been set to begin next week. In a filing on Tuesday in United States District Court in Los Angeles, the parties in the case said they had agreed to a settlement to end the case. The terms of that deal are confidential. But if the settlement is approved by the court, the song is expected to formally enter the public domain." (We mentioned the case in September, too.)

120 comments

  1. Read: "Warner avoids massive class-action lawsuit" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    They made hundreds of millions of dollars off of a single fraudulent copyright claim and will experience no repercussions. These are the people RIAA is fighting for.

  2. Needs more "Appy Appday to App"! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0, Funny

    "Happy Birthday" is for LUDDITES. Modern app appers sing "Appy Appday to App!"

    Apps!

    1. Re:Needs more "Appy Appday to App"! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "Happy Birthday" is for LUDDITES. Modern app appers sing "Appy Appday to App!"

      Apps!

      I laughed.

    2. Re:Needs more "Appy Appday to App"! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      You insensitive clod!!! Cows have birthdays too!

    3. Re:Needs more "Appy Appday to App"! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Seriously right? What sort of low-life loser posts this stupid "cow" crap on every post every day?

      Nothing better going on in their life?

    4. Re:Needs more "Appy Appday to App"! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      For a while I thought the "COWS SAY MOO" guy had to be a bot, because he almost always managed to get first post. The fact that this idiot - or perhaps an imitator, it really doesn't matter - is still at it is pretty fucking sad.

    5. Re:Needs more "Appy Appday to App"! by ruir · · Score: 1

      Why could not it be a bot?

    6. Re:Needs more "Appy Appday to App"! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "Happy Birthday" is for LUDDITES. Modern app appers sing "Appy Appday to App!"

      Apps!

      I laughed.

      Me too. I hate it when that happens.

      All the formula trolls on Slashdot should get together and write a book, and call it Score:0, Funny: The Slashdot Story.

    7. Re:Needs more "Appy Appday to App"! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Apparently sexconker does.

    8. Re:Needs more "Appy Appday to App"! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      it could be worse, it could be APK spamming stuff about hosts files

  3. Happy Birthday to You, Happy Birthday to You by SmaryJerry · · Score: 1

    Happy birth... sorry I'll cease and desist my rendition of your song in text form... Pleasant Day of Birth to you, Pleasant Day of Birth to you..

  4. Chemo by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    That Happy Birthday of all things could have stayed so long locked under copyright is the prime example of why Copyright is such a horrible cancer for society.

    This is not about anything but making more profit for big labels.

    1. Re:Chemo by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Don't musicians get paid by the gig? What does a corporation's exclusive right to sell recordings of their work have to do with it?

    2. Re:Chemo by jc42 · · Score: 5, Interesting

      Yes! Down with copyright! Musicians and writers should never be paid!

      Most of them never have been paid. Copyright as interpreted by the courts in the US and many other countries is basically a tool for the publishing and recording industries to insist that the creators sign the copyright over to them, otherwise their newly-created works will never be seen or heard by the public. Once an artist signs the "standard" contracts, they have no further rights over their creative works, and only get paid the minimum that their corporate masters decide will keep them producing.

      Of course, the internet has made some inroads on that. I know a number of musicians who are making more from their personal web site than they'd ever get from a recording-industry contract. But the legalities surrounding this are a bit tricky, and lots of artists get tricked into signing away the rights to their output anyway.

      (I've had fun pointing out the statement in many ISP and other "hosting" companies contracts saying that anything copied to their machines become the property of the company. ISPs routinely ban and block web servers on customers' sites, and generously offer to host the web site on the company's machine. Then, when a musician or writer produces a best seller, the ISP can step in and claim the income for themselves, since the artist agreed to the contract that transfers the copyright to the ISP. The ISPs can make it rather tricky to avoid this gotcha.)

      --
      Those who do study history are doomed to stand helplessly by while everyone else repeats it.
    3. Re:Chemo by ArmoredDragon · · Score: 2

      Property doesn't grant copyright (i.e. the right to make copies.) Just as if you buy a copy of a CD, that copy becomes your property, but it doesn't entitle you the right to make copies and distribute (with the exception of fair use purposes.) It would need language like "you agree to transfer all copyrights to anything you upload", and good luck with that if their customers didn't own those rights to begin with (which in many cases they don't, i.e. Apple doesn't own the copyrights to its iTunes songs that it uploads to Microsoft's Azure cloud. And yes, iTunes IS hosted on Microsoft's Azure.)

    4. Re:Chemo by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      People get paid for a good or service. They should get paid, their efforts performed some kind of service.

      But not for an imaginary good. Not for a mental construct. Playing pretend and calling dibs is for children.

    5. Re:Chemo by easyTree · · Score: 1

      Yes! Down with copyright! Musicians and writers should never be paid!

      Agreed; get real jobs.

