Apple's iPhone 8 To Replace Touch ID Home Button With 'Function Area' (appleinsider.com)

An anonymous reader quotes a report from Apple Insider: Apple will ditch the home button when it debuts a new 'iPhone 8' model later this year, and will dedicate the extra screen real estate to an area for virtual buttons, according to KGI analyst Ming-Chi Kuo. Adding detail to his previous predictions regarding the next-generation handset, Kuo in a note to investors obtained by AppleInsider said the full-screen design will allow Apple to integrate a "function" area never seen in an iPhone. The device is expected to adopt a 5.8-inch OLED panel in a form factor similar to the current 4.7-inch iPhone 7. Despite having extended screen real estate as compared to current iPhone models, the actual active display area on "iPhone 8" will be closer to 5.15 inches on the diagonal, with the remaining bottom portion dedicated to system functions like virtual buttons. While Kuo failed to elaborate on an exact implementation, the note suggests Apple plans to hardcode a set of always-on, static system controls into iOS. Whether the so-called "function area" is capable of switching to an active display mode for in-app activities like watching videos or playing games, remains to be seen. With the deletion of current Touch ID technology, Kuo believes "iPhone 8" will incorporate new bio-recognition assets to take over device security and Apple Pay authentication duties. The analyst did not offer predictions on the type of biometric tech Apple intends to use, but a report earlier today said the company could integrate a 3D laser scanning module capable of facilitating facial recognition and augmented reality applications. Kuo in a note last month said Apple might integrate a dual biometric system utilizing optical fingerprint readers and facial recognition hardware.

Comments

Still playing catch-up

[pecosdave]

Once again the latest iPhone introduces revolutionary new ideas Android has had for years.

Re:Still playing catch-up

[coofercat]

Still, it means /. gets to fill up it's front page.

Re: Still playing catch-up

[Anonymous Coward]

Like rounded rectangles?

Re:Still playing catch-up

[AmiMoJo]

Yeah, although I guess they will claim it's based on the touchbar on the new Apple laptops. It's about time they did something about having only one button and a lack of standard controls in the UI.

Re: Still playing catch-up

[Anonymous Coward]

They're already working on removing that last button.

Re:Still playing catch-up

[JaredOfEuropa]

And hopefully Apple will get it right. My android phone has two "soft" buttons next to a physical home button, and I hate those little fuckers. It's entirely too easy to accidentally press them. Since the screen on the iPhone is pressure sensitive, they better make the buttons react to a forceful push rather than a touch, but they probably will; they usually pay a lot of attention to this stuff.

Re:Still playing catch-up

[BitZtream]

The real problem is that iOS tends to copy the shitty features of Android where as Android tends to take the good features from iOS.

The virtual buttons are a shitty feature. WTF is this obsessive need to get rid of physical buttons with tactile feedback? Its great that they can be changed, but I'd like to be able to do a few things without 100% attention to the screen constantly.

I'm a physical being. Not everything has to be software.

Benefits Annoyances

Re:Still playing catch-up

[Anonymous Coward]

and your post gets to put useless apostrophes into possessive pronouns. it's means it is.

Re: Still playing catch-up

[Anonymous Coward]

Like rounded rectangles?

WAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHA! Damn that was a funny joke!!! Have you considered a career in comedy? You'd doubtless end up as one of the all time comedy greats in all of recorded human history.

Re: Still playing catch-up

[Anonymous Coward]

oh oh and touching a touch screen to unlock your phone.

Re: Still playing catch-up

[Anonymous Coward]

And you don't capitalise so who's really got the biggest problem here?

Re: Still playing catch-up

[Anonymous Coward]

Hoos

Re: Still playing catch-up

[Anonymous Coward]

who really has

Re: Still playing catch-up

[Anonymous Coward]

Nah I could never compete with the comedians that work at the patent office. Thanks for thinking I could make it though :).

Re: Still playing catch-up

[Anonymous Coward]

OK smartass, before the iPhone, where could you buy a phone where you could touch the screen to interact with the phone? Nowhere... More stolen tech.

