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Tribeca Film Festival, Robert De Niro Pull Anti-Vaccination Film
theodp writes: USA Today reports that one day after defending the scheduled screening of a controversial documentary linking vaccinations to autism, Tribeca Film Festival co-founder Robert De Niro announced that the film is being pulled from the event. The film, Vaxxed: From Cover-Up to Catastrophe, was scheduled to debut April 24. It is directed by Andrew Wakefield, known to many as the father of the anti-vaccine movement. Wakefield authored a 1998 report on vaccinations and autism that was later retracted, He also had his medical license revoked. The decision to include the film in the festival resulted in outrage from many who are upset that the film's inclusion could offer legitimacy to a study debunked by leading scientists. "My intent in screening this film was to provide an opportunity for conversation around an issue that is deeply personal to me and my family," said De Niro, who has a child with autism. "But after reviewing it over the past few days with the Tribeca Film Festival team and others from the scientific community, we do not believe it contributes to or furthers the discussion I had hoped for."
...Robert DeNiro expected more people to be on his side. He believes that horse-shit that Wakefield published in '98. He's just too much of a coward to admit it in the face of controversy, so rather than stick to his guns he's backpedalled hoping to save face...that and actually get someone talking about the Tribeca Film Festival, of course. No publicity is bad publicity.
So what's the take away here. Do I take health care advice from movie actors or not. If the answer is yes then what about clowns and mimes?
I have a better title for the summary:
Filmmaker Decides to Screen Film for Festival, then Changes Mind
T, FTFY.
What a non-story.
It's simple minded idiots like you that prevent this topic from having any constructive discussion. Go back and read what herd immunity is and maybe you can join the adult table again.
I'm sure it was pretty tough.
One would have to be certifiably insane to get a flu shot.
"the father" is irrelevant. Anti-vax movement was born out of the need to blame someone for bad things. In this case, the evil vaccine overlords. That need is so compelling that the erroneous blame survives in the face of clear scientific evidence.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Herd_immunity
The rate of kids who can't be vaccinated is below the threshold where the virus dies off to fast to spread to large populations. If every one who can get vaccinated gets it, then all the people who cant are also protected. If to many people opt out, then people do get sick. So yes, the people who opt out are more dangerous than the ones who cant be vaccinated.
This is an excellent podcast from 2011. All DeNiro had to do was listen to this.
http://www.econtalk.org/archives/2011/01/deer_on_autism.html
Locating by-State prevalence of autism stats over a decade ago, I started collecting by-State stats on hundreds of variables including vaccinations, mercury, diseases, econometerics, demographics, etc.
Three things stood out: 1) The best single-variable ecological correlation was mother's age at first live birth. 2) The best two-variable ecological correlation was Finnish ancestry and immigration from India. 3) Of all the variables, autism averaged the least powerful correlations with the wide range of by-State variables I had collected.
The mother's age at first live birth was a lower level of correlation than the 2-variable one, but it was more "robust" -- meaning that the scatter of points followed what you would expect from a "normal" distribution.
That was clear back in 2004.
I'm no pro, was not funded and didn't even have a relative with autism spectrum at that time (I do now). The fact that the CDC hasn't conducted an all-out statistical assault of like this at the county level given all the time, money and "big data" available is damning. They just don't care -- or don't want to know.
Seastead this.
Streisand Effect? of course. Nobody would have pressured for the removal of the film if it was about the Flat Earth Society.
"A Little Song, A Little Dance, A Little Seltzer Down your Pants" -Chuckles The Clown
I am surprised, and totally in joy that this film was pulled. Finally we are starting to see some common sense for proper science beating back hysteria and ideology.
I thought this was supposed to be a tech news site....in the past weeks....since dice took over...it's only mainstream crap...and wasn't expecting this from timothy.... maybe from that manishs guy...
Although it is very sad that innocent children sometimes die due to the anti-science viewpoints of their parents, at least the dumb genes will be killed off, thus ensuring a brighter future for humanity. The problem should solve itself in a few generations.
"I'm going to tell these people they are stupid and type in all caps, that usually works pretty well."
"the father" is irrelevant. Anti-vax movement was born out of the need to blame someone for bad things. In this case, the evil vaccine overlords. That need is so compelling that the erroneous blame survives in the face of clear scientific evidence.
And yet ironically, the concept of the Devil was born, and managed to stick around.
Religion has killed millions. Ever wonder what's their (damned) excuse for raging on in the face of clear scientific evidence...
I don't believe in the anti-vaxxer bullshit, but that doesn't mean we should block movies or discussion about it.
Not really. There is no winning move in this game -- either show it, and erode rationalism and empiricism just a little bit more, or don't show it, and allow it to die a martyrs death, which we all know only strengthens believers' faith.
Personally, my vote is for not showing, as it is one way to limit the amount of people exposed to the propaganda. Not by a significant factor, as people usually get misinformed about this topic through the internet, which is a more global medium than a film festival.
They have a fall back position. They'll show films about the faked moon landing, and chemtrails.
The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
"He took the time to press the shift key, Marge. I think he knows what he's talking about"
Modern society allows none to stray from the 'correct opinions' of the hivemind. The issue at hand can be total anti-scientific drivel (like idiots who deny climate change and whackjob anti-vaxxers) or it can be something as simple as an opinion on something from pop culture such as a film or a book.
If you don't align with the narrative of the hivemind, you'll have millions of people finger-wagging at you and signalling to the world how in-tune with 'correct opinions' they are by demanding that you be removed from every public (or even private) space. How dare you have an incorrect opinion?
