Coin Teams With MasterCard In Wearable Payments Push (thestack.com)

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Coin Teams With MasterCard In Wearable Payments Push (thestack.com)

Posted by Soulskill on Wednesday January 6, 2016 @04:53AM from the just-work-on-universal-support-already dept.

An anonymous reader writes: Smart payments startup Coin has announced it will team up with MasterCard to use its electronic card technology to help companies integrate payment services into their wearable devices. Under the new MasterCard partnership, owners of wearables with integrated Coin technology will be able to pay at retail outlets without the need to take out any cash or card . The deal is not exclusive, which means that there is still potential for Visa and American Express customers to benefit when the Coin-embedded tech begins to ship later this year.

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I can see it already by ickleberry · 2016-01-06 04:55 · Score: 1

People will be getting these implanted for convenience. No need to line up the population and stamp them all with the mark of the beast.
1. Re:I can see it already by sycodon · 2016-01-06 05:03 · Score: 2
  
  And people will come up with a way to read it as the walk by you. They'll pick your pockets even when you don't have a pocket.
  
  --
  When Fascism comes to America, it will call itself Anti-Fascism, and tell you to give up your guns.
2. Re:I can see it already by Marginal+Coward · 2016-01-06 05:43 · Score: 1
  
  I think that was already implemented long before this new technology: it's called "taxes."
3. Re:I can see it already by sycodon · 2016-01-06 06:12 · Score: 1
  
  Sadly, that's true.
  
  --
  When Fascism comes to America, it will call itself Anti-Fascism, and tell you to give up your guns.
4. Re:I can see it already by cayenne8 · 2016-01-06 06:29 · Score: 2
  
  No thank you.
  I'll just stick to cash. Especially for my private individual gun purchases.
  :P
  
  --
  Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.........
5. Re:I can see it already by Anonymous Coward · 2016-01-06 06:42 · Score: 0
  
  But I get something for my taxes, roads, bridges, schools, an army and navy and rules about how to build stuff so it doesn't crush us in our sleep.
  Now, if you want to follow the money and then complain about our taxes being used to fund corporations I'm all in, otherwise move to a banana republic and see how that no taxes things works out for you.
6. Re:I can see it already by sycodon · 2016-01-06 08:24 · Score: 1
  
  The 2014 Federal budget was $3.506 trillion.
  If you think all of that was necessary and proper, seek psychiatric help.
  
  --
  When Fascism comes to America, it will call itself Anti-Fascism, and tell you to give up your guns.
Chip cards by 110010001000 · 2016-01-06 04:59 · Score: 3, Insightful

On the other hand in the US we have finally started to require chip (and signature) cards. I never understood this stuff. How hard is it to insert a plastic card in a slot for payment? And given the sorry state of Smart Phone security why do people insist on using their phones for payment? You are just asking for trouble.
1. Re:Chip cards by ewibble · 2016-01-06 05:10 · Score: 2
  
  I agree, A device where you can download and install arbitrary software from the internet is not a place where I want the authentication method for monetary transactions to be kept. Yes I know buying things online counts, but there is a solution for that too.
2. Re:Chip cards by tepples · 2016-01-06 05:21 · Score: 1
  
  Yes I know buying things online counts, but there is a solution for that too.
  Namely?
3. Re:Chip cards by Anonymous Coward · 2016-01-06 05:27 · Score: 0
  
  Yes I know buying things online counts, but there is a solution for that too.
  Namely?
  credit cards that have a chip and require a signature.
4. Re:Chip cards by Anonymous Coward · 2016-01-06 05:29 · Score: 1
  
  And given the sorry state of Smart Phone security why do people insist on using their phones for anything? You are just asking for trouble.
  FTFY.
5. Re:Chip cards by ewibble · 2016-01-06 05:32 · Score: 1
  
  Have a external non-programmable card plugged in do a challenge response authentication. Make there be a physical action that must be performed on that card, eg enter pin, press a button.
  Your details cannot be stolen since you never give them out. Your computer cannot just authenticate transactions on bulk because you need to press that button each time. This could also be a good way of logging into places.
6. Re:Chip cards by Anonymous Coward · 2016-01-06 05:32 · Score: 1
  
  On the other hand in the US we have finally started to require chip (and signature) cards. I never understood this stuff. How hard is it to insert a plastic card in a slot for payment? And given the sorry state of Smart Phone security why do people insist on using their phones for payment? You are just asking for trouble.
  
