Slashdot Mirror


Trump Says He'd Make Apple Build Computers In the US (businessinsider.com)

mrspoonsi writes with Business Insider's report that presidential candidate Donald Trump says he'd like to make Apple "start building their damn computers and things in this country instead of other countries." From the article: Trump's ultimatum to the most valuable company in the world was made towards the end of a 45-minute speech he gave at Liberty University in Virginia on Monday. The most popular candidate in the Republican party said he would impose a 35% business tax on American businesses manufacturing outside of the United States. Apple has manufactured its Mac Pro at a factory in Texas since 2013, but the vast majority of its products (including the iPhone) are largely made and assembled in China. How Trump would force Apple's supply chain, which relies heavily on a vast network of suppliers and large factories throughout Asia, to be brought stateside remains unknown. Apple CEO Tim Cook recently called the U.S. tax code "awful for America." If Trump (or anyone) thinks this is a good idea, why start or stop with Apple?

39 of 875 comments (clear)

  1. Trump just says stuff by MichaelSmith · · Score: 5, Insightful

    He is not actually going to build that wall on the Mexican border, and whatnot.

    1. Re: Trump just says stuff by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Trump just says stuff because he doesn't actually know how anything works. Business included. He's a complete moron who just got handed a silver spoon at birth. His apparent success should not be any indication he has a clue how anything other than bribing works in the world. He know nothing about politics, nothing about business, nothing about people, nothing about the world. He's gotten were he is simply because of money.

    2. Re:Trump just says stuff by Penguinisto · · Score: 4, Insightful

      He is not actually going to build that wall on the Mexican border, and whatnot.

      I suspect that he has no idea at all what this whole 'checks and balances' thing actually does.

      That said, yeah, he's pandering his ass off, just like Sanders and Clinton (and numerous others) are happily doing as I type this. There will be no border wall, no free college/healthcare, no auditing of the Fed (sadly), no tax reforms (in *either* direction)... none of that shit.

      Of course, the angry redneck and the stupid sophomore both have one thing in common: You can't tell either one of them a damned thing right now which refutes their little dreams.

      --
      Quo usque tandem abutere, Nimbus, patientia nostra?
    3. Re:Trump just says stuff by DrXym · · Score: 5, Insightful
      The problem is that Trump says stuff and he means it. He's absolutely right in all matters. He's right even when he demonstrably isn't. He's right even when experts tell him he's full of shit. He's right even if it means reality is wrong. And don't dare tell him he is wrong because suddenly you're an enemy to be demeaned and mocked.

      It's not hard to find articles that suggest he is suffering from a narcissistic personality disorder and I can easily believe it.

    4. Re: Trump just says stuff by Rob+Kaper · · Score: 4, Insightful

      His apparent success

      ... consists of being outperformed by the average market and the likes of Paris Hilton.

    5. Re:Trump just says stuff by Chas · · Score: 4, Insightful

      This is the US.

      If someone could get away with "BLOWJOBS FOR EVERYONE" as a campaign plank, there'd be enough idiots out there to elect the person.

      --


      Chas - The one, the only.
      THANK GOD!!!
    6. Re:Trump just says stuff by Chas · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Better communication?

      No. We have MORE IMMEDIATE communication.

      Of course, what that means is that the lag time between brain and appearance of rampant idiocy is about as low as we could get without hive-mind telepathy.

      On top of that, years of "reality TV" and general "popular person worship" have inured us to the existential agony of watching people the average IQ of a dead slug acting like idiots and assholes on TV and in the media.

      This is, more or less, why all our presidential candidates are slack-jawed mouth-breathers. Because nobody has to try harder than that.

      It's pretty much Idiocracy: The Early Years.

      --


      Chas - The one, the only.
      THANK GOD!!!
    7. Re:Trump just says stuff by RabidReindeer · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Of course, the angry redneck and the stupid sophomore both have one thing in common: You can't tell either one of them a damned thing right now which refutes their little dreams.

      That's not limited to "the redneck and stupid sophomore". Damn near the entire population of the US is like that anymore. It's strange how we have better communication and more access to information than ever before in this country, and people are more narrow minded than ever.

