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Apple Suspends Sales of LG's UltraFine 5K Monitor Over Hardware Issues (appleinsider.com)

Posted by msmash on from the taking-a-step-back dept.

Roger Fingas, writing for AppleInsider: Apple has temporarily stopped sales of LG's UltraFine 5K monitor, due to technical problems associated with a lack of proper shielding from wireless interference. Over the weekend, Apple retail staff were told to keep the product on display yet not sell any units if people asked, according to a Business Insider source. The site added that it heard the same from a representative at a New York Apple store. Separately, AppleInsider has confirmed the organized removal from sale of the Thunderbolt 3 display. Sources inside Apple not authorized to speak on behalf of the company indicated that retail locations are retaining demonstration displays, but not selling any stock on-hand that it may receive that may actually have the shielding fix, nor filling any pending orders until otherwise informed. Big blow to Apple, which has given up on external monitors business. But at least, it's comforting to know people who wish to purchase a new display for their MacBook or MacBook Pro have several company-approved alternatives. Oh wait, they don't.

49 of 79 comments (clear)

  1. doing the right thing by XXongo · · Score: 4, Insightful

    It's actually quite responsible for them to stop selling the unit, rather than continuing to sell product that they know has a problem, which is what many companies in the past have done.

    1. Re:doing the right thing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Funny

      Clearly they are just holding their monitors wrong.

  2. Tim Cook is sad by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Funny

    First Tim Cook can't hire all those employees he desperately needs from Syria, Iran and Somalia for a few months, and now this. Guy is getting hit from all directions.

    1. Re:Tim Cook is sad by backslashdot · · Score: 2

      Yeah i see the sarcasm. You seem to know who all these companies should hire. Yet none of you geniuses who say Google, Apple, Microsoft and others don't need to hire foreigners have ever made a billion dollar technology company (real estate, oil, and businesses profiting off monopolization of resources don't count).

      There is a reason many of the patents on the original iPhone have foreign names.

  3. The reason? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    No courage in this monitor.

  4. Big blow to apple? by berj · · Score: 4, Informative

    Why is a third party monitor having problems a big blow to apple? Why would mac users need an apple approved monitor? I've been using macs for the better part of 15 years and I don't recall ever using an apple branded monitor let alone some mythical "apple approved" one.

    1. Re:Big blow to apple? by AmiMoJo · · Score: 2, Insightful

      It's a blow because they decided to discontinue their own line of monitors (the "cinema" range) and instead nominate LG's display as the official successor. This monitor non-standard in a number of ways, similar to the old cinema displays, and somehow worse is better. For example, there is no OSD, all adjustments must be made from within MacOS.

      Apple were clearly hoping that they could sell this monitor as the new "recommended" one, i.e. charge well over the odds for it.

      --
      const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
      SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
    2. Re:Big blow to apple? by Luthair · · Score: 1

      It is a bit of hyperbole, but its also their strategy failing leaving their users without an in store monitor option.

    3. Re:Big blow to apple? by teh+dave · · Score: 1

      I hate Apple with a passion and lament their frequently backwards ways, but the drivel of a summary for this sorry excuse for a "story" brings the usual Apple- and Microsoft-bashing tripe I expect of this place to an even more pitiful low. Just ignore it and continue using your preferred variety of shiny.

    4. Re:Big blow to apple? by MachineShedFred · · Score: 1

      Because Apple decided to use unicorn ports on their new MacBook, and this is the one display that has a matching unicorn plug that doesn't require an adapter.

      Except that apparently LG didn't bother to build it right. Oops.

      --
      Slashdot still doesnâ(TM)t support Unicode after it was added to the HTML standard in 1997.
    5. Re:Big blow to apple? by MassacrE · · Score: 2

      If it were an 'official' successor, it would have an Apple logo on it. Apple pushed LG to make a thunderbolt 3 monitor, in turn for carrying them at apple stores and mentioning them during a keynote. Hardly 'official'.

    6. Re:Big blow to apple? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      They're the only monitors that the Apple Store carries.

      They're the same panels that Apple uses in its iMacs.

      They're official.