Re: Still playing catch-up

[Anonymous Coward]

I can't hold that against them so much as I assume Android has similar patents. My Aunt and Uncle aren't the most tech savvy people the world has ever known and have iPhones. They were wondering why you had to swipe up from the bottom to get some dock thing to show, and seeing my Android thought that the Android way made a lot more sense. My guess is Apple had to do the swipe from the bottom upwards because of a patent Android has on the swiping from the top downwards to get the notification bar to show.

Re:Still playing catch-up

[Anonymous Coward]

A) The physical home button uses up space that could be better used by the tiny screen.

B) Physical buttons are prone to failure, especially one used as frequently as the home button. So, good riddance.

Re: Still playing catch-up

[Anonymous Coward]

IBM?

Re:Still playing catch-up

[cayenne8]

Unless they allow the disablement of the biometric shit, and allow good old fashioned passwords....I'm not buying it.

Re: Still playing catch-up

[DontBeAMoran]

Palm?

Re:Still playing catch-up

[Anonymous Coward]

WTF is this obsessive need to get rid of physical buttons with tactile feedback?

They already removed the physical home button in the iPhone 7. It's now a software button that just looks like the old Home button. Instead of "clicking" it now vibrates the phone.

If you're physically holding the phone, it does almost feel like a button. If you're not, or if you're holding it wrong (why does that sound familiar), the physical feedback is just off and the phone just sort of shakes.

Oh, and because it's a software button, it now occasionally just doesn't work and does nothing, with no ability to tell whether or not you're pressing hard enough or that the phone has crashed. Because Apple fired their QA staff, generally the phone will have crashed and now you get to do the new "reboot the phone" gesture which had to change because the home button isn't a button any more.

Re: Still playing catch-up

[Anonymous Coward]

Swiping down rather than up makes more sense? for some random display of secondary info?

Why?

Re:Still playing catch-up

[NatasRevol]

I'm sure they'll miss you.

Re:Still playing catch-up

[Hognoxious]

The virtual buttons are a shitty feature. WTF is this obsessive need to get rid of physical buttons with tactile feedback?

Cost - the components themselves plus assembling them. It can add up to whole tens of cents!

As a rule, if it has a touchscreen then two revisions down the line it will only have a touchscreen.

Re: Still playing catch-up

[reanjr]

Doubtful. Ubuntu phone is designed around various side swipes. This is probably a case of Apple designers not wanting anything spoiling their pretty mockups. Apple: fuck usability, it's fucking pretty.

Re:Still playing catch-up

[Anonymous Coward]

Maybe the revolutionary new idea they are introducing is to do it in a way that people actually like to use it?

Re:Still playing catch-up

[ausekilis]

It is funny how with Jobs at the helm Apple was the visionary. Windows '95 was basically MacOS '85. Then the iPod hit, with Creative's Nomad and MS's Zune being also-ran's some months/years later. Today we have iPod features years behind competitors.

Apple went from 10 years ahead to 4-5 years behind. First screen sizes, then the "thin wars", now removing physical buttons in favor of tactile screens. What's next? Slightly larger screen with a Wacom digitizer a-la Samsung Note series?

Re: Still playing catch-up

[Anonymous Coward]

Personally I think design ideas aren't something that should be protected too much, and the world benifits. Imagine if there was no Android, apple would probably charge $5,000 for an iPhone and they still wouldn't be water resistant.

Re: Still playing catch-up

[pecosdave]

The Handspring Treo?

Re:Still playing catch-up

[unixisc]

Completely agree. The last time I saw a major leap in iPhone was from 5s to 6, when they brought in Apple Pay, and enlarged the phone a bit, allowing for more icons per screen. Had I bought my phone a bit later when 6 came out, I'd have avoided any upgrades - depending on the storage that I bought.

I recently upgraded from the 5s to a 7, and the loss of the aux slot hasn't hurt, since I don't use the music aspect of the phone. However, that's the last upgrade I've done. I don't plan to ever go w/ 8. I'd be curious about what a Surface Phone is like once it's out.

Re: Still playing catch-up

[Anonymous Coward]

Butthurt apple fanboi found. Tell the truth, how many jokes have you made about the note 7 being "hot". Prediction: Non-zero.

Re:Still playing catch-up

[peragrin]

Biometrics work awesome for phones.