      The Internet has made it possible for anyone, no matter how marginal, to "prove" that their ideas are "right" because they can find like-minded people spewing the same nonsense.

      As Rudyard Kipling's monkeys chanted: "It must be true, because we all say so!"

    8. Re: Trump just says stuff by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

      "A wise man speaks when he has something to say. A fool speaks when he has to say something."

    9. Re:Trump just says stuff by peragrin · · Score: 5, Insightful

      True communism has never been practiced on a major scale. Current communism countries get stuck at the command level economy setup stage. And to keep the peasants from revolting they give away a bunch of stuff.

      Norway and Sweden are closer to true communism than China,Cuba or russia(was).

      Both Norway and Sweden ditched command economic mode in favor of regulated capitalism.

      That is the mode Bernie wants for the is and will a decent goal, won't happen with the number of hypocrite we have in this country. If you vote republican and accept Medicare and social security you are a hypocrite.

      --
      i thought once I was found, but it was only a dream.
    10. Re:Trump just says stuff by Beezlebub33 · · Score: 5, Insightful

      No, not typical.

      One of the problems with political discourse is that the expectations are so low that Trump can literally say anything and there will people who say 'Politician X says stuff too' or 'They all do it'. However, Trump is different. He is isn't even bothering to try to couch his words in standard dog-whistle terms or not directly insulting massive parts of the electorate. The things he has said about specific women, about physically handicapped people, about particular racial and religious groups are far beyond anything we have seen for a national politician. It has significantly lowered the bar in terms of acceptable behaviour; and you're not helping by being an apologist for him by calling him typical.

      --
      The more people I meet, the better I like my dog.
    11. Re:Trump just says stuff by The-Ixian · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Of course, the angry redneck and the stupid sophomore both have one thing in common: You can't tell either one of them a damned thing right now which refutes their little dreams.

      That's not limited to "the redneck and stupid sophomore". Damn near the entire population of the US is like that anymore. It's strange how we have better communication and more access to information than ever before in this country, and people are more narrow minded than ever.

      I don't buy it. I think that most people are considered and reasonable. I think that the extremes are just more interesting and consequently receive disproportional attention.

      Not everyone who votes Republican is a fundamental Christian NRA wingnut. Not everyone who votes Democrat is a tree hugging, socialist nutjob.

      I believe that the truth (as is usually the case in my experience) is somewhere in the middle. Most people just want to live and not be hassled.

      You may vote repub because you are fiscally conservative. You may vote dem because you care about social programs... I don't know the reasons people vote the way they do, but in my experience we all have the same basic desires.

      Besides, our system of government doesn't really give all that much power to the president without the help of the other branches. So no matter who is president, you are pretty much guaranteed the same thing you have now.... for better or worse... I think that is by design.

      Don't get me wrong, I definitely lean left and I think it would really say something about this country if Trump were to win, but I also know that even if he does, nothing will change. It will just be the same thing we have now (with slightly more comedy perhaps).... but nothing will really change...

      I mean, think about the biggest thing Obama "rammed" through during his presidency... Obamacare... and now tell me how your life is now ruined because of it...

      --
      My eyes reflect the stars and a smile lights up my face.
    12. Re:Trump just says stuff by hey! · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Of course; anyone with a half a brain can see he's a bigtime bullshitter. But that doesn't mean you should dismiss what he says; you can a learn a lot from the BS he spouts about the people who support him. What this shows is that they're not conservative or libertarian; and they're certainly not liberal either. So what are they?

      They're authoritarian.

      Authoritarians are a different breed from conservatives or liberals; conservatives and liberals differ on issues of ideology, but authoritarianism is about the cult of personality. The key attribute of an authoritarian leader is the utter lack of intellectual integrity. Authoritarian leaders don't serve ideologies, they use them, even mixing and matches to suit the need of the moment.

      So the election of an authoritarian would be news for anyone who holds a principled political position, no matter what position that leader claims to support. In this case Trump is running as a conservative, but here he's signaled his complete lack of interest in consistency with principled conservatism. And his admirers admire him all the more for it. They aren't interested in consistency, they're interested in a "strong" leader, by which they mean someone who will unashamedly give voice to their resentments -- of foreigners and of the elite. That should sound alarmingly familiar.