      *sigh* Another wrong righted. *Skips away*

    6. Re:Chemo by Trailer+Trash · · Score: 1

      You're confused. Labels typically own the master recordings (because they pay for them - that's part of what a label does), but the copyright on the composition remains the property of the writer(s). They might use a publisher in order to publish the composition, but that doesn't negate or diminish their copyright.

      Label deals are usually terrible and one-sided, but they also give the artist exposure that's difficult to come by (and impossible to come by pre-internet) otherwise. The artists are left to make their money with live shows which can be very lucrative. Weird Al Yankovich has an excellent write up from a few years ago on this topic, look it up.

    7. Re:Chemo by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I disagree on the latter part. Copyright is fine and a net positive for society ... IF the duration for copyright was sensible, which the current scheme isn't. It needs to be shortened.

    8. Re:Chemo by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I would've though AWS

    9. Re:Chemo by david_thornley · · Score: 1

      I'm not a lawyer (check with one if you don't want to get legal advice on important matters from random pseudonymous geeks on the internet), but I don't think a contract to transfer copyright, as opposed to a contract that does transfer copyright, is valid. Alternately, you could argue that the contract is a contract of adhesion (a contract that you don't have a chance to negotiate, but have to agree to in order to get something), and that automatically transferring the copyright is more than a contract of adhesion can do.

      --
      "When you have eliminated the unacceptable, whatever is left, however improbable, must be the truthiness" - Holmes
    10. Re:Chemo by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Distrubutors must die.

      We pay for distribution (bandwidth)... so why do they live?

  5. Happy Birthday Repost From September... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Happy Birthday to you.

  6. No ! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    So we will have to hear it even more often ?

    Warner's extortion plan had some positive aspects indeed.

  7. thank god for that. by nimbius · · Score: 5, Funny

    For years we've waited with bated breath for such a revelation. Now that happy birthday is truly free, armies of Applebees servers, waitresses, and line cooks can rejoice as through their dead posture and vacant saccharine manufactured glee theyre paraded out in front of yet one more table of midwestern suburbanites to sing the true call of happy birthday to a fourty-something housewife checking her phone.

    --
    Good people go to bed earlier.
  8. Precedent by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0, Flamebait

    Better just walk away and let it go then have the court establish a precedent of how to "force" works into Public Domain.

  9. What I like best is by rsilvergun · · Score: 4, Interesting

    that the copyright on a song whose melody was composed in 1893 and lyrics in the 30s is _still_ being contested. IIRC nothing has lapsed into the public domain since 2010, and that's not likely to change. Anyone remember when the Mouse is up for another extension?

    --
    Hi! I make Firefox Plug-ins. Check 'em out @ https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/youtube-mp3-podcaster/
    1. Re:What I like best is by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Mickey Mouse will *never* be in public domain. Not ever. Disney trademarked the mouse and trademarks do not expire. Now bow down to your corporate overlords and take it like the dirty little pleb that you are.

    2. Re:What I like best is by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Probably never

      Then again, thanks to the internet, maybe locked out content will be treated as damage and routed around. I mean as much as love movies I feel like that industry is fading. It'll still kick around, like theatre, but it won't be the same.

      In a perfect world big stupid companies like Disney fight and spend stupid amounts of money to keep the rights to all this garbage just in time for nobody to give a shit anymore

    3. Re:What I like best is by Gr8Apes · · Score: 1

      Incorrect. When the copyright expires on the works that Mickey Mouse is in, those can be freely copied once those enter the public domain. Now, the interesting question would be, as a trademark, can Mickey Mouse be used under fair use? Obviously you cannot create a full blown Mickey Mouse cartoon, but what would be permissible?

      I know, I know, I'm dreaming that Disney won't buy 1000 year copyright extensions every time that comes close to occurring.

      IANA[PTC]L

      --
      The cesspool just got a check and balance.
    4. Re:What I like best is by ClickOnThis · · Score: 1

      that the copyright on a song whose melody was composed in 1893 and lyrics in the 30s is _still_ being contested. IIRC nothing has lapsed into the public domain since 2010, and that's not likely to change. Anyone remember when the Mouse is up for another extension?

      If Mickey Mouse were to sing Happy Birthday, the clash of copyright forces would annihilate the known universe.

      Wait, never mind. It happened already, with no catastrophic effects.

      --
      If it weren't for deadlines, nothing would be late.
    5. Re:What I like best is by phantomfive · · Score: 3, Informative

      Now, the interesting question would be, as a trademark, can Mickey Mouse be used under fair use?

      I would think it'd depend on the precise way the cartoon is used. I would expect that if you posted the early MM movies on your website, under a disclaimer saying that these were produced by Disney and are now out of copyright, that you would be ok. However, if you posted them in a way that made users think your website was Disney approved, then you would be in trouble.