Hundreds of millions of people are being taught to align the contents of their minds with the hivemind. Critical, reasoned thought can take a backseat to the hivemind when it comes to a conclusion that's "correct". Critical, reasoned thought is in fact racist/misogynist/problematic when it in any way deviates from the hivemind.
Why, insane? No, but are their complaints real or imagined? Are there safer methods of doing the same thing? Or is it just because it costs less doing it this one way? Why use poisions as a preservative for shot materials. To me, that seems illogical. Flu shots, they haven't guessed right yet. Have you noticed, you get sick with the flu, after the shot, if it's done right. Spreading the germs around for others to get sick. And recent advocates say a shot for each type, and the mutations. Hat would be four shots per year.
When have we heard of Hollywood types doing that before?
...Autism or Aspergers...
I WOULD RATHER SHIT LIKE MEASLES, POLIO, MUMPS, WHOOPING COUGH, EVEN RUBELLA, GET WIPED OFF THIS FUCKING PLANET.
P.S. This message was brought to you by someone with Aspergers but is highly-functional. I do not believe Vaccines had any cause of it either. *Thumbs Up*
I have no dog in this fight. But this proves once again that true freedom of speech is baloney in the US right now. You know, the one where both sides get to speak. And this under a regime that claims to be transparent (Bwhahaha) and fair. And to the Hollow-wood types that go Full-retard Hysterical when their little Limousine-Liberal Boutique Cause is concerned, but others they don't like need to be snuffed. And others opinions... not so much. Especially opinions not considered 'kewl.' Those, in fact, get 'no freedom' at all. Imagine that. ~
God, you're so stupid. The government isn't stopping De Niro from showing the film. You need a better understanding of what freedom of speech really means.
Oh yeah, I love it. One knows they've hit a real, true 'nerve,' that is truth, when someone wants a message silenced. And oh look, right here, we have an example. I'm certain most people with a functioning brain do look at the -1 posts to see why they received it. Only the most lazy brain-dead sheep in the herd don't.
So thanks and enjoy.
To paraphrase: All animals are equal, but some animals (pigs) are more equal than others. Ding.
mod parent up
could offer legitimacy to a study debunked
See, this is your problem right here. While I might think that the great space goat created heaven and earth, there is no evidence to support this and therefore I cannot claim it is legitimate or a "fact".
Seven puppies were harmed during the making of this post.
God, you're so stupid. The government isn't stopping De Niro from showing the film. You need a better understanding of what freedom of speech really means.
Wow. Unable to fathom nuance and social behavior influenced by our so-called leaders. Behavior especially emulated by Hollow-wood. Unable to 'get it.' Check.
Projection of low-IQ onto others. Check.
Being 'that guy' in the room, who when told a weird illogical joke, never laughs and sternly cries out "But pigs can't fly dammit!" And everyone in the room rolls their eyes at The Clueless Guy. Check.
Again, wow.
Freedom of speech dosent mean freedom to be stupid and endanger others. Where is my right to shout "fire" in a crowded theater and watch people hurt and kill themselves trying to flee? What about my freedom to enter a bank and shout "this is a robbery - give me all your money!"? The reality denying anti vaxxers have killed many people with thier celebrity endorsed, college of Google graduate quackery. Those motherfuckers should be strung up by thier gonads in a public square and left to rot. And don't think females like Jenny can't be strung up by thier genitals, it is entirely possible and justly deserved.
[...]Those motherfuckers should be strung up by thier gonads in a public square and left to rot. And don't think females like Jenny can't be strung up by thier genitals, it is entirely possible and justly deserved.
And there we have it. Freedom of Speech in Obama's "changed" America.
Hint: A movement who's leading spokes-person is a vacuous Playboy Centerfold with no scientific knowledge should be a leading indicator that something is amiss. Huh. People will figure that out.
But, instead you and others want to go straight to mass murder. That will stop that awful Freedom of Speech! Imagine that. I'll venture a guess. You love Eugenics and sterilization as well? Yeah. Indeed. Or should we just kill those we don't like outright. Oh wait, you said we should. Nice.
Vaccines contain adjuvants and preservatives. The preservatives prevent bacterial growth, since you wouldn't want to inject a toxic bacterial culture (which happened before stuff like thimerosal was used). Adjuvants induce a localised inflammatory response to increase the effect of the immune system against the virus you're innoculating against. Without it, it would have reduced efficacy, or maybe no effect at all. So the reason for their presence is absolutely logical, and was determined by empirical testing to quantify exactly how much was needed, after it was determined that they *were* needed.
You're right that these aren't "nice" things. But they *are* necessary. Like everything there's a tradeoff. In this case, the toxicity of the preservatives and adjuvant against toxic bacterial growth and then benefit of the immunity to viral infection, respectively. Given the tiny amounts used, the negative effect is absolutely minor, and it will mostly get flushed out of the body within a short time. Note that they have not been shown to be harmful. Given that the tradeoff for some of these vaccines is chosing not to have brain damage, die, or suffer other long-term debilitating consequences, any negatives from the preservatives and adjuvants are greatly outweighed. Put it this way: if vaccines did cause autism as claimed by this fraud (which they don't, but let's pretend it's true), then it would *still be worth vaccinating everyone*. Why? Because the tiny chance you would get autism pales in comparison with the ~1/1000 chance of death from measles, and the still higher chance of long-term disability or serious complications. The numbers don't lie. Even if these charlatans were correct, vaccination would still be the correct choice every single time.