Why ? My nieces 3-4 year olds could figure out pins, that stupid android but drawing thing, etc but they can't duplicate my thumb easily. (Yes it isn't that hard but it requires skills and tools not found in most homes)

The iPhone thumb has a 48 hour timeout where if you haven't typed in your password in 48 hours the thumb doesn't work. Police in the USA can hold you for 24 hours so odds are the police won't be able to unlock your phone and will be locked out by password by the time they get around to you.

Re: Still playing catch-up

[Wovel]

No to you and all your ancestors. Try again.

Re: Still playing catch-up

[hidden]

Because you're pulling down the notification bar to expand it and get more stuff, which is a logical action. When you swipe up on iPhone, you're just pulling things out of nowhere.

Re:Still playing catch-up

[cayenne8]

The iPhone thumb has a 48 hour timeout where if you haven't typed in your password in 48 hours the thumb doesn't work. Police in the USA can hold you for 24 hours so odds are the police won't be able to unlock your phone and will be locked out by password by the time they get around to you.

The police can force you to physically touch your thumb or other biometric to the phone to open it. They could easily do this within your 48 hours time limit.....

So far to point, they still cannot pry into your mind to get your code(s)....

That and I just would rather NOT share my fingerprints anymore than I have to, especially with a company....who knows what database that will end up on.

Re: Still playing catch-up

[Rakarra]

Like rounded rectangles?

WAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHA! Damn that was a funny joke!!! Have you considered a career in comedy? You'd doubtless end up as one of the all time comedy greats in all of recorded human history.

I only wish it were a joke, but sadly that's the reality we live in.

Re: Still playing catch-up

[Anonymous Coward]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wFeC25BM9E0

Re:Still playing catch-up

[TheFakeTimCook]

The iPhone thumb has a 48 hour timeout where if you haven't typed in your password in 48 hours the thumb doesn't work. Police in the USA can hold you for 24 hours so odds are the police won't be able to unlock your phone and will be locked out by password by the time they get around to you.

The police can force you to physically touch your thumb or other biometric to the phone to open it. They could easily do this within your 48 hours time limit.....

So far to point, they still cannot pry into your mind to get your code(s)....

That and I just would rather NOT share my fingerprints anymore than I have to, especially with a company....who knows what database that will end up on.

Fingerprint data never leaves the TouchID Chip built into the Home Button. And I don't think it even keeps an image of the fingerprint(s), per se; just some sort of ID-hashing code.

Re: Still playing catch-up

[Anonymous Coward]

HTC? Motorola? Any of the above?

Re:Still playing catch-up

[TheFakeTimCook]

The real problem is that iOS tends to copy the shitty features of Android where as Android tends to take the good features from iOS.

The virtual buttons are a shitty feature. WTF is this obsessive need to get rid of physical buttons with tactile feedback? Its great that they can be changed, but I'd like to be able to do a few things without 100% attention to the screen constantly.

I'm a physical being. Not everything has to be software.

Benefits Annoyances

The physical button is taking up quite a bit of potential front-panel area.

Think about it: The button on my iPhone 6 Plus is about 9 mm in diameter. That's bad enough; but the real issue is that it sits in an area that is completely unused on either side of that button. If the "button" is emulated by the already touch-sensitive display, then the ENTIRE area can be used as DISPLAY area, with a simple Gesture, or small on-screen button used to bring up Springboard (the App Launcher) and its dedicated, emulated "Home" button area.

Voila! You have just increased your effective Display area!

Re:Still playing catch-up

[tlhIngan]

Unless they allow the disablement of the biometric shit, and allow good old fashioned passwords....I'm not buying it.

Touch ID has always been optional. You're not forced to use it (in fact, you can't enable it without enabling some other more secure authentication first - even a 4 digit PIN is considered more secure).

I would expect iOS 11 to have a new feature to disable Touch ID quickly - not only after reboot, 48 hours or 3 failed attempts (requiring use of the alternate authentication system) so if the police are forcing people to unlock their phones with fingerprints, you can temporarily disable it. Perhaps if you double-click the power button for example which will disable Touch ID until a successful login (using the more secure methods).

