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On Wall Street, a High-Ranking Few Still Avoid Email (reuters.com)

The world may be increasingly becoming digital, but a small group of the Wall Street elite refuses to say anything substantive in an email, text, or chat, and some will not communicate digitally at all. From a Reuters report: This group, which includes top bankers like JPMorgan Chase & Co Chief Executive Officer Jamie Dimon and powerful investors like Carl Icahn and Berkshire Hathaway Inc's Warren Buffett, were eschewing electronic communications long before the probe of U.S. presidential candidate Hillary Clinton's emails and the recent hacks of her campaign manager's account made headlines. Some on Wall Street are nostalgic for a time when in-person conversations or phone calls were the norm, but others believe the words they type and send can come back to haunt them. Prosecutors have built insider trading, mortgage fraud and rate-rigging cases on embarrassing emails over the past several years, and they are often the most memorable part. Recent email woes among Washington power players have provided yet another reason for bankers to try to protect private correspondence from prying eyes. Dimon uses email but is known to keep his replies short and factual, favoring "yes," "no" and "thank you."

18 of 168 comments (clear)

  1. Smart move by Geoffrey.landis · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Judging by recent stories, sounds like they're pretty wise.

    --
    http://www.geoffreylandis.com
    1. Re:Smart move by I'm+New+Around+Here · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I didn't know you worked at the Clinton Foundation.

      --
      If you think I voted for Trump because of this post, you're wrong. I voted for Dr. Jill Stein of the Green Party. Again.
    2. Re:Smart move by UnderCoverPenguin · · Score: 3, Insightful

      I have a phrase, it is quite useful: "Can I get that in Email?" If the answer is "no", then I assume I am free to ignore that request.

      ... And if they ever try to "Get" you, you play dumb, "I don't recall".

      Doesn't matter. The boss can still fire you - or lay you off.

      The other thing I find useful is sending an email with a "brief summary" of whatever meeting it was. If they don't respond, then that is tacit acknowledgement the summary is accurate, and it becomes official record. Any non-written "clarification" would be followed up with same.

      Still doesn't matter. The boss can still say he followed up in-person or by phone. The lack of a further email summary won't matter to his boss.

      The problem is, far too many people find sleazy as an acceptable practice in organizations, and actively participate in the sleaze.

      Agreed

      Don't participate and you have nothing to worry about.

      Unfortunately, no. Too many people will believe the sleeze-balls.

      --
      Don't try to out wierd me, three-eyes. I get stranger things than you, free with my breakfast cereal. --Zaphod Beeblebr
    3. Re:Smart move by war4peace · · Score: 3, Insightful

      It's much harder for the boss to fire you if you have performed all duties that came to you in written form.

      --
      ...gis sdrawkcab (usually not responding to ACs; don't bother posting as AC)
  2. That's just common sense for crime organizations. by ZecretZquirrel · · Score: 5, Insightful

    The feds are watching.

  3. Makes sense by ErichTheRed · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I know I, as a lowly mid-level person, am very careful and exact about electronic communication. Whatever side of the Clinton email thing you're on, how would you feel about having the last 10 years of your private communication dumped out in an investigation? Would you be comfortable with your emails showing up in a publicly searchable court record even if it was unrelated to you? People have forgotten the basic premise that was drilled into my head when email first arrived -- don't write down anything you wouldn't be comfortable posting in public for the world to see.

    Executives are one of the last groups of people in a company to have the privilege of not communicating via email, text, etc. Everywhere I've worked, the execs' secretaries were the only ones sending out emails (logged in as the exec.) This is a big problem in the finance industry, because only the mid-level and below is captured in electronic communication. It makes it extremely hard to build a body of evidence in any legal case directly affecting the executives of a company. It's one of the reasons why lawsuits target the company only, and end with a settlement where the company does not admit any fault.

    1. Re:Makes sense by Trailer+Trash · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I know I, as a lowly mid-level person, am very careful and exact about electronic communication. Whatever side of the Clinton email thing you're on, how would you feel about having the last 10 years of your private communication dumped out in an investigation?

      I'm honest, so it doesn't matter. Also, if my emails were subpoenaed, I would turn them over. Looking at my friends' email and business associates' email wouldn't turn up any emails that I hadn't turned over since I would perform my legal obligation.

      This is only a problem if you're a dishonest scumbag.

    2. Re:Makes sense by taustin · · Score: 1, Insightful

      People have forgotten the basic premise that was drilled into my head when email first arrived -- don't write down anything you wouldn't be comfortable posting in public for the world to see.

      This is good advice for the entirety of the internet. The idea of any form of privacy online is laughably naïve. It isn't even possible.

    3. Re:Makes sense by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

      I'm honest, so it doesn't matter.