Do you really think that the people developing the vaccines would add this stuff for the hell of it, or not be fully aware of the risks involved? Thimerosal usage has been greatly reduced or dropped entirely in response to public hysteria. But it can only be done in the first world where you can manufacture and distribute the vaccine in bulk for immediate usage, since it can no longer be stored. In the third world, or for less commonly-used vaccines, it's still used. And that's still absolutely fine.
As for flu vaccines, like all vaccines they use dead or attenuated virus. Of course it makes you "sick"; having a mild infection (or at least the effects of an infection without actually being infected) and consequently developing an immune response to it is the *entire point* of the vaccine. The attenuation means it's not going to spread significantly in your body or to others, but it *is* sufficient to develop an immune response. Then you'll be protected when a real infection hits you.
behind an extension of trumps wall - if they survive then they should develop immunity to all those illnesses, have lower levels of autism etc. and also prove evolution.
But no they are fucking parasites who hold their right to have stupid beliefs is more important than anything else - yet they leech of the herd protection vaccination gives.
No, it proves you don't know what the whole "free speech" thing is about. Take a quarter and go buy a clue, because you haven't got one at the moment. Now, you could just as easily say that news organizations stifle your free speech when you want to report that the sky is actually pink and paisley, but what they're really doing is simply saying "you're a fucking idiot, begone."
http://xkcd.com/1357/
Fascism: An authoritarian and nationalistic right-wing system of government and social organization. See also: NAZI's
Hint: A movement who's leading spokes-person is a vacuous Playboy Centerfold with no scientific knowledge should be a leading indicator that something is amiss. Huh. People will figure that out.
How's that working out so far? I think you have seriously underestimate how truly fucking stupid people are.
Fascism: An authoritarian and nationalistic right-wing system of government and social organization. See also: NAZI's
I have no dog in this fight. But this proves once again that true freedom of speech is baloney in the US right now. You know, the one where both sides get to speak.
Yes, because it's always two sides, equally valid, with some evil conspiracy acting to silence one side. It's never one well-supported, well-documented consensus, with a handful of deluded fools struggling to cherry-pick two or three anomalous research results out of thousands of thoroughly consistent studies, then scream "Halp! Halp! We're being oppressed!" when the larger community points out that they're likely to occur by chance.
First there's Becky, then we get Rebecca, now there's a TRIbecca? What's next, Quadbecca?
I thought this was supposed to be a tech news site....in the past weeks....since dice took over...it's only mainstream crap...and wasn't expecting this from timothy.... maybe from that manishs guy...
I'd like to file a bug report. This post appears to have come from September 2012, not 2016. Not only has Dice not taken over Slashdot but offloaded it, but also anti-vax movement has been widely discussed since 2012.
Slashdot please fix your database so these posts from the past don't make some people look like they don't know what they are talking about.
I think there's a meaningful difference between being "silenced", i.e. not allowed to speak at all, and what is happening here: having an organization decide, however clumsily, that that organization does not want to give yet another platform for a discredited opinion piece that is a public health danger. Were this issue truly "silenced", we would not be allowed to have this discussion. There's no part of "free speech" that guarantees that you or I must publish something we do not want to. I'd argue that part of my free speech is the right not to promulgate the anti-vaxxer nonsense. It is free speech that they have the right to try to find platforms and publishers. I would not want them silenced. They get free speech too. They have the right to talk to anyone who will listen. But I won't offer them a platform.
Don't step on the baby.
F Di Niro!
Why is he supressing an anti-VAX film?
Leave our PDP-11s alone!
Taking your opinion as fact, how do you explain the recent measles outbreak in Cali being localized only to the vaccinated?
Proper science doesn't censor incorrect results, it lets them speak for themselves.
Agreed, only correct opinions are allowed to be expressed in CURRENTYEAR.
Incorrect opinions are dangerous / racist / misogynistic / anti-refugee / nazi and they need to result in blacklisting from social events. Being excluded from social interaction, tech conferences, film festivals and any other type of gathering for holding an incorrect opinion is not in any way an attack on free speech. Free speech only exists for those of us with correct opinions.
No, it proves you don't know what the whole "free speech" thing is about. Take a quarter and go buy a clue, because you haven't got one at the moment.
Oh but the Mighty meglon with his Hubris and superiority complex will decide what is correct speech... or not. Behold!
Now, you could just as easily say that news organizations stifle your free speech when you want to report that the sky is actually pink and paisley, but what they're really doing is simply saying "you're a fucking idiot, begone."
Yes, oh yes, because anyone you don't agree with is a "fucking idiot" and should be gone. Oh the Mighty meglon has spoken!
You are so far gone up your own ass, with your weak Projection and ego you can't even see it can you? And as a bonus you reach for the sad little "higher authority" ploy as well.
Free speech is only free when it is speech you agree with eh? How does it feel to be a Southern Plantation Owner? Crack that Whip!
It would have been far better and made a more valid point to let the film run to an empty house. That would prove a point. Oh nose! Free Will. Can't have that. No, the Mighty meglom needs to decide for everyone. It's weird, cognitive dissonance I guess,when people talk out of both sides of their mouths. "I love freedom!, when it's the freedom I decide!" So, yeah.
If you're honestly asking the question, I can only presume you missed out on all of the statistics and biology classes you were ever required to take.
But in case you needed a reminder:
1) "Getting sick" does not necessarily mean "becoming infected with influenza." Many common colds manifest symptoms that are very similar to influenza. It's possible your coworkers mis-diagnosed themselves.
