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New Wyoming Bill Penalizes Utilities Using Renewable Energy (csmonitor.com)

An anonymous reader quotes a Christian Science Monitor report on "a bill that would essentially ban large-scale renewable energy" in Wyoming. The new Wyoming bill would forbid utilities from using solar or wind sources for their electricity by 2019, according to Inside Climate News... The bill would require utilities to use "eligible resources" to meet 95 percent of Wyoming's electricity needs in 2018, and all of its electricity needs in 2019. Those "eligible resources" are defined solely as coal, hydroelectric, natural gas, nuclear, oil, and individual net metering... Utility-scale wind and solar farms are not included in the bill's list of "eligible resources," making it illegal for Wyoming utilities to use them in any way if the legislation passes. The bill calls for a fine of $10 per megawatt-hour of electricity from a renewable source to be slapped on Wyoming utilities that provide power from unapproved sources to in-state customers.
The bill also prohibits utilities from raising rates to cover the cost of those penalties, though utilities wouldn't be penalized if they exported that energy to other states. But one local activist described it as 'talking-point' legislation, and even the bill's sponsor gives it only a 50% chance of passing.

37 of 502 comments (clear)

  1. Wind and Solar are Environmental Disasters by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Funny

    Wind murders countless migratory birds every year, and the environmental impact of Chinese solar panels is similarly out of this world. There are no environmental regulations in China.

    This is a good move by WY to help save the environment.

    1. Re:Wind and Solar are Environmental Disasters by Anaerin · · Score: 4, Informative

      It's not "Countless". Wind turbines kill between 214,000 and 368,000 birds annually - a small fraction compared with the estimated 6.8 million fatalities from collisions with cell and radio towers and the 1.4 billion to 3.7 billion deaths from cats. So if it's really migratory birds you're so worried about, you'd better ditch your cellphone. And/or kill your cat.

    2. Re: Wind and Solar are Environmental Disasters by FatdogHaiku · · Score: 4, Funny

      So, the take-away is that birds are mostly blind?
      I've had them miss my car by an inch and I think what saved them was the slipstream created by the car.
      Maybe they're just distracted... check their bodies for tiny smart phones...

      --
      You have the right to remain sentient. If you give up the right to remain sentient, you will be elected to public office
    3. Re: Wind and Solar are Environmental Disasters by ShanghaiBill · · Score: 5, Insightful

      So, the take-away is that birds are mostly blind?

      No. The take-away is that birds evolved before there were large obstacles moving at 70 mph, and large transparent areas on cliff faces. They rarely run into parked cars, or windowless buildings.

    4. Re:Wind and Solar are Environmental Disasters by ShanghaiBill · · Score: 5, Informative

      Also, the newer, larger turbines kill far fewer birds.

      The big reason for this is that they are higher off the ground, where winds are stronger and more reliable. Most local birds fly low, and most migrating birds fly even higher than than the big turbines.

      The "bird" objection to wind turbines has always been stupid and disingenuous (the people making it don't really give a crap about the birds), but it has become even stupider as turbines improve.

    5. Re:Wind and Solar are Environmental Disasters by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

      If only we could harness the wind power of that WHOOSH

    6. Re: Wind and Solar are Environmental Disasters by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Don't worry, evolution is fixing this issue right now.

    7. Re:Wind and Solar are Environmental Disasters by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative

      http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2013/01/29/cats-wild-birds-mammals-study/1873871/

    8. Re: Wind and Solar are Environmental Disasters by blindseer · · Score: 4, Insightful

      No, birds just run into things. I remember a study where someone tried to figure out why birds ran into windows so often. They found out that birds just run into things, like trees. I grew up on a farm where the birds liked to run into the farmhouse quite often. We'd hear them thump against the wall. Living in the suburbs now I still hear them thump, just not as often. This has probably less to do with where I live and more to do with the thicker walls on my current house compared to the house I grew up in.

      --
      I am armed because I am free. I am free because I am armed.
    9. Re:Wind and Solar are Environmental Disasters by CaptainDork · · Score: 4, Insightful

      This is about the Bakken oil fields that run through Wyoming.

      The US has a fossil fuel glut and renewable energy is not going to help that.

      I helped litigate Big Tobacco and fossil fuel is the back story here.

      They stab it with their steely knives
      But they just can't kill the beast

      --
      It little behooves the best of us to comment on the rest of us.
    10. Re:Wind and Solar are Environmental Disasters by sphealey · · Score: 4, Informative

      Gas turbine power plants are not exactly friendly to birds. I've walked across parking lots in the morning that looked like the dumpster at the rotisserie chicken place had been knocked over.

      sPh

      (insects are drawn to the warmth radiating from the exhaust stack wall. Birds dive after the insects, and if they dive through the exhaust, toasted bird)

    11. Re:Wind and Solar are Environmental Disasters by ragahast · · Score: 5, Interesting

      10,000x more birds are killed by cats than by solar (?!?) and wind? Can you provide a citation for that? I'd like to use it in shutting-up idiots in the future (if true).