  Sales.
  It's been demonstrated that people are likely to spend more when there's less friction.
  Ridiculous friction: Barter of physical commodities. I bring my cow to the market, I go home with two of your pigs. Crap, now I have no milk. Maybe I should keep my cow.
  High friction: Cash. I have to go to the bank (at one time a human teller, and then the robot teller in the form of the ATM) to refill my wallet with physica cash. Every time I buy something, I feel the notes and coins passing through my hands, the lifeblood of my commerce. Better buy the little $2 for 2L milk instead of the big $3 for 4L milk jug. That leaves me an extra dollar for bus fare.
  Low friction: Credit/debit card. Get the $3 for 4L milk jug even if the milk spoils. And the $2 candy bar in the checkout aisle. It all shows up as "groceries" when I import my bank statement into Excel. But I still have to spend 10 seconds physically performing an action to "spend" that money.
  Lower friction: Contactless card. Bump your ass into a wall-mounted terminal, place your purse on the checkout counter while your groceries are being bagged, fist-bump the cute little robot terminal while wearing a smartwatch, all sorts of ways to make the ritual "fun" and engaging. 2 seconds. And the brightly colored robot mascot waved at me and wished me a happy day! Consumer nirvana from 1994: Have you ever checked out of a supermarket a whole cart at a time? -- except there's no need for the store to even have a cashier. (It's amusing: as futuristic as those commercials seemed 20 years ago, even AT&T didn't anticipate that the card could also be contactless.
  Zero friction: combine the contactless card with RFID tagging of every individual object in the store. No more scanning of individual objects (so you don't even need a self-checkout aisle.) You walk into the store, put the objects in a shopping cart, and walk out of the store with the goods. Like shoplifting, but nobody stops you, and it's legal. You're not really spending money. You're just going to the store and walking out with armloads of cool stuff. The money is debited from your account automatically, but you never have to do anything in the act of spending it other than get that sweet consumer high of acquiring stuff without the unpleasant feeling that comes with spending money. The IBM Shoplifter commercial absolutely nails it.
7. Re:Chip cards by 110010001000 · 2016-01-06 05:46 · Score: 2
  
  You are 100% right. I guess what I meant is why the consumers keep using this stuff. I understand the credit card companies love the idea of frictionless payments. I also think paying with a phone is more of a hassle than paying with a card. And the other point is why even bother requiring chip and signature if you are going to push people to use insecure smartphones for payment?
8. Re:Chip cards by unrtst · 2016-01-06 05:52 · Score: 2
  
  The last two replies got it wrong (IMO), so here goes on my attempt...
  MFA (Multi Factor Auth). Sorry, I couldn't find an easy doc or example within my first few searches, so you'll have to trust me a bit.
  When you check out from some sites, such as newegg, if your bank supports the extra secure pay thingy (I can't remember its exact name), then newegg redirects you to your banks site. If you have it enabled, then you must enter some info for your bank so it can authenticate that you are the owner of the card, then it sends you back to the original site with some tokens it can use to verify that went through ok. If you don't have it enabled, you get the option to enable it at that time, or skip it and continue anyway.
  The big shortfall there is that sites are not required to set up that support, so a rouge or less-professional site could still use your card without jumping through that hoop. However, that's the case for the real world as well - even retailers in the EU can, at their option, accept just the mag swipe, or even do a carbon rub of your card. The extra security protects the retailer and the bank - you don't get much say in protecting your credit card info.
  There are also other online, alternative, payment methods that, supposedly, offer more security. PayPal, bitcoin, temporary CC numbers, etc. Regardless, there are solutions for that, but the physical world solution should not (IMO, and the opinion of the GP) be on some relatively insecure device where arbitrary software can be installed from the internet.
9. Re:Chip cards by unrtst · 2016-01-06 06:04 · Score: 1
  
