China's Huawei Catching Up With Apple, Samsung Smartphone Sales (livemint.com)

From a report: Chinese smartphone maker Huawei managed to gain ground on Samsung and Apple in terms of global market share last year, following the problems encountered by the two giants, the Gartner consultancy group said on Wednesday. Over the year as a whole, the Chinese maker saw its sales leap by 26.7 percent, while the South Korean and US rivals both saw their sales decline by 4.3 percent, Gartner said in a study. As result, Huawei was able to increase its share of the smartphone sector to 8.9 percent in 2016 from 7.3 percent a year earlier, while Samsung saw its market share shrink by two full percentage points to 20.5 percent and Apple's contracted to 14.4 percent from 15.9 percent. "Chinese makers succeeded in winning market share over last year and Huawei now seems to be the main rival to the two giants, even if the gap remains large," Gartner analyst Annette Zimmermann told AFP.

Comments

Of course they will

[jjthegreat]

We have seen this before with tons of mainstream devices, smartphones are no different. You have the incumbents designing and engineering something main stream while other manufacturers will come in and sell something similar with slightly less features for vastly lower costs. I think we are coming close to "peak smartphone development" where it's at the point they are good enough for almost everything we want them to do. I bought an SG 7 and quite frankly, it will be the last 800$ phone I ever buy. Nothing revolutionary, just iterative at this point. Apple and Samsung are at the top end of a saturated market. Really nowhere to go but down unless they are only interested in market share with lower end phones they can sell at lower costs. Not sure if this is the market they want to chase, especially Apple.

Re:Of course they will

[bluefoxlucid]

while other manufacturers will come in and sell something similar with slightly less features for vastly lower costs

There are two forces there. One is the general luxury effect--a luxury item has a smaller audience, and lower demand means bigger margins and higher prices (fewer potential consumers at cost means higher risk and higher barriers to entry, constricting competition). Apple manages to hold this one all on its own by being the only iOS supplier, whereas anyone can make an Android phone; other makers are facing a high barrier to entry using a non-Android OS because they have to compete in a Smart Phone market which is dominated by iOS and Android, and they don't have anything to show for it due to all the apps being for iOS or Android (see: Windows Phone 7--hence why Microsoft wants the apps to be cross-platform with Windows 10 and Windows Phone 10, as they have the desktop market and can build a phone OS app store base to try to pry their way in).

The other is just leading-edge technology and its cost. When you get into newer technology, you hit something like scarcity. I typically describe scarcity as a matter of scaling: if you can ramp up production by 10% for a 10% increase in cost (i.e. labor), you're not seeing scarcity; whereas if ramping up by 10% means expending 12% more cost, you've crossed into scarcity territory. Leading-edge technology can either be completely-different and high-labor or it can be an incremental advance that exceeds proportional cost. Squeezing more storage onto NAND, for example, requires a 14nm process instead of 22nm, whereas the 22nm process is stable (98% yield) and the 14nm process isn't (25% yields)--thus you need 400% more labor per viable chip, yet those chips store about 57% more, so cost more per unit storage. As the 14nm process exceeds 70% yield or so, it'll become cheaper per unit storage than 22nm. QED.

Your top-tier tech generally has those leading-edge technologies, or something appreciably close. They boast brand-new 8+8 homogeneous-architecture SOCs with huge amounts of on-die RAM, 3D NAND, the latest screens, and the latest high-end camera sensors. They push the cost way up and talk about all the features they have--all stuff that's going to be standard in the next generation 6 months from now, when those components are cheaper; but we can let people call Samsung and LG "Apple Immitators" for "cloning the iPhone" months after iPhone did it first.

Your low-cost, $300 phones generally have current-gen tech, which is pretty impressive. Cheap phones can have lagging tech because they're trying to squeeze costs out, but then you get a way-out-of-date $200 phone because a 90%-efficient process isn't that much more expensive than a 98%-efficient process.

The nice thing about making a $300 phone is not everyone can afford an $800 phone; you have a big market to work with. That also means you face competition, whereas Apple and Samsung are competing for fewer voting dollars at the top-tier range and don't have to worry about every cheap Chinese manufactory releasing a top-quality phone comparable to their flagships. Instead we see the OnePlus Three--competitive, but it's not a brand-new iPhone or Galaxy and is more a problem for the mid-tier market. That mid-tier market has lower margins, and also has stability in that it has many players and isn't going to sharply-divert to a new one unless they found a way to make the same tech 20% cheaper; whereas the upper-tier market has stability in that any new competitor is trying to divert fewer people from a high-end luxury device which is essentially purchasing identity, and so has a slim chance of making a stable profit largely contingent on convincing people to identify with someone other than Apple or Samsung.

