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Intel's Joule is Its Most Powerful Dev Kit Yet (engadget.com)

Devindra Hardawar, writing for Engadget: We've seen plenty of unique dev kits from Intel, including the SD card-sized Edison, but not one as powerful as this. Intel announced Joule today, a tiny maker board that will allow developers to test RealSense-powered concepts and, hopefully, bring the to the market faster than before. The company says the tiny, low-powered Joule would be ideal for testing concepts in robotics, AR, VR, industrial IoT and a slew of other industries. And it also looks like it could be an interesting way for students to dabble in RealSense's depth-sensing technology in schools. There will be two Joule kits to choose from: the 550x, which includes a 1.5GHz quad-core Atom T5500 processor, 3GB of RAM and 8GB of storage; and the 570x, which packs in a 1.7Ghz quad-core Atom T5700 CPU (with burst speeds up to 2.4GHz), 4GB of RAM and 16GB of storage. Both models include "laptop-class" 802.11AC wireless, Intel graphics with 4K capture and display support, and a Linux-based OS.

55 comments

  1. Pffff by TheRealMindChild · · Score: 4, Informative

    $369. No.

    --

    "When life gives you lemons, don't make lemonade. Make life take the lemons back!" -- Cave Johnson
    1. Re:Pffff by invictusvoyd · · Score: 1

      $369. No.

      $5 yes ! .. Raspberry PI zero

  2. $369 by gmack · · Score: 4, Informative

    I'm not sure Intel quite understands the concept.

    1. Re:$369 by SuperKendall · · Score: 1

      That's probably three times the cost of the actual computers people are using to develop for the Rasperry Pi...

      --
      "There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
    2. Re:$369 by ArchieBunker · · Score: 1

      Can you recommend an equivalent ARM based board?

      --
      Only the State obtains its revenue by coercion. - Murray Rothbard
    3. Re:$369 by myrdos2 · · Score: 1

      See, it works like this:

      Step 1: Intel maker board for $369.

      Step 2: Bring the _____ to the market faster than before.

      Step 3: Profit!

    4. Re:$369 by 0100010001010011 · · Score: 1

      Not sure you quite understand their market.

      Look at what DIN mounted automation controls cost.

    5. Re:$369 by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      So about the same price as an equally low-end NUC with bits added. Seems reasonable.

  3. Looks like the first two posters... by CajunArson · · Score: 2, Insightful

    have never bought a dev kit in the real world before, and believe me there's a world of difference between these things and a Raspberry Pi.

    $369? Intel priced these to move.

    --
    AntiFA: An abbreviation for Anti First Amendment.
    1. Re:Looks like the first two posters... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Not interested. They should be giving these things away if they want people to develop for the platform..

    2. Re:Looks like the first two posters... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Develop for the platform? The x86_64 platform? The most used platform in the world for at least the last 30 years?

    3. Re:Looks like the first two posters... by rickb928 · · Score: 1

      The people that want to develop for this platform will pay. They will be making money with the results.

      Me, I'm hoping to manage my 3D printer with one Pi, and my garage door with another. Not a big money maker, either.

      --
      deleting the extra space after periods so i can stay relevant, yeah.
    4. Re:Looks like the first two posters... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

      369$ for a development tool that is well documented?

      In the corporate development world that is pretty much giving them away.

    5. Re:Looks like the first two posters... by 0100010001010011 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Reading these comments make me question how much experience some people actually have with corporate development tools.

      The compilers for our development tools cost more than this thing.

    6. Re:Looks like the first two posters... by TechyImmigrant · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Reading these comments make me question how much experience some people actually have with corporate development tools.

      The compilers for our development tools cost more than this thing.

      Compared to the costs of sourcing parts and developing and manufacturing a custom board, $369 is free.

      If you're learning to wiggle gpio pins, a Pi might do you, but if you're doing something that requires a scalable platform that's going into real products, you will want these things available to you to oil the wheels of development.

      --
      I should use this sig to advertise my book ISBN-13 : 978-1501515132.
    7. Re:Looks like the first two posters... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Whatever you say bro. These things are stuck in a weird middle ground of not that great of performance for insane cost. Times have changed man.

    8. Re:Looks like the first two posters... by 0100010001010011 · · Score: 2

      I'm still developing for a sub 100 MHz PPC in an embedded environment. These things are nothing short of magic.

