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Watchdog Group Wants Uber's Self-Driving Trucks Off the Road (usatoday.com)
New submitter Kemtores quotes a report from USA Today: A few months ago, the ride-hailing giant announced that it would begin testing self-driving Volvo SUVs in this hilly city, but a day later that process was halted after the DMV said Uber had not applied for the proper permits. Uber moved its fleet to Arizona. Uber cars laden with sensors still troll San Francisco, but the company said it is only for mapping purposes. Now a southern California non-profit that has long raised concerns about the safety of autonomous vehicles has asked the DMV to look closer at the operations of Otto, a self-driving truck company that Uber bought last year for $670 million. Otto made headlines in October when it completed a 120-mile beer run with a large semi-tractor in Colorado. But Consumer Watchdog's John Simpson charged in a letter to DMV director Jean Shiomoto that in fact Otto's testing here did violate the law by operating in autonomous mode, offering proof in the form of documentation Otto submitted to Colorado officials that described a process where the driver hit a button and let the truck do the work.
Takin R Jerbs!
I very much disagree with Uber's business model as far as passenger livery is concerned, as passenger livery laws are usually there as a reaction to something bad that has happened in the past, so those laws that Uber violates are there for reasons.
Long-haul, on the other hand, makes a lot more sense for self-driving vehicles, especially if they're basically limited to the interstate highway system as a limited-access freeway model. There are less people on the roads outside of motor vehicles, and the rules for where cross-country hikers and bicyclists are supposed to be at on those roads are definable. If operators remain with the trucks, if the trucks can be made reliable enough to self-drive where the driver doesn't have to be involved at all then driver fatigue can be significantly curtailed on the over-the-road part, so the drivers are fresh for operating where manual control is necessary, like at warehousing depots, in cities, and on roads that do not lend themselves to autonomous mode. Lastly, from the trucking-company perspective, using the convoy model where perhaps twenty trucks are shepherded by a single driver, ostensibly playin follow-the leader, would significantly curtail labor costs and would allow the trucking companies to base more staff locally to depots and cities, so that convoy, moved city-to-city by one driver, would be distributed to numerous local-delivery drivers or warehousing-yard drivers once it's near its destination, those drivers wouldn't be stuck in a sleeper cab overnight away from home when they're off-shift.
Granted, there probably still needs to be some ground rules for companies experimenting with autonomous trucking, but it makes a lot more sense to start with trucks than with around-town passenger vehicles.
Do not look into laser with remaining eye.
Usually when a "watchdog group" appears, it tends to have been funded by someone in order to either derail some technology (as it can interfere with the profits of the company lining the "watchdog group"'s pockets), or it is made to suit some political agenda.
I wonder who runs the group in question. Some other state wanting people to test there, perhaps?
And certain towns that have large truckstops as their main activity will diminish like towns that had railway stations as their main activity? Just wondering. It seems this topic can be part of automation debate, like this lively one at reddit: https://www.reddit.com/r/expla...
mfwright@batnet.com
Usually it's a Warren Buffet backed organization trying to mess with anything that could interfere with his rail investments. Automated trucks would fit the bill.
My Other Computer Is A Data General Nova III.
As a 20 year veteran of driving heavy trucks. Otto is a major accident waiting to happen, even if a human driver is sitting waiting to react, that time at highway speeds may be too late. The arguments are plenty to avoid a Otto autonomous truck, such as a lack of real statistics to back up safety of such a system. Then you have the physical threats of a large vehicle not reacting correctly to a incident or condition on the highway. I personally think we are moving too fast to push this technology onto our public roads without proper certifications and data. I am not even sure a self driving truck can ever be fully self driving without a human occupant to perform other duties to meet DOT regulations. How then will this technology be cost effective in a industry so lacking in profits is beyond me?
"We want the past!"
"When to we want it? NOW!"
Where are we going and why are we in a handbasket?
There is POLITICAL opposition by lobbyist groups for drivers and union groups for the jobs required because human drivers need guidance at both ends. Once semi-automated trucking arrives, the path back will disappear. Yet another reason for opposition. Automated trucking is inevitable.
Now can we have GPS on trains so they don't crash!?
Technically this tech has arrived. PERIOD.
What makes you think that the economics of that situation will change at all? In fact, it will be more likely, as an economic optimum will be computed, instead of an hourly driver going "fuck it" and not passing.