Honestly, imagine GM releasing a Tesla competitor. It's $85,000. It's about on-par with an $85,000 Tesla Model S. What sets you apart from your friends? How do you feel about driving a Chevrolet--an el

Re:Of course they will

[Anonymous Coward]

while other manufacturers will come in and sell something similar with slightly less features for vastly lower costs

There are two forces there. One is the general luxury effect--a luxury item has a smaller audience, and lower demand means bigger margins and higher prices (fewer potential consumers at cost means higher risk and higher barriers to entry, constricting competition). Apple manages to hold this one all on its own by being the only iOS supplier, whereas anyone can make an Android phone; other makers are facing a high barrier to entry using a non-Android OS because they have to compete in a Smart Phone market which is dominated by iOS and Android, and they don't have anything to show for it due to all the apps being for iOS or Android (see: Windows Phone 7--hence why Microsoft wants the apps to be cross-platform with Windows 10 and Windows Phone 10, as they have the desktop market and can build a phone OS app store base to try to pry their way in).

The other is just leading-edge technology and its cost. When you get into newer technology, you hit something like scarcity. I typically describe scarcity as a matter of scaling: if you can ramp up production by 10% for a 10% increase in cost (i.e. labor), you're not seeing scarcity; whereas if ramping up by 10% means expending 12% more cost, you've crossed into scarcity territory. Leading-edge technology can either be completely-different and high-labor or it can be an incremental advance that exceeds proportional cost. Squeezing more storage onto NAND, for example, requires a 14nm process instead of 22nm, whereas the 22nm process is stable (98% yield) and the 14nm process isn't (25% yields)--thus you need 400% more labor per viable chip, yet those chips store about 57% more, so cost more per unit storage. As the 14nm process exceeds 70% yield or so, it'll become cheaper per unit storage than 22nm. QED.

Your top-tier tech generally has those leading-edge technologies, or something appreciably close. They boast brand-new 8+8 homogeneous-architecture SOCs with huge amounts of on-die RAM, 3D NAND, the latest screens, and the latest high-end camera sensors. They push the cost way up and talk about all the features they have--all stuff that's going to be standard in the next generation 6 months from now, when those components are cheaper; but we can let people call Samsung and LG "Apple Immitators" for "cloning the iPhone" months after iPhone did it first.

Your low-cost, $300 phones generally have current-gen tech, which is pretty impressive. Cheap phones can have lagging tech because they're trying to squeeze costs out, but then you get a way-out-of-date $200 phone because a 90%-efficient process isn't that much more expensive than a 98%-efficient process.

The nice thing about making a $300 phone is not everyone can afford an $800 phone; you have a big market to work with. That also means you face competition, whereas Apple and Samsung are competing for fewer voting dollars at the top-tier range and don't have to worry about every cheap Chinese manufactory releasing a top-quality phone comparable to their flagships. Instead we see the OnePlus Three--competitive, but it's not a brand-new iPhone or Galaxy and is more a problem for the mid-tier market. That mid-tier market has lower margins, and also has stability in that it has many players and isn't going to sharply-divert to a new one unless they found a way to make the same tech 20% cheaper; whereas the upper-tier market has stability in that any new competitor is trying to divert fewer people from a high-end luxury device which is essentially purchasing identity, and so has a slim chance of making a stable profit largely contingent on convincing people to identify with someone other than Apple or Samsung.

Honestly, imagine GM releasing a Tesla competitor. It's $85,000. It's about on-par with an $85,000 Tesla Model S. What sets you apart from your friends? How do you feel about driving a Chev

Re:It's about time

[Anonymous Coward]

As opposed to Huawei?

Where?

[T.E.D.]

I'm guessing these sales are happening almost entirely in China? There's no Huawei phone even listed as an option on my carrier's website. As a consumer, sales maketshare really doesn't mean a whole lot to me until they are selling phones in my market.

I can kinda see why they wouldn't bother though. While I think its really important that Samsung has good viable competition in Android devices, I don't think I'd be entirely comfortable buying myself a consumer communications device from a company with deep ties to the Chinese Army.

