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Judge Blasts Oracle's Attempt To Overturn Pro-Google Jury Verdict (arstechnica.com)

Joe Mullin, reporting for Ars Technica: Google successfully made its case to a jury last month that its use of Java APIs in Android was "fair use," and the verdict rejected Oracle's claim that the mobile system infringed its copyrights. After Google argued its case, though, Oracle filed a motion arguing that the judge should decide as a matter of law that fair use didn't cover it. In the wake of the jury's pro-Google verdict, Oracle's motion was its last hope of a trial victory. It didn't happen; US District Judge William Alsup shot down the motion on Wednesday. The same order also denied Google's motion making similar arguments, filed at the close of trial but before the jury's verdict. Alsup's stinging order [PDF], which rejects Oracle's argument [PDF] on every front, hardly comes as a surprise. But the document provides the first insights as to what Oracle might bring up in an appeal proceeding, which the company has said it will pursue. In the order, Alsup defends how he ran the trial. The evidence and instructions presented to the jury were a mix of mandates from the appeals court, which overruled Alsup on the key issue of API copyrightability, and modifications urged by both sides' lawyers.

8 of 106 comments (clear)

  1. Who are we rooting for today? by mi · · Score: 2, Insightful

    I forgot, is it Google or Oracle? Which multi-billion dollar corporation needs our sympathy, cheers, and support today?

    --
    In Soviet Washington the swamp drains you.
    1. Re:Who are we rooting for today? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      It's more of an Aliens vs. Predator situation. Whoever wins, we lose.

    2. Re:Who are we rooting for today? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Never Oracle.

    3. Re:Who are we rooting for today? by HiThere · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Oracle is never on the side of right. This is so true that if they do something that you thought was right, you should think again and try to decide whether they are being deceitful, or whether you were wrong to thing it was the right thing to do.

      Google is sometimes a good guy. You can't use their actions as any guide to what proper behavior is. So they are less trustworthy than Oracle.

      --

      I think we've pushed this "anyone can grow up to be president" thing too far.
    4. Re:Who are we rooting for today? by Mr.+Gus · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Google doesn't need our sympathy--Oracle needs our antipathy. The people behind Oracles side of the case are sociopaths attempting to do something that will set a precedent that is extremely negative for technological progress in American society. Once set, it could extend beyond the country as part of our continual series of copyright treaties, making Oracle responsible for doing serious damage to human society as a whole. They're monsters who should be locked up.

      Nobody seriously should care whether Google has to pay a million or even a billion dollars to some company, but they should care about the dangerous precedent Oracle was trying to set.

    5. Re:Who are we rooting for today? by MightyMartian · · Score: 4, Insightful

      It's not about which one of them cares about us, but rather being pragmatic. There are many situations in which the enemy of my enemy is my friend. If Oracle is successful in its claims that APIs can be locked down, there's a world of hurt coming in the US, as any organization or individual that has replicated the function call list of any library (including kernels) could be viewed as having infringed on the original creator of that API. By that I mean just the call list and/or symbol tables, not any actual code.

      In this case, Google is fighting an important fight that we should all hope it is successful in. Tomorrow it could be fighting a fight we disagree with.

      To simply mindlessly support a company is the worst kind of fanboism, as mindlessly attacking a company's every move is just pointless contrarianism. Even Microsoft fights some fights I agree with, even if I think Redmond is run by some of the most loathsome individuals in the tech history.

      Oracle, sadly, is a company whose positions almost always seem to fly in the face of reason, ethics and fair play, but it's at least theoretically possible that some day they may be on the right side of a battle. I dunno, maybe they don't like North Carolina gender bathroom laws or something.

      --
      The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
  2. Re:Copyrighting APIs by epiphani · · Score: 5, Insightful

    While I agree with your premise - read the judgement. It's actually pretty impressive. The judge clearly took the time to learn some programming and some java. It's a very well thought out, and clearly well informed judgement. For a judge to dive this deeply into the issue gives me some hope for some of the other idiocy of the legal framework around software.

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  3. We're rooting against Evil by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

    We're rooting for technological progress, so that means that everyone has to root for APIs to not be granted exclusive monopolies by the government. That means you should be on Google's side and it doesn't matter if either side happens to be rich.

    What Oracle is doing seems dangerous to me. The last they they should want are judges (or anyone else) thinking about this. Asking judges to reconsider Fair Use is a very bad idea, because the more someone understands the issue, the more likely that they'll realize: "you're right, Fair Use doesn't make much sense."

    It was an error to call it Fair Use, because it was a grevious error to even rule that an API could possibly be covered by copyright at all. The very nature of an API is that two entities speak it, so government misusing The People's power to grant a monopoly on a form of communication is absurd. Government does not need to grant monopolies in order to incentivize people to establish means of communicating with one another. That is a form of "the progress of the arts and useful sciences" which already incentivizes itself.

    The more people think about this, the more likely this error will be spotted by someone able to do something about it. (All three branches of the government could get involved in this to varying degrees; Oracle is lucky that only one branch is finding them so contemptuous so far.) Oracle won this case by advancing the cause of evil, even if they didn't get their money.

    Oracle: if you truly value injustice, unfairess, theft, technological retardation and stagnation, and want to help remove incentives for developers to create things, then you need to STFU immediately, because you're risking the loss of all your progress. Be happy with the damage that you have already done. It won't last, but you have have hurt everyone (Google almost doesn't matter in the larger context) for now, so you should be grateful.