  Lower friction: Contactless card. Bump your ass into a wall-mounted terminal, place your purse on the checkout counter while your groceries are being bagged, fist-bump the cute little robot terminal while wearing a smartwatch, all sorts of ways to make the ritual "fun" and engaging. 2 seconds. ...
  Except that's a fantasy and does not reflect reality at all.
  You have to accept the charge via your phone. That's the only thing that keeps people from walking buy and taking all your money without ever touching you.
  That alone doesn't sound hard, but that means you have to take out your phone (could have taken out your wallet).
  Then you have to unlock it (or open your wallet).
  Then put the phone where the reader can read it and wait for those things to talk to each other (or swipe your card, which is, IMO, faster).
  Then accept the charge (or sign the terminal or receipt, or not if it's a small purchase).
  Then lock and return your phone (or put card back and put wallet in your pocket).
  Chip+pin / Chip+sig / Contactless... none of those are really faster either. In fact, they're often slower. They're sold as faster so we'll use them. They're more secure and provide more protection for the retailer and the banks, but this isn't about ease of use at all.
  Retailers did NOT accept the move to credit cards because people bought more. They accepted it so they didn't have to deal with checks or fraudulent cash, and a lot of retailers still don't accept cards, mostly due to the additional service fees that they're not allowed to pass onto the customer. If customers really didn't care about spending more when they used the cards versus cash (as you implied), then we would have been footing the bill for every transaction.
10. Re:Chip cards by Just+Some+Guy · 2016-01-06 06:16 · Score: 1
  
  And given the sorry state of Smart Phone security why do people insist on using their phones for payment?
  Because my phone hasn't been stolen and used to buy gas in Tijuana or clothes in Florida 4 times in the last 4 years. I trust Apple Pay because I've actually read their published whitepapers and like its design. I love the idea that I'm not giving Joe's Meth Shack my actual credit card number when I stop for food on a roadtrip.
  Given a choice between handing out sensitive data to anyone who asks for it, versus a one-time-use number that's still fully backed by fraud liability limits if something goes wrong, I know which one I choose every time I can.
  
  --
  Dewey, what part of this looks like authorities should be involved?
11. Re:Chip cards by orasio · 2016-01-06 08:14 · Score: 1
  
  Magnetic stripe cards provide no security themselves. They are good enough for now, but card makers and some customers want something with a bit more security. Chip cards provide reasonably good encryption, and are much harder to clone.
  Phones, on the other hand, are used for payment a lot right now. They are used when you pay for Uber, or when you buy apps, or when I pay my rent with a bank transfer using my phone's web browser + a coordinate card. Plus, it's usually with you, so it's convenient, that is also important.
12. Re:Chip cards by Anonymous Coward · 2016-01-06 08:38 · Score: 0
  
  Is Joe's Meth Shack going to sell you food that won't make you sick, that is a more important question!
13. Re:Chip cards by TechyImmigrant · 2016-01-06 08:49 · Score: 1
  
  Regardless, there are solutions for that, but the physical world solution should not (IMO, and the opinion of the GP) be on some relatively insecure device where arbitrary software can be installed from the internet.
  And yet, time after time, millions of people's card credentials have been stolen from supposedly certified, secure, PCI-DSS compliant Point of Sale equipment on which arbitary software was installed from the internet. Whereas payments through phone-NFC-PoS-Bank transactions have not suffered the same fate.
  Maybe because people involved in the creation of the through phone-NFC-PoS-Bank transaction mechanisms knew what the hell they were doing, whereas the PCI-DSS people do not.
  
  --
  I should use this sig to advertise my book ISBN-13 : 978-1501515132.
14. Re:Chip cards by Anonymous Coward · 2016-01-06 09:33 · Score: 1
  
  You have to accept the charge via your phone. That's the only thing that keeps people from walking buy and taking all your money without ever touching you.
  That alone doesn't sound hard, but that means you have to take out your phone (could have taken out your wallet).
  Then you have to unlock it (or open your wallet).
  Then put the phone where the reader can read it and wait for those things to talk to each other (or swipe your card, which is, IMO, faster).
  Then accept the charge (or sign the terminal or receipt, or not if it's a small purchase).
  Then lock and return your phone (or put card back and put wallet in your pocket).
  That's true of many of the shittier ways to pay, if you have an Apple Watch (or I'm guessing an Android one), it looks like this:
  Double tap button on side of watch, bump it against payment terminal.
  Done.
15. Re:Chip cards by unrtst · 2016-01-06 11:52 · Score: 1
  