Re:Where?

[Anonymous Coward]

You can only choose phones supplied by your carrier? What a stupid little bitch you are.

Re:Where?

[Anonymous Coward]

Why do you continue to be ripped off by your carrier? No one I know uses anything but a SIM only deal.
Why not think outside the box from time to time. You can buy a perfectly good phone for a lot less than 1) what your carrier charges and 2) outside the range that your carrier limits you to AND gets the best prices from the makers and pockets the difference.

Re:Where?

[Anonymous Coward]

Oh, please, fuck off and die, toe-jam-eating Richard Stallman worshiper. If you are a cocksucker, and you certainly fit the bill, the government can easily spy on your without any electronics whatsoever. Not having a mobile phone because "ohh, the gubament can spy on me" is akin to saying "I don't want a penis because then girls will think I want to have sex with them." Please, kill yourself. Humanity can't risk having your flawed genes pollute the human race.

Re:Where?

[tsqr]

Despite the derision heaped upon you by the ACs, you're correct. The vast majority of smartphones in the US are purchased by people who don't consider options beyond what their provider offers, and that's enough to prevent significant market penetration in the US. If Huawei really cares about increasing sales in the US, they will pursue deals with Verizon, ATT, T-Mobile, and Sprint. Until they do, they won't see widespread use in this country.

Re: Where?

[Anonymous Coward]

You can walk into any best buy and buy an unlocked Honor phone.

Re:Where?

[T.E.D.]

Why do you continue to be ripped off by your carrier?

That's quite a leap. But you seem to be in good company pole vaulting over there, so perhaps I should explain why this is relevant...

You see, in the US different carriers tend to have semi-incompatible phone networks. Therefore, I can't just go buy any cellphone and expect it to work optimally with my carrier. For instance, if I want an S7, I need to go buy the version of the S7 that is customized to work on my carrier's network.

Does that mean I need to buy it from my carrier directly? Of course not. I believe I bought my last cellphone off of Amazon. But it does mean my carrier's "phone store" web page is a good place to go when I want to present a nice central list of "the different types of phones that work on their network" for the purposes of discussion.

I assure you it is also the case that if we were talking about cars, and I illustrated a point with Toyota's web page for a Corolla, that doesn't mean I go buy brand new Corollas directly from Toyota all the time either.

Re:Where?

[tlhIngan]

The Nexus 6P is made by Huawei. While Sprint no longer carries it, I'm sure you probably can find it as a free phone somewhere.

Re:Where?

[Anonymous Coward]

Well bully for you for continuing to buy into 3rd world technology.
The rest of the world uses compatible phones but 50% of the USA does not. Who are the odd people out then.
My phone from Europe works fine in the USA, Russia, China and pretty well everywhere else on the planet. Why not change your carrier to one that uses a more compatible standard?

Even if you persist with your carrier, you can buy CDMA phones that are unlocked. any half decent phone will work with your carrier.
You have a choice to not be tied to a carrier supplied phone.

My SIM only deal is $15/month inc tax. 600minutes/600 Text and 3Gb of Data. One month rolling.
Easy to move to a different carrier and I can take my number with me.
What's not to like about that.

Re:Where?

[Anonymous Coward]

Just put it in a metalized crisp packet, since removable batteries are becoming the norm, saves on the tin foil hat. In the uk the car your traveling in will still be tracked via license plate and camera network.

Re:Where?

[DontBeAMoran]

Typical USA thinking. The only answers are always absolutes of two options.

Just because you can't stop the government spying on you doesn't mean you should take steps to minimize the spying that gets done. And it's not only the governments, it's all the companies going after your information and trying to monetize everything you do.

Re:Where?

[Anonymous Coward]

You can only choose phones supplied by your carrier? What a stupid little bitch you are.

Wow. What a mood. Someone was wanking it alone on Valentine's Day.

Re:Where?

[ctilsie242]

This gets me wondering about another avenue in the US market:

Hell with the carriers, make unlocked phones that work on all four as well as the MVNOs. Make the deals with retailers. A low cost phone from Dollar General that works everywhere (just needing a SIM card from a carrier) may be a lot more useful to a lot of the people out there than trying to buy a package deal from a carrier.

Heck, it might be wise to make a deal with MVNOs, because it may not be the "prime" market segment... but there is money to be made selling Chevies as well as Cadillacs, and making decent phones at a low price might be a market niche worth pursuing. Especially because Android is pretty much a commodity item, other than the $3 a company has to give to Microsoft for exFAT and other patents.