      This site is really good IMHO, (and also check out the section on fair use of trademarks):

      if the mark is being used by another party in such a manner that potential consumers are likely to believe that such use is endorsed by or is otherwise associated with the mark’s owner, then the mark’s owner may have rights to prevent such use and to seek damages and other remedies for the same.

      That page makes clear that trademark rights are not as strong as copyright rights, and they are harder to get. You don't get a trademark just by creating a character.

      --
      "First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
    6. Re:What I like best is by slashdice · · Score: 1

      Under EU law, unpublished works lose their copyright protection and become public domain after 50 years. 50 years ago... that was 1965. Lots of music still relevant today was being made (Beatles, Rolling Stones, etc). Some of those songs had a dozen or more alternate takes. Some record companies are now releasing them to prevent them from going into the public domain. Many record companies don't have their shit together and have allowed them to lapse.

      Many (pre-1964, soon pre-1965) Beatles recordings are now public domain, but locked up in a facility. I've started a kickstarter to finance a commando raid to liberate these public domain recordings. We've assembled an international team including a soviet heavy weapons guy, a french spy, an australian sniper, an alcoholic black scottish cyclops, a german medic, a texas engineer, a new england scout, a soldier, and a pyro. Once we have the funding, we intend to capture their intelligence.

      --
      Copyright (c) 1990 - 2014 Dice. All rights reserved. Use of this comment is subject to certain Terms and Conditions.
    7. Re:What I like best is by Purity+Of+Essence · · Score: 1

      You could make new Mickey Mouse cartoons as long as you base then solely on the public domain aspects and can convincingly argue that your updates aren't taken from still-copyrighted material. And you will have to argue because Disney will sue your ass even though you are in the right.

      See new "Sherlock Holmes" stories and the machinations of the estate of Arthur Conan Doyle for precedent.

      http://free-sherlock.com/

      --
      +0 Meh
    8. Re:What I like best is by sociocapitalist · · Score: 1

      that the copyright on a song whose melody was composed in 1893 and lyrics in the 30s is _still_ being contested. IIRC nothing has lapsed into the public domain since 2010, and that's not likely to change. Anyone remember when the Mouse is up for another extension?

      Times being what they are, Mein Kampf is becoming public domain and will be published again:
      http://www.telegraph.co.uk/new...

      --
      blindly antisocialist = antisocial
    9. Re:What I like best is by Hognoxious · · Score: 1

      Do you reckon they'll make a movie of it?

      --
      Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
    10. Re:What I like best is by Gr8Apes · · Score: 1

      The way I understand the law to work in the US, that case would make such a task by Disney even more difficult since precedent has been set and the bar raised.

      --
      The cesspool just got a check and balance.
  10. expected to formally enter the public domain ? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Then why are the terms of the deal confidential ? If this results in the song entering the public domain, it is essentially a complete loss for Warner Music. It is hard to imagine that Warner would see the need for a confidential deal in that case.

    1. Re: expected to formally enter the public domain ? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The deal probably includes legal fees and NDAs preventing them from making more documentaries etc. That part is fair game for confidentiality.

  11. "World's Most Popular"? by dohzer · · Score: 2

    Isn't the most popular song that "Watch me whip, now watch me neigh neigh!" song?!

    1. Re:"World's Most Popular"? by KGIII · · Score: 1

      I have gotta stop Googlin' shit I find on Slashdot. You'd think I'd know better by now. How the hell do you even know that? I don't know which one of us should be more ashamed of ourselves. :/

      --
      "So long and thanks for all the fish."
    2. Re:"World's Most Popular"? by Zero__Kelvin · · Score: 1

      Sadly, Silento does not live up to (their?) name :-(

      --
      Guns don't kill people; Physics kills people! - John Lithgow as Dick Solomon on Third Rock From The Sun
    3. Re:"World's Most Popular"? by UnknownSoldier · · Score: 1

      Not according to YouTube, "Silentà - Watch Me" is not even in the top 20.
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...

      1. "Gangnam Style" 2,465,911,892
      2. "Blank Space" 1,326,124,076
      3. "Baby" 1,249,211,311
      4. "See You Again" 1,216,871,611
      5. "Dark Horse" 1,196,348,746
      6. "Uptown Funk"1,194,402,414
      7. "Shake It Off" 1,192,095,624
      8. "Bailando" 1,179,675,147
      9. "Roar" 1,165,459,427
      10. "All About That Bass" 1,141,592,739
      11. "Counting Stars" 1,057,017,413
      12. "Wheels On The Bus" 1,042,697,466
      13. "Chandelier" 1,014,540,273
      14. "Party Rock Anthem" 984,918,786
      15. "Love the Way You Lie" 976,470,589
      16. "Masha and The Bear (Episode 17)" 974,697,923
      17. "Waka Waka (This Time for Africa) 961,321,628
      18. "Sugar" 904,907,448
      19. "Gentleman" 899,929,582
      20. "On the Floor" 880,178,349

    4. Re:"World's Most Popular"? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      ... Watch me whip, now watch me nae-nae ...