      So yes, Trump doesn't intend to force Apple to make its computers here. But if he gets elected and it serves his purposes he'll try. If he fails, he'll just point that as proof he has to have more power.

      --
      Post may contain irony: discontinue use if experiencing mood swings, nausea or elevated blood pressure.
    13. Re:Trump just says stuff by Straif · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Obama has passed less EO's than most other Presidents because he simply prefers to write Presidential Memorandum instead. Legally speaking they are the same, with the one exception that Memorandum don't have to be published to the Federal Register (they can be but they are not legally required to be except when the current Administration deems it necessary).

      As of last year (and he's written several EOs and PMs since then) he had written more EOs and PMs combined than any President since Carter and more PMs than any President in history.

      Of course, none of this takes away from the fact that Trump is just a blowhard and if given the chance would probably blow FDR's EO record away.

      --
      Of course that's just my opinion...... you could be wrong!
    14. Re:Trump just says stuff by The-Ixian · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I think the most dangerous part about Trump is this "filter" (or lack thereof) problem he has on his mouth.

      There are some people out there who will be stirred up by this so much that they will take action.

      The most dangerous part about Trump being president is not that he would have any political power. I am sure the dems (and probably a lot of repubs) will block him ever step of the way should he be president. I think the problem is that the presidency will give his voice disproportionate power and when he says something stupid and hateful, someone out there will take it as a call to action and do something terrible.

      --
      My eyes reflect the stars and a smile lights up my face.
    15. Re:Trump just says stuff by MightyYar · · Score: 3, Insightful

      It's a matter of degree, which is my point. European socialists advocate a strong safety net, with strong government pensions and government-provided healthcare. The primary purpose of corporations - in a European socialist's view - are to provide jobs.

      This is different - but not so different - from the traditional American model. Which model is more conducive to economic growth is - IMHO - self-evident. But not all people feel that economic growth is worth the drawbacks. I can respect that, even if I think they are mistaken.

      --
      W..w..W - Willy Waterloo washes Warren Wiggins who is washing Waldo Woo.
    16. Re: Trump just says stuff by unrtst · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I, too, would like to see MUCH simpler tax codes. If someone is required to file them, then said person should be able to understand it (I'm mostly referring to personal taxes here). That's often not the case.

      However, your solution:

      You pay x% on profits after your expenses, period.

      ... leaves bigger holes than any that currently exist. Re-invest profit into the company by any means, or pay it out as bonuses to top execs, or just buy stuff. Make sure there's a small profit every couple years so you can stay incorporated, and the tax would end up as some infinitesimally small amount.
      Most of the laws had the best intentions at one point, like your comment, but those need to continually be patched, which results in the current situation.

    17. Re:Trump just says stuff by cayenne8 · · Score: 2, Insightful

      If you vote republican and accept Medicare and social security you are a hypocrite.

      The trouble is, depending on your age, you almost HAVE to take them when you get to retirement age.

      This money was forceably taken from my pay over many decades, rather than giving me a choice on how best to invest it for myself. If given that choice early on in my employment history, I could have e invested it and I'd be more well off by having that money grow more, and I could use it.

      But when you get close to retirement age, well....you've thrown so much money into the pot, it makes no sense not to try to draw a little of it back from the well.

      --
      Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.........
    18. Re:Trump just says stuff by DarkOx · · Score: 5, Insightful

      If you vote republican and accept Medicare and social security you are a hypocrite.

      Hardly! That is not how a representative democracy works. You vote for who and to a lessor extent how you think things ought to be and then you play by the rules the winners set for society. Its does not make someone a hypocrite for accepting medicare or social security, while voting to end them. Since that person does not get a choice about paying medicare and social security taxes while they are working, they are as entitled as everyone else to accept the benefit.

      --
      Repeal the 17th Amendment TODAY! Also Please Read http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/right-to-read.html
    19. Re: Trump just says stuff by shadowrat · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Trump just says stuff because he doesn't actually know how anything works. Business included. He's a complete moron who just got handed a silver spoon at birth. His apparent success should not be any indication he has a clue how anything other than bribing works in the world. He know nothing about politics, nothing about business, nothing about people, nothing about the world. He's gotten were he is simply because of money.