2) The flu vaccine developed each flu season is based on the expected mutations of the virus for the upcoming season. Since mutations are less predictable, the vaccine has a chance to match the season's flu strains poorly, well, or somewhere in the middle. If it matches poorly, more people get infected with influenza.
3) Looking at a small sample size - your coworkers - is a poor indication of the population-level efficacy of the vaccine. Influenza can be deadly to elderly, infants, and immuno-compromised individuals. If the influenza vaccine lowers the overall number of deaths each season by a statistically significant number, it is successful - regardless of whether your local pocket of coworkers were all infected or not.
In denial much?
First of all, demonstrate your claim. Produce the numbers,
Otherwise it's just an anonymous guy on the Internet making claims with absolutely no evidence.
The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
Burn all of them!
Comment removed based on user account deletion
At least the anti-vaxxers can take credit for resurrecting diseases we thought had been eradicated.
That's right, thanks to the anti-vaxxer idiots, Measles, Mumps, Whooping Cough, and Chicken Pox are showing up once again.
Thanks, anti-vaxxer fuckheads, thanks a lot for your stupid anti-science delusions which now put everyone's children at risk.
Just cruising through this digital world at 33 1/3 rpm...
How about: The Disneyland outbreak was in fact localized in the unvaccinated (or those whose status was undocumented.)
"Among the 110 California patients, 49 (45%) were unvaccinated; five (5%) had 1 dose of measles-containing vaccine, seven (6%) had 2 doses, one (1%) had 3 doses, 47 (43%) had unknown or undocumented vaccination status, and one (1%) had immunoglobulin G seropositivity documented, which indicates prior vaccination or measles infection at an undetermined time.
"Twelve of the unvaccinated patients were infants too young to be vaccinated. Among the 37 remaining vaccine-eligible patients, 28 (67%) were intentionally unvaccinated because of personal beliefs, and one was on an alternative plan for vaccination.
"Among the 28 intentionally unvaccinated patients, 18 were children (aged http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/previe...
"Ruthlessly pursuing the idea that the accordion is just another instrument."
Broke my link, sorry:
http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/previe...
"Ruthlessly pursuing the idea that the accordion is just another instrument."
Honest answer here: maybe you're coworkers are just unlucky. Can't say that I've ever heard of any coworkers coming down with the flu after getting vaccinated, nor have I ever myself.
(Lenovo's hypersensitive touchpad strikes again. Finishing the last paragraph.)
With effective herd immunity, the number and/or strength of immunizations can be lower than with a constant threat of exposure from mini-epidemics. There are legitimate risks associated with additional immunizations, so the smart move is to stop when the risks of the immunizations approach or exceed the risks they mitigate. With a large population of anti-vaxser victims, the risks from disease are higher and the crossover is pushed out.
The anti-vaxxers are creating extra risk from immunizations for the rest of us. Thanks for the self-fulfilling prophecy, guys!
Bantam Dominique roosters crow a four-note song. Once you've heard it as "Happy BIRTHday" you can't NOT hear it that way
The glaring problem with this debate is that no one supporting the pro-vaccine side displays the discipline to assume the other side could possibly be valid. This means they do not have the discipline to discern the truth. The reason for this is that they are judging the available information unevenly. They are applying a single and unchanging pattern of thought to multiple scopes of data. They are unwilling to break down the details and find the underlying causes of confusion. The are convinced they have spotted the problem too early on in their analysis of the situation.
Take it or leave it. This is a hard life lesson.
You and your dipshit friend below are too stupid to understand a cartoon i see. Not surprising, given the bent of your whining. Idiocracy wasn't a comedy, it was a documentary... one that you to inbreds are living up to.
Fascism: An authoritarian and nationalistic right-wing system of government and social organization. See also: NAZI's
It's all part of a government conspiracy. Follow the money it's all there. Big Pharma doesn't make anything off preventing a disease in the first place let alone curing it. It's all a cabal of 435 powerful individuals in Washington. They funded it, they're pushing it! And their shadow agenda? A healthier populace that can work and pay more in taxes!
[P]ut all the anti vaxxers in their own tribe behind an extension of trumps wall - if they survive then they should develop immunity to all those illnesses, have lower levels of autism etc. and also prove evolution.
That experiment has already been run:
- Many tribes of the American Indians had substantial public works infrastructure, medical procedures, and cultural biases (like hygiene) that helped protect them from disease.
- The Europeans went through a thousand years of "Dark Ages" when "mortifying the flesh" was a way of life, baths were exceptional occurrences for much of the population, and waves of plagues decimated the population repeatedly.
So when the Europeans arrived, they brought with them some pretty severe diseases which most of them could survive and to which the American Indians were substantially more susceptible and more likely to find fatal. Several major civilizations were wiped out and their populations knocked down to minor handfuls. (And some tribes that had been relatively minor, but had access to early Smallpox immunizations, became major powers in the next decades.)
Estimates of the indigenous American population's reduction due to imported European diseases run as high as 90-95%
Bantam Dominique roosters crow a four-note song. Once you've heard it as "Happy BIRTHday" you can't NOT hear it that way
Isn't that what everyone on slashdot does?
You just summed up our community in a nut shell. Should get rid of news for nerds and replace it with your saying.
Proper science doesn't censor incorrect results, it lets them speak for themselves.
Proper science is conducted in scientific journals, not through bad propaganda films.
Men lie, woman lie, numbers don't.