      I can't decide if The funky gibbon or Cactus in my Y-fronts is better than this but one of them must be.

  12. Sigh. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    No, it will NOT enter the public domain. It will become an orphan work.

    1. Re: Sigh. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The main debate is over when the copyright was assigned. Evidence suggests that it's older than Warner claims, which means public domain.

  13. How much other material? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    How much other material is hiding behind the same kind of false copyright terms?

  14. Regardless of the courts or Warner Bros by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    The song has been in public domain for many decades now. Warner Bros has just falsely taken money from people. Perhaps they should be sued?

    Warner Bros is wrong as they are on so many of their other expired copyrights and the courts are just stupid. But when the rich pay for the laws to be written by political brides, this is what we get.

  15. Re:Read: "Warner avoids massive class-action lawsu by Areyoukiddingme · · Score: 4, Informative

    They made hundreds of millions of dollars off of a single fraudulent copyright claim and will experience no repercussions. These are the people RIAA is fighting for.

    These people fund the RIAA (along with the other major labels), so naturally the RIAA fights for them.

  16. I'll take my rights now by jdavidb · · Score: 5, Interesting

    In the meantime, I'll just keep practicing civil disobedience.

    1. Re:I'll take my rights now by kheldan · · Score: 2

      I dunno about 'secessionism' being a basic right of all sentient beings, but 'civil disobedience' sure as hell is, or should be; life (the continuance of, and quality of, that is) more important than government, or even laws; those two things are supposed to facilitate life, not the other way around. When they get transposed, then Bad Things are happening; the system is broken and must be 'fixed' -- thus 'civil disobedience'. As someone else once said, 'Soap box, ballot box, and ammo box -- use them in that order'. 'Secession' should the be last resort. If your system of government doesn't allow the first two, and you have to immediately go to the third and last option, then you've got a poorly designed system of government.

      --
      Are YOU using the TOOL, or is the TOOL using YOU? Think about it!
    2. Re:I'll take my rights now by jdavidb · · Score: 1

      Secession doesn't have to be the first thing you go to. My point is that it should be explicitly allowed. If it were explicitly allowed a lot of things would be different and you'd be much less likely to ever get to the point of needing it, and we'd have a lot less people contemplating it.

      From a certain point of view a person practicing civil disobedience may be said to have seceded, perhaps partially. In the late 1700s and early 1800s many or most of the statesmen in the U.S. believed in the right of states to nullify federal laws, which was a precursor before ever needing secession. If you check some of the writings and speeches of Thomas Woods talking about this, you'd be surprised who was doing it .

    3. Re:I'll take my rights now by moeinvt · · Score: 1

      Getting way off topic here, but...
      You forgot about "jury box" in your list, which is typically considered option #3, the theory being that juries can nullify unjust laws by refusing to convict people who break them. Of course government courts have long since prohibited defendants from making a case based on that argument however.
      By your definition, I guess most of the countries in the world throughout human history have/had poorly designed systems of government. Governments which respect freedom of speech, elections and due process (including a right to trial by jury) are the rare exceptions. Even in supposedly free places like the USA, these things are little more than an illusion and the government is hell bent on eradicating the "ammo box" option. Central government is a failed institution. Secession would open up all sorts of opportunities for improving quality of life.

    4. Re:I'll take my rights now by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Wow, I'm sorry I made the mistake of even commenting on this at all now, I really didn't want to get into a huge debate over this, sorry enough that I'm posting this as an AC so I don't have to see any more comments-on-comments. Enjoy arguing about this amongst yourselves, I'm out.

    5. Re:I'll take my rights now by david_thornley · · Score: 1

      Civil disobedience is the process of breaking unjust laws and accepting the punishments. It can be practiced in any circumstances where there is a government, although it may not be worth it. Simply disobeying the law, while trying to avoid punishment, can also be practiced wherever there are laws, and this can help push for changes in the law. It's options you always have, and if you consider that a "basic right" then that's fine with me.

      By its nature, civil disobedience is illegal. Consider the marijuana laws in my state. I could write my legislators or participate in a protest march or something legal. I could smoke it anyway and try not to be caught. I could get some friends together to light up in unison in front of a police station, and invite the press. (Actually, I don't like the stuff.)

      --
      "When you have eliminated the unacceptable, whatever is left, however improbable, must be the truthiness" - Holmes
  17. Re:Read: "Warner avoids massive class-action lawsu by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    They made hundreds of millions of dollars off of a single fraudulent copyright claim and will experience no repercussions. These are the people RIAA is fighting for.

    What exactly prevents any individual who paid the license fees to request a refund plus interest?