  Great example; batshit insane conclusion.
  It also has nothing to do with this branch of the thread. Read what I was replying to.
  I would agree that the original designs for the secure payment systems for smart phones were great, even if they were on devices like that. However, corners are being cut now. For example, from what I can tell, Android Pay no longer requires the use of a separate chip to securely store the sensitive data (the secure element).
16. Re: Chip cards by Anonymous Coward · 2016-01-06 12:15 · Score: 0
  
  There's only one thing you should be buying at Joe's method shack. And you should use cash.
17. Re:Chip cards by rtb61 · 2016-01-06 12:41 · Score: 1
  
  Cash and buying in person will always be better. Why, because you choose, cash in pocket and you choose whether to spend it or not. Electronic payments breaks down to this, "Please sir, may I have this", this is the begging plea, each and every time you ask permission to have something. Every time I make a credit card purchase in store I always laugh with the comment, "my card still loves me". I limit my credit card purchases because it inherently irritates to plead for permission to have something and stand pathetically waiting for approval from my credit card master.
  Nothing at all to do with privacy and everything to do with who is the master and who is the slave, I refuse to spend my fucking life asking for permission to do stuff every single fucking day of it and waiting pathetically for approval.
  
  --
  Chaos - everything, everywhere, everywhen
18. Re:Chip cards by ewibble · 2016-01-06 13:22 · Score: 1
  
  No it is not, maybe you every time you buy on a credit card you worry about it being declined, but I don't, I do not purchase anything on a card that cannot afford to buy with cash.
  You could make the same argument with cash, each time you pay for a particular good you, they could say no. I don't beg for anything if the shop doesn't give me the goods, or even slightly annoys me I say stuff off and go somewhere else. If you are talking about the bank kindly letting me take money out of my account, then unless you keep your money under your mattress you have the same scenario when take that money of of your account. You ask for your money and they say certainly SIR. If they refuse to give me my money they will be facing legal action (unless they are insolvent). I am not begging I am demanding nicely. I do accept certain security checks because I don't want them giving my money to anyone.
19. Re:Chip cards by DanJ_UK · 2016-01-06 15:40 · Score: 1
  
  What? You've only just got chip and pin?
  
  Jesus christ we've had that for decades.
  
  --
  - Dan
20. Re:Chip cards by rtb61 · 2016-01-06 15:57 · Score: 1
  
  Idjiot, generally people who prefer cash, prefer cash because that's what that have plenty of and dislike credit because they don't need it. Delude yourself all you want but make no mistake it's "Please sir may I have another" and should they develop a dislike to you for what ever political reason, not only does it become a no but they will track you down, beat you up and throw you in a cage. A freeman uses cash, a slave presents a permission slip provided by their master.
  
  --
  Chaos - everything, everywhere, everywhen
21. Re:Chip cards by tehcyder · 2016-01-07 01:35 · Score: 1
  
  Cash and buying in person will always be better. Why, because you choose, cash in pocket and you choose whether to spend it or not. Electronic payments breaks down to this, "Please sir, may I have this", this is the begging plea, each and every time you ask permission to have something. Every time I make a credit card purchase in store I always laugh with the comment, "my card still loves me". I limit my credit card purchases because it inherently irritates to plead for permission to have something and stand pathetically waiting for approval from my credit card master.
  Nothing at all to do with privacy and everything to do with who is the master and who is the slave, I refuse to spend my fucking life asking for permission to do stuff every single fucking day of it and waiting pathetically for approval.
  No offence, but you're as mad as a sack full of weasels.
  
  --
  To have a right to do a thing is not at all the same as to be right in doing it
22. Re:Chip cards by tehcyder · 2016-01-07 01:37 · Score: 1
  
  they will track you down, beat you up and throw you in a cage
  Congratulations on your follow up post being even more deranged than your first.
  