Then explain why an outbreak occurred on a navy ship with 99% of its people vaccinated. Heard immunity is BS. http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/mm6342a3.htm
There are lies, damned lies, and statistics.
While I'm not a virologist, I did do my PhD in an immunology lab and am fairly well grounded in how the immune system works. So it's not really "opinion", it's current scientific understanding (well, reasonably current, I've been working in another field the last four years). And it's not like the facts are not readily available. You can read about all this stuff with minimal effort. The basics are high school science (second year for me...); the more advanced stuff is in any immunology text, you can get a second hand copy of one for almost nothing, or you can look it all up online.
Regarding the outbreak, I'll defer to the other comment here regarding the numbers. However, I'll just add this: being vaccinated *does not mean you won't get infected*. It *does* mean that the body is prepared to mount a rapid secondary immune response when infection does occur. Unlike a primary immune response, which occurs on the first infection (or when mimicked with a vaccine) and takes days or weeks to elicit a response, the secondary response is much quicker since you already have the necessary memory cells waiting to be called into action, and it's also much more effective for various reasons (e.g. affinity maturation and isotype switching). You'll get over the infection quickly, and you'll likely not be as infectious to others, but you'll still have an infection for a brief period and you're still at risk of complications, though significantly reduced from an unvaccinated individual. Example: I had measles twice as a child, despite being vaccinated; the difference was it was a few days with spots feeling slightly miserable, rather than spending a fortnight seriously ill getting long term organ damage. Seriously, look up and read about herd immunity. Loss of that is a risk to the entire population, but most especially to the children of uninformed idiots who opted out of getting vaccinated. Vaccination prevents the spread of serious diseases through the population, and the stuff we vaccinate against *is* serious; don't forget that before vaccination programmes, these were routinely killing and maiming hundreds of thousands every year and child mortality was common, rather than an exception. I.e. worrying about a one in a million chance of autism when there's a one in a thousand chance of death or an even higher chance of brain or other organ damage is totally illogical.
Immunology is a fascinating field; there's a huge amount being discovered all the time, but this stuff has been well understood for many decades. There's not any doubt about any of the above, it's been studied extensively by many hundreds of thousands of researchers and medics around the world. We continue to discover new cell subsets which add extra details to the picture, and which expand our understanding of specific diseases and autoimmune conditions, but the basics were nailed down comprehensively a long while back. It's not like vaccines are new or that the way they work isn't understood. We understand how the whole lots works at the molecular level, from all the components of a virus, to how it controls the cellular machinery, to antigen presentation and detection and the selection and expansion of the immune cells to counter it, including how T and B cells vary at the genetic level, even by single base pairs, to do the affinity maturation and isotype switching I mentioned above.
What I do find incredible is that people are totally uninformed about what vaccines are, how they work, and why they are important. Not only because it's taught to everyone (it certainly is in the UK), so you don't have an excuse not to know, but also because it's trivial to *get* informed. As the comment I originally replied to showed, there's a lot of misinformed opinions flying around, partly due to irrational fear, partly due to media attention despite there being zero evidence for any problems, and partly due to irrational nutjobs. Whatever the reasons, it's takes very little effort to educate yourself about the *reality* of how this stuff works should you choose to do so, and given that the "debate" over this stuff is without any merit whatsoever, it's clear that education to get people informed is definitely needed.
I too worked in a large office at a company with over 20k employees and observed that most of those I worked with who religiously got their flu vaccine would still get sick. They won't accept that the vaccine didn't help them. Hey, to each their own, live and let live! Just don't force your snake oil on me.
Then explain how an outbreak occurred on a navy ship with 99% of its people vaccinated. Heard immunity is BS. http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/mm6342a3.htm
What happens when they perfect the artificial womb? Science will show how it's 1000 times safer for the woman and the child. What's wrong with a more natural/primitive lifestyle? It's a choice. You sure of your answer? Next will be natural sex vs doctor insemination in order to eliminate VD and other biological contaminants. Then reduced sodium and no beef. And finally we have the world in the Silvester Stallone Judge Dredd movie. It's quality of life and happiness issues. People should be able to live how they wish and take risks and choose what and how they invest their risks. Everything is belief including science.
Only religions try to dictate how people should live.
are not the cause of the resurgence of these diseases in the USA.
These diseases, and Tuberculosis too were largely (or completely in some cases) eliminated in the US by the combination of Vaccines, hygiene, and the federal government enforcing the borders. Remember: when huge populations of European immigrants came to the USA, they came through Ellis Island and any that failed health screenings or could not demonstrate that they would not become dependent on the government were loaded back onto ships and sent back to Europe without ever being allowed onto the mainland of the USA.
With the HIV/AIDS epidemic, TB returned to the USA as political pressure was applied to allow AIDS sufferers into the country; for the first time in US history, sufferers of a disease were treated as a political cause whose contagion was protected and the public was intentionally exposed (to the airborne TB). Pre-AIDS, TB was controlled in America, in part, by isolating the sufferers away from the rest of the public who they could easily infect just by breathing. We have been spoiled by vaccines however and the public has been told to tolerate the presence of people with such diseases now and rely on vaccines to save them. This might work well as long as our vaccines and antibiotics remain effective, but if the drugs begin to fail in the face of "superbugs" we may need to go back to quarantines (which have NO risks or side-effects for the health population).