This would be a win/win for retailers, consumers, and Huawei. This makes the carrier the commodity.

Re:Where?

[nwaack]

Amazon. They sell unlocked phones on Amazon buy the boatload.

Re:Where?

[tsqr]

Interesting. According to the Verizon website, your can remove an activated Verizon sim card from your phone and use it in any phone that's compatible with Verizon's network. Or you can get a new Verizon sim card and activate it in any compatible phone.

Re:Where?

[ctilsie242]

That has been the norm with AT&T and T-Mobile for a while. Historically, providers shipped phones that were locked to their network, even phones that were purchased in full. However, there is a market for unlocked phones, especially people who find that they don't really need a flagship device for day to day use, and can save the C-notes. Blu Mobile devices come to mind for example.

Phones are getting to a point where, similar to hand tools, there is more than enough room for Harbor Freights in addition to the MAC and Snap-On companies. Especially with phones getting to a point where even a low end phone is "good enough" for most everyone.

Re:Where?

[T.E.D.]

Issues with this:

I don't live in Europe, Russia, China, or anywhere else on the planet.

I don't need it unlocked (which is usually more expensive here), because the phones I buy are cheap, and thus no real hardship to replace on the rare occasions I decide to jump ship (perhaps 3 times in the last 10 years).

It is already easy to move to a different carrier and take my number with me. Cell networks don't "own" numbers here anymore. Haven't for a long time.There are enough of us that my family actually has 2 plans (with different carriers) and we've switched carriers several times with at least 3 different numbers that I'm aware of..

I don't use my "phone" for talking, for the most part, but as a mobile internet device. It is now the exact midpoint of the month, and I'm (personally, not counting anyone else on the plan) at 2.4GB of data usage. I have multiple teenage girls on my plan too. Some bare-bones setup with 3GB a month would not be sufficient. If it was, I suspect they'd be available, but it isn't.

All of this has exactly 0 to do with my point about the availability of that manufacturer's devices for purchase in the US (again, they are not). If you feel personal ire toward a US cell carrier, that's certainly your prerogative. But kindly direct it in appropriate threads.

Re: Where?

[Anonymous Coward]

As a different a.c. i have two different plans at the same time both for $15. One has 30gb data (sim only), the other is bare bones for the huawei p8 which i chose for the great camera (twin lenses merged in software) but i also like the great battery life. I use the good sim with the good phone and dont use the spare sim at thre moment...

Re:Where?

[oakgrove]

Hell with the carriers, make unlocked phones that work on all four as well as the MVNOs.

That's exactly what I have with the Moto X Pure I bought from Best Buy a few months ago. Great phone and it works with every carrier. I don't know why people would accept anything less when this thing is on the market.

Re:It's about time

[cayenne8]

Yeah, but who wants to buy and el-cheapo chinese smartphone, that will likely blow up and crash on your within a week or purchase?

Re:It's about time

[mridoni]

Not really: Huawei phones are Chinese-made, but they're not your typical super-cheap crap that doesn't work half of the time (and believe me, I speak from experience). They have good build quality, and you will find they are affordable, but nonetheless they're fast and reliable.

Re:It's about time

[Curunir_wolf]

As opposed to Huawei?

What's wrong with Huawei phones? I considered buying one when I was shopping for a phone last year. I ended up getting one from Alcatel, but the Huawei phones had really good reviews and all the features I was looking for, and made my short list. They were a very popular alternative to the big (and expensive) brands.

Re:It's about time

[epyT-R]

and loaded with state sponsored spyware.

Re:It's about time

[avandesande]

Kind of silly statement when IPhone is made in China. If your specifications and QC are in place Chinese can make quality products.

No Dream Phone Yet from Any Manufacture

[ad454]

My dream phone is a large 7 inch 4G phablet, with stylus, wifi (IEEE 802.11ac or newer), HDMI (out), GPS+GLONASS+Galileo navigation, 1080p (or higher) OLED display, unlocked boatloader, and pre-installed with rooted LineageOS.

The large size still fits in my purse and eliminates the need to carry a separate tablet. Besides I mostly use my phone for web, email, and conferencing (with screen sharing) far more than for occasional phone-calls.