    9. Re:Looks like the first two posters... by TechyImmigrant · · Score: 3, Funny

      I'm still developing for a sub 100 MHz PPC in an embedded environment. These things are nothing short of magic.

      There should always be respect for a processor with an EIEIO instruction.

      --
      I should use this sig to advertise my book ISBN-13 : 978-1501515132.
    10. Re:Looks like the first two posters... by fuzzyfuzzyfungus · · Score: 1

      It's obviously x86 based; but Intel's big push with this thing appears to be their "realsense" camera and machine vision stuff. They obviously aren't going to forbid other uses; but that seems to be the feature they were most interested in repeating themselves about.

    11. Re:Looks like the first two posters... by jcdr · · Score: 1

      We are talking here about a kit with the capabilities of a very basic PC running Linux, so many open source compiler are available.

    12. Re:Looks like the first two posters... by 0100010001010011 · · Score: 1

      Ding Ding Ding.

      Now put those two pieces of information together and you realize why the price isn't a problem at all.

    13. Re:Looks like the first two posters... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The x86_64 platform? The most used platform in the world for at least the last 30 years?

      Really...people were coding for 64-bit x86 30 years ago? Those folks had some vision.

    14. Re:Looks like the first two posters... by lars_stefan_axelsson · · Score: 1

      There should always be respect for a processor with an EIEIO instruction.

      When I was in industry and we (briefly) changed to PPC we had a field engineer come over and present the architecture etc.

      And as luck would have it his name was MacDonald... He started by telling us all that, yes, the connection between his surname name and the EIEIO-insn had not been lost on his colleagues. In fact he heard it hummed in the corridors at least once a day when he walked by. :-)

      --
      Stefan Axelsson
    15. Re:Looks like the first two posters... by jcdr · · Score: 1

      What two pieces of information ?

      There are many others ARM based kits that brings comparable capabilities and also run Linux (with open source compilers) for a fraction of the Intel price.

      For most embedded projects, especially those running Linux, the instruction set architecture weight as much as a photo in the design decision. I myself run many armhf and arm64 architecture based embedded boards with the exact same Debian distribution that I run on my amd64 architecture workstations, laptop and servers.

    16. Re:Looks like the first two posters... by jcdr · · Score: 1

      photo -> photon, sorry for the typo.

  4. 16gb ssd by blackomegax · · Score: 1

    In this day and age, when 128gb worth of mmc is 30 bucks, 16gb of storage is a travesty.

    1. Re:16gb ssd by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Why would a dev kit need even half that much storage?

    2. Re:16gb ssd by rickb928 · · Score: 1

      The size of the production run has a lot to do with the pricing.

      --
      deleting the extra space after periods so i can stay relevant, yeah.
    3. Re:16gb ssd by nitehawk214 · · Score: 1

      No; he is saying, why the fuck is a device with the specs of a 2001 pc costing $369?

      Look at Raspberry, Atmel, Microchip, and other companies. They have much lower specs, but are also actually affordable.

      Who is going to buy this thing?

      --
      I'm a good cook. I'm a fantastic eater. - Steven Brust
    4. Re:16gb ssd by JaredOfEuropa · · Score: 2

      Who is going to buy this thing?

      People who need a higher specced board in a compact, low power configuration. Looks like this board is sold as a solution for applications like robotics, machine vision, and VR, which often requires a bit more processing power than a Raspberry Pi can offer. And it's $369 for the dev kit, the real question is what the price of the board alone will cost (especially in bulk).

      --
      If construction was anything like programming, an incorrectly fitted lock would bring down the entire building...
    5. Re:16gb ssd by fuzzyfuzzyfungus · · Score: 2

      Their promotional literature says the following:

      "Because the Intel Joule platform is based on an Intel® Atom SoC, transitioning a product design to high-volume production can be done with modest engineering expense, providing a mature platform for companies who require the option to scale down the road."

      That suggests that the asking price, even in volume, is going to be at least modestly higher than the cost of stuffing the same parts onto your board; unless compactness is the only reason a customer would care about cutting the module and connector out of the design; but they probably care more about moving CPUs than about charging a markup on that specific packaging option, so I'd assume that they would offer the same deal for the SoC and wifi module whether purchased for your own board or integrated onto their board; with the cost of the rest of the assembly not being given away; but not being something it would make sense to mark up too much.