With the modern bi-partisan open-borders treatment of people entering the USA illegally, the elites who want those immigrants for cheap labor or for future votes have decided to ignore the tidal wave of illnesses that have been brought into the country. These elites are all likely vaccinated, their kids go to elite private schools, and they mostly not have direct contact with these immigrants while their bank accounts grow from increased corporate profits. The huge number of often illiterate poor immigrants from 3rd world countries with no immunization and often carrying illnesses not before seen in the US are a FAR larger problem than the far smaller pool of Luddites who fear injections.
If we are serious about these diseases, we should prove it by first shutting off the influx of millions who are not properly vaccinated and have no lawful right to be here, before properly fussing about a few thousand citizens with delusional beliefs about pharmaceutical companies.
Correct. But proper science also doesn't censor bad propaganda films.
Actually, he already did, you just failed to understand.
No, I don't agree with the anti-vaxxers and I think they're positively delusional.
However, take a moment to consider what you've done. You've called me "an inbred" for daring to argue against censoring them for their views. Let's not mince words here either, this is censorship based on the fear that allowing 'incorrect opinions' in this film festival will lead to backlash from the hivemind. Censorship can be practiced by entities other than the government, and it's just as damaging when society tries to silence people at the behest of the hivemind of correct opinions.
If we're living in Idiocracy, you'd be one of the people sitting around the table yelling that plants just need Brawndo and trying to silence anyone who suggested otherwise.
LOL at "herd immunity". I see that YOU couldn't even comprehend what I was saying: We have two types of people who aren't 'vaccinated':
1) People who can't be 'vaccinated' because they allegedly have immune system reactions to 'vaccines'.
2) People who CHOOSE not to be 'vaccinated' because they found out it was all a load of bullshit.
You and all the other assholes on here who believe in Jenner's fraud say that people in group 2 are a 'danger' to everybody else and are preventing 'herd immunity' (which is laughable and doesn't exist - see: http://www.vaccinationcouncil.org/2012/02/18/the-deadly-impossibility-of-herd-immunity-through-vaccination-by-dr-russell-blaylock/), but people in group 1 are innocent victims and somehow AREN'T dangerous to everybody else, and aren't preventing 'herd immunity'.
Is that simple enough for you, special snowflake? Idiots like you want to prevent people from group 2 from even going to school because of the mythical 'herd immunity' problem, but people from group 1 ARE JUST AS 'DANGEROUS', according to your own insane beliefs, except that they have DIFFERENT THOUGHTS and therefore aren't dangerous, and ARE ALLOWED TO GO TO SCHOOL, without dicks like you condemning them. So why aren't people in group 1 just as much of a risk to OTHERS in group 1, as people in group 2 allegedly are? You fucking idiots.
Was that simple enough for you?
Hint: A movement who's leading spokes-person is a vacuous Playboy Centerfold with no scientific knowledge should be a leading indicator that something is amiss. Huh. People will figure that out.
How's that working out so far? I think you have seriously underestimated how truly fucking stupid people are.
Ha! Wait till he finds out about religion!
-- sudon't
Air-ride Equipped
Like the bulk of Hollywood celebrities, deNiro thinks that because he is famous, he must be smart. Unfortunately, most Americans agree. Because he is smart, his opinion must automatically be correct. This time, he got his tit caught in a wringer, to quote John Mitchell.
Well, I'm going to make a guess and assume you are talking about our border with Mexico. Guess you don't know or care to know that Mexico follows the CDC guidelines for vaccinations. They give free vaccinations to all children.
So really what we're basically dealing with here is stupidity. Unfortunately for you there is no vaccination for that.
Go back and read what herd immunity is
Why the fuck does "herd immunity" matter if the vaccinated don't get the virus? The issue real is that vaccines don't work nearly as well as you've been told. See also: The outbreak at Disney. It wasn't due to non-vaccinated people, it was due to the ineffective vaccine.
Additionally, children only got a handfull of vaccines in the 70's / 80's, but then Big Pharma lobbied to win an exemption against all possible harm due to vaccines. Suddenly we're giving kids tens of vaccines before they become adults, and the "herd immunity" propaganda has been used to make these vaccines MANDATORY. If they were really necessary we would have been giving the shots before hand, but now vaccines are hugely profitable and have no risk for the marketeers thereof, who can now DEMAND that you MUST pay for their useless product which can have serious side effects they're no longer liable for. Why don't you think this is odd? You haven't researched the issue at all, really. Just admit it. Cognitive dissonance much?
TL;DR: "Herd immunity" doesn't exist or else that measles outbreak at Disney wouldn't have happened, fool.
What studies? Citations please or GTFO
You show some serious lack of understanding about what influenza actually is.
The grandparent just explained it to you, and you just showed that what he said went in one ear and out the other.
And yet ironically, the concept of the Devil was born, and managed to stick around.
I don't know that that is irony. It's more another example of what the parent post said -- when we don't immediately see the source of "bad things that happen," we invent it to band together against it. Human society has always favored uniting against an adversary over just accepting that "Shit happens."
Haha, wrong. And with a specific study dated like two weeks ago. More than half of measles cases due to unvaccinated but vaccine-eligible people. See
http://jama.jamanetwork.com/mobile/article.aspx?articleid=2503179
You and your dipshit friend below are too stupid to understand a cartoon i see. Not surprising, given the bent of your whining. Idiocracy wasn't a comedy, it was a documentary... one that you to inbreds are living up to.
And of course, this laughable superior attitude is from someone who can't put together a cogent sentence and has a pathologic aversion to any spell-checker ever made. But, he makes up for it with classless swearing, vapid "insults" and having no idea what he is gurgling forth.
