Slashdot Mirror
How The US Will Likely Respond To Shadow Brokers Leak (dailydot.com)
blottsie writes: The NSA and FBI are both expected to investigate the leak of NSA-linked cyberweapons this week by an entity calling itself the Shadow Brokers, experts with knowledge of the process tell the Daily Dot. However, multiple experts say any retaliation by the U.S. will likely remain secret to keep the tactical advantage. Meanwhile, Motherboard reports that some former NSA staffers believe the leak is the work of a "rogue NSA insider." "First, the incident will be investigated by the National Security Agency as it tracks down exactly what went so wrong that top-secret offensive code and exploits ended up stolen and published for the world to see," reports Daily Dot. "An FBI counterintelligence investigation will likely follow, according to experts with knowledge of the process. [...] Following the investigation, the NSA and other entities within the United States government will have to decide on a response." The response will depend on a lot of things, such as whether or not an insider at the NSA is responsible for the breach -- a theory that is backed by a former NSA staffer and other experts. "The process is called an IGL: Intelligence Gain/Loss," reports Daily Dot. "Authorities suss out a pro and con list for various reactions, including directly and publicly blaming another country. [Chris Finan, a former director of cybersecurity legislation in the Obama administration and now CEO of the security firm Manifold Technology, said:] 'Some people think about responding in kind: A U.S. cyberattack. Doing that gives up the asymmetric response advantage you have in cyberspace.' Finan urged authorities to look at all tools, including economic sanctions against individuals, companies, groups, governments, or diplomatic constraints, to send a message through money rather than possibly burning a cyberwar advantage. Exactly if and how the U.S. responds to the Shadow Brokers incident will depend on the source of the attack. Attribution in cyberwar is tricky or even impossible much of the time. It quickly becomes a highly politicized process ripe with anonymous sources and little solid fact."
NSA leaked bullshit then claimed their shadow did it.
Do not believe shit on this fucking site right now regarding security or government.
Or really anything.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sD73t0xa0Ew
Their moles won't like it though because they are not Americans.
but was it "intentional"???
1) there will be a witch hunt.
The nsa will investigate its own employees against its already existing psych profile sheets to see who is the most likely to have been motivated to steal the data. Then they will set up an internal emtrapment scenario to catch the leaker red handed. They will then be charged with federal espionage, and put into prison.
2) the same investigation will sift out accomplices and contacts. The trap will not be sprung until positive id has been made on all members of the cell.
3) the nsa will not directly move against the other members of the cell. Instead it will monitor, and selectively leak false intel to this cell, making it ineffectual, or worse, countereffectual to the foriegn government operating it.
4) if deemed useful to do so, the cell will be infiltrated with a new "insider", who will actually be collecting and analyzing the cells instructions to better predict and respond to the foriegn power's activities.
Really, this is not hard.
It was 3 years ago. Importance of this detail is this: in pre-Snowden era NSA did not have access logs or other internal audit tools. Those were considered risk to security of operations.
My speculation is that this is why the data dump is so old - to maximally complicate forensic team's job.
For you tracking pleasure. Either these guys have gotten complacent or this is a setup. Either way it is fucked up.
"remain secret to keep the tactical advantage"
I'm not entirely convinced the FBI and NSA know what those terms mean.
If Trump were president somebody would be getting Nuked over this.
Everybody on this FBI ass BBS need to go watch Citizen Four (Ed Snowden actually explains the NSA ways)
Everywhere you look something on your computer or website is trying to hijack you. The spies need to fuck off and die. They pretend they are your solution but can you count the debt of your country? Do you feel like they used your money to help you?
Do you see anybody in burka's trying to kill you or spy on you? No. There is no ISIS neighborhood just FBI and CIA NSA lies.
Thanks for taking over Slashdot feds. We needed to talk about this.
Why not both!
I think you mean a decent human being unlike all the other thugs
Not one of the steps involves questioning whether the NSA should be sitting on these 0-day exploits for their own use for years and leaving their own citizens and companies vulnerable to attack, rather than notifying the owners of the code and getting them patched.
First order of business is finding out who let the cat out of the bag and getting retribution.
because of seth rogen, trust me, it was all because a freaking seth rogen movie
ive got inside sources and stuff guyz
The shadow broker leak is pretty boring. Just a bunch of exploit tools for publicly unknown zero days (Yeah sort of redundant but you get what I mean)
No back doors, no secret keys, no yet unheard of techniques or technologies. Just zero days exploits for popular commercial systems.
Even the fact that most are security appliances really isn't shocking. Such things promote a false sense of security and users trust them far too much, leading to an easy attack surfaced. - It just reinforces what we've known for a long time. Closed, commercial, security is an oxymoron. If you can't audit it, expect it to be vulnerable.