      ARK doesn't list either of those Atom parts, though, so I don't know what the SoC itself would be expected to cost.

    6. Re:16gb ssd by wierd_w · · Score: 3, Insightful

      The builtin wifi with piggytail antennae is a nice touch, but it is still a step backward from the minnowboard, imo.

      Minnowboard has much less processing power and much less ram, but sports an actual sata interface.

      Intel seems fixated on having the sdcard be the one and only storage device on these dev boards. Personally, i feel putting a real ssd on here, or a spspiny disk for swap/temp file userver makes the offering far more robust.

      I see it has what looks like a mini pie riser zif connector over on the side there, but that means buying in even deeper into their proprietary hardware stream. I would rather have seen an M.2 socket with lock down screw on the back. That at least is industry standard hardware.

    7. Re:16gb ssd by bheerssen · · Score: 1

      > Intel seems fixated on having the sdcard be the one and only storage device on these dev boards. Personally, i feel putting a real ssd on here, or a spspiny disk for swap/temp file userver makes the offering far more robust.

      Perhaps, but the eight gig model is enough to run an OS and a few chosen applications, which is what something like this is designed for. For more data intensive applications, there is a sixteen gig version. If you need extra storage (for video, maybe) then you could add an external USB SSD.

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      (Score: -1, Stupid)
    8. Re:16gb ssd by wierd_w · · Score: 1

      You have to be kidding.

      Unless it is USB 3.0, that port will saturate far faster than the sata2 port on the minnowboard.

      An actual nvme based M.2 ssd put on would smoke both suggestions. If the device is running its own transactional database for object identification, having access times that fast becomes more than just a nice thing to have-- something i mention because of the suggested use case for the board, from intel themselves.

    9. Re:16gb ssd by bugs2squash · · Score: 1

      And maybe they can build a one-off with it. They can't base any kind of product they plan to sell on it because chances are it leaks RF like a sieve (since it's a development tool not a "product" and it will be discontinued next week when something new pops into the minds of the dev tool team at Intel.

      --
      Nullius in verba
    10. Re:16gb ssd by dwsobw · · Score: 1

      It has USB3 (I think on headers)

    11. Re:16gb ssd by nitehawk214 · · Score: 1

      Yeah that is true, they come out with new generations of products too quickly. My guess is this thing is targeted at businesses, but I assume a big enough company developing with Atom already has their own tools and doesn't need this. I just don't know who the target audience for this thingis.

      --
      I'm a good cook. I'm a fantastic eater. - Steven Brust
  5. Watt? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Most powerful?

    But only for one second!

  6. FBI advertisement for next-gen spyware platform. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    >bring the to the market faster than before.

    They are so flustered at Slashpot now they can't even type.

  7. Price of x86 Single Board Computers by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The few on the market seem to be at least double the price of a Pi 3.

    A quad-core Atom x5-Z8350 costs $21. The Pi 3's CPU might cost $5. So an Intel board could cost $51, assuming there aren't other associated expenses.

  8. RealSense == 3D camera. by sbaker · · Score: 2

    At first sight, it looks like this is a horribly overpriced tiny-Linux gizmo - but what I think people here are missing is the important fact that it includes an integrated RealSense 3D camera...over 300 bucks for a $10 computer is a lot - but the RealSense 3D camera was selling for over $100 a few months ago - and that was a gigantic thing compared to this.

    So, while I think they should be selling this for $50 to get more people interested in using it - I don't think it's surprising that they're asking so much as a "dev kit". The original RealSense dev kit (just the camera) was (IIRC) $200 - but included support from Intel engineers for serious developers.

    --
    www.sjbaker.org
    1. Re:RealSense == 3D camera. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      what I think people here are missing is the important fact that it includes an integrated RealSense 3D camera...

      No. It supports it, it does not include it. Read the fact sheet... $369 is just the board.

    2. Re:RealSense == 3D camera. by fuzzyfuzzyfungus · · Score: 1

      They also announced(though I can't find a price) a "Euclid" device that does include the camera and the computer; specs aren't specified beyond 'atom processor' but it would be pretty unsurprising if that hardware is either built around one of these modules or very similar in specs; but the camera is not included with this one.