So if they come around and ask people to unlock their phones, you can double-click the power and Touch ID is disabled for unlocking purposes until the phone gets unlocked via the alternate means.

Re:Still playing catch-up

[cayenne8]

Fingerprint data never leaves the TouchID Chip built into the Home Button. And I don't think it even keeps an image of the fingerprint(s), per se; just some sort of ID-hashing code.

And you trust them to keep to this...?

Re: Still playing catch-up

[Anonymous Coward]

HP iPaq.

Yes, that was what it was called.

Re: Still playing catch-up

[Anonymous Coward]

I wouldn't say iPhone users pull stuff from nowhere.

Re: Still playing catch-up

[Anonymous Coward]

That's not true. Cowon had players which could play divx, xvid, mpeg2 and h264 mkv video with subs on a 800x480 IPS screen when iPod was doing their own codec on a far lower res.

Re: Still playing catch-up

[Newander]

So, what's this?
Palm Treo 180

Re:Still playing catch-up

[thegarbz]

So you blame Android but you mention a problem with your very specific implementation of it. It's quite possible that there are companies other than Apple who have solved this problem.

but they probably will; they usually pay a lot of attention to this stuff.

You're assuming that this is a problem for most people that needs to be addressed.

Re:Still playing catch-up

[TheFakeTimCook]

Fingerprint data never leaves the TouchID Chip built into the Home Button. And I don't think it even keeps an image of the fingerprint(s), per se; just some sort of ID-hashing code.

And you trust them to keep to this...?

Yes. Yes I do.

Re:Still playing catch-up

[nasch]

Not to be that annoying android fan boy guy but if you had gone with android, you could get a different launcher (the thing that manages the home screen basically) and customize how many icons are on it. Some launchers even completely change the way the home screen works. I'm not saying you should have gone android by the way, you're probably happy with your phone and that's great.

Re:Still playing catch-up

[Anonymous Coward]

The 7's home button is barely a button. It's a force touch sensitive area with a fingerprint scanner underneath. The next step is to put lcd behind it - And forgive me if I'm wrong, but I think that's exactly what the touch bar on the new MBP.

Re:Still playing catch-up

[Anonymous Coward]

Unless they allow the disablement of the biometric shit, and allow good old fashioned passwords

And that's your brain on Liquid Ecstasy.

Re: Still playing catch-up

[Anonymous Coward]

Neither Android nor iOS are water resistant. What's your point?

Re:Still playing catch-up

[mjwx]

And hopefully Apple will get it right.

With Apple's track record of implementing Android features, they'll do it completely wrong.

I've never encountered an Android phone "doing it wrong", this goes from the first HTC Dream to my latest Nexus 5X. If you're accidentally pressing the soft buttons, you're doing something horribly wrong as they need to be pressed properly to work and have no function if held down too long. In fact, I'd prefer the soft buttons to be more sensitive on my 5X.

Re:Still playing catch-up

[Anonymous Coward]

Stop lying, you don't own an Android phone. Your entire post history is gushing over Apple.

Re: Still playing catch-up

[Anonymous Coward]

The problem with Android is that the art work is still designed by engineers...

Re:Still playing catch-up

[unixisc]

I have good news for you. I have 3 phones - one of each type. One iPhone 7, which I described, and which I use for purely personal uses - family, relatives, my doctors, et al. One Moto X w/ Lollipop, which I use for anything work related. I also have a Lumia 550, which I use as a travel phone, and which is actually pretty good.

On top of that, I have 2 tablets - one iPad mini, and one Verizon Ellipsis 10. The latter, as you can guess, has Lollipop as well, but it recently gave me an update that allows me to install apps to the SD card and run them from that. The launcher is fine - I try to minimize the number of screens. When it first comes up, it has 5 active screens, which IMO are 2 many. I have 2 - one for the normal apps I use, and the other for games. On my Moto X, I just have 1 active screen, and go into the menu.

Actually, on Android, I like Lollipop, but as far as my Ellipsis goes, I would have preferred the ability to have Marshmallow or Nutmeg, so that I could redefine my 128GB SD card as the main storage, and the 16GB as secondary storage. On my Moto X, it's not an issue, since that phone doesn't have an SD card.