Absolutely nothing you would not expect for an organization that has state actor levels of funding and support.
If the NSA, CIA and FBI would actually use their powers for good and share the information they find to make our systems more fortified we'd be much better off than letting these exploits continue. They sure as fuck are not plugging the holes in their systems or other government systems, they just exploit them. They let our financial industry run around with the same exploits they know about and they are dumb as fuck to think that someone else China, Russia, you name it, are not also discovering these exploits. As we can see they were used on the NSA. What a bunch of retarded idiots.
It's much easier and cheaper to defend and create strong defenses than it is to attack and exploit weakness. Why don't they work with everyone and plug the holes, create truly unbreakable encryption and let's move forward. You do not need weak encryption to catch the bad guys. The bad guys ALWAYS ultimately will have a weak link who will bring down an organization. If you're always working on a strong defense nobody is going to penetrate, but if you're always trying to attack, someone will penetrate your weak defenses because you're focusing on attacking.
To bad power hungry assholes can't see that working together benefits all everyone, where as the constant fighting ultimately doesn't benefit anyone except for a very tiny few.
this thread has given me many brainstorms. I am appauled at the audacity of these assholes that are supposed to work for the people of america.
Part of me wonders if this leak is somehow related to Snowden's mysterious messages a couple weeks ago.
I can't find mention of Shadow Brokers on Google before this hack. (Granted, they may have wanted to remain hidden.) Did the Shadow Brokers exist before this hack? Did they adopt a new name because of the scale?
Some people think about responding in kind: A U.S. cyberattack.
I vote we do much worse than that. The very worst, in fact!
When we figure out who the bastards were, we send them Donald Trump. And no giving him back.
I do see many comments that sound very plausible. I have seen Citizen Four myself.
I don't log in any more but this is surely odd in the summary.
https://motherboard.vice.com/read/former-nsa-staffers-rogue-insider-shadow-brokers-theory
It is linked twice? Are you even like kidding me? How hard do you need to hammer that narrative in?
Myself, I reject it. I know this place is feds just by the content of the posts lately.
This looks like the political response. Which narrative out of a "Snowden 2.0" or a "Russia broke us" has less political costs? Of course - there has already been Snowden 1.0. Snowden says this looks like Moscow. The general narrative so far is "Moscow". Even Kaspersky - the folks who "discovered" the equation group and verified the authenticity of the software - says it was likely Russian.
Asymmetric advantage is an interesting idea here. Economic sanctions against a rouge agent? The article is suggesting nation-states as targets because they are likely sources. Can they actually bomb a hacker? I think the costs would be horrific. That means the asymmetric advantage in the current circumstances might be in favor of the shadow brokers.
A better piece of misinformation might be "we already downloaded the other trove, and know what makes the key" and "we watch all communication on the planet (Echelon) and will know within seconds when it is released" - in fact we will know well enough to intercept it, delay it, and get both the source and the destination. Such a statement would delay and complicate the interactions of parties, as well as being true. As folks with the source code, and keys to most encryption (and brute force to crack nearly everything unclassified on the planet in under 3 days) they have decoded everything that is currently public. With eyes in several places, they likely have a good idea both of who has copies, and when they got those copies. They have had man-in-the-middle corruption since the 90's, so there might plausibly "call home" flaws and such in the downloaded code, should it ever attempt to be activated.
Feds all up in this bitch fuck you
9.99/10 yes.
They run that game like beasts.
Just gave security to a lot of previously unprotected American citizens and foreigners.
It seems like the only agents worth their food are the rogue ones.
https://www.sendspace.com/file/w35ddl
It was linked someplace online, it is Tails Linux and not a compromised version. I think this should go here.
Hackers breach Russian Command and Control server, auction off exploits.
https://yro.slashdot.org/story/16/08/05/0329246/popular-bittorrent-search-engine-site-torrentzeu-mysteriously-disappears
Such as blaming national actors or internal leaks
And they will convince themselves they are correct
and the cycle will continue
... they bring in child porn and child sex trafficking and drugs more than any other group does in the states.
As people are prone to gravitate toward profession that coincide with their interest (child molester to schools, church, summer camps, etc. closet thugs likes to join police force, etc.) I suspect FBI is full of them.
The FBI, CIA and NSA are all traitors to the United States and have been undermining liberty and have been propagating terrorist fear for years. Every single person who works for one of those agencies needs to be tried and executed for treason.
our elected officials (and thus indrectly, us) created this fine mess, we're all guilty of high treason.
That fits with the way people in large bureaucracy act when they feel they can only talk to the press. Given the US press is still constitutionally protected at least the wider public can have the "collect it all" domestic spying conversation that an internal bureaucracy never will.