  18. New version by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    Happy birthday to you,
    Happy birthday to you,
    Unless you're Warner Music,
    In which case sod off.

  19. Re:Read: "Warner avoids massive class-action lawsu by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    That's kind of the point of the settlement. If you didn't already jump on board, I'm not sure if it isn't too late. :P

  20. ban copyright by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    wait, no. ban /. .

  21. Already in public domain by phantomfive · · Score: 1

    The only thing that happened here is that Warner Music has been forced to release their unlawful claim to the music. It already is in public domain.

    --
    "First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
  22. Re: Read: "Warner avoids massive class-action laws by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    They probably signed a license agreement that prevents them from doing so. Whether that contract would stand up in a court of law is undetermined.

  23. That's a BIG assumption by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I'd have thought the only reason Warner would have settled would have been because that avoided Happy Birthday going into the public domain.

  24. Mickey and Pooh leave prison in 2024 by tepples · · Score: 3, Interesting

    the copyright on a song [from] the 30s is _still_ being contested.

    U.S. copyright in works of authorship first published in 1923 through 1977 or later subsists for 95 years after the end of the year in which the work was first published. If a song's lyrics were first published in the 1930s, it would have fallen under this rule. A pre-1923 publication, on the other hand, would have put the lyrics in the public domain.

    Anyone remember when the Mouse is up

    The keystone of copyright in Mickey Mouse is three short films published in 1928: Plane Crazy, The Gallopin' Gaucho, and Steamboat Willie. Likewise, the keystone of copyright in Winnie the Pooh is the books Winnie-the-Pooh and The House at Pooh Corner, the latter having been first published in 1928. Under current law, copyright in these works expires at the end of 2023, meaning those characters become fair game starting in 2024. (And before you say "trademark", read through Dastar v. Fox.)

    for another extension?

    The Supreme Court has allowed re-extension of a copyright term that had already been extended, but only when the extension has had the intent of harmonizing the term to that of another major developed market. For example, the Court in Eldred v. Ashcroft allowed the 1998 extension to let the U.S. harmonize with the European Union but was careful to distinguish it from what copyright reform advocates have since called "perpetual copyright on the installment plan." With which major developed market would a subsequent term extension prior to the end of 2023 harmonize?

    1. Re:Mickey and Pooh leave prison in 2024 by sconeu · · Score: 1

      Does TPP extend copyright terms?

      --
      General Relativity: Space-time tells matter where to go; Matter tells space-time what shape to be.
    2. Re:Mickey and Pooh leave prison in 2024 by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Also keep in mind that some stuff even THEN still will not pop out. As some of it is still under the myriad of state rules.

      This chart puts it all together
      https://copyright.cornell.edu/...

      That is everything before 1972
      "Subject to state statutory and/or common law protection. Fully enters the public domain on 15 Feb. 2067"

      Stuff after 1989 will expire before then. 2049 to be exact. So it could be the song 'ice ice baby' will come out of copyright before the Jimi Hendrix.

    3. Re:Mickey and Pooh leave prison in 2024 by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Informative

      Outside of the US it "harmonizes" copyright to meet the new US duration. So for lots of the world it does extend copyright.

      All it takes is for one country to extend it some more, and then everyone else can ratchet theirs up in the name of consistency.

      3. Profit!

    4. Re:Mickey and Pooh leave prison in 2024 by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      > So it could be the song 'ice ice baby' will come out of copyright before the Jimi Hendrix.

      The lyrics maybe, but not the tune. "Under Pressure" by Queen & Bowie came out in 1981.

    5. Re:Mickey and Pooh leave prison in 2024 by gwolf · · Score: 2

      In fact... The US is getting its copyright terms extended by the TPP. Mexico has life-plus-100-years since 1995, and as a signer country of TPP, that will make our (stupid) terms become the norm for all of the other partners. Yay for harmonization :-P

    6. Re:Mickey and Pooh leave prison in 2024 by russotto · · Score: 1

      With which major developed market would a subsequent term extension prior to the end of 2023 harmonize?

      I believe they started with Mexico, life + 100. By the time 2023 rolls around they'll have gotten a few other countries to "harmonize" with Mexico

    7. Re:Mickey and Pooh leave prison in 2024 by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      ... everyone else can ratchet theirs up in the name of consistency.

      So if one country enforces a registration fee, do all countries have to charge it?

    8. Re:Mickey and Pooh leave prison in 2024 by sociocapitalist · · Score: 1

      "Under current law, copyright in these works expires at the end of 2023"

      The key word here being 'current', of course. No doubt before 2023 the law will have been changed.

      --
      blindly antisocialist = antisocial
    9. Re:Mickey and Pooh leave prison in 2024 by jabuzz · · Score: 1

      Out side the USA Winnie the Pooh is locked up for life plus some duration. That is 70 years in most places so 2027.