Re:Still playing catch-up

[SandWyrm]

They do allow for good old-fashioned passwords (of any length). The biometrics just make it so you don't have to enter it more than once a day. Or after restarting (hint hint for those at airport security).

Facial Recognition...

[Anonymous Coward]

So, I have to re-register every time I shave in order to use apple pay? Oh, you are wearing a baseball cap, so you have to take that off to pay? Oh, you want to unlock your phone while walking down the street. Better take off your sunglasses... Apple, why you gotta keep losing desired functionality?!?!

Re: Facial Recognition...

[Anonymous Coward]

I'm sure they've taken facial hair into account considering their general apple geniuses appearance.

Re:Facial Recognition...

[dknj]

Not gonna happen. They are also incorporating wireless charging. Wireless charging (a) takes a lot of space (relative to a phone) and (b) increases the heat of a battery requiring either a much slower charge or a smaller battery design. So either all of this happens and you are getting a microprocessor with the same speed as an iPhone 7 (think Kaby Lake for phones) or you are not getting all these fancy bells and whistles until the iPhone 8s

-dk

Re:Facial Recognition...

[Anonymous Coward]

Next they'll introduce a designer who has ugly recognition. Seriously, I can't look at iOS anymore without wanting to vomit.

Re:Facial Recognition...

[Freischutz]

So, I have to re-register every time I shave in order to use apple pay? Oh, you are wearing a baseball cap, so you have to take that off to pay? Oh, you want to unlock your phone while walking down the street. Better take off your sunglasses... Apple, why you gotta keep losing desired functionality?!?!

I know that venting your outrage over everything that Apple does is great fun but please do not trash talk facial recognition just because Apple is using it. You are severely underestimating what modern face recognition algorithms can do. If you set out to do it and if this: http://www.webrok.com/news/201... is your taste in sunglasses, you can certainly screw up facial recognition systems but modern facial recognition software has pretty impressive success rates even with subjects wearing headgear, different hair styles, 'normal' sunglasses or regular eye glasses and obscured faces (beards, scarves, veils). engineers@google.com already tried integrating face recognition login into Android and it turned out to be an embarrassing fail: https://www.youtube.com/watch?... because the Android camera could not distinguish between an actual 3D face and a 2D picture of one. Hence the mention of 3D laser scanning module for the new iPhones in the article summary because 3D scanning is what you need for pattern recognition based security features that are hard to fool regardless of whether you are talking about face recognition or fingerprint scanning. On an unrelated note a 3D laser scanning module sounds like a pretty awesome addition to a smartphone for all kinds of reasons having nothing to do with facial recognition and a lot to do with a long standing desire on my part (as, I am sure, many others here) to own a fully functional Start Trek tricorder. A 3D laser scanning module built into your phone would be a major step in that direction. Being able to scan an object on my kitchen table with a smartphone and then sending it to a 3D printer after a short stopover on my laptop to clean up the scan would be nothing short of awesome.

Re:Facial Recognition...

[unixisc]

Why can't they take your thumb print on the touch screen itself, and match it to whatever is in the database?

Re:Facial Recognition...

[Anonymous Coward]

Wow you say how good it is and then give an example of how the leading tech company darling royally fucked it up. That doesn't instill confidence. Also I don't want to have to face this thing toward my face to unlock it every time. What about all the times you're not wanting to angle your phone toward toue fully in obscured face? I link that I can do that now with a 100% reliable solution and functionality that I can feel and not look ata a fucking physical button. Trust me this shit will be apples undoimg, just look at the "touchbar" on the new Macs and tell me how this is faster to do anything. It isn't because it takes something that can be accomplished through touch memory with keys and makes you take your eyes off the thing you need to look at to look at a different thing. It's fucking hunt and pecking.

Re:Facial Recognition...

[Freischutz]

Wow you say how good it is and then give an example of how the leading tech company darling royally fucked it up. That doesn't instill confidence. Also I don't want to have to face this thing toward my face to unlock it every time. What about all the times you're not wanting to angle your phone toward toue fully in obscured face? I link that I can do that now with a 100% reliable solution and functionality that I can feel and not look ata a fucking physical button. Trust me this shit will be apples undoimg, just look at the "touchbar" on the new Macs and tell me how this is faster to do anything. It isn't because it takes something that can be accomplished through touch memory with keys and makes you take your eyes off the thing you need to look at to look at a different thing. It's fucking hunt and pecking.