    7. Re:Big blow to apple? by Solandri · · Score: 1

      The Apple-branded monitors reported their resolution and physical screen size back to the Mac. The Mac then uses that info to scale the font so that a 10 point font on the screen is the same size as a 10 point font on paper, or a 10 point font on another different monitor. It's one of the features built into the Macs which made them immensely popular in the publishing industry.

      Since they discontinued their monitor line (not really sure I'd call it "their" line since they just repackaged panels by LG and Samsung), I presume the whole point of Apple-approved third party monitors was that they encoded this functionality into OS X. If it recognized the approved monitor, it could look up the resolution and physical size and perform this auto-scaling.

    8. Re:Big blow to apple? by arglebargle_xiv · · Score: 1

      More importantly, has anyone done a teardown on one of these to try and figure out how you can possibly make a product (other than doing it on purpose) that's this sensitive to WiFi? How on earth did they manage this?

    9. Re:Big blow to apple? by tlhIngan · · Score: 1

      For example, there is no OSD, all adjustments must be made from within MacOS.

      That's not an Apple-specific feature. In fact, it's a standard feature of all modern monitors. Display Data Channel / Command Interface is what's used for a computer to control the display. Granted, on PC, Microsoft has been lax on getting support for this, but on the later versions you should be able to control the brightness at least through Windows. Though some monitor manufacturers have utilities that let you configure the monitor much more than what the OSD allows you.

      It's a spec since 1998, and in 2004 it was revised.

      Now, this also separates consumer electronic displays (aka TVs) from computer monitors - most TVs don't support any of the commands.

    10. Re:Big blow to apple? by itsdapead · · Score: 1

      Why is a third party monitor having problems a big blow to apple?

      (1) Because these displays were advertised (by Apple) as being designed by LG in close collaboration with Apple. They featured prominently in the launch of the new MacBook Pro.

      (2) Apple's new policy seems to be not to produce their own displays, routers, back-up drives (they've stopped AirPort development, dropped their existing display) - this is a blow to that policy.

      (3) Because Apple have staked a lot on the Thunderbolt 3/USB-C port by making it the only port on the new machines (TB3 has been around on newer PCs for a while, but always backed up by USB, HDMI/DP etc.). Having a single cable to a display that provides 5k, webcam, audio, downstream USB3 ports and can power the laptop is TB3's party trick - but the LG/Apple display is the only thing on the market that currently does that. There are a few 4k USB-C displays but they can only support USB2 downstream and don't typically supply enough power to do more than trickle-charge a MacBook Pro.

      (4) Its early days for USB-C/Thunderbolt 3 and Apple has forced the pace with its new machine - we've had stories about cheap USB-C devices frying machines, incompatibility problems (didn't Dell have to drop their TB3 dock?) so, yeah, at this stage in the game I'd have a preference for buying USB-C/TB3 gear from Apple's list where feasible.

      Also, its kinda likely that this was originally going to be an Apple-branded product - if you ignore the black plastic case, the restricted choice of ports and their layout is far more iMac/Apple Thunderbolt Display-like than other LG products. That would also explain the interference problem: if the electronics were supposed to go in an Apple-style solid aluminium case then who needs extra RF shielding?

      --
      In a survey of 100 programmers, 111111 thought that duck-typing was a good idea.
    11. Re:Big blow to apple? by shadedream · · Score: 1

      Apple hasn't sold a "line" of monitors since 2010. Just a singular one (other than overlap when a newer model came out). The latest one wasn't exactly a great seller either... If you fit it's niche it was a great display a few years ago... today... meh. It also had no OSD, can't speak to the revisions before it on that though. As such, it makes sense for them to get out of the business of selling their own (singular) display.

      I'm seeing nothing non-standard whatsoever about this display. As another comment mentions, it's using DCC/CI, it's using a standard thunderbolt 3 connector. So are you suggesting Apple is charging too much for it? I'm not sure I can even buy that as there's not exactly another 5k resolution wide gamut display out that I've seen yet.

