White House Silence Seems To Confirm $4 Billion 'Computer Science For All' K-12 Initiative Is No More

theodp writes: "2016 as a year of action builds on a decade of national, state, and grassroots activity to revitalize K-12 computer science education," reads the upbeat White House blog post kicking off Computer Science Education Week. But conspicuous by its absence in the accompanying fact sheet for A Year of Action Supporting Computer Science for All is any mention of the status of President Obama's proposed $4 billion Computer Science For All initiative, which enjoyed support from the likes of Microsoft, Facebook, and Google. On Friday, tech-backed Code.org posted An Update on Computer Science Education and Federal Funding, which explained that Congress's passage of a 'continuing resolution' extending the current budget into 2017 spelled curtains for federal funding for the program in 2016 and beyond. "We don't have any direct feedback yet about the next administration's support for K-12 CS," wrote CEO Hadi Partovi and Govt. Affairs VP Cameron Wilson, "other than a promise to expand 'vocational and technical education' as part of Trump's 100-day plan which was published in late October. I am hopeful that this language may translate into support for funding K-12 computer science at a federal level. However, we should assume that it will not."

Comments

Re:Don't worry, there is a new initiative

[Anonymous Coward]

... Because the initiative was a good one and we're sad it's gone? ... Because computer scientists can't be born again? ... Because Trump is a fundamentalist?

Oh... I get it. You just hate Trump. My I suggest conflating his campaign with white supremacism? I hear that's the current strategy.

Good start

[Anonymous Coward]

Now, we need a push so that kids the math, writing and science skills they'll need because the schools are failing horribly at those - especially science. What good is them learning to code when they still come out of school thinking Evolution is "just a theory" and not a fact?

Or coming out of school without the basic math skills to succeed in a STEM field.

And this focus on STEM is horribly musguided. Everything builds on one another. Music and art education is just as important and helps with other subjects. Why while everyone in my data structures class were struggling, I learned it instantaneously by making analogies to music.

And also keep in mind that compared to the general population, more Noble winners play instruments. Interesting correlation between musicality and scientific creativity.

But code.org is about creating a pool of low cost labor and not our economic future.

And soon, computers won't need to be programmed, they'll be trained.

Re:Good start

[TimothyHollins]

Waaaaat?

Personalized medicine, vaccines, cancer therapy and prevention, agriculture, space exploration and exploitation, all future medical treatments, insurance, life prolongation, climate change survival.

All these are partially or completely dependent on our grasp of evolutionary processes and how to exploit/apply them. To do that we need to know the evolutionary theory and how the genomic pathways developed over time.

You might notice that the list above includes several of the most daunting challenges this generation will face, so I'd say evolution is not a "minor scientific theory".

Re:Good start

[KeithJM]

My only concern with that line of thinking is that it isn't just evolution -- the same group that denies evolution denies anything that implies the earth is more than 10 thousand years old. So you end up writing off not just the foundation of modern biology, but geology, astronomy (stars can't be more than 10,000 light years from us if we can see them!), even history (we have archaeology from societies that existed before the world did). At what point do you stop catering to this and just teach as though we're living in the real world?

Re:Good start

[Trailer Trash]

I know at least 10s of nurses and two doctors (one of whom is a high-paid specialist, the other of whom is an *extremely* high-paid specialist and researcher) who are outright creationists. It doesn't affect their work quality in any way. If anything, their strong Christian beliefs probably make their work better.

I'm an evolutionist, so I think they're wrong. I *know* they're wrong. But the fact is that it doesn't matter for the work that they do.

I agree with you that many researchers need to understand evolution, but that's very very few people. And I'm not saying it shouldn't be taught. I'm just saying that for the vast majority of people - including health-care professionals - it doesn't matter.

The same goes for advanced math, most of science, literature, etc. Most people don't use most of their education in their day-to-day jobs.

Provide this at the state level

[Karmashock]

These sorts of programs should not be Federal.

Re:Provide this at the state level

[kevin lyda]

How much profit can you make off a kindergartner?

Re:Provide this at the state level

[Anonymous Coward]

You can test your hypothesis by working in one state without state income taxes and living in another with state income taxes. See if the state that collects income taxes agrees that you don't have to pay them. Then report back on whether that was an imaginary line or not.

Re:Provide this at the state level

[geekmux]

How much profit can you make off a kindergartner?

Perhaps you should ask a parent who has paid several thousand dollars for the years leading up to kindergarten (pre-school), as well as those parents who feel public school is utter shit, and pay several thousand dollars per year to send their children to private school instead.

I'd say by the time a kid reaches kindergarten, the profit margin can be well-established.

Re:Provide this at the state level

[Austerity Empowers]

These sorts of programs should not be Federal.

Because computer science is different for citizens of Kansas than it is for Citizens of California? Because children in Wyoming won't ever need to code, but children in New York might? Even my grandfather had to leave Nebraska because the farm was going to his older brother(s) and he needed skills that would help him on his own in places where he could get a job.

I can understand pushing some things down to states if anyone who isn't corrupt is genuinely interested in the welfare of individual states, but education seems universal.

All those "backers"....

[goose-incarnated]

Oh Noes!!! All those 'backers' won't have large cheap pool of labour anymore! Whatever shall we do?

Tempests and Teapots

[Slugster]

Might as well teach US kids to make tennis shoes while you're at it.