Woosh!... I also explained why Apple's approach with the 3D laser scanner module is betteer and more secure than Googles attempt using only 2D.

Re:Facial Recognition...

[carlcmc]

No, WHOOSH to you!

I don't want it to have to have line of sight to my face. What a fricking step back. I can reach my hand into my pocket and touch the button to unlock. I can unlock in the dark. It is retarded and as someone who has owned every generation of iphones and ipads, I will quit buying them because of that stupid feature.

Re:Facial Recognition...

[Freischutz]

No, WHOOSH to you! I don't want it to have to have line of sight to my face. What a fricking step back. I can reach my hand into my pocket and touch the button to unlock. I can unlock in the dark. It is retarded and as someone who has owned every generation of iphones and ipads, I will quit buying them because of that stupid feature.

Your personal preferences are immaterial to this discussion. You tried to make the claim that Apple's 3D facial recognition ID would be every bit as insecure as Googles 2D facial recognition ID and you are wrong. So, one more, time if Apple's implementation of face recognition unlocking includes a 3D laser scanning module it is going to be by many parsecs more secure that Googles 2D implementation was that is a mathematical fact. Do you get it now? ... Oh, and you forgot to check the 'Anonymous Coward' box.

Re:Facial Recognition...

[Gussington]

You are severely underestimating what modern face recognition algorithms can do.

I can't speak for the GP, but face recognition should only be able to be called face recognition when it works like nature. ie Humans can recognise a familiar face under all sorts of weird circumstances. But 'modern' facial recognition algorithms still only work under specific circumstances and then only sometimes. How many times has a friend or family member come up to you to say hello and you've responded, "I'm sorry I do not regonise you, please try again?
We have these AI conversations in here all the time, and how impressive it is, but it's only impressive from technology development point of view (ie it's come a long way in only a few years). From a compete-with-nature point of view it, it is still absolute crap.

Great

[Anonymous Coward]

Can I still use a password?

I'm unsure if I'm in a minority of people who don't like all this biometrics stuff or the majority are just told to like it.

Re:Great

[JaredOfEuropa]

Fingerprint ID on current iPhones is entirely optional. And you still need to set a password in case the scanner fails to recognise you 5 times (or after a reboot)

Re:Great

[Anonymous Coward]

Can I still use a password?

I'm unsure if I'm in a minority of people who don't like all this biometrics stuff or the majority are just told to like it.

I agree. Handing out biometrical data to american companies with all that NSA stuff going on seems kind of dumb.

Re:Great

[tattood]

I agree. Handing out biometrical data to american companies with all that NSA stuff going on seems kind of dumb.

Do you not have a driver's license? The NSA (government) can get your fingerprint from its own databases much easier than trying to get it from your phone.

Re:OMG I can see it now

[Anonymous Coward]

Yes, apple is doomed and they will lay off everyone and file for Chapter 11 on April 1 2017.

And pigs might fly.

Not a real fan of Android because of promises about updates and patches never appearing.
Android and Updates? There's an oxymoron.
now Google is working on a new OS that may or may not allow Android apps to run.
I guess the threat of Oracle actually winning in their suefest is scaring them.

So I'll stick with my old Nokia 6310 which apparently will be made again. Yay, where can I get one?
At least it can't run all that lovely data slurping spyware. Delightful.

I wish Android would copy the iPhone's ...

[Anonymous Coward]

... reliable update feature. The need to purchase a new phone just to get the latest version of Android is starting to get ridiculous.

Frankly, I blame Google for open sourcing Android in the first place, instead of keeping it closed source, and providing OEMs with ways to build kernel extensions, and leverage a built-in theme engine.

The only way Google can fix this mess now is to come up with a new OS, which is "Android compatible". Then again, they'll probably do just that, open source it, and we'll be right back to square one as Samsung, LG, etc. jump on it, and make a few minor adjustments ...

Borrowing features

[