The Dunning-Kruger Effect at its finest. Or worst, depending on the Sh-Meglon effect. Ewww, icky! Don't get any on you!
Side note since you like cartoons. Do you live in San Francisco? Do you drive a Prius? Do you like the smell of your own farts? (Clearly you do since you have your head firmly up your own ass.) Occam's Razor says yes to each. So avail yourself of South Park's Smug Alert! episode (S10:E2). It's incredibly doubtful you'll even get it, since you don't get much, but one can hope. ~Enjoy.
Mexico may follow CDC guidelines, the problem is Mexico takes in more illegal immigrants than the US does by itself where Mexico is a huge transition point from South America, Central America and the Caribbeans, to the US, where people are from countries that don't have effective means of dealing with diseases.
The illegal immigration into Mexico just completely pales in comparison to the US and it's why Mexico is all too happy to help them get into the US with whatever means possible, because that means Mexico doesn't have to take care of them.
Unfortunately, though it's obvious the links between Autism and certain vaccinations is negligible if not zero, there are still plenty of risks with vaccines, which I believe shouldn't be mandatory for that reason.
My personal experience was getting French Polio due to a flu shot. It's no fun, and it's certainly caused by the flu shot. I wouldn't wish it on anyone, least of all children.
If you only read the biased blurb posing as a post, you would imagine that the movie is about Dr. Andrew Wakefield. Follow the link to the movie's website, and you will find that it focuses on Dr. William Thompson, CDC Senior Scientist & Whistleblower.
A case of fraud has been uncovered in the CDC data linking vaccination to Autism. This data seems to contradict the 'Nail in the Coffin' cohort longitudinal study (a study is not an experiment) that practically nobody who claims to have an opinion actually read.
Instead of focusing on the individual, focus on the facts. You can read Wakefield's own words regarding his research. You can call Wakefield names, but keep in mind that history is littered with scientists who were vilified and ultimately vindicated. For instance, Nobel Laureate Dr. Barry Marshall for suggesting that H Pylori could live within the acidic environment of the stomach.
Personally, I trust that science will ultimately prevail in due time. I also recognize that there is a genetic link, and there may be other environmental factors that have not been thoroughly researched, such as diet, antibiotics, plastics, etc. Finally, I would be willing to accept that even if a link between Autism and vaccination is ultimately proven, the vaccination campaign may still doing more good than harm to society.
The bottom line is that a mob, such as this, grabs their pitchforks without thinking. The many responses on this and similar Slashdot posts do not further knowledge. They only spread FUD.
If you're honestly asking the question, I can only presume you missed out on all of the statistics and biology classes you were ever required to take.
But in case you needed a reminder:
1) "Getting sick" does not necessarily mean "becoming infected with influenza." Many common colds manifest symptoms that are very similar to influenza. It's possible your coworkers mis-diagnosed themselves.
2) The flu vaccine developed each flu season is based on the expected mutations of the virus for the upcoming season. Since mutations are less predictable, the vaccine has a chance to match the season's flu strains poorly, well, or somewhere in the middle. If it matches poorly, more people get infected with influenza.
3) Looking at a small sample size - your coworkers - is a poor indication of the population-level efficacy of the vaccine. Influenza can be deadly to elderly, infants, and immuno-compromised individuals. If the influenza vaccine lowers the overall number of deaths each season by a statistically significant number, it is successful - regardless of whether your local pocket of coworkers were all infected or not.
Adding on to your #3, one of the flu epidemics of recent years (I can't remember if it was swine flu or bird flu or even some other flu) was bad because it was more likely to kill healthy adults then those who are usually susceptible to influenza deaths. This was due to the reaction that a healthy person's immune system had to the particular strain of virus.
I have no dog in this fight. But this proves once again that true freedom of speech is baloney in the US right now. You know, the one where both sides get to speak.
Yes, because it's always two sides, equally valid, with some evil conspiracy acting to silence one side. It's never one well-supported, well-documented consensus, with a handful of deluded fools struggling to cherry-pick two or three anomalous research results out of thousands of thoroughly consistent studies, then scream "Halp! Halp! We're being oppressed!" when the larger community points out that they're likely to occur by chance.
Yes, because it's always two sides, equally valid slave owners, with some evil slave driven conspiracy acting to silence one side. It's never one well-supported slave owner, well-documented consensus of slave owning, with a handful of deluded fools (that being slaves) struggling to cherry-pick two or three anomalous research results out of thousands of thoroughly consistent slave owner studies, then scream "Halp! Halp! We're being oppressed!" when the larger slave owning community points out that they're likely to occur by chance.
Sure. The times, they are a' changin' or perhaps getting blown by the wind.
Here’s one. “Never believe everything you read on the internets.” – Abraham Lincoln.
The flu is known to mutate and spread quickly. So chances are that flu shot won't do a damn thing for any of the new flavor of the season strains.
Just in case any retard thinks this is how all viruses work, think again. The flu is rather unique.
http://howdovaccinescauseautis...
Silence is a state of mime.
The answer is in the article you linked:
"Influenza A virus was isolated from seven of 11 nasal swab specimens selected for viral culture. These seven specimens had HA1 protein sequences that were identical to each other and differed from the 2013–14 influenza A (H3N2) A/Texas/50/2012 vaccine strain by 5 amino acid substitutions (N128A, R142G, N145S, P198S, and V347K)."
These people got a flu shot, but the flu shot didn't cover the strain they were infected with.
