Air Force Says F-35 Glitches Mean the A-10 Will Keep Flying 'Indefinitely' (jalopnik.com)

The A-10 aircraft "is just too effective to get rid of," wrote one defense blogger -- especially in light of ongoing issues with the F-35. schwit1 quotes Jalopnik: Strategists have feared that the jet will be axed in favor of funding the F-35, but the U.S. Air Force recently confirmed that it plans to keep the A-10 flying "indefinitely." While the Air Force is theoretically supposed to be diverting the A-10's operating expenses to feed the F-35 Joint Strike Fighter, the people in charge are now planning to keep the plane running...

Air Force Materiel Command chief Gen. Ellen Pawlikowski told AviationWeek in a interview, "Our command, anyway, is approaching this as another airplane that we are sustaining indefinitely." While the beancounters and product planners are trying to push the A-10 off the board, Materiel Command is going to keep on keeping the planes in peak condition, which will give the A-10 it's best chance of proving its worth over and over again. And it seems to be working -- the A-10 posted a 5% increase in its availability rate from 2014 to 2015, and the Air Force seems to keep postponing its demise.
In Congress one representative has even suggested an operational testing "fly-off" between the two aircraft -- a jet-vs-jet competition to determine whether any more A-10s get retired.

Comments

Cost matters

[JustAnotherOldGuy]

Cost of an A-10: ~$18.8 million

Cost of an F-35: ~109 million

Cost of an F-35 not being able to support ground troops adequately: $1,000,000,000,000,000,000

Wrong.

[Qbertino]

It was designed to strafe tanks, but modern tanks will survive its shitty popgun, and it's vulnerable to SAM. IOW it can't be used against an enemy with an air force and it can't fly low enough to use its gun.

It's "shitty popgun" as you call it is just about the most powerful fully automatic firearm on the planet and has been ever since. At least as far as airbourne fully-automatics go. It might be that some soviet tank with active armour can survive a first attack run or a fully armoured Leo2 can surfive even a little longer, but thats not the point.

Todays enemies are ISIS troupers in modified Toyota Trucks and Bulldozers, they don't have Leo2s. For that type of enemy the A10 is more than a perfect match. And the most important thing: It's actually finished. We have quite a few of those sitting there and ready to fly and kill stuff. Can't say that of the F35 or the Jaeger90, ... errrrm sorry, "Eurofighter" it's now called.

Re: Good, then we can scrap that stupid f-35

[Tablizer]

As background, here's how to avoid the sunk cost fallacy. In accounting one should evaluate the cost/benefits by weighing both choices going forward. Money spent in the past should be ignored in the calculations because that cannot be changed.

Human nature has a tendency to favor options that one has invested a lot of time or money in. But that's often a mistake, kind of like grading on effort instead of merit.

Thus, the question is, if we scrapped the F-35 now, would we get a better military for the same money than if we kept it. The fact that lots has been invested in the past should be ignored.

Re:Good, then we can scrap that stupid f-35

[amiga3D]

The F-16 is a lawn dart and the F-35 is the new lawn dart. The 16 has a horrible safety record. Look at this year alone! Hell, 5 bit the dust in the month of July! Single engine war planes are idiocy at it's supremacy. When you lose an engine in an F-15 or F-18 you go home. When you lose one in an F-16 or F-35 you grab the ejection handle. With all the complicated software and fly by wire systems software glitches are a killer in a war plane which are inherently dangerous due to extreme performance and it doesn't help that most of the pilots are young and cocky but relying on a single engine insures a high rate of loss. I think it's past time to scrap the F-35 and quit throwing good money after bad. We're to the point now anyway where the pilot is holding the weapon system back. They've got autonomous systems working up now and they are the future. Let's quit wasting money of yesterdays technology especially when it's yesterdays bad technology.

Most F-35 hit pieces are garbage

[cfalcon]

Most of the F-35 stories are moderately garbage, usually able to be traced back to someone with an axe to grind. See: any of the stuff about dogfighting tests. Then read a bit more and find out what conditions they were held under, how many OTHER tests are left out (4v4, etc), and check out who wrote the original thing, and which pieces they cherry picked.

The A-10 complaints, however, are not like this. The A-10 is beloved by many whose lives depend on it, and seems to have capabilities that the F-35 does not, at least according to the fiery defenders you find on the net (who I don't see reason to doubt). I will not be surprised if some of the A-10 missions are rightfully replaced by F-35s. I would be surprised if they ALL were, however. The original desire for scrapping the A-10 came from excellent F-35 performance on some air force tests (and a desire to save money long term), but that seems unlikely to apply to every A-10 mission.

When you have a bunch of infantry bitching about something, it is probably worth listening to the bitching. And they seem to love the A-10. I mean, that seems pretty compelling.

Re:Maybe both have their place.

[Loki_1929]

The F-22 clears the skies of everything that flies. There isn't another jet even on the drawing board that competes with it in the air, but it also costs a fortune to fly it and since we screwed ourselves out of production (it'd take years to restart production on them), you don't want to risk them any longer than you have to. So against most adversaries with marginally effective air forces, you send F-15s all day. Against China or Russia, you send F-22s, force them to ground everything they care about keeping, and then fill the skies with F-15s to clear out everything they don't care as much about. After that, you just need effective ground attack and/or close-in air support options (depending on your decision to send ground troops).

This obsession with the F-35 is remarkably foolish. Remarkable for the fact that nobody with a decision capacity seems to comprehend the simple premise of using a mixture of high-end and low-end, role-specific equipment to do all the jobs that need doing as effectively as possible. Nothing beats the A-10 at doing what the A-10 does and it's cheap as Hell. Nothing beats the F-22 at doing what the F-22 does, but it's expensive as Hell. Once the expensive stuff has made operations reasonably safe by clearing the greatest threats, you pull it and start pumping the cheap-but-hugely-effective alternatives into the field. The only gap I see in the US Air Force's existing lineup is a long range, high-stealth, high speed ground strike aircraft capable of flying right into downtown Moscow and dropping a JDAM down Putin's chimney (or more likely, into hardened C&C centers).

Put that in development and start churning out more A-10s, F-15s, and other similarly effective tools. Nobody will be able to match the top-end tech and nobody will be able to overwhelm it with sheer numbers (e.g. WWII).

As an Army Vet

[s.petry]

The F35 does not, nor will it, top the A-10. Fast movers are fine for hit and run jobs, but close air support requires lingering time. The A-10 has plenty of linger and scares the F*$^ out of enemies. If you are ever in combat you want 2 things on the battlefield with you. A-10s and Apaches.