On the Android side, I am sick and tied of locked bootloaders, preinstalled crap-ware, and proprietary Android versions. Give me LineageOS, the Cyanogenmod successor, since it does exactly what I want without unnecessary crap, and is more secure than alternatives.

Re:It's about time

[cayenne8]

Kind of silly statement when IPhone is made in China. If your specifications and QC are in place Chinese can make quality products.

Well, sure, they can, but if they're not having their feet held to the fire, usually by a US or other major western nation....quality isn't really a major motivator in run of the mill chinese products.

Most of the shit you buy from over there that aren't western products, are pretty much that....shit.

At least in my experience to date.

How about some nice chinese firewall and pet food for ya?

;)

Re:It's about time

[kit_triforce]

I've been using the Huawei Honor 8 for about 6 months now, and it's an impressive phone, especially with it's $400 retail price tag (Best Buy, Amazon, etc). Mine just updated to their version of Android 7.0, and I fell like I just got a new phone again (in all the positive ways). It's less expensiv, faster, and has more features than many competitors, and stands up very well against it's Samsung and Apple competition. This is not a "el-cheapo", it's a high quality and well manufactured phone.

To quote the Macalope...

[Chmarr]

Nobody. Cares. About. Market. Share.

I've had 2 in the last 4 years

[p51d007]

BOTH have been perfect. My first Huawei phone was the Mate2, less than $300 dollars off Amazon. I bought it sort of as a joke. I was waiting for the stupid invite for the Oppo/OnePlus phone. I had the Mate2 for about a week before the OnePlus One invite came. Ordered it with the intention of sending the Mate2 back, since the specs for the mate2 were: 720p screen, SD400 chip, 2gb ram, 4,000mAH battery, Adroid 4.3 Jelly Bean, and the OnePlus had a HUGE advantage in specs. I got the OnePlus, and yes it was a good phone, but the battery life of the Mate2 won me over, along with the larger screen. Yes, from a BENCHMARK, the OnePlus blew it out of the water, but, running the same apps, same launcher (Nova Prime) on both phones I couldn't see a huge difference. Both were snappy, but the Mate2 had a 2-3 day battery life. I don't run games, just phone, text, web, Mp3's, streaming music etc. In that aspect, the Mate2 was perfect. Sold the OnePlus One about a week later. But...but...but...the Mate2 was "saddled" with an older version of Android. So? It was rock solid, very smooth, stable, which I take over bleeding edge any day of the week. My company uses the web for service calls and what not, so I don't have time to deal with force close, reboots and what not. I never turn my phone off. It runs 24/7 and I'd run for 3-4 months easy between reboots. Huawei skipped KitKat and went straight to Lollipop 5.1 for the Mate2. When the Mate8 was announced/released in 2015, the price was NUTS...600 bucks or more. I said no way. When the Mate9 was released this past November, the price on the 8 dropped to around 399/425 so I bought one. It's just as rock solid and stable on Marshmellow 6 as the Mate2 was on 5.1 Lollipop. Granted, with the faster processor and brighter screen, I don't get 2-3 days battery life, but you can get 2 days usually. Android 7 is suppose to come within the next 30-60 days for my version, but I'll hold off a bit. The reports on XDA show some of the early releases are having a glitch here and there with bluetooth, which I use 100% of the time. Huawei has a great phone, and should be considered when making a decision on a new phone.

Re: I've had 2 in the last 4 years

[fubarrr]

BuBuGao group (Oppo/Vivo/BBK/One Plus/No name OEM) makes them all on sales times four or five. A hidden giant

Re:It's about time

[Gaygirlie]

I can't say anything about their phones, but I've got a tablet of theirs; it's about two years old now and I've only received a *single* update to it during all this time. I also haven't received a single reply to any of my inquiries to me as to if/when my tablet will ever receive anything -- I've only received a confirmation about the ticket having been opened, but never any reply at all.

I cannot claim to have any sort of positive image of Huawei.

I can only carry one phone

[FeelGood314]

An extra 10% of utility might be worth $500 to me over the life of the phone. So if you offer me 2 phones that are 90% as good as the top Samsung phone for the same price as that Samsung I still will choose the Samsung.

Re:I can only carry one phone

[skam240]

I think it has more to do with the value you put on 500 bucks. The vast majority of people would not call your scenario a good deal.