The NSA will try and counter any more walk outs with more automation of the product lines to other agencies. Wider issues of more human security is then the final customers responsibility not with collection.
More of the buddy system (two workers at any site or for any task) insuring more contractors will be needed for the same amount of work.
Logging and tracking of all workers at work and in the community at all levels. Proactive collection on all US journalists by default rather than after publication.
i.e. an expansion of FIRSTFRUIT. "The Most Intriguing Spy Stories From 166 Internal NSA Reports" (May 17 2016)
https://theintercept.com/2016/...
Less of the artisan thinking to add value to the raw product line and more of a direct production line with a classic time and motion study on every worker all day, every day.
The GCHQ ideas shared with the US in the 1960-80's to ensure good working conditions for all staff could be fully reversed in the US.
How much more access to ongoing education, good wages, great conditions can cover for the domestic collection issue?
Give collection to the FBI and their experts can buy in more hardware, hire contractors, get upgrades. Compliment collection with skilled local staff to finally fully expand on all domestic investigations.
The interesting aspect is that other agencies could task directly to the CIA, FBI and over time the CIA and FBI could take up all the international and domestic work in house.
That could then see a change in flow of future budgets back to more productive traditional methods and make skilled staff very happy. Better control over budgets and a clear focus on all domestic or international collection missions. Staff get the new tools they need locally and depth of ongoing support in house.
A camaraderie, esprit de corps sets in given new cash, experts and missions not needing to slow down to try and seek constant outside agency support.
Domestic spying is now "Benign Information Gathering"
How The US Will Likely Respond To Shadow Brokers Leak
Liara needed that intel so Commander Shepard could thwart actual terrorist attacks.
If they make a master key to unlock backdoors into everyones houses, and someone copies that key, now everyone can be robbed. This is why we don't have backdoors all unlockable with a master key. Maybe they shoukd have thought of fixing vulnerabilities instead of building a master key to backdoor into people's computers.
It quickly becomes a highly politicized process ripe^H^H^H^H rife with anonymous sources and little solid fact.
There. Fixed that for ya.
"We reject as false the choice between our safety and our ideals." --The American President (20.1.2009)
This release would be very interesting if it broke new ground -- finding a computationally-easy way to break commonly used encryption, or a smoking gun universal back door built into OSes or network gear. From what I've read this is just previously undisclosed, easy to implement and potentially dangerous flaws in network equipment firmware.
Here's an interesting question from someone not in the security field -- is this basically what hacking groups do? Are they just collecting a huge inventory of bugs by constantly banging on these devices every possible way they can?
As the investigation goes on, it's going to be enlightening to see how this got out, if it's an actual legit NSA "hack." Was it a spy agency using traditional espionage tactics? Was it a rogue Snowden-esque contractor? Was it some idiot taking work home, then getting his bag stolen on the train or out of his car? Time will tell.
"CALEA is intended to preserve the ability of law enforcement agencies to conduct electronic surveillance by requiring that telecommunications carriers and manufacturers of telecommunications equipment design and modify their equipment, facilities, and services to ensure that they have the necessary surveillance capabilities as communications network technologies evolve. Communications services utilizing Circuit Mode equipment and facilities, and communications services utilizing packet mode are all subject to CALEA. "
Packet mode = Applies to all American networking companies and telecom companies, esp now that VOIP is so wide spread, broadband, email, etc this was amended in 2006.
I know Cisco and third parties sell CALEA compliant software, BUT:
-Cisco invented Netflow in 1996, a standard to spew out network traffic to collectors for analysis. Say a CALEA compliant collector / Analyzer. Netflow collects metadata, but it's enough to know who is talking to who.
-Also after they bought Cascade and created the Catalyst switching line, those switches feature Netflow and software port span/mirroring(this allows full capture of data without taps)
-CALEA response to comments [2] states if manufacture equipment is used to facilitate any type of telecommunication activity it must have backdoors .
-Cisco purchased Stratcom and Lightstream in 1996/1997I think? LS made ATM switches, ATM connections both intra facility and Stracom made long haul ATM WAN gear that drove much of voice, video, and data traffic in the 90s. These switches would have to be compliant.
-Cisco purchased a SONET telecom company, Cerent in 1999, this was a service provider - ATM and DWDM switches were compliant as well, because they could pass voice traffic, and IP traffic.
-Cisco created the lawful intercept package in 2007, right after tapping the Internet was authorized by CALEA.
It seems like Cisco seriously jumped on the bandwagon right after CALEA and it wouldn't surprise me at all if all of their source code was audited for either compliance to CALEA or by NSA for equipment use in TS government networks, and of course, spying.
I don't know if NSA and Cisco worked together in secret, if it was the result of source code auditing, and we'll probably never know Due to National Security. Add in Juniper and Fortinet, sounds like too many big players are involved in 0 day NSA military grade exploits.