  --
  To have a right to do a thing is not at all the same as to be right in doing it
23. Re:Chip cards by ewibble · 2016-01-07 05:23 · Score: 1
  
  First electronic payments, and credit are 2 separate things you should be able to use one without the other. You said in your post
  
  Nothing at all to do with privacy
  So tracking you down really is not relevant, but with facial recognition getting better all they need is a store camera to track you down, irrelevant on if you pay by cash or electronic methods.
24. Re:Chip cards by TechyImmigrant · 2016-01-07 05:57 · Score: 1
  
  Great example; batshit insane conclusion.
  It also has nothing to do with this branch of the thread. Read what I was replying to.
  I would agree that the original designs for the secure payment systems for smart phones were great, even if they were on devices like that. However, corners are being cut now. For example, from what I can tell, Android Pay no longer requires the use of a separate chip to securely store the sensitive data (the secure element).
  There are reasons for that. The secure storage is still a requirement. However chip vendors have begun incorporating the secure storage on the main die. From an attack surface point of view, this is better. The physical 'separateness' of the storage element is not a security goal or feature. The logical separateness certainly is.
  
  --
  I should use this sig to advertise my book ISBN-13 : 978-1501515132.
25. Re:Chip cards by rtb61 · 2016-01-08 14:30 · Score: 1
  
  Let me guess, you work for a company that demands a corporate tax upon every transaction on the planet, a tax you don't pay if you pay with cash, basically billions lost to those corporations when people pay with cash instead, well billions lost to those corporations and billions saved by every one else. Credit cards companies are basically financial parasites and regardless of ad hominem attacks, I'll stick with cash for the bulk of my purchases.
  
  --
  Chaos - everything, everywhere, everywhen
Well this is embarrassing ... by scunc · 2016-01-06 05:06 · Score: 1

I seem to have left my wallet in my other pants. Literally.
from 0 to 60 in 3 hours by Anonymous Coward · 2016-01-06 05:15 · Score: 0

must be some kind of record for outdoor thermometers? hanging on to our hemispheres... what a gig..
Maybe If It Was Attached To Your Hand by zenlessyank · 2016-01-06 05:26 · Score: 1

Or Forehead. That way you won't forget it. Seems like I have heard this idea before though..hmmmm.
1. Re:Maybe If It Was Attached To Your Hand by faldore · 2016-01-06 06:28 · Score: 1
  
  It's the mark of the beast!
Useful by Anonymous Coward · 2016-01-06 05:33 · Score: 0

Handy for (mostly) women who can never seem to find anything in their purses.
Here is a better idea... by kuhnto · 2016-01-06 05:36 · Score: 1

Why don't you work on getting my second coin shipped to me from my order 2 years ago?

--
"A 'person' is smart. 'People' are dumb, panicky animals and you know that."
1. Re:Here is a better idea... by MachineShedFred · 2016-01-06 08:17 · Score: 1
  
  Exactly why I cancelled my preorder - when they delayed it to be a month before all the retailers were supposed to have EMV readers installed at the point of sale, and Coin didn't yet support EMV, it showed that they weren't keeping up. Then, when they reduced the number of available units in their 'beta' due to manufacturing issues, it reinforced it.
  I wasn't going to pay that kind of money to get something already obsolete, months late. Nice try, but learn to execute.
  
  --
  Slashdot still doesnâ(TM)t support Unicode after it was added to the HTML standard in 1997.
Is this a Joke? by nukenerd · 2016-01-06 05:43 · Score: 1

I don't understand this. Contactless cards have been around in the UK for a while now. While they are "wearable", like you could wear them in your sleeve, they do need to be waved in front of the reader so you could not wear them in your socks, or your pants probably.

But that is also the case with these "Coin" devices too. FTFA :- "owners of wearables with integrated Coin technology will be able to pay ... just waving the device in front of the payment terminal., So what is supposed to be new about this? What have I missed?

Anyway, have you seen this thing, in the photo in the first link? Strapped to someone's wrist, it's as big as a bible FFS!
1. Re:Is this a Joke? by 110010001000 · 2016-01-06 05:56 · Score: 1
  
  Coin is more than just contactless. It has a whole set of (useless) technology behind it. The US also has contactless cards. The wrist thing isn't a real device, just a marketing photo.
2. Re:Is this a Joke? by MachineShedFred · 2016-01-06 08:20 · Score: 1
  
  By integrating Coin's "technology" you can make your "wearable" as useful for contactless payment as your two year old smartphone with NFC. As in, your device can have multiple payment card infos on it, you pick one, and then do a Jedi wave. Just like you can with basically an Android or iPhone since 2014.
  Yay?
  