Huawei definitely "good enough" but prices rising

[Bearhouse]

I'm very happy with my work iPhone 7; great device within its limitations, and to my mind still a slicker user experience than Android.
But - my main personal phone is a Huawai complete with dual sim, SD slot etc. and I can load whatever I want to ensure my data is securely synced to my servers and them only.
When my wife's expensive Samsung Note started acting up, it was replaced with this year's updated version of my model.
She's happy, but although the specs are slightly better, I was surprised that the price has nearly doubled...

Re:It's about time

[Anonymous Coward]

I considered purchasing a Pixel XL and balked at the $800 price tag, as well as the lack of important features that I enjoy having (swappable battery, SD card, IR blaster). I have never paid that much for a phone, and for that much money I would expect zero compromises, but I would have to pay an exorbitant amount AND give up those features I want. Nope, not gonna happen. I noticed the Honor 8 when they started advertising it heavily right before Black Friday this year. It's $350 brand new, and it has 2 out of 3 of the features I mentioned (no swappable battery, unfortunately). I decided to take a chance on it since I needed a phone right then and there, because I was sick and tired of this piece of shit LG G3 phone bootlooping on me because of its crappy hardware design issues. Besides, the Pixel was not even in stock, I would not have been able to purchase it even if I was willing to pay $800. Well, it turns out I like the Honor 8 a lot. It has much better battery life than any phone I ever had previously. I ended up buying a second one for my wife after her piece of shit LG Nexus 5X crapped out on her (to their credit, LG did later repair it under warranty). She loves the Honor 8 camera, it takes really nice pictures. We may not get updates as quickly from Huawei as we would with a Google-branded phone, but we have very quick, responsive phones with great battery life and didn't have to pay an arm and a leg. Huawei FTW.

Re:It's about time

[Austerity Empowers]

Huawei should be forbidden from doing business in the western world. If Emperor Nectarine even remotely means a word he has ever said, he'd take his venom out on them in particular. They are scumbags of the highest order.

Re:It's about time

[Austerity Empowers]

And "borrowed" technology.

Called

[erapert]

It's too early to actually say "I called it", but I'll just leave this here anyway.

Re:It's about time

[Anonymous Coward]

Racists like you should be forbidden from breathing.

Huawei warranty service is terrible

[jessepdx]

I had a Nexus 6P for 5 months until Oct of 2016. The phone stopped working, no inbound or outbound calls, data also stopped working. I called for warranty and the y said I have to send it to them first, then they'll send me a replacement. I asked for advanced replacement and they said they didn't offer that service,I offered to pay for it and they still wouldn't send me a new phone first. I went out an bought a Pixel XL immediatly. It took 6 days to receive a call tag for UPS from Huawei. A new phone arrived 4 days later. I'm not sure how they will gain any market share in the US with this type of customer service. Especially from business customers like myself.

Re:Huawei definitely "good enough" but prices risi

[CrashNBrn]

For the most savings, buy a late-year previous gen around March of the following year.E.g. Purchase a Sep.-Nov 2015 model, in March 2017. Otherwise you are going to mostly see full priced (~$600) phones. Whereas those $500-$600 phones will be $300 to $400 within a little over a years time.

For example, the Moto X Force, Asus Zenphone 2, and LG's V10.

Re:It's about time

[Anonymous Coward]

Well this is what you get with these cheaper premium smartphones. People complain about Google and Samsung charging premium prices for their phone and bash them all day long but fact is they and those other manufacturers who charge premium prices for premium phones provide a good level of customer service and OS updates usually for at least a couple years. Huawei makes some really good looking phones with great specs to match, their Android skin is kind of hit or miss but you really expect to buy a premium phone for $300 and then get OS updates for the next couple of years for that price? There has to be a trade-off on the price and testing these updates with their phones isn't free. Their testers and developers aren't doing that work out of the goodness of their hearts. You get what you pay for and you get a very good specced phone at an affordable price and have to accept that maybe you have to compromise on the service level of things. People want everything for free but sorry that's just not how it works in business

Re:It's about time

[coastwalker]

There is a point behind the venom though. Huawei have a cost base lower than any other company in the market due to the strategic position of the China. Cost is everything in the current market so they are winning. This cost advantage will not necessarily continue so Huawei will not necessarily continue to be so successful.

Re:It's about time

[jawtheshark]

cheaper premium smartphones

It's not a premium smartphone, if you don't get updates... So, let me fix that for you: cheaper smartphones. That's it, explains it all...