You're implying a connection between De Niro pulling the film and the government having some sort of a shadowy "conspiracy theory-like" agenda.
You're also having a misunderstanding on how "freedom of speech" works. De Niro and the rest of the board at the Tribeca Film Festival are allowed to play or pull any film they want.
The onus is on you to prove whatever tenuous connection between De Niro and the government supposedly exists.
(P.S. You do have a low I.Q. problem since you can't refer to a place or a group of people with mocking them. Act like an adult and maybe next year you can sit at the grown up table at Thanksgiving.)
Then how do you explain how about half the people that came down with measles weren't vaccinated, given that the majority of people _are_ vaccinated? If your idea had any merit, only like 5% of the cases would be the unvaccinated given that they're likely to be 5% of the exposures
Correct. But proper science also doesn't censor bad propaganda films.
Incorrect. Bad propaganda films that lead to behavior that is at best contributory negligence and at worst involuntary manslaughter definitely should be censored, with the scientific evidence that proves that the behavior is negligence or manslaughter.
Censorship is not universally bad. It is entirely reasonable for a society to decide as a whole that something is so terrible that it needs to be suppressed. Flat Earthers are mocked and derided and no one anywhere thinks they deserve to present their case in an hour and a half long video at a major film festival, despite the fact their delusions don't tend to kill anybody. That general opinion is censorship in action. It's such an all-pervasive and well-accepted censorship that you may not actually think of it as such, but it is. Antivaxxers deserve all that censorship and more because their delusions do maim and kill people.
I will revise my initial statement a little. Not all forms of censorship are universally bad. Antivaxxers don't deserve to be maimed or killed for their delusions, despite the fact that their delusions are maiming and killing other people. However they should not be given a bully pulpit, they should not be given worldwide publicity, they should not be given the slightest shred of avoidable exposure, and they should not be tolerated in polite company, precisely because their delusions are so dangerous.
Good resources:
http://autismsciencefoundation.org/what-is-autism/autism-and-vaccines/
http://justthevax.blogspot.com.au/2014/03/75-studies-that-show-no-link-between.html
Regardless of whatever rubbish Wankfraud makes up, there is a MOUNTAIN of evidence that vaccines don't cause autism. It's not just from the CDC but from both public and private institutions AROUND THE WORLD. If only the countless piles of cash that have gone into this enquiry had actually gone towards productive medical research instead.
"Society" can't decide anything; "society" is a delusion. What exists is a bunch of people in power and delusional fools like you.
It's fascists and totalitarians like you that shouldn't be tolerated in polite company.
We can get on with real science.
you know a flu vaccination doesn't protect against all possible illnesses? It won't stop the common cold, which I assume is what they contract.
Alternatively, if most are actually contracting influenza, then what kind of crazy office is it? Influenza is a serious and debilitating disease. Is your vending machine stocked with flu viruses?
With a massive backlash now mounting against Robert De Niro for censoring an independent film on vaccines, the Tribeca Film Festival has been subjected to intense scrutiny across independent media as journalists seek to discover who got to De Niro and what did they threaten him with?
After being threatened by vaccine industry totalitarians and science bullies, De Niro blackballed the VAXXED documentary from the Tribeca Film Festival, playing right into the hands of state-run medical propagandists who are all pro-vaccine.
This betrayal of a powerful, historic indy film has not gone unnoticed by the people of America. In effect, Robert De Niro has become a traitor to his own film industry that was founded on freedom of expression. He has just announced to the world that any film which dares challenge the official narratives of criminal vaccine corporations will be blackballed at Tribeca and not allowed to see the light of day.
But far beyond that, we've now learned that the Tribeca Film Festival has a strategic partnership with the Nazi-linked Sloan Foundation, founded by Alfred P. Sloan, a Nazi collaborator and hater of blacks and Jews. Sloan, much like Bill Gates, was a globalist eugenics promoter who believed in eliminating the "undesirable" people from the planet, leaving only a superior race in charge.
A Zen Gardner article also reveals how the Sloan Foundation held corporate stock in the Merck corporation, the world's largest manufacturer of vaccines:
Learn more: http://www.naturalnews.com/053456_Tribeca_Film_Festival_Nazi_eugenics_Robert_De_Niro.html#ixzz44DpA2Whp
Freedom of speech does mean freedom to be stupid and potentially endanger others. I can say stupid things that might cause deaths down the line. What I can't do is demand any particular podium be used to support my idiocy. Anti-vaxxers have no right to have their lies shown in a particular film festival. There are plenty of places they can spread their lies, but they have no right to anything that looks like endorsement from other people.
"When you have eliminated the unacceptable, whatever is left, however improbable, must be the truthiness" - Holmes
Would you care to show when badthink has actually been censored in the US? Anti-vaxxers are free to socialize with anyone who will socialize with them, go to tech conferences that don't bar dangerous propaganda, submit films to film festivals (although not to require they be included), and have their own gatherings to which they can invite people. Regrettably, they do.
Are you saying that no web forum, no film festival, no conference, should have people allowed to use judgment about what to include, particularly when they have limited resources?
"When you have eliminated the unacceptable, whatever is left, however improbable, must be the truthiness" - Holmes
Just like Mein Kampf should be available in libraries, films like this should be shown. Ignoring stuff never helps.
I can't click the link for some reason. Does it say how many of the measles infected victims died?
Posting links to whale.to and expecting people to take that seriously as evidence? Either you're a Poe or you have a serious case of the Dunning-Krugers.