      Also while the USA has a ruling on the use of trademarks to lock up copyright for longer that does not apply to the rest of the world.

      Why is this relevant, because Happy Birthday has been out of copyright out side the USA for some considerable period of time. However if you wanted to make a movie that had someone singing it you need a license if you wanted to show it in the USA. In effect it was still in copyright.

    10. Re:Mickey and Pooh leave prison in 2024 by tepples · · Score: 1

      The US is getting its copyright terms extended by the TPP. Mexico has life-plus-100-years since 1995

      Where does the released TPP text say that the copyright term shall be extended past life plus 70? I thought it just said life plus 70 is a minimum. The EU's extension from life plus 50 to life plus 70 was ultimately to reconcile the original rationale for the Berne copyright term, which was the life of heirs who knew the author personally, with life spans that had been extended by better health care. Besides, the EU is far more economically powerful than Mexico. Thus any attempt at "harmonization" to Mexico would be a more obvious attempt at policy laundering and might even widen debate about the very concept of policy laundering.

    11. Re:Mickey and Pooh leave prison in 2024 by tepples · · Score: 1

      I wrote another comment about why harmonization to Mexico isn't as persuasive.

    12. Re:Mickey and Pooh leave prison in 2024 by gwolf · · Score: 1

      Would be great to harmonize for less rather than for more. But it has never been seen, and probably never will.

    13. Re:Mickey and Pooh leave prison in 2024 by gstoddart · · Score: 1

      but only when the extension has had the intent of harmonizing the term to that of another major developed market

      Which of course the US state department has been dutifully trying to do at the request of the copyright lobby so it can be extended domestically.

      You can bet your ass that people are working diligently to ensure that the needs of the copyright lobby are served, because US foreign policy has been so thoroughly polluted with serving corporate interests there's no other option.

      Uncle Sam is on the take, and now mostly represents the real constituents ... multinational corporations.

      I'm sure the TPP has been designed to further this goal.

      --
      Lost at C:>. Found at C.
    14. Re:Mickey and Pooh leave prison in 2024 by tepples · · Score: 1

      In which countries did case law on the interaction between trademarks and copyrights go the opposite way?

  25. Royalty refund by tepples · · Score: 1

    In addition to a declaration that copyright did not subsist in "Happy Birthday to You", the lawsuit sought a refund of royalties to the class of licensees. I imagine the confidentiality relates to Warner's payout under that claim.

  26. Dastar v. Fox by tepples · · Score: 3, Informative

    trademarks do not expire

    Trademarks die once they are no longer distinctive. Exclusive rights under the Lanham Act cannot be used to extend the effective term of an expired U.S. copyright. See Dastar v. Fox .

  27. Only one jurisdiction by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    So this may be the case for the USA, but what about other countries?

  28. Re:Read: "Warner avoids massive class-action lawsu by edjs · · Score: 1

    It looks like they settled before class-action status was granted. Or even asked for? If class-action status was granted, this would be dragging out for another year or more as they looked for people to join the action, put it before a judge, and negotiate a settlement.

    And the real harm was the chilling effect on using the song. Harder to measure that in monetary terms.

  29. Re:Read: "Warner avoids massive class-action lawsu by KGIII · · Score: 4, Interesting

    I actually find it hard to believe that this is true. I'm half-tempted to make a bet that, within a year, this will be back in court.

    Hmm... Anyone want to take the bet? I'll sing and upload the song if it's not back in court within a year from today if anyone wants to take the opposite bet where they sing and upload the song (and accept the consequences).

    --
    "So long and thanks for all the fish."
  30. Here's an interesting twist by phantomfive · · Score: 2

    In a twist to the case, the Association for Childhood Education International, a nonprofit group that was co-founded by Patty Hill [the sister of the composer of the song] and has collected a large portion of the song’s royalties, filed a motion last month arguing that if Warner did not control the copyright to “Happy Birthday,” then it did.

    --
    "First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
    1. Re:Here's an interesting twist by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Given that it was always in the public domain (when initially published, copyright was not automatic and in this case was not applied for), which is where Warner got it before they started claiming they owned it... I don't think Patty Hill will have much luck.

  31. Re:Read: "Warner avoids massive class-action lawsu by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I'll sing...

    NO! Please don't! I believe you!

  32. No dystopian future here by GoodNewsJimDotCom · · Score: 1

    I wondered after 20 year imprisonment for copyright infringement in the UK if people with birthday parties on facebook would get prison time.