Even Google and Samsung suck at keeping updates going for longer than six months, which is why the user who expects longevity and supports shells out for Apple. Sad to say, but I expect my smartphones to last four years. Two, new as my wifes phone on a subsidized contract (with flat everything), and then two more years as a hand-me-down for me with a much cheaper plan.

A car analogy

[AHuxley]

Think back to the 1950-80's. Everyone expected the huge protected domestic production lines in the US and UK to just keep producing cars.
The brands pushed national pride, the prices had to be accepted by the buying public, new designs always set the latest trends and fashions.
Then Japan exported. Exports got reviewed by local media. Lower prices, a much better understanding of the quality control needed to work in cold climates.
The buying public enjoyed the change. For the same price they could get quality. Drive to work, rather than spend time getting a car working.

Smart phones design teams just expect brand loyalty due to past innovation.
Why give some design team so much pure profit for every upgrade over decades?
Apps still work on most hardware thanks to a layer that can support most hardware.
The visual appearance of the hardware is not an issue. The characteristics of using a phone, getting and sending data is the same given cellular infrastructure.
Camera lens design allows for better images and video. That lens option is been provided by hardware on the open market.
Patriotism and national security feels like a new import tariff.

Nortel destruction

[Anonymous Coward]

Never support this state sponsored of IP theft and malicious code they hide in firmware. Never.

Sounds familiar

[Plumpaquatsch]

Similar stories from recent years sounded pretty much alike: Xiaomi, LG, Lenovo. Too bad that massive increases of marketshare mean shit if you still lose money,

Re:It's about time

[piojo]

Slashdot ate my longer comment, so I'll type the short version:

- The software is okay, but has some glaring problems. Still small enough, though.
- The Nexus 4 and LG G4 had crippling problems that left me with a solid helping of contempt for those companies. (Funnily, both were made by LG, but Google signed off on the design so they are at fault as well.)
- If I had to buy another phone, the brands I would look at are Huawei, OnePlus, and a distant third being Meizu or HTC.

Re:It's about time

[Anonymous Coward]

I only buy LG smartphones and haven't had a problem. The problem is you, not the phone.

Re:It's about time

[Anonymous Coward]

You are a racist piece of shit.

I have lots of well-made stuff that was made in China. Usually the worst quality crap is the stuff that says "Made in the USA". Now that's the real joke.

Huawei, Lenovo... so many others

[bazorg]

I don't know about Huawei, but my current phone is Lenovo and does the job just fine: 16GB storage when Samsung low-end all had less than that; Dual SIM is a nice to have for data only SIMs abroad; RAM and CPU are OK for what I need, and it does a good job as a sat nav.

I don't feel I need to pay for sponsorship on Chelsea FC shirts nor high rents in California for the design department if in the end it's some Chinese company that does the bulk of the work. By buying Lenovo I get the product I need without that sort of overheads.

Re:It's about time

[Anonymous Coward]

No I'm going with cheap premium because these Chinese manufacturers can and do use some of the newer hardware for their flagships which cost half of a Samsung Galaxy or a Pixel. The cost of hardware and assembly is usually a couple hundred dollars so the Chinese manufacturer markup is far less than the big names for essentially the same internals. It's the software where cost comes in though and you're la liar if you have a Google phone and getting 6 months of updates because most if not all Nexus devices have gotten a couple years of updates and the Pixel is guaranteed 2 years of updates. I've had the many Galaxy phones since the very first one and have gotten at least a couple years of updates as well so you're either a liar or you have a low-mid range phone in which case you shouldn't expect updates because the lower price you paid for the phone is the trade-off for software maintenance

Re:It's about time

[Anonymous Coward]

That's not always true. There's always a chance of getting a defective unit. My friend got a LG G5 when it just came out and it died less than 2 weeks later. He got a new unit and it's been fine ever since. I've also had two friends who got a Nexus 4 and one worked perfectly well for the few years he had it while the other guy had one that had a host of problems. These kinds of experiences can give people a lasting impression of a brand or product line so yes it's not always the person, some times it's just bad luck that you got a defective unit

Re:It's about time

[jawtheshark]

Yeah, Google sells there phones everywhere. (Hint: they don't. I can't get a Google phone if I wanted). Google may support their phones a longer time, but other manufacturers don't. Even in the premium segment.

Besides, you talk about 2 years for a Pixel... I talk about over 4 years supported. So, liar? More like realistic vision on longevity of devices.