      Oh, it's quite true. See this recent study for the numbers on wind turbines, and this one for cats*. This report ranks various energy sources; perhaps unsurprisingly coal actually kills the most birds.

      It turns out cats kill a lot of animals, making them "the single greatest source of anthropogenic mortality for US birds and mammals." According to that second study, though, most of the deaths are attributable to un-owned cats. The actual numbers from the studies are exactly those quoted by Anaerin above.

      * Nature isn't open access but...

      --
      .:Semper Absurda:.
  2. Wyoming = big coal country by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Interesting

    They just are trying to protect their coal industry so that it doesn't wind up the West Virginia of the western US.

    1. Re:Wyoming = big coal country by TWX · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Wind power in particular could also be a great way to ensure that grazing rights on lands are maintained, since there's no reason why a wind farm and ranching would have to be incompatible, and with the land already being several stages away from being pristine, no reason not to continue to leave grazing rights.

      --
      Do not look into laser with remaining eye.
  3. Huh by barrywalker · · Score: 4, Insightful

    The retards have really taken over, alright.

    If we don't burn ourselves up, we're headed for a really nice repeat of the dark ages.

    1. Re:Huh by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      But I thought Republitards were all about government getting out of regulating businesses? Magic of the free market and all?

      Oh, they are just hypocritical? I guess whatever makes America great again.

    2. Re:Huh by TeknoHog · · Score: 4, Funny

      I guess whatever makes America great again.

      whatever, n. The je ne sais quoi that makes America great again.

      --
      Escher was the first MC and Giger invented the HR department.
    3. Re:Huh by Darinbob · · Score: 3, Informative

      Not sure how this would be legal. You can't dictate that a company can't sell a legal product. So how would a wind only operate? Sounds like Republicans for Excessive and Unnecessary Regulation. Doncha love a party that sticks to its ideals instead of pandering to big business interests?

    4. Re:Huh by dbIII · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Or at least Trump goes around telling people he's the best fuck.
      I thought "Idoicracy" was supposed to be a satire.

    5. Re:Huh by TWX · · Score: 5, Insightful

      For each party's pet causes, the only difference that I see is that the Democrats don't pretend that they're not picking and choosing when to intrude. The Republicans seem to intrude just as much while claiming that they're not intruding.

      --
      Do not look into laser with remaining eye.
    6. Re:Huh by whoever57 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      These are very persuasive sentiments. I wonder why the people of Wyoming don't listen to kind-hearted entreaties such as this?

      We should lie to the special snowflakes and not call out their stupidity?

      That's the new normal? Politicians in a state propose a stupid law and we should just praise the people who elected them because otherwise they might get upset?

      --
      The real "Libtards" are the Libertarians!
    7. Re:Huh by AmiMoJo · · Score: 4, Insightful

      In my experience they often propose a stupid, draconian or simply abusive law in the full expectation that it will get shot down. They can then claim they were stifled and shift blame to someone else, or introduce a lesser but still basically evil "compromise" bill that does get through. That latter one is a favourite technique for the current UK government.

      --
      const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
      SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
  4. Interstate commerce? by whoever57 · · Score: 5, Informative

    Surely, there is interstate commerce going on here, which would take the issue out of the hands of local politicians?

    Also, it's anti-employment, anti-business. Renewable energy employs more people than coal. The only people to benefit are a small number of miners and a tiny special interest group (coal mine owners).

    --
    The real "Libtards" are the Libertarians!
  5. Ah, yes. by fuzzyfuzzyfungus · · Score: 4, Insightful

    If this bill's author has had the temerity to claim to be in favor of 'freedom' or 'free markets'; and then pushes this nonsense, somebody needs to feed him to a wood chipper.

    1. Re:Ah, yes. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Passing a bill restricting others market freedom or freedom in general is not "speaking your mind". It is using force and stealing from people. That is certainly worthy of jail or death.

    2. Re:Ah, yes. by meglon · · Score: 4, Informative

      Sure, lets end those subsidies... then end all the oil and gas subsidies, then go reclaim the past 110 years of subsidies we gave to oil companies. The author isn't speaking his mind... he's too fucking stupid to have a mind, and he's put on a pedestal for being a fucking idiot by other fucking idiots like you.

      --
      Fascism: An authoritarian and nationalistic right-wing system of government and social organization. See also: NAZI's
    3. Re:Ah, yes. by Uberbah · · Score: 4, Informative

      Coal is killing the planet, wind and solar are not. Your dad probably complained about when asbestos and lead paint were being phased out, too.