  33. Really world's most popular song? by guantamanera · · Score: 1

    I need citation. I think it might be natives anglophone's most popular song, but not world's. I been around the world and most cultures have their own song song for birthdays totally different than the english happy birthday. The one song I have found in common amongst Christians has been holy night, which is a german song, I think

    1. Re:Really world's most popular song? by gwolf · · Score: 1

      In many Latin American countries, the same melody is sung "Feliz cumpleaños a tí / feliz cumpleaños a tí / feliz cumpleaños querido _____ / feliz cumpleaños a tí".
      In Israel (yes, I know, not too many people speak Hebrew; the country's population is ~0.1% of the world population) it's the same case.
      I would expect the same to hold in many other cultures.

    2. Re:Really world's most popular song? by Zontar+The+Mindless · · Score: 1

      Same in China, where it's "Zhu ni shengri kuaile / Zhu ni shengri kuaile / Shengri kuaile _____ / Zhu ni shengri kuaile".

      (Damn it, when is Slashdot going stop filtering out Hanzi?)

      --
      Il n'y a pas de Planet B.
    3. Re: Really world's most popular song? by pandafs2 · · Score: 1

      I dunno how that happened, but in Russia it sung very often, with russian lyrics.

    4. Re:Really world's most popular song? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      And in Estonia.

  34. Yet another IP category by gwolf · · Score: 1

    Beatles' songs are covered by copyright — Yes, the (mostly) Lennon/McCartney lyrics and music. But the audio recordings are covered by a completely different beast, the "related performance rights", which have their own rulebook.

  35. Re:Read: "Warner avoids massive class-action lawsu by FatdogHaiku · · Score: 1

    I agree it's a sneaky way to win a bet...
    When I break out in song the top request is "The refrain from singing"...

    --
    You have the right to remain sentient. If you give up the right to remain sentient, you will be elected to public office
  36. Re: Read: "Warner avoids massive class-action laws by davester666 · · Score: 1

    Why would it be invalid? License agreements for patents between corporations are generally like that [anything paid for a royalty/license fee is non refundable, even if patent is later found to be invalid]. Hell, just recently the precedent was set that patent holders can't force royalty payments for time periods after the patent has expired [patent runs out in 2 years, but holder says you pay royalties for 5 or 10 years or you have to wait].

    --
    Sleep your way to a whiter smile...date a dentist!
  37. The terms of that deal are confidential. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Let me guess: "If we can keep the royalties we've unlawfully forced people to pay, we won't fight this in court for another ten years."

    Confidential is confidential because they don't want the public to know.

  38. Re: Read: "Warner avoids massive class-action laws by sjames · · Score: 2

    The plaintiff would need to show that Warner knew or should have known that the copyright was expired. Then the contract might be thrown out by a judge for being fraudulent.

  39. Re: Read: "Warner avoids massive class-action laws by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The RIAA is truly the association of death. They are evil, they hate us and want us to die. They raped my teddy bear. They raped my teddy bear. Moo.

  40. Re:Read: "Warner avoids massive class-action lawsu by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    2 million per year for more than 100 years. Sounds like $200,000,000 that doesn't belong to them. Time to pay that money back.

  41. Re:Read: "Warner avoids massive class-action lawsu by Maxo-Texas · · Score: 1

    The real harm was all the creation of all those corporatized chant/non-happy birthday songs.

    Who can forget such gems as ..

    Applebeeâ(TM)s is fun, itâ(TM)s true,
    Especially when we sing for you.
    Good news is we sing for free!
    Bad news is we sing off key!

    Chevys

    Happy, happy birthday,
    Todayâ(TM)s your birthday day!
    You are one year older,
    And so weâ(TM)re here to say:
    First you get your flan,
    And then you eat it, too.
    So happy, happy birthday,
    From all of us to you!
    Ole!

    Chuck E. Cheese

    Clap your hands!
    Now stomp your feet!
    Youâ(TM)re a Birthday Star at Chuck E. Cheese!
    Youâ(TM)re our special guest,
    We all aim to please
    Youâ(TM)re big time, big stuff, going far
    Hereâ(TM)s to you, our Birthday Star!

    Chiliâ(TM)s

    Happy happy birthday,
    From the Chiliâ(TM)s crew,
    We wish it was our birthday
    So we could party too.
    HEY!

    LongHorn Steakhouse

    Fried chicken,
    Country hog,
    Itâ(TM)s your birthday:
    Hot dog!

    Olive Garden

    From the pasta we make
    To lasagna we bake
    Ba ba ba ba
    Weâ(TM)re wishing you a happy birthday!

    We hope you will remember
    This fond event forever
    Weâ(TM)re wishing you a happy birthday!

    Itâ(TM)s like family and friends
    At the Olive Garden
    In the true Italiano way
    Hey! Hey!

    So if youâ(TM)re looking for some fun
    Try Hospitaliano
    Have a happy happy day!

    Hey!

    ---

    It hurts even to read them.

    --
    She was like chocolate when she drank... semi-sweet at first and then increasingly bitter.
  42. Re: Read: "Warner avoids massive class-action laws by 91degrees · · Score: 1

    One of the rules of contracts is that both parties must get something. Called "Consideration", in contract law. It doesn't strictly have to be of equal value (I can sell a gold plated car for $1 if I want) but both parties must get something.