      If you give me six lines written by the hand of the most honest of men, I will find something in them which will hang him - Cardinal Richelieu

      Do you tend to close the door when you go to the toilet when there are other people around? Then you've got something to hide even though it's totally accepted that everybody uses the toilet. It is utter nonesense that being honest means you don't need privacy. Privacy isn't about hiding things that are unacceptable, privacy is about keeping perfectly acceptable things to yourself or out of sight. Often culture demands it (like closing the toilet door), and it may be a very fundamental need for most humans that has nothing to do with being dishonest.

    4. Re: Makes sense by D00MSlayer · · Score: 1, Insightful

      What she did wrong was use her own potentially vulnerable e-mail and server instead of a government-issued e-mail. They (the republicans) also believe she lied about it, but so far they have no evidence that she is guilty of perjury

      Ethically, she messed up. Legally, she's fine. She broke policy, not the law.

    5. Re:Makes sense by DarkOx · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Yes well we have public records laws that applied to Hillary that do not apply to the rest of us. Being Secretary of State is a privilege, you get all kinds of opportunity afterward to enrich yourself thru public speaking and consulting as well as other legal grey areas around what is and isn't insider trading etc. All that before you consider all the fine meals out at the worlds fanciest eateries and stays at the best hotels etc.

      In exchange for all this you give up a little privacy, I don't feel bad for her she knew what she was getting herself into. She could have had a nice career back home in Arkansas as an attorney and enjoyed all kinds of privacy if that is what she wanted. She chose public life, and that means the rest of us have a right to know what she was up to!

      --
      Repeal the 17th Amendment TODAY! Also Please Read http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/right-to-read.html
  4. That defines separation of class by SuperKendall · · Score: 4, Insightful

    You know you are in the underclass when you find it useful to have proof of what you have done.

    You know you are in the upper class when you find it useful to not have any proof of what you have done.

    The obvious conclusion of those statements is that money is a direct replacement for proof.

    --
    "There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
    1. Re:That defines separation of class by vux984 · · Score: 5, Insightful

      You know you are in the underclass when you find it useful to have proof of what you have done.

      You know you are in the upper class when you find it useful to not have any proof of what you have done.

      I suspect its more like...

      you know you did something where you are in the right when you find it useful to have proof of what you said and did.

      you know you are in the wrong (illegal, unethical, whatever) when you find it useful not to have any proof of what you said or did.

      While there is a correlation between the 'upper class' behaving illegally and unethically, and the 'under class' trying to keep the shit from landing on them there are plenty of (bottom class) criminals who (if they have 2 cells in their brains to rub together) also know better than to leave a 'paper trail'.

  5. Re:On the record by ShakaUVM · · Score: 5, Insightful

    >Where I work, sometimes you want it on-the-record. I want proof I said something, or did something, far more often than I'd ever want to be able to deny such actions later on.

    I also try to make sure any important communications get logged in email. If I have a phone call, I will email the client and summarize what we talked about. Not only does this minimize miscommunications (which can be very costly), but it has led to me winning a lawsuit when the client claimed I had never communicated with them and wanted to cancel an upcoming event I was going to speak at, despite having a contract and all that. So I printed out my copious email communications with them planning the event, put it and the contract in front of the "judge", and he took a look over the evidence and awarded me the full amount on my contract plus legal fees.

    Without the emails it would have been very hard to prove just through phone records that the event had been planned and booked six months in advance of the event date.

  6. Re:On the record by jenningsthecat · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Where I work, sometimes you want it on-the-record. I want proof I said something, or did something, far more often than I'd ever want to be able to deny such actions later on.

    That's because you're a peon. Perhaps well-paid and well-respected, but a peon nonetheless, compared with those who effectively run the world. The farther up people are on the ladder of power, the harder it tends to be to tell the difference between them, and the criminals recognized as such by the justice system. Most of them cover their tracks, live substantially covert lives, and have adopted 'plausible deniability' as a second-nature practice. It might simply be prudence, or it might be the vestige of a guilty conscience in an otherwise sociopathic makeup. Whatever it is, it seems to go with the territory.

    --
    'The Economy' is a giant Ponzi scheme whose most pitiable suckers are the youngest among us and the yet-unborn.
  7. Re:That's just common sense for crime organization by CajunArson · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Well if you think Wall Street moguls are a bunch of crooks, let's see who they want to win:

    GOLDMAN SACHS CEO: I support Hillary Clinton

    http://www.businessinsider.com...

    --
    AntiFA: An abbreviation for Anti First Amendment.
  8. Re:Sounds like... by epyT-R · · Score: 2, Insightful

    No. Sounds like people are responding the way they always do to oppressive surveillance: censor their words and funnel their beliefs into less traceable action instead.

  9. Nothing to hide != Nothing to fear by sjbe · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I'm honest, so it doesn't matter.

    Apparently you are naive too. Just because you have nothing to hide does not mean you have nothing to fear. It is VERY easy for a lawyer or law enforcement to make even innocent sounding statements into something incriminating. Your honesty may not be any protection and in fact might serve as "evidence" to hang you with.

    This is only a problem if you're a dishonest scumbag.

    You REALLY need to watch this video about why you should never talk to the police.