    12. Re:Big blow to apple? by tlhIngan · · Score: 1

      The Apple-branded monitors reported their resolution and physical screen size back to the Mac. The Mac then uses that info to scale the font so that a 10 point font on the screen is the same size as a 10 point font on paper, or a 10 point font on another different monitor. It's one of the features built into the Macs which made them immensely popular in the publishing industry.

      Since they discontinued their monitor line (not really sure I'd call it "their" line since they just repackaged panels by LG and Samsung), I presume the whole point of Apple-approved third party monitors was that they encoded this functionality into OS X. If it recognized the approved monitor, it could look up the resolution and physical size and perform this auto-scaling.

      Screen size and resolution are already supported by all displays. It's a part of the bog-standard VESA EDID block - height and width in millimetres.

      Now, most PCs ignore it, and I suspect most monitors - being used by PCs that ignore it - have it improperly set, but most of the time it's pretty accurate. I guess Apple might have LG ensure their EDID block is completely accurate (Apple has a tendency to over-rely on standards - so a mis-programmed field will cause issues) so everything happens properly, but there's no reason any other monitor doesn't have that ability.

      I've found a lot of TVs actually have this part of the block correct, too.

  5. And yet... by bazmail · · Score: 1

    .... the monitor has the FCC certification logo that indicates that it was tested against such interference. Strange that. Someone has some splainin to do.

    1. Re:And yet... by berj · · Score: 4, Informative

      The FCC is interested in the emission of interference, not being affected by it.

    2. Re:And yet... by bazmail · · Score: 1

      So it is. I tip my hat good sir.

    3. Re:And yet... by AmiMoJo · · Score: 3, Informative

      Problems with interference are not the only ones this monitor has. It's supposed to be able to charge your MacBook at 85W, but it actually only delivers about 60W. People are finding that if they are doing intensive tasks the laptop's battery slowly drains while it supposed to be charging. MKBHD covered it in his review recently.

      --
      const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
      SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
    4. Re:And yet... by MachineShedFred · · Score: 1

      FCC Part 15 "Class C" certification says that it emits no interference, and can be effected by already present interference.

      There is nothing here that violates Part 15.

      --
      Slashdot still doesnâ(TM)t support Unicode after it was added to the HTML standard in 1997.
    5. Re:And yet... by Ozoner · · Score: 1

      In most countries, Immunity testing is also compulsory.

      I'm not familiar with US laws, but even if the FCC doesn't demand Immunity testing, any manufacture who overlooks it is begging for trouble.

      Since way back in the CB radio days, manufactures have known that they must address Immunity.

    6. Re:And yet... by Ozoner · · Score: 1

      It is true that the US Immunity laws are very lax, but to be sold world-wide it must meet EU/JA/AUS Immunity standards.

      And even under Part 15 there are still Susceptibility tests.

      Whatever, any manufacturer who ignores immunity testing is asking for big trouble.

  6. Comforting? by thegarbz · · Score: 4, Insightful

    What's more comforting is that Apple don't have an "approved" display. What would be even more comforting is if they never did and if consumers didn't need such arbitrary "approvals" to plug a display into a computer.

    What an absurd idea that is.

    1. Re:Comforting? by berj · · Score: 1

      This is not some mythical "apple approved" display. It never was. It's just a 3rd party monitor that apple sells.

      You can get monitors for macs from any number of vendors.

    2. Re:Comforting? by DontBeAMoran · · Score: 2

      I never connected an Apple-approved display nor an Apple-made or Apple-approved mouse into any of my Macs.

      I do use made-for-Apple and made-by-Apple keyboards, if only to get the proper labels and function keys for OS X*.

      * my Mac stills runs 10.9.5, fuck off with your "It's called macOS now" reply.

      --
      #DeleteFacebook
    3. Re:Comforting? by Kjella · · Score: 1

      What's more comforting is that Apple don't have an "approved" display. What would be even more comforting is if they never did and if consumers didn't need such arbitrary "approvals" to plug a display into a computer. What an absurd idea that is.

