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Homeland Security Wants To Subpoena Techdirt Over The Identity Of A Hyperbolic Commenter (boingboing.net)
Techdirt is in hot water with the Department of Homeland Security all thanks to a commenter known as Digger. Techdirt's Tim Cushing published a story about the Hancock County, IN Sheriff's Department officers who stole $240,000 under color of asset forfeiture. In response to the story, Digger wrote, "The only 'bonus' these criminals [the Sheriff's Department officers] are likely to see could be a bullet to their apparently empty skulls." The Department of Homeland Security then contacted Techdirt to ask whom they should send a subpoena to in order to identify Digger. Masnick is worried the subpoena could come with a gag order. "Normally, we'd wait for the details before publishing, but given a very similar situation involving commenters on the site Reason last year, which included a highly questionable and almost certainly unconstitutional gag order preventing Reason from speaking about it, we figured it would be worth posting about it before we've received any such thing," Masnick writes.
Hm. Highly illegal sounding.
The only 'bonus' these criminals [the Sheriff's Department officers] are likely to see could be a bullet to their apparently empty skulls.
So it looks like "homeland security" should be renamed STASI/NKVD/etc. They appear to be going after people for wrong-think, just like other state security apparatus of yesteryear in various communist countries.
Om, nomnomnom...
This is the worst thing that ever happened of all time. When I'm president, I'm going to make subpoenas so massive it'll make your head spin. They will be tremendous, tremendous subpoenas.
You are welcome on my lawn.
... they always want the gold and silver but never the copper and lead. So picky.
Bullies love to pick on the meek small guy, they only learn a lesson when they get beaten. So out of necessity to protect myself, I will arm myself with nuclear, chemical and biological weapons. After all, there is no bigger bully than the US government. If the US government decides to target me, I launch my WoMD, destroying the world and thereby the USG. ALL HAIL KIM JONG UN ! The protector against bullies! ........... /s
Steal my money under asset bullshit and I may very well put a bullet in your head.
If they issue the gag order must we gag ourselves?
What if we refuse to gag? What if we continue to talk? What the fuck can they do to us? Kill us?
This is no motherfucking North Korea, this is the United States of America
If they think they can gag Americans with a fucking gag order they can go fuck themselves
A Waco, Texas incident is enough, we will not allow any more government goon incident to happen
If you offer anonymous comments? Tell them the IP address is 127.0.0.1 and that's all you know.
From day one I have feared and loathed the use of the name Father^h^h^h^h^h^h Homeland Security. I did and continue to say; What the absolute fuck? Does no one else see the irony. And then they started acting the part.
Who is Masnick? Oh right, its the editor of Techdirt. Ok now the article makes some sense. Of course, simply writing "Mike Masnick, the editor of Techdirt, is worried the..." is probably too complicated, and I guess it should be common knowledge who 'Masnick' is, or we should expect people to look it up right?
If an experiment works, something has gone wrong.
Getting out in front of the predictable gag order and bringing attention to this was ballsy and smart. Of course now DHS will probably start gag-ordering the pre- subpoena request... But thanks techdirt staff for shining the light.
This comment is fully compliant with RFC 527.
I always assumed you can get away with some relatively stupid shit (I've come close regarding our Australian PM and housing prices) but within reason. Outright threats of course, very stupid thing to say but the law generally can interpret angry voter / reader from genuine loonatic.
That comment reply is honestly pretty tame, it's not pointing the finger at who would be pulling the hypothetical trigger, it could infact be a sarcastic reply or whatever.
To think D.H.S is investigating this is pretty scary.
What next? Should I pack my bags if I write "Obama is a doo-doo head" or something?
In several countries, the simple threath of death is, in itself, a punishable criminal offence.
We need this shit like we need a hole the head. Meanwhile:
DHS Tard1: "What if they really need this shit? I mean.."
DHS Tard2: "Yeah, then they'd actually need..."
DHS Tard1: "...a hole!"
DHS Tard2: "This could be a mass suicide threat. Better track em down."
DHS Tard3: "I'll go write a Visual Basic script and trace their Eye Pea."
That's the rhetoric. The reality is other.