I am 100% behind the push for autonomous vehicles, but why in the world are they being TESTED on public roads with other drivers? It's insane. Make sure you vehicle works BEFORE you put it to real world use in non consenting test subjects (the other drivers just going about their normal day).
Obviously the line between "it works" and "it doesn't work" is fuzzy, but IMHO we are no where near the "it works" -- at least not good enough to put in a non-controlled situation.
Those things with 18 wheels also reach a lot of places that aren't practical for a train. This is quite similar to why your circulatory system has both capillaries and arteries.
...a southern California non-profit that has long raised concerns about the safety of autonomous vehicles
Have they long raised the concerns about human drivers who have a 100-year track record of abysmal failure? Accidents will happen with autonomous vehicles, but it's not going to be anywhere near the rate it happens with a human behind the wheel.
"No sir! I don't like it one bit! I don't want any new-fangled automo-contraptions making all kinds of noise on the streets. What's wrong with a carriage and good horse?"
I'm sorry, but your opinion seems to be wrong.
All these people doing is just say no to innovation.
Do tesla have this special autonomous license everywhere, or is it an oversight?
Waterfox - a Firefox fork with legacy extension support, security updates and better privacy by default.
Uber seems to be relying on a "We're on the Internet, there's no laws here!" approach rather than complying with local taxi regulations. Most cities and states limit the number of taxis on the roads to prevent gas waste and traffic, but Uber and Lyft don't apply for such things, they just start up anyway.
Shouldn't it be possible to outfit one of these trucks to log not only the actions of the automated system, but also of the human driver? Have human drivers doing their usual routine for a year while also having the automated systems active—But instead of actually controlling the truck, they would merely log the actions they would have taken and any discrepancies between the human driver and automated systems could be analyzed to account for edge-cases.
Roll out the Luddites!
:T:R:A:N:S:
The people in the crowd are going to kill themselves by pulling out their hair in fear because the government told them they aren't safe?
The problem is infrastructure. Every single store you shop at has a loading dock in back for trucks, not rail. So why accept the time delays of putting intermodal trailers on train then back to truck when gas is so cheap.
-The art of programming is the pursuit of absolute simplicity.
It wasn't always that way. Grocery stores used to have their own rail sidings, back when trucking wasn't so heavily subsidized.
Any sufficiently unpopular but cohesive argument is indistinguishable from trolling.
This. I don't see it happening in my lifetime.
Those things with 18 wheels also reach a lot of places that aren't practical for a train. This is quite similar to why your circulatory system has both capillaries and arteries.
Constrict capillaries!
(C'mon, *some*body was gonna say it!)
Strat
Progressivism (aka US 'Liberalism'): Ideas so good they need a police/surveillance-state to enforce.
Well really, there's a very easy solution to getting them "off the road"
Until an autonomous system itself reaches an extremely higher level of maturity/sophistication it’s a long way from coming mainstream. The system, as it stands now cannot see an accident a mile down the road, it can’t see a police officer having pulled someone over on the shoulder of the highway, it can’t see debris in the road. In the 20 truck convoy scenario laid out, the shepherd riding in truck# 1 will not be able to respond/react quickly enough when truck# 17 blows a steering tire.
Once it does reach that level of sophistication, it will only be for general commodities going from and to a distribution point. It will be a very long time before it goes from the loading docks at Bob’s Dog Food and Ink Pens to your local retailers dock.
I’m the shipping manager for a rather large steel company in Texas. Moving steel bridge girders around the country where a single girder weighing in at 156k and 140’ is an everyday occurrence. 300k+ and 200'+ long is not uncommon. But it will be some Star Trek level docking program before these get moved autonomously.
Your sig here!
I don't know if it's just me or not, but I'm getting pretty fucking sick and tired of any kind of activist group constantly telling us what we should do.
All these groups WANT something and that something is almost always wanting YOU to behave in the way THEY want. Even if it doesn't affect you in particular instance, you just want to shout SHUT THE FUCK UP YOU COCK SUCKING BUSYBODIES and GET THE FUCK OUT!
Just the image of a bunch of whiny, cock sucking mother fuckers waving stupid flags or signs and chanting stupid slogans (For ANYTHING) so they get their way makes me want to machine gun them all down and feed them to the sharks.