To get CALEA data all it took was a search warrant or a National Security Letter or the like..... This has been going starting with voice then Internet for atleast 22 years. Then don't forget about NSA Echelon where the five eyes spied on all Satellite communication and committed industrial espionage against Europe.... In the early mid 90s. Look it up
Maybe they are just trying to work out escape sequences for the Snowden character.
He was the hero who showed the U.S. how it is violating itself with unconstitutional behavior. Then, once it reaches the epic peak, they will pin him as 'the shadow' broker, or whatever name they come up with, later on, if this attempt fails...
When this happens the force for those who stand with him and his principles will be pitted against the force of people who at best vaguely understood him as either hero or villian, will wax over the glossy details of his principles.
Russia will have no excuse to protect him anymore, either. It will be proven he acted purely in self-interest (well grey area proven). Then Russia could use this as pretext for war. They could deny extradition and escalate things. Once that fuse is lit, every other country in the world can start picking sides...
I don't know a whole lot about who's who in the national sphere of things, but I'm sure There are plenty of nations who would side with russia to bring their own beef to the table, and like wise...
This would be the goal of the Snowden game...
I always personally felt very fishy about Snowden from the start, not to the same degree as I did about 9/11... that was beyond fishy, that was like a two ton truck of fish who's refridgerator went out 5 days ago and was stuck parked out front of your house...
Snowden always felt more subtle... Like a fish-hook, waiting to see if anyone would bite... Or perhaps a loose thread that if pulled could unravel the entire garment...
Historically speaking, from my limited understanding, China usually just wants outsiders to stay outside...
Russia on the other hand... I know very little about (I know very little about mostly anything... but..)
and to top it all off, this whole argument is based on the assumption the world is currently operating as a collective of nations, which on many many levels it may; but I would gander the snowden character is not operating under the auspices of any one nation's interest....
Possibly a bit more how a lot of European nations decided to divide up Africa. The real big players are making another land grab, so to speak... (TPP?)
If I do know anything about Russia, I would guess it's that they highly value a certain type of greatness. And if nothing else, I think they would be highly motivated to get to a place where the world can look to Russia and feel awe at their accomplishments, at least looking at things from the point of view of national interest...
That's my bit...
This is another example of why there should be no secrets about anything, anywhere on our planet.
This seems to be clearly part of a larger campaign against the US. Whether true or not, I think that many of the smaller countries and even some of the larger ones feel that America has been the unchecked bully for far too long. Continuously chastising others while performing those same actions. Do as I say, not as I do.
I can imagine that these players are working in concert to destabilize America with attacks designed to make the average American lose trust in the government and lose faith in the entire political system.
I fully expect that in the next 2-3 month there will be several new “leaks” which are vastly more damaging to the democratic party than the current batch which only proves the primary was rigged.
Combine this with the fact that for many in Russia, the cold war never ended and you have an obvious conclusion.
So uh let me get this straight. We infected others with malware, some of them allies, some enemies. They release the malware we tried to infect them with and this article says we should retaliate with economic sanctions? How is that fair?
...better be some smokin' hot Asaris.
Here is a mostly complete set of Bureacratic Responses. Sometimes these are used serially, and in approximately this order:
1). Deny the problem exists;
2). Admit the problem exists but claim it doesn't matter;
3). OK, the problem exists and matters, but we told someone in an obscure and forgotten policy paper;
4). We asked for money to fix the problem and were denied;
5). We asked for money to fix the problem and were funded, but we screwed up the implementation;
6). The problem existed in the past under "previous leadership" but it's all good now;
7). We tried to fix the problem but required cooperation from outside entity X. Entity X did not cooperate (for all possible values of cooperate, including Entity X setting themselves on fire, in public, in the middle of Times Square, at High Noon on a work day);
8). We are hunting for the Guilty now and we are Shocked! Shocked we say!
9). We are punishing several innocent parties as we speak. Say no more;
10). None of this would have happened if we had the budget for our Plan Opticon Uber Security Delta Integration Scheme! We've not previously revealed our Top Secret internal plans for this, but for the low, low price of 1 Trillion Dollars, we can get the basics up and running!
11). We've repeated asked for all the other security agencies to be folded into our own. We'll never get proper coordination unless we own, er, dominate, er, manage the entire security picture ourselves. Why does no one listen to these urgent requests!? Proper Int-Op-Sec-Norm-Blat-Pop clearly mandates that this take place!
Please let this be the result of a breach of Hillary Clinton's email server.....oh please, oh please, oh please!
Basically they will do nothing except pound and cry. Possibly also use this as a way to restrict freedoms on the internet for the average civilian.