This is the country where you can never be forgiven for anything. Where a bad credit report, an arrest, adjudication withheld, conviction, a tweet, or just the lack of a Facebook account can result in a distinct narrowing — or complete loss of — job opportunities. Why? Not because of the law. Because people have chosen retribution over rehabilitation, and further have taken retribution into their own hands, which they are encouraged to do by their peers, by the media, and directly by the government through one-way enabling mechanisms such as public lists designating no-fly, no-buy and of course violent and sexual offender. Also by much of theism, which, as always, specializes in pointing at anyone not of a particular faith and labeling them in some negative way. Atheists, those despicable human beings not of any faith, have been specifically called out by various legislation as not suitable for public office, etc., and of course huge numbers of people blithely and comfortably declare they wouldn't elect them anyway. Many posters here regularly cheer the activities of vigilante groups. We have met the enemy, and they are us.
Considering that this is the accepted norm for the behavior of the average citizen, I fail to see how anyone expects to get any meaningful number of said citizens significantly upset about the government's recent tendency to take another inch in its never-ending crusade against "things that might cause things that might be bad things or be inconvenient for the courts, law enforcement, or public officials."
The masses swallow every little dollop of "FOR THE CROTCH-BLOSSOMS! TERRORWITS! DWUGS!" they are fed. They don't know a meaningful statistic from any other number flung at them by the media or the government. They think cops are heroes doing such a dangerous job that no rule is inviolate. Very few could tell you what the constitution says, and even fewer have any idea of what the overall thrust of the document is, much less a grasp on specific meanings, either as "interpreted" by the judiciary or as likely intended by the people who wrote it.
Fulminating about things on the Intarwebz isn't going to accomplish anything. Well, other than draw the attention of some facet of law enforcement. You won't get people unglued from their televisions and apps. A very small number of people have been yelling about these erosions for decades now; the course the nation has taken has remained uniformly towards more authoritarian law, ever more tenuous lip service to the constitution, all the while constantly throwing up carefully-crafted bogymen to keep the masses well focused away from the core problems. People don't listen. They don't care. They're pretty comfortable overall, and the plight of the relatively small number of people the system screws — just a few percent — means basically nothing to them until it is them, and then it's far too late.
I have no suggestions. I think the people have screwed themselves far beyond any hope of redemption. It would be lovely to be proven wrong, but so far... no sign of that.
No Math On Planes bitches
Actually, it was supposed to be "look if you have probable cause, supported by oath or affirmation, authorized by a warrant which specifically limits looking to the place(s), and/or person(s), and/or thing(s.)"
Supposed to be.
Actually, though, it's "do anything you like, and by the way, feel free to plant false evidence and beat, or even shoot, anyone you think would be fun to have at."
With a soupçon of "layer on charges so thick that the only thing you can do is plead to one of them" and a dash of "if you talk about this, we'll throw you in a hole so deep the Chinese will be able to give your feet acupuncture."
Yessir, things are perfect.
Hey, now that this site is under new ownership, maybe they could do some things to prepare for the possibility that this will happen here. Don't log IPs. Post a warrant canary.
Remember Asset Forfeiture doesn't invoke a court or a lawyer, or often even a future case. They are taking peoples land, or sometimes cash AND NOT CHARGING THEM WITH ANYTHING in many cases. Of course once you lose your farm and house and car and your cash savings, you are their bitch. And sometimes the police can use the money to fund their operations, which means they have a incentive to lie. This is what corrupted some medieval governments in the past and some lines in the constitution were directly written because of it.
If you don't want death threats, stop being criminals.
Also, assuming someone does up and spend (at least) $5k to get some lesser amount back, the perpetrators know that nothing else will happen to them. There's no penalty for trying, so hey, why not try?
Informative graph: Civil forfeiture in the United States amounts to billions of dollars every year.
I've fallen off your lawn, and I can't get up.
But, damn, those are small fingers.
I've fallen off your lawn, and I can't get up.
Back in the day of early 2-way radio, you always spoke in codes:
smokey was a trooper and so on. That's what you gotta do today
to safely express an opinion that is not an intention to act.
So, for example if I want the use the f-bomb I'll use its code
"What cheney said." bush is the general goto for other things as well.
CAP === 'plumed'
Don't you understand that our highly trained police and other LEOs are only doing what they KNOW - because they are omniscient - is best for all of us. Can't you accept that you are just a slimeball that is not worthy to polish their shoes, as they slave every day to ensure that nothing nasty will ever happen to you again...
