Slashdot Mirror
Researchers Improve Efficiency of Plug-in Hybrid Electric Vehicles By Almost 12% (dispatchtribunal.com)
hypnosec writes: A new study has put forward claims that by working on and improving the energy management system (EMS) that decides when the switch from 'all-electric' mode to 'hybrid' mode in plug-in hybrid electric vehicles, efficiency of these vehicles can be improved by as much as 12 per cent. Researchers have shown in their lab tests that blended discharge strategies wherein power from the battery is used throughout the trip, have proven to be more efficient at minimizing fuel consumption and emissions.
Since gas is between $1-$2 a gallon now I think the need for hybrids has passed.
"Passed" isn't quite the right word. These prices are something Saudi Arabia is doing on purpose to try to run all the US shale oil producers out of business. If their plan works (Mwaahahahah! Good kitty), presumably they will then be able to go right back up to the higher prices they were selling Oil at 5 years ago.
Since gas is between $1-$2 a gallon now I think the need for hybrids has passed.
short memory you have... Look past election day and we'll be back in $3-4 territory
Did I post something?
They just lower the price so that its below all regernative energy, and if we develop the new solar collector that is even cheaper to produce, oil will get even cheaper. The spiral only ends at the price of the extraction of the fossile sources and that's pretty low, we won't get green energy so cheap in this half of the century, especially as extraction will probably get cheaper as well (better technology etc).
The only real option to meet the 2 degree goal is to get all countries together and to not let the stuff out of the earth. Otherwise someone somewhere burns it, whoever it is. Even if you banned all fossile energy in your country, there are many other countries more than eager to buy the oil. Industrial revolution of Africa? The chinese are already preparing it.
I hope you are right.
Basically what they're doing is optimizing the electric/gas switching for specific routes to make best use of the battery (e.g. plan so that it doesn't run out of juice halfway up a hill). In order to make that generally applicable, each car would have to constantly track location and other telemetry and send it back to a central database to build a map of all common routes. Alternatively, it could also be used as a self contained system that would learn the best strategy for your normal commute, but then it would have no benefit on roads you haven't driven before.
Knowledge Brings Fear
It's not just about gas usage, it's about minimizing emissions, too:
"more efficient at minimizing fuel consumption AND emissions."
Well, they're pretty much interchangeable. Ignoring minor side products, 1 C -> 1 CO2.
My grandma would not appreciate your comment. She was fond of saying
"If each person swept their own doorstep, the whole world would be clean."
You can hold the price of oil low with oversupply and create market disturbance if you want, but only for so long.
Not so much Saudi Arabia, Iraq, Iran, and many others... but the US economy is very diverse for a major petroleum producer.
Happiness in intelligent people is the rarest thing I know.
Ernest Hemingway
You missed right after they buy up all the bankrupt shale gas producers.
The middle east is running out of oil. Countries like Dubai are investing heavily in alternative markets to deal with the impending end of black gold - Dubai is basically trying to be a high end tourist resort, for example.
Saudi Arabia is trying to do it another way - buy up the next set of oil producers so the profits can be taken that way - bankrupt the existing oil producers in North America, buy them all up, and then jack up the prices and let the profits flow into the country. So even when they run out of oil, they still own all the companies producing oil in other countries, thus ensuring prosperity of their own.
Plus, I think they also want to bankrupt Iran who because of the nuclear treaty can sell oil on the market again.
My grandma would not appreciate your comment. She was fond of saying
"Mein Auto fährt auch ohne Wald."
(if you haven't guessed, she was German)
Countries like Dubai
You mean countries that are actually cities?
and their air quality. The nice thing about electrics is they don't really pollute outside of the factories and power plants that make/fuel them. And it's a _lot_ easier to deal with the pollution from 1000 plants & factories than 1 million individual cars.
Hi! I make Firefox Plug-ins. Check 'em out @ https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/youtube-mp3-podcaster/
The only real option to meet the 2 degree goal is to get all countries together and to not let the stuff out of the earth. Otherwise someone somewhere burns it, whoever it is
Well, at some point, petroleum's value as a chemical feed stock exceeds its value as a fuel. Then, you're not burning it. Petroleum is used for a whole lot of things besides just burning.