  --
  Slashdot still doesnâ(TM)t support Unicode after it was added to the HTML standard in 1997.
They want to remove anonimity by Anonymous Coward · 2016-01-06 05:55 · Score: 0

They want to remove anonimity, this was decided at a Bilderberg meeting a few years ago (Facebook and Google attended that one), and they decided to start to remove anonimity. Now the EU is forcing anonymous bitcoins to be illegal and cash is being reduced in favour of non-anonymous electronic "personal" payments via mobile and wearables.
With this new era of non-anonymity, they want to control the balance of money (power) and gives them more control over society via more information and control.
This is why there is a big issue with real names on social media services and more, you will be held accountable (but will they?) and the ability to switch you on and off and know what you buy.
In the end, bartering and the black market will grow stronger out of these moves.
this is getting out of hand. by nimbius · 2016-01-06 06:02 · Score: 1

My local coffee shop has evolved to accept so many forms of payment, from apple to coin to mastercard to google pay and i think even bitcoin, that i've simply out of habit begun storing torn and crinkled singles in my shoes. I know the future of e-i-e-i-o payment is here, but the mode lacks the satisfaction of bypassing 150 different imaginary money systems in order to push a wad of sweat-soaked washingtons across a counter to a liberal arts major. Im even working on a payment system that uses dimes and nickels i store in expired cartons of milk.

--
Good people go to bed earlier.
1. Re:this is getting out of hand. by R3d+M3rcury · 2016-01-06 15:42 · Score: 1
  
  Actually, the one I enjoy is the self-serve lines at the grocery store. It's a great place to get rid of all the coins--they even accept pennies--that you accumulate when you pay $7.38 for something.
Solution in search of a problem by JoeyRox · 2016-01-06 06:05 · Score: 1

Credit cards are cheap, thin, light, have chipped security, and couldn't be any easier to use.
1. Re:Solution in search of a problem by Anonymous Coward · 2016-01-06 09:21 · Score: 0
  
  I think that is part of the problem. My wallet is full of cards as each vendor wants me to use their card and gives me incentives for doing so.
  I believe a big part of coin was to be able to store lots of card in a single cards so I could empty out my wallet and just carry one card.
  I think I already have that with Apple Pay (except where not accepted).
I hope they all die in a fire by Hognoxious · 2016-01-06 06:33 · Score: 2

They deserve to fail and die for not only choosing a common word for their name, but also choosing a name that's in common use in something closely related.

--
Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
1. Re:I hope they all die in a fire by nukenerd · 2016-01-06 07:37 · Score: 1
  
  They deserve to fail and die for not only choosing a common word for their name, but also choosing a name that's in common use in something closely related.
  Like Microsoft's "Windows" and "Word" you mean ?
2. Re:I hope they all die in a fire by MachineShedFred · 2016-01-06 08:22 · Score: 1
  
  Especially since the use of said device makes it so that a coin is never involved.
  
  --
  Slashdot still doesnâ(TM)t support Unicode after it was added to the HTML standard in 1997.
Authenticator is something else to carry by tepples · 2016-01-06 06:43 · Score: 1

Have a external non-programmable card plugged in do a challenge response authentication.
I'm not so sure to what extent cardmembers would be willing to carry around an EMV card reader in case they want to buy something online with a laptop, tablet, or smartphone.
1. Re:Authenticator is something else to carry by ewibble · 2016-01-06 07:15 · Score: 1
  
  The reader doesn't need to be safe just the card, that stores your private key, it would not need to be bigger than a credit card or a usb key. Your chip and pin card should already do a challenge response.
  This http://www.slipperybrick.com/2... has data entry any processing (power could be supplied by the reader) that is 7 years ago.
  If readers became standard which they would if everybody paid this way then their would be no issue, the reader could even be wireless. I would be happy with that as long as a pin was entered on the device and was part of the challenge response. If you managed to get the pin from the device so what you couldn't make the transaction without the card.
2. Re:Authenticator is something else to carry by ewibble · 2016-01-06 07:24 · Score: 1
  
  Actually thinking about it, it probably would not need to be any bigger than a sim card, you could have it in a shielded slot on your phone, it physically connects it to your phone ready to authenticate 1 transaction.
3. Re:Authenticator is something else to carry by jrumney · 2016-01-06 12:47 · Score: 1
  