US kids don't need more computer science, US companies are already (still) offshoring tech jobs as fast as they can.
The colleges want to keep selling the courses and the big tech guys want to say that they're "doing something" about "the problem" (meanwhile they need more H1Bs, please) but nobody else would benefit.

If US public education gets behind *any* concept, you can bet that it's at least 5 years out of date already, and may be 10+ years out of date.

Re:Tempests and Teapots

[Hognoxious]

If US public education gets behind *any* concept, you can bet that it's at least 5 years out of date already, and may be 10+ years out of date.

That's a bit of a generalisation.

It might just be plain wrong.

(Sorry, Texas, I tried to not look at you)

Re:Tempests and Teapots

[hey!]

US kids don't need more computer science, US companies are already (still) offshoring tech jobs as fast as they can.

Well, it's not so simple as that. Let me illustrate.

The average salary of a software engineer in San Jose is $110,000. The average salary for a software engineer in Omaha NE is $77,629/year. So why aren't software companies setting up shop in Omaha? Possibly, they should. But the size of the talent pool around San Jose is immensely larger, making it more likely you can find exactly what you need if you're an employer. The market says that's worth paying a 42% salary premium.

Software is almost unique in its ability for workers to create the need for even more workers. If you are producing washing machines, the demand curve for washing machines doesn't shift because you make more of them. But the demand for software as a whole can. Software isn't like washing machines, because it isn't just one thing that addresses a single need. It's many things, some of which create new needs. The 130,000 people working for Oracle create many times that number of tech jobs -- for good and bad reasons. Who knows how many jobs the 700 people working for Canonical create, both users, app developers, and even developers of derivative distros.

I happen to agree that US kids don't need computer science, but for different reasons. You can't really learn much computer science until you've had at least high school math, so what they're really talking about is vocational training for programmers. That's an utter waste of time. Employers want at least *some* college, if not a degree, and if you're talking about middle school kids the training you give them is likely to be obsolete by the time they enter the workforce.

Which doesn't mean I think teaching kids to program in Python or (depending on their age) Logo isn't a good idea. A little programming is a useful skill across many professions. But there are only so many class hours in a child's education, and you have to look very sharply for anything resembling diminishing returns. In my state Kindergartners are being assigned homework, believe it or not, because of the curriculum pressure in higher grades. Kindergarten is covering material that used to be covered in first grade, and day care providers (even small operations run out of the provider's home) are expected to take early childhood education classes and do what used to be done in kindergarten.

There's just no room to put more stuff in unless it's extremely useful.

Know that "privilege" you like to talk about?

[MikeRT]

All of these initiatives keep reinforcing it. Wake me up when some poor, rural community or ghetto school has seen a major improvement. I'm sick and tired of the nonsense where we give an already decent school more resources, some middle class kid (probably a girl) gets cajoled into taking CS as an elective and it's like "look ma, we're fighting inequality and making America work for everyone!"

FFS, we half of the kids that leave (one way or another) from inner city schools are functionally illiterate and we worry that some middle class kid who doesn't have enough curiosity to google "how to start programming" is not going to start? Priorities, you don't have them...

Re:Know that "privilege" you like to talk about?

[Pinky's Brain]

A school can't correct for a class filled with poor single parent household kids who refuse to be educated. A class environment requires a basic level of deference to the institution school to operate. Good teachers can help create that, but most of it has to come from home.

Inner city black schools which are successful are selective and enforce discipline, they are almost all charter schools which can expel the dregs to the public school system. All comer schools which don't have any real measure to enforce discipline are the drain of the schooling system, in a region with lots of kids who simply refuse to be educated there is almost no escaping the suction of losers pulling you down with them.

PS. there's also unfortunate focus on college in the US high school system, a lot of kids would be better off starting apprenticeship early and finding joy in disposable income.

It was a joke to begin with

[stevegee58]

There is a common misconception among non-technical "folks" (i.e. lawyers, politicians etc) that anyone can learn to "code". Of course anyone can be shown how to write a "hello world" application in any language but that doesn't make them a programmer. Unfortunately the perception that "coding" is easy is perpetuated by these democratizing programs that try to turn everyone into a programmer. The fact is that writing the actual code is a small percentage of the intellectual effort required to implement a working software system.
We don't need a generation of code monkeys typing away at keyboards; we need people with mathematics and analytical skills. Our current education system is simply not producing enough people with math/analytical skills. Meddlesome, short-sighted Federal programs such as "computer science for all" are simply not addressing this basic lack of skills. The fact is that teaching the hard, basic skills required to produce technical professionals is very difficult but no one seems to have the stomach for hard work any more.

How do you define "support"?

[geekmux]

"I am hopeful that this language may translate into support for funding K-12 computer science at a federal level. However, we should assume that it will not."

In the meantime this program "enjoyed support from the likes of Microsoft, Facebook, and Google"

By "support" do you mean companies with hundreds of billions of dollars in cash reserves sit idly by and hope that clapping on the sidelines will bring this program to fruition?

Gotta love that fucking show of support. I agree with others, this program should not be Federally funded. Perhaps it should be instead supported by the very tech companies that were allowed to abuse tax programs in order to stockpile their billions.

Re: Don't worry, there is a new initiative

[Anonymous Coward]

We could just be honest and associate it with rampant stupidity.

Right, because anybody who doesn't agree with *you* is stupid.

Please do not breed or interact with impressionable youth, m'kay?.

Barking up the wrong tree.

[jcr]

There is no reason to teach every kid to code, any more than we should teach every kid to pilot a ship or practice law.

-jcr