Congratulations on saying the dumbest, most shortsighted thing I've read all week.
We hope your rules and wisdom choke you / Now we are one in everlasting peace
I'd say that Saudi Arabia doesn't much care whether or not shale gets shut down, they can produce oil for less so they are doing that to gain market share. They don't value the oil in the ground and they don't value the distant (beyond 2040) future, so they're looking to maximize their income today. Any hardship on other oil producers, the ecology, or the future is incidental - of no concern to the decision makers who will be long dead when those imagined problems might happen.
If they do jack the prices back up, capped wells can be uncapped and start producing relatively quickly. Also, the US industry is hoping that the LNG export market that is opening up will raise prices, giving them the funds to bide their time on the oil market.
New companies are constantly formed so what Saudi buys today doesn't lock much in.
As for this 12% efficiency gain... did they calculate the extra cycles on the battery and it's increased expense?
It's not about companies, it is about wells.
I don't think you quite understand. Saudi Arabia doesn't get to just dictate what the price of oil is.
That was the case 6 months ago. Now Saudi Arabia is peeing their pants in fear and regret. Their high prices created the incentive to develop shale extraction and make it economical. There is enough oil shale in the world to produce for decades. Every time I hear a report on what a barrel of shale oil can be produced for it's lower than the last time. OPEC fucked up, big time.
Not major, the largest.
That's what the guy you're tailgating said.
I was wondering where all the Diesel engine software engineers from Volkswagen went after their 'improvements' to the emissions system in diesel VWs was 'discovered'... Now I know - they went to work on hybrid cars apparently.
Call me when the amount of CO2 released per gallon decreases along with the price.
By manually controlling the switchover between electric mode and hybrid mode in my Prius Plug-in I can get over 20 miles per charge (100Wh/mile), which is double what the car gets if you just let it manage things. Once you figure out that electric mode is more efficient for maintaining speed on flat or downhill ground (low engine load), and gas is more efficient for acceleration and climbing uphill (high engine load), you can push a plug-in far more than the factory programming would achieve.
I'm guessing you're referring to the US. However there are many countries where various taxes on gas are much higher, so that the dropping oil prices are felt less at the pump.
I took a look at the NOX emissions from typical hybrids. They are shockingly low. Kid you not the emissions from hybrids are a tenth that of standard cars.
There are countries with high taxes, where the gas price is not so close connected to the oil price.
Also: plenty of people own a Hybrid already, so if a simple software change can safe them fuel/money and reduces CO2 output, why not?
Cost free eBook I read (by iBook/Kobo/Amazon/ObookO/Gutenberg etc.): "The Green Odyssey" by Philip Jose Farmer.
Yes, like Monaco, St. Marino, Vatican or the Principat d'Andorra ... and perhaps two dozen more.
Heck: wikipedia even lists Kuwait as city state, IMHO wrongly.
Cost free eBook I read (by iBook/Kobo/Amazon/ObookO/Gutenberg etc.): "The Green Odyssey" by Philip Jose Farmer.
As for this 12% efficiency gain... did they calculate the extra cycles on the battery and it's increased expense? ;D
That does not influence efficiency
Actually that improvement reduces the amount of cycles, so: there are no extra cycles.
A no brainer if you had bothered to read the article, here, I link it again for you: http://www.dispatchtribunal.co...
Cost free eBook I read (by iBook/Kobo/Amazon/ObookO/Gutenberg etc.): "The Green Odyssey" by Philip Jose Farmer.
Fossil power plants are mainly running on coal and gas, not on oil.
To undercut renewables you would also need to build up new oil burning power plants ... that is a huge investment.
Industrial revolution of Africa? The chinese are already preparing it.
Yes, and as renewable plants are cheaper and easier, they mainly build those instead of oil/coal or nuclear plants.
Cost free eBook I read (by iBook/Kobo/Amazon/ObookO/Gutenberg etc.): "The Green Odyssey" by Philip Jose Farmer.
a negligible amount.
Dubai is a country, you asshat.