  Your phone is not a secure keypad. Any PIN you enter there can be logged, and the GPS coordinates of your phone recorded for later retrieval of the card.
4. Re:Authenticator is something else to carry by ewibble · 2016-01-06 13:05 · Score: 1
  
  I understand that, your phone is not a secure anything, but it would require the criminal to actually track you down and steal from you, they could do that without even entering any details. Just like when you type your pin in any EFTPOS machine there can be cameras watching, (if the machine is not itself compromised) or next person can use an infra red camera to get your pin. This of course rely on actual physical access to your card. If your phone is on you and compromised it can broadcast a signal so they can then track you.
  The solution doesn't stop you from ever being robbed, they can always just take your card and say give me your pin or I will kill you, but it increases the requirement from anybody in the world can access your money because you gave them your credit card number, to some random web site, to they must have the card, they must know your pin. The having your card is the hardest part since if you don't have it you will report it stolen.
5. Re:Authenticator is something else to carry by tepples · 2016-01-07 01:57 · Score: 1
  
  If readers became standard which they would if everybody paid this way then their would be no issue, the reader could even be wireless.
  But it'd still be something to have forgotten at home or to have misplaced.
6. Re:Authenticator is something else to carry by ewibble · 2016-01-07 06:24 · Score: 1
  
  The reader would be in every shop, every cell phone, every computer, the reader could simply be a NFC reader which is in pretty much every smart phone now, the point is the reader does not have to be secure. All it does is, asks the bank I would like to authorize this transaction, the bank says here encrypt random number X appended with the pin with the cards private key. If you made the card itself enter the pin the reader could not even capture the pin (minor point as mentioned before). The user holds down the button which forms a circuit which allows the card to do the encryption.
  What does the reader know? How to encrypt X+Pin for a given value of X, maybe the pin? big deal it could not use that ever again because the bank would not ever issue X again. You could also do offline transactions (at the vendors risk) by making X the current time, you would probably want to prefix a type in front of X. No more than 1 transaction within whatever accuracy you deem it is reasonable for a clock to have. You may need an account number there but that could be encrypted too, by sending a public key to the card as part of X.
  You still have the problem of the transaction being more than what you think, (currently a problem anyway) There is a solution to this, and probably most credit card fraud, even without the other parts, simply text the person a receipt every time a credit card payment is made.
  If you mean you could leave your card a home, or lose it, that is the same with a cash, or any authentication method that is something you have, unless you implant it, I don't want peoples appendages being cut off when people steal your money. "Something you have" I believe is the best form of authentication, because something you know has to be very simple and you cannot tell if someone else has captured it, and something you are, can never be changed, and must be done from a trusted reader, since if that reader captures that information, it can simply resend that information at any time (slightly modified of course since bio-metrics are never exactly the same). Of course you can combine them, but I believe the something you have is an essential part, if you want a high level of security.
  Sorry for the long explanation, that is why I didn't want to go into the details of how to implement this.
7. Re:Authenticator is something else to carry by tepples · 2016-01-07 07:14 · Score: 1
  
  If you mean you could leave your card a home, or lose it
  I meant leaving the reader at home. Readers are in every shop but not already in every cell phone or every computer.
8. Re:Authenticator is something else to carry by ewibble · 2016-01-07 07:47 · Score: 1
  
  Not now but could easily be, if this was to become a standard method of payment that banks supported. You could make a usb dongle for old computers. To admit I do not have NFC in my cell phone, it is a feature phone. I don't know which phones do, certainly people in my office do but I do work in the IT industry and that may not be a fair sample. Then again I do not use my phone to make purchases either. people do seem to replace their phone often, every couple of years, not me of course, my phone is 10 years old. I would be willing to purchase a reader for my home computer though, if it meant I would not have to give out random companies on the internet my credit card information.
  I admit that there would have to be a transition phase where both methods of payments where accepted, but eventually the old method could be phased out.
This is the same shitty company by Anonymous Coward · 2016-01-06 09:31 · Score: 0

That delayed orders on it's broken shitty credit card for over a year and then shipped a barely functional product. Fuck them
No real security by Anonymous Coward · 2016-01-07 14:33 · Score: 0

These things will be like a smörgåsbord for criminals.