      Sounds like every US president ever. What exactly was your point?

      well, we know obama wasn't handed a silver spoon at birth. they don't have those in kenya :)

    20. Re: Trump just says stuff by Tough+Love · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Let me guess, you didn't have anything to say, so you just went for ad hominem attack.

      True, let's replay that. Sure, all presidents have flaws but Trump has the potential to take it to an entirely new and unimaginably destructive level.

      --
      When all you have is a hammer, every problem starts to look like a thumb.
    21. Re:Trump just says stuff by tgrigsby · · Score: 4, Insightful

      New rule: If you can't tell the difference between socialism and communism, you can't comment on either.

      --
      *** *** You're just jealous 'cause the voices talk to me... ***
    22. Re:Trump just says stuff by sudon't · · Score: 4, Insightful

      My theory is that Trump is a stooge for the Clinton campaign.

      Ha! If only we had politicians who were that smart. Listen, my friend, nobody thought an idiot like Reagan could get elected. We've had thirty years of policies that have been disastrous to working people, the same working people who continue to vote Republican. The Republican Party decided to go after the racists, the religious nuts, and other right-wing loonies to gain votes. What they didn't count on was these people taking over the Party. Between that, and Fox News, they went from being the party of the rich, to being the party of the disaffected ignorant. Now, Trump comes along, and instead of speaking with a dog whistle, he says out loud everything the other Republicans only hinted at, and they love him for it. Don't kid yourself, the man could be elected.

      --
      -- sudon't

      Air-ride Equipped

    23. Re: Trump just says stuff by Dan667 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      every bankruptcy means someone does not get paid what they are owed. The biggest problem with trump declaring bankruptcy so often is he is screwing over his creditors and has no problem with it, making him is a corporate welfare queen. Now what do you think he would do if he became President?

    24. Re:Trump just says stuff by Dan667 · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Sanders' thing is bribing the voters with my money. Turns out, it's pretty popular, no matter the current year. Communism is a disease.

      communism is not a good system, but Sanders does not support communism, he supports some socialist policies, which do make sense. The US has double the cost of healthcare compared to the next closest country. And if you work your whole life and do everything right including having health insurance why should you have to declare medical bankruptcy from getting a treatable illness? Privatization of healthcare makes absolutely no sense and there are other issues where privatization is also dumb.

    25. Re: Trump just says stuff by Ranbot · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Trump just says stuff because he doesn't actually know how anything works....

      Wrong.

      Trump says these things because he knows how the media works. He makes wild statements because it gets media outlets, bloggers, and every day people talking about him. As long as he's in the news and in the headlines his "stock" rises. It's very similar to how pundits generate attention [and ultimately profits] for their media businesses, Trump just happens to be running for president. This most recent claim, like so many others before, is outrageous, but Trump knows it will never come back to him to follow through on and it serves his purposes now. Just look at this page and the 350+ comments in less than 5 hours all talking about Trump! The fact that the nation doesn't just ignore Trump's inane statements and we hang on his every word is as big of a problem as he is.

      I could use many bad words to describe Donald Trump, but dump or stupid is not one of them.

    26. Re: Trump just says stuff by phantomfive · · Score: 4, Insightful

      It's great we live in America, which has a system designed to survive through a string of lousy presidents.

      --
      "First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
    27. Re:Trump just says stuff by tlhIngan · · Score: 5, Insightful

      The trouble is, depending on your age, you almost HAVE to take them when you get to retirement age.

      This money was forceably taken from my pay over many decades, rather than giving me a choice on how best to invest it for myself. If given that choice early on in my employment history, I could have e invested it and I'd be more well off by having that money grow more, and I could use it.

      But when you get close to retirement age, well....you've thrown so much money into the pot, it makes no sense not to try to draw a little of it back from the well.

      Guess what? It's going to be taken from you no matter what.

      People seem to think "social safety net? That's for irresponsible people". Guess what? There are irresponsible people, and they cost you and I money. Either we plan for this and accommodate the fact that there will be irresponsible people and make it so everyone gets to benefit, for we pay for it via increased costs in everything.