UAE: Established in December 1971, the country is a federation of seven emirates. The constituent emirates are Abu Dhabi (which serves as the capital), Ajman, Dubai, Fujairah, Ras al-Khaimah, Sharjah, and Umm al-Quwain. Each emirate is governed by an absolute monarch; together, they jointly form the Federal Supreme Council.
You know of any cities that are governed by absolute monarchs that aren't countries? I can think of a city governed by an absolute monarch that nobody disputes is a country.. Vatican City.... Yeah, it's a city.. It's also a country.
Because that's literally the price anywhere in the world where hybrids could be used ...
Try 5 USD/Gallon
http://www.wolframalpha.com/in...
That short term thinking qualifies you to be a Wall Street executive or a congresscritter.
Since electric cares are more efficient, the obvious way to make a hybrid more efficient is to make it full electric.
But you see, it isn't even "oversupply."
Rather, it's "decreasing but not eliminating the artificial supply constraint."
Even today's prices are higher than they would be without the cartel.
That said, the world changed with the Saudi policy of letting prices go below our production cost.
Oh, dear, they'll sell us their oil for less than it costs to produce our own. I'm terrified.
And don't throw me in the briar patch, either . . .
hawk
So basically it's a country in the same way as New York is a country? A city within an administrative region of the same name, in turn within a country of a completely different name?
Still, with US production tapering off slower than anticipated, and world demand lagging, the Saudis would sign on for restricting output if they didn't know what the other OPEC nations would likely do: cheat.
That is the way production cutbacks have worked out, and then the Saudis just lose market share.
Happiness in intelligent people is the rarest thing I know.
Ernest Hemingway
Troll or idiot?
I'm going to pretend idiot and answer you: ... I want to say non-polluting, but that's a lie. Lower polluting plants. Like wind, solar, and possibly even nuclear or fusion. Wind and solar still need better storage and distribution to be practical on a large scale, fission has numerous problems dealing with waste, safety, etc., and fusion isn't here yet. So a slow changeover seems necessary. But we need to have started the process much more vigorously than we have, and we need to have pushed research harder than we did. (Yes, research becomes less efficient when you push it harder, but you still get results faster, if you do it right.)
The real need for hybrids is not because of high gas prices, that's only the enabler. The need is to reduce the rate at which CO2 is emitted into the atmosphere. When the technology is more perfected hybrids will be replaced by electrics, and electrical production plants will be phased over to
Currently the people who champion any one particular source of power as "The Answer" are blind to the faults of that source. They all currently have unacceptable drawbacks. But some of the drawbacks could be handled with significant investment (wind and solar). All could benefit from increased research results.
P.S.: I'd say that fission suffers from too much government regulation, but then I recall that they wouldn't build the existing plants without the government indemnifying them against liability in case of problems. If the builders don't think the plant is safe enough to build, why should I disagree?
I think we've pushed this "anyone can grow up to be president" thing too far.
OPEC has been surprisingly stable compared to historic cartels, largely due to the Saudi dominance and willingness to bear the brunt when the inevitable cheating occurred.
They're playing a different game now, though: that shale isn't going away, and the price of producing it is a ceiling on the cartel price.
*All* cartels eventually end by cheating; some just get there faster than others . . .
(And the *real* key to the Debars cartel was somehow convincing people that the least desirable gemstone, the plain white wine, was the most desirable and only thing to put in an engagement ring . . . before that, diamonds were *less* valuable than rubies, sapphires, etc. . . .)
hawk
Did you ever heard that US isn't the whole world? Gas prices in Europe are still mostly taxes as it should be, and still over 1 EUR per liter, not gallon.
Get one charge to go 350+ miles, same as a tank of gas, and they may have something actually useful. Still can't drive from SF to LA without an overnight to recharge. Too much hassle.
Think cleaner emissions, we still need hybrids.
Vatican City is a sovereign city-state enclaved within Rome (and therefore, Italy). Despite its physical location within the city of Rome, it is not, however, politically a constituent of Rome or Italy. It truly is sovereign and sui generis.
'He who has to break a thing to find out what it is, has left the path of wisdom.' -- Gandalf to Saruman