      Do you know why motherboards have CPU and memory compatibility lists, NAS have HDD compatibility lists and so on? Because no matter how much you try adhering to a standard nothing beats actually testing the combination in question. Granted, graphics cards and monitors haven't been very big offenders in that department but I don't mind that Apple tries to sell you an Apple branded or recommended display, just like Dell will try to sell you a Dell monitor. And that does make it hurt when you tried buying the "safe" option and not try your own franken-combination of hardware and get bitten by compatibility bugs. It's the kind of thing that makes you go screw this, might as well buy a third party accessory because it won't be worse for wear. And I think you know why that's not good for Apple's business model...

      --
      Live today, because you never know what tomorrow brings
    4. Re:Comforting? by avandesande · · Score: 1

      It's funny how Mac Apologists will rationalize anything Apple does is good. If they sell monitors it's good. If they don't sell monitors it's good too.
      Dell has been successful selling monitors because many people and institutions like being able to buy a complete system in one transaction. Who the heck wants to write two PO's? Apple not having a monitor is just another part of the AppleFail ® program....

      --
      love is just extroverted narcissism
    5. Re:Comforting? by MachineShedFred · · Score: 1

      There was never any approval. This display just happens to use the unicorn port that Apple has festooned their latest notebooks with, rather than the standard Mini-DisplayPort that used to be good enough, and still is good enough for the rest of the world. You know, the connector that Apple created and gave to VESA royalty-free in order to increase the rate of adoption...

      --
      Slashdot still doesnâ(TM)t support Unicode after it was added to the HTML standard in 1997.
    6. Re:Comforting? by harperska · · Score: 1

      It seems to have worked out fine for Apple since they discontinued their line of printers.

      A monitor is a monitor. There really is no value that Apple can add to a monitor by designing and building it themselves. Since the return of Jobs, Apple's m.o. has been to focus their energy on areas where they can differentiate themselves on functionality as well as build quality. There was nothing that an Apple LaserWriter could do that a Canon printer couldn't, so the LaserWriter was discontinued. There is nothing a Cinema Display could do that an LG display can't, so the Cinema Display was discontinued. Likewise, there isn't anything an Airport can do that a Linksys router can't, so I wouldn't be surprised in the least if the Airport line was dropped in the future as well.

    7. Re:Comforting? by MachineShedFred · · Score: 2

      Too bad - the 27" Cinema Displays are actually really good products. I have two of them on my desk - one LED Cinema Display, and one Thunderbolt version, chained together.

      One cable plugged into the side of my laptop gives me two 27" displays, external SSD, gigabit ethernet, the four speakers in the displays, camera, mic, USB keyboard, USB mouse. And there's a MagSafe connector coming off the same cable, which powers the MacBook Pro.

      Add to that the Mini-DisplayPort version is on a KVM switch for my desktop PC, so the mouse, keyboard, and that one display switch when I hit a button. It all works brilliantly, and you can't do it anymore because Apple decided to ruin their notebooks by stripping off all ports that aren't USB-C, and discontinue the Thunderbolt Cinema Display in favor of the fault piece of shit in TFA.

      --
      Slashdot still doesnâ(TM)t support Unicode after it was added to the HTML standard in 1997.
    8. Re:Comforting? by DontBeAMoran · · Score: 1

      Good for you that you can afford Apple Cinema Displays. But we're not all made of money like most Americans.

      --
      #DeleteFacebook
    9. Re:Comforting? by ilsaloving · · Score: 2

      You do realize that if Apple is selling it directly, then it is defacto "Apple Approved" whether they explicitly say so or not.

      The whole point of buying something directly from Apple, is that an average consumer has the reasonable expectation that Apple specifically vetted the device in questions as being fit for purpose against Apple-made hardware.

    10. Re:Comforting? by MachineShedFred · · Score: 1

      One was purchased at a discount several years ago (the DisplayPort model) and the other was provided by my employer (the Thunderbolt model).

      I didn't have any problem purchasing the one I bought myself, because I bought one of the 20" displays at a discount a decade ago, and it still works flawlessly on my server rack. Apple built them right, and it shows. You might pay a bit more for one (when they were available for purchase) but you weren't going to throw it away for many years to come.

      --
      Slashdot still doesnâ(TM)t support Unicode after it was added to the HTML standard in 1997.
    11. Re:Comforting? by lindseyp · · Score: 1

      What other monitor has a 5k screen and can connect to the new macbook pro without an adaptor?