    3. Re:RealSense == 3D camera. by cdrudge · · Score: 1

      but what I think people here are missing is the important fact that it includes an integrated RealSense 3D camera

      All the announcements and spec sheets say that they "Support for the Intel RealSense cameras and libraries", not that it has a RealSense 3D camera built in. Where did you see that the camera was built in, that as you say, we're missing?

    4. Re:RealSense == 3D camera. by Megane · · Score: 1

      In other words, it's really a devkit for the camera, not the CPU. But they can't miss the opportunity for another chance at forcing x86 into the embedded space.

      Intel still hasn't gotten the clue that most people don't care about or don't even want to go near x86 (or x64) for embedded computing. It's a hammer looking for a nail. The only thing x86 ever had going for it was the momentum of decades of MS-DOS and its follow-ons. It's a really mediocre architecture full of bodges on top of warts, and it would have died long ago if IBM hadn't picked it.

      --
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    5. Re:RealSense == 3D camera. by sbaker · · Score: 1

      Oh - well if that's the case then it makes no sense. The RealSense camera dev kit interfaces via USB...why wouldn't you just use a RaspPi Zero for $9 rather than the $300+ Intel board? Plus, RealSense is only available for developers - they make you sign an agreement not to use it in any actual product!

      --
      www.sjbaker.org
  9. bringing the to the market. by hackwrench · · Score: 2

    I always love it when I can bring the to the market quicker than ever before!

  10. SD-card sized? by Traf-O-Data-Hater · · Score: 1

    I'd say the Edison was credit card sized. And (relatively) expensive-sized, like this new one.

  11. Re: the by hackwrench · · Score: 1

    Really? Because I think everyone except you really loves it when they can bring the to the market faster than ever before.

  12. Intel's Roadmap is really confusing... by ndykman · · Score: 2

    Okay, they cancel Broxton, but then they release this. So, smartphones and tablets are out, but this is a great prototyping board for industrial IoT and other smart devices? Look, if they don't have a story on cellular network capabilities, nobody is going to care, and if they do have a story there, then they didn't really leave those markets. Does the Surface Phone crawl along, zombie like, after all? At any rate, Intel has a lot of work to do in the embedded space. A lot.

  13. T5500 not on ark.intel.com by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    It's a Core 2 Duo actually.

  14. Journalism is dead by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    There once was a time when an article would clearly explain what it was talking about. What is a joule? A dev kit for what? What does it do? Why do i care? I have no idea. TFS is complete crap.

  15. Intel becoming a dinosaur by gnalre · · Score: 1

    This is why Intel is becoming irrelevant in the embedded space.

    While I am sure that this is not meant as a raspberry pi killer, the lack of a low cost Intel platform means that all cool interesting stuff is being done on ARM.

    Not only that but the next generation of embedded engineers will grow up knowing about the ARM architecture, and Intel will become increasingly marginalized.

    If I was Intel I would produce a $30 board, put on a version of vxworks linux (also Intel owned) and give them out to schools at the same time encourage the hacking community to extend the boards. But it won't happen, because Intel cannot see beyond PC's which are increasingly becoming irrelevant in the modern world

    --
    Choose your allies carefully, it is highly unlikely you will be held accountable for the actions of your enemies
    1. Re:Intel becoming a dinosaur by K.+S.+Kyosuke · · Score: 1

      It actually does remind me of those PC expansion cards with mainframe CPUs on them. "Pay us a lot of money for the new thing whose largest benefit is just binary compatibility with the old thing".

      --
      Ezekiel 23:20
  16. How's the software support? by caffeinated_bunsen · · Score: 1

    Back when Edison hit the market, I got seriously excited and started developing things that weren't possible without the CPU muscle and low power consumption that it offers. Then I ran into the sucking quagmire that is Intel's software support.

    Broken drivers. Broken build environments. Undocumented pin muxing. Undocumented power management. Undocumented everything. Proprietary, unavailable tools needed to reconfigure things. They took a half-finished, 30% functional board support package, excreted it upon the world, and hoped that Open Source Magic meant that everyone else would fix their shit. Nearly three years later, almost nothing has been fixed and the product (whose hardware is still unmatched for power efficiency among hacker SBCs) is effectively dead.

    I won't put any confidence at all in Joule until I see the kind of hardware documentation and software support that an embedded system needs to actually be, y'know, embedded into things.

    --

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