      Let's take a few examples. Say you save for retirement. You don't want to give money for stuff that others need like social security because you're responsible, so you want to keep that money for yourself and invest it giving yourself a nice retirement account. Well, what about those who didn't, couldn't, or wouldn't? The end up on the street, and do petty crimes and all that. If they shoplift, well, the stores have to pay for the missing goods, increased security, etc., by raising prices. We all suffer because we, the responsible ones, pay for that increased cost. If they get caught and are sent through the justice system, WE again pay for the policing, the courts and the jails. In other words, we pay.

      Healthcare - again, people seem to think they can buy insurance, or just save it themselves. Well, there's a group who qualified for neither, or again, could not, would not, save for health. They get sick, they go to the ER, and everyone else pays for the medical treatment. Even worse, emergency room medical treatment is among the most EXPENSIVE treatment there is - so not only are we paying for other's irresponsibility, we're paying for the most expensive care available.

      I can go on and on and on. But it basically shows that you DO have to plan for others to be irresponsible because it's human nature, and if you don't, you end up paying for it. It's why countries have social security nets, national healthcare, etc - because really, you're going to pay anyhow, so why not pay to make it efficient and available to everyone rather than those who end up gaming the system and costing us all.

      And it's why ideas like basic income are being reinvigorated, because we're all going to pay somehow or other.

      Anyone who claims otherwise is just looking to reduce their tax bill in favor of making you pay more.

    28. Re:Trump just says stuff by hey! · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Yes, I know about the political compass, but I believe it is intrinsically flawed as a guide to authoritarian behavior. Yes, you can be located in the upper left or right hand quadrants in terms of your theoretical opinions, but authoritarian leaders will always do what's most opportunistic and self-serving regardless of what they say they're for on the left/right axis.

      Take the Nazi Party -- aka the "National Socialists". Their early platform fits very poorly into the political compass model; or rather it fits rather neatly into the model in a misleading way. They were authoritarian leftists according to the political compass model, in particular they were corporatists -- which doesn't refer to rule by business corporations, but rather rule by institutions representing groups in society. They also had racist and nationalistic planks to their program which differ dramatically from other upper left-hand quadrant parties.

      All of the positions espoused by the Nazi party have a simple, straightforward explanation: mass insecurity, leading to fear and resentment of foreigners and of the elite. The resentment of foreigners accounts for the "national" part of national socialism, and the resentment of the elite accounts for the "socialism". However when Hitler gained the chancellorship he had no more use for the anti-elitist strain in the Nazi party, so he quickly moved to purge the party of its socialist elements in the Night of Long Knives. This illustrated the behavioral unreliability of authoritarian leaders I'm talking about. According to his rhetoric Hitler was as national socialist as ever, but given the lack of interest of authoritarians in consistency that's mere lip service. Authoritarian leaders always act to consolidate their power; their views on the other axis are window dressing. And the nature of authoritarian followers is to follow regardless of the leader's ideological inconsistencies.

      That's not to say that the wise authoritarian doesn't take some care in shifting his positions. I think this explains the vital role of anti-semitism in the success of Naziism. The Nazis were initially anti-capitalist and anti-communist; but by identifying both with Jews they could keep some pretense of consistency while coopting big business and playing footsie with Stalin. You see what's really wrong with capitalism is the Jews; so doubling down on the anti-semitism allows you to shift right because it was really the Jewish element of capitalism that was the problem. Of course it's all opportunistic nonsense, and trying to locate that nonsense on some political axis is a waste of time. The one consistent thing about the Nazis was they could be relied upon to consolidate their power.

      I also think that left/right axis of the political compass is a gross oversimplification, but that's a story for another day. Yes, the political compass is better than collapsing all differences to a single axis, but it's still simplistic.

      --
      Post may contain irony: discontinue use if experiencing mood swings, nausea or elevated blood pressure.
  2. Politician-Speak by Jason+Levine · · Score: 4, Insightful

    For someone who claims to not be a politician, Trump is very good as politician-speak - the art of telling people you'll do things with no intentions/plans/ability to follow through on it.