  6. Congrats Wyoming! by Notabadguy · · Score: 4, Funny

    Now if we could just get Wyoming to also pass a bill to put up a wall around the state, then send the bill Colorado. Then they could put a dome on the wall and send the bill for that to Utah.

    No walls, no gates, no windows. Must contain the tard.

  7. I'm ok with this... by Gravis+Zero · · Score: 4, Insightful

    as long as the CO2 from Wyoming is contained within Wyoming. They can build a dome and then suffocate if they like.

    --
    Anons need not reply. Questions end with a question mark.
  8. Re:It's a tax by quantaman · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Or more accurately, a backlash against subsidies - $10 per megawatt hour.

    It's a middle finger to progressives.

    This is the problem with the political right at the moment. They're not trying to correct the market or protect local jobs, they're trying to rile up their base by pissing off people concerned about global warming.

    --
    I stole this Sig
  9. Tables are turning by transporter_ii · · Score: 4, Insightful

    It seems like paid shills are posting under every renewable energy article about renewables not being viable without government subsidies. Well here you go. It seems that coal is now the one in need of government hand outs.

    --
    Doctors destroy health, lawyers destroy justice, universities destroy knowledge, religion destroys spirituality
    1. Re:Tables are turning by MightyMartian · · Score: 4, Insightful

      And what would you call this proposed bill in Wyoming? It's an unapologetic subsidy to the coal industyr, because clearly the Wyoming government believes that the Wyoming coal industry will not be able to compete with renewables. Now maybe the justification boils down to "we get more taxes from coal than wind", but whatever that justification is, the intention is clear, Wyoming coal is seen as being at a competitive disadvantage, and therefore it will be subsidized by making renewable energy sources more expensive.

      --
      The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
  10. The real headline by hackwrench · · Score: 3, Funny

    President Col. Sanders, beloved mascot of KFC passes an ordinary bill mandating the purchase of KFC chicken once a week. People will rejoice at this yet another natural outcome of the amendment passed during the Trump administration that relinquished the vote of the common people to the companies that are responsible for them.

  11. Re:All about the fight by dbIII · · Score: 4, Insightful

    And the problem with the left is that they can't compromise

    Often the "compromise" wanted is complete capitulation so the people who see themselves firmly on the "right" can appear "strong".
    Stupid fucking games instead of trying to run something properly. Edge cases on minor issues getting attention just to deliberately start a fight instead of actual governance.
    In a lot of cases it's not "left" or "right" but huge fucking egos trying to turkey slap everyone just to prove they have balls.

  12. Re:I'm conflicted on this by dbIII · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Good point - the free market is biased between the quick solutions whether they are better in the long run or not, plus it tends to concentrate in places where profit is highest. Without government involvement we wouldn't have nukes and just about every farm and small town would still be dark just as it was more than fifty years after Edison lit up a profitable part of New York.

  13. Re: WY is a good place to be from by meglon · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Might try comparing say... California... to shitholes like Kansas, idiot. Red states are predominantly leeches on blue states, and they still rank the shittiest states on pretty much any quality of living/prepping for the future index. I do understand though, fucking idiots like you can't be bothered with reality.

    --
    Fascism: An authoritarian and nationalistic right-wing system of government and social organization. See also: NAZI's
  14. Re:All about the fight by quantaman · · Score: 4, Insightful

    And the problem with the left is that they can't compromise and won't evolve.

    Have you been sleeping the past 8 years? The right refused compromise on principle.

    I was just listening to Bill Maher from last night, and all the liberals encouraging the audience to fight, disrupt, oppose, insult(*), and combat everything the right wants to do.

    I didn't see the segment in question, but I'm pretty sure he was talking about Trump, a character so dangerous the GOP spent most of the primary desperately trying to stop him.

    Nowhere did anyone say "we have to become better". Nothing about making better policies, making more intelligent arguments, doing things voters want, making the country better, or anything that could be considered noble.

    The left talks about that constantly, a huge part of the post-election conversation is trying to understand why the left lost touch with the white working class.

    But as to "better policies" and "intelligent arguments", a huge part of the criticism of Sanders was that his policies weren't robust. The right has spent the last few year using high deductibles as a major criticism of Obamacare, all the while selling high deductible coverage as their replacement.

    Trump's speeches were warm and inclusive, saying essentially "we're in this together, we can win, we can do better".

    "Warm and inclusive" is an odd description of mass deportation, immigration bans based on religion, promises to imprison your rival, and the constant demonization of the media.

    I don't think anyone on the left has a clue how ineffective their campaign of crying, whining, and insulting is.

    It can be very effective, whiny insulting campaign speeches won Trump the election.

    --
    I stole this Sig