The original Techdirt comment:
The only "bonus" these criminals are likely to see could be a bullet to their apparently empty skulls.
The person wronged probably knows people who know people in low places who'd take on the challenge pro-bono, after a proper "cooling-off" period.
WTF? Digger is simply speculating that the victim of the forfeiture proceeding might be pissed off enough to go after the terminal kind of revenge. That seems like a reasonable speculation to me, and does not constitute a threat.
However, perhaps more to the point is the comment Digger posted immediately prior to the one quoted in TFS:
Everyone on the government side of this should have grand theft and / or larceny charges filed against them, and double the jail time as it is a slam dunk case.
They did not follow proper procedures, they no longer have the protection or immunity to prosecution normally afforded to government agents.
By failing to follow procedure, they've shown their true colors and should be treated as the criminals that they are.
I suspect the DHS, and whichever other TLAs and LEOs stepped on their own dicks in this case, are more upset about the comment Digger posted first, and are only using the one he posted next as a flimsy excuse to go hunting. Frankly, if they really believe Digger poses or is connected to a threat, then they might as well be the Keystone Cops. And if they DON'T believe in the threat, then they're bullies and thugs. Either way, they all need to be dismissed and barred from any further government jobs.
'The Economy' is a giant Ponzi scheme whose most pitiable suckers are the youngest among us and the yet-unborn.
Right, "encourage others to go kill that person" is what flips it from debatably insightful free speech absolved from responsibility of consequences to incitement. But it's amazing how few members of society can grasp that level of nuance. Scary fucking world.
What people need to do is join me in New Hampshire where liberty activists are organizing all over the state. It's a low population libertarian heaven [or going there anyway]. While there are lots of laws to eliminate there is real hope in accomplishing something. Nowhere else are you going to find a sufficient percentage of the population willing to participate in activism relative to the population of the state. The Free State Project has been working hard for several years to attract 20,000 liberty lovers here and has finally reached its goal. 10% of the signers have already moved and it's only been a handful of months since this number was reached. Many even moved prior to the goal being reached in anticipation of it. There have been dozens of Free Staters elected over the last few years and the migration movement is succeeding. While we still have bad laws against pot and other victimless crimes it's only because of the governor refusing to sign laws which passed legalizing it. There is a 4/20 rally at the statehouse every year where smokers (and non-smokers alike) get together for a smoke out on the lawn of the statehouse in protest. Every Friday there is or was (not sure if people are still doing this) a smoke out in the town square of Keene, NH. They've made arrests but gave up long ago since there were too many people and one arrest led to a bunch of people taking there smoking into the police station itself! :) Now they just ignore it. But liberty isn't just about drugs. It's about not having to submit to some arbitrary law where no one was harmed. Drivers licenses, social security, copyright, moral laws related to age, sex [ie consensual], alcohol, licensing of all kinds, license plates, vehicular registration, car insurance, etc don't stop harm from happening and yet refusing these things will result in violence against the individual by the state.
The "Prove your innocence using your own money, which you don't have cause we just stole it" mentality surrounding civil forfeiture paints the police as always the hero and everyone else as the villain: It's an unsustainable conflict of interest; at least if the police are meant to protect everybody, not just those with lawyers.
What about the real criminals, do they consider this robbery as just the cost of doing business? Why don't they have a cost mitigation mechanism? Putting a "wanted dead" bounty on cops would turn cities into war zones the rich wouldn't tolerate, or stop the police robbing tourists. Or the crime gangs could start shooting their own couriers for relinquishing the money: The gangs can't recruit staff, or the police have a lot of couriers in jail holding money the police can't touch.
The inequity of this law is making the news on a regular basis yet no-one is demanding the law be changed. Many people are fighting for religious ideals (homosexuality, abortion, contraception) but not for legal protections (presumed innocence, limits on police power). Things have to get worse before they get better.
Send the subpoena to my home address:
127.0.0.1
Digger
Being in several countries is, in itself, a punishment.
Homeland Security needs to be DISMANTLED.
We need to take back this country from the paranoid lunatics and the exploiters.
You never joke with law enforcement officers. They have been specially bred and selected for non-intelligence, and will always SWOOOOSHED by any joke that’s smarter than what a 8 year old can grasp.