    Also, I thought Republicans didn't like the government interfering in business? Wouldn't forcing a company to redo its entire operations just to keep everything in America fall under government interference? How long until people realize that President Trump won't be able to do half the things he claims he'll do?

    --
    My sci-fi novel, Ghost Thief, is now available from Amazon.com.
    1. Re:Politician-Speak by Drethon · · Score: 4, Insightful

      For someone who claims to not be a politician, Trump is very good as politician-speak - the art of telling people you'll do things with no intentions/plans/ability to follow through on it.

      Also, I thought Republicans didn't like the government interfering in business? Wouldn't forcing a company to redo its entire operations just to keep everything in America fall under government interference? How long until people realize that President Trump won't be able to do half the things he claims he'll do?

      If he pulled off half of what he claims, he would be 10x better than any previous candidate.

    2. Re:Politician-Speak by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      If he pulls off half of what he claims, he'll make America in 2017 look a hell of a lot like Germany in 1939. Only with smartphones.

    3. Re:Politician-Speak by Chris+Mattern · · Score: 4, Insightful

      He says he would raise taxes on businesses manufacturing outside the US. That seems like a practical and implementable, if stupid, plan.

      Except that it breaks about half-a-dozen treaties, of course.

  3. Treaty obligations by silas_moeckel · · Score: 4, Insightful

    As in how many would we have to back out of to do this?

    --
    No sir I dont like it.
  4. 10 yrs out with robotics by justcauseisjustthat · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Apple will be assembling productsin the US within 10 yrs, using robotics, but it won't help employment rates because it will all be robotics based.

  5. Do as I say, not as I do by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

    When Trump starts making his own crap in the US, maybe he can be taken seriously on the issue.

  6. This tax would have problems by maroberts · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Its effectively a disguised import tariff and the US has gone to a lot of trouble to get "free trade" agreements with many countries, or alternatively deals with minimal customs duties. He'll end up with the regulatory bodies saying that this form of tax is illegal under the agreements and the USA would have to pay a lot of compensation

    --

    Donte Alistair Anderson Roberts - hi son!
    Karma: Chameleon

  7. Re:Not that I like Trump, but... by njnnja · · Score: 5, Insightful

    While I agree with your analysis about the fact that companies will find ways to legally avoid the tax ("loopholes"), it is unlikely that the cost of the iPhone will go up as a result. Non-commodity firms like Apple charge the highest price they can get away with in the marketplace, regardless of their costs. If they thought the same number of people would pay $50 extra for an iPhone, that is what the price tag would be already. When costs go up, in the short run, Apple just becomes less profitable because of the higher costs. In the medium run, the next generations of iPhones will tend to have a focus on cost cutting because competitors will have to lessen features to remain profitable under the new regulations, so Apple can afford to cut costs and still look better than the competition by comparison. In the long run, the decision to mass produce the next iWhatever will have to incorporate these extra costs in the evaluation of whether the total costs of R&D + production + regulatory costs are sufficiently less than the revenue they will get for it. If the costs are too great to produce the profit their investors demand, they will not produce the iWhatever.

    True, apple will claim that this (or any) new government mandate will "require" them to increase prices by $x, but that is just lip service to try to avoid the policy from going into effect. And if it does go into effect anyways, then whatever extra they add onto the price is only done because they now believe that people will pay more (possibly because other manufacturers will reduce their product selection, and with decreased competition, Apple can increase prices).

  8. Re:Ted Cruz is a lawyer. he has ignored NASA by UnknowingFool · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Unfortunately, the only thing in the Senate Ted Cruz is the head of, is the Senate Subcommittee on Space and Science (NASA).

    And when Cruz runs up against someone reasonably intelligent, it clearly shows. In this hearing before the Senate Subcommittee, watch as Cruz tries to subtly make his point that NASA was spending too much money on climate change. NASA Administrator Charles Bolden tactfully makes a fool of Cruz by pointing out some key points: 1) He doesn't know what numbers Cruz is talking about because they are not the official budget numbers (Cruz is a liar) and 2) the decrease in space exploration was directed by Congress to NASA to spend less (Cruz is a hypocrite).

    --
    Well, there's spam egg sausage and spam, that's not got much spam in it.