      --
      j'ai découvert une démonstration vraiment admirable (de ce théorème général) que cette si
    12. Re:Comforting? by AaronW · · Score: 1

      Exactly. An hour ago I finished debugging a problem with a non-approved SFP+ module not working. It turns out that Intel SFP+ SR 10G Ethernet modules do not have a proper checksum in their EEPROMs as defined in the SFF-8472 specification (section 8.8), hence my software rejects them (it turns out that the Linux Intel IGB driver doesn't validate the checksum either). I've come across a number of crap products that fail (don't get me started on USB thumb drives) because they are either buggy or don't follow the standards. I've spent way too much time debugging customer issues because they chose a crappy thumbdrive or SD card (even from very well-known vendors (I'm looking at you Sandisk). Since there's so much crap out there the best way is to only approve certain devices that have been tested and verified to work. If other devices happen to work, great, but don't contact support if they don't.

      --
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    13. Re:Comforting? by thegarbz · · Score: 1

      Do you know why motherboards have CPU and memory compatibility lists, NAS have HDD compatibility lists and so on?

      You know why no one cares or gives a crap? Because 99.999% of the time when there's an issue with a part it's due to them not actually following the spec. Most of the time the compatibility list is either:
      a) for complete idiots.
      b) for procurement people who need easy purchasing decisions.
      c) for contractual performance requirements (here's a combination we tested and actually achieves our xxxx reliability, buy this one if you intend to sue us).
      d) for technical people who realise that the biggest problem is some idiot not writing a certain spec correctly (such as if RAM should be buffered or not).

      My comment stands. Companies should focus only on standards compliance and should hold each other accountable for producing garbage if something doesn't work. Especially when we are talking about a frigging monitor using a frigging universal bus.

    14. Re:Comforting? by thegarbz · · Score: 1

      Not even Apple are courageous enough to limit users to not using adaptors.

  7. The note at the end is very impartial... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    The note at the end is very impartial...

    1. Re:The note at the end is very impartial... by DontBeAMoran · · Score: 4, Insightful

      It's so impartial that you'd think msmash was an idiot who's never used a Mac in his life and doesn't know that Macs have used VGA, DVI, HDMI and DisplayPorts for over a decade now. And their keyboards and mice connect via USB or Bluetooth, just like a "PC".

      --
      #DeleteFacebook
    2. Re:The note at the end is very impartial... by DontBeAMoran · · Score: 1

      I said "for over a decade", implying that Apple has used industry-standard ports on most of their Macs since even before their switch to Intel processors.

      But yeah, I forgot about the Thunderbolt ports since all I use is the HDMI port on my Mac mini. I haven't used one of their laptops in ages so my comment about standard ports is probably invalid for most Macs too.

      --
      #DeleteFacebook
  8. RF emissions by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    Now we should just get that router to stop all RF emissions...and problem solved.

    Oh...wait....

  9. Don't worry, Tim is on to it! by martinX · · Score: 1

    Tim Cook has announced a new Mac Pro, Mac Book Pros will come with a 99 watt-hour battery and the Mac Mini will be updated. Oh, wait, no he didn't. He's doing something much more important.

    --
    When they came for the communists, I said "He's next door. Take him away. Goddam commies."
  10. Re:Courageous by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    Trouble is, they're getting nothing but positive feedback from the market. The crappier they make their hardware, the more they sell. Can you blame them for trying to take advantage of their users' gullibility?

  11. We aren't turning away PhDs by zerofoo · · Score: 3, Insightful

    The H1B visa was designed for the best and the brightest - no one is suggesting that we turn away brilliant people.

    We need more PhDs - not code monkeys and run-of-the mill sysadmins. The H1B system is being abused to flood the market with cheap imported labor.

  12. Easy interim fix by Solandri · · Score: 2

    Just connect to your router with an ethernet cable.

    Oh, that's right. They courageously got rid of the ethernet port because wireless networking is the future.

    1. Re:Easy interim fix by thegarbz · · Score: 1

      Oh just man up and whip out your dongle.