    So based on my complete absence of expertise, I'd guess the contract could be invalidated on the basis that the recipient didn't get anything of value. That's assuming Warner only licensed the song, of course. They might have licensed rights to a catalogue of songs of which only Happy Birthday is actually worth anything.

  43. eos anothrr slow business day by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    so, how is this news 4 nerdz?

    1. Re:eos anothrr slow business day by Zontar+The+Mindless · · Score: 1

      "Stuff that matters". Which this does.

      In case you've not noticed, Slashdot has been posting stories relating to copyright issues since Chips&Dips days. Maybe *you* don't care about this topic (or you just fail to recognise that it's heaps bigger than just the song "Happy Birthday To You", which is just the tip of the iceberg), but lots of technically-minded folks do, and many of them have personal and/or business-related concerns about it as well.

      --
      Il n'y a pas de Planet B.
  44. Will not happen by kbg · · Score: 1

    This will not happen, I can assure that Happy Birthday will not be entering the public domain any time soon. When there is money to be made the corporate scumbags will do anything to keep this copyrighted perpetually.

  45. Re:Read: "Warner avoids massive class-action lawsu by Hognoxious · · Score: 1

    Are they that much worse than the original?

    --
    Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
  46. Eminent (public) domain by tepples · · Score: 1

    I've read that harmonizing for less would be perceived as a 'taking' under the Fifth Amendment and would thus require the logistical nightmare of providing "just compensation" for all copyright owners for the portion of the copyright term "taken for public use".

    1. Re:Eminent (public) domain by david_thornley · · Score: 1

      That's one theory. It may or may not be valid. However, if we reduce to 75 years for corporate copyright and 50 after death for personal, we'll find that almost all the stuff going into public domain has little value. There aren't all that many people paying for early Mickey Mouse cartoons.

      --
      "When you have eliminated the unacceptable, whatever is left, however improbable, must be the truthiness" - Holmes
    2. Re:Eminent (public) domain by tepples · · Score: 1

      There aren't all that many people paying for early Mickey Mouse cartoons.

      The point is that once the copyright expires, people can lawfully make new Mickey and Pooh cartoons.

  47. Re:Read: "Warner avoids massive class-action lawsu by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I wonder if they'll wipe the massive debts of all those 6 year olds busted for singing that song in public.

  48. Re:Read: "Warner avoids massive class-action lawsu by Shirley+Marquez · · Score: 1

    Not really. But they contribute additional badness to the world.

  49. Lawsuit or not? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Did Warner ever sue Marilyn Monroe for singing "Happy Birthday" to JFK?

  50. Dubious by equivocal · · Score: 1

    Yet another secret out-of-court settlement. And somewhere (not the Times article) I read that both parties agreed to vacate the previous ruling. So NOTHING is official.

    And a reminder, the court ruled that Warner Music did not have valid copyright. That's not the same as ruling that "Happy et al" is public domain. American courts never do something so useful. Instead they leave the situation open to future litigation.

    1. Re:Dubious by david_thornley · · Score: 1

      Warner Brothers does not have a valid copyright. Someone else could come forward with a valid copyright; there's not enough information to rule that out.

      --
      "When you have eliminated the unacceptable, whatever is left, however improbable, must be the truthiness" - Holmes
  51. Re:Read: "Warner avoids massive class-action lawsu by jc42 · · Score: 1

    Are they that much worse than the original?

    Remember that the original was intended for young children. It wasn't supposed to be a great work of musical art; it was intended to be something that a 5-year-old could easily learn to sing.

    --
    Those who do study history are doomed to stand helplessly by while everyone else repeats it.
  52. Re: Read: "Warner avoids massive class-action laws by jc42 · · Score: 1

    The plaintiff would need to show that Warner knew or should have known that the copyright was expired. Then the contract might be thrown out by a judge for being fraudulent.

    The "smoking gun" in the whole thing was the copy of the original publication that Warner presented to the court. It has a smudged-out piece of text that they claimed no knowledge of. Someone found a copy of the book in a library, and the text wasn't smudged out. It was the original copyright information.

    Ya can look it up ... (Try googling "Happy Birthday smudge" .;-)

    --
    Those who do study history are doomed to stand helplessly by while everyone else repeats it.
  53. Re:Read: "Warner avoids massive class-action lawsu by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Wow wow! This is much better:

    Fried chicken,
    Country hog,
    It's your birthday:
    Hot dog!

    No company. No slogans. Just fun.

  54. Re:Read: "Warner avoids massive class-action lawsu by Hognoxious · · Score: 1

    Why does that mean it has to be shit? There are plenty of children's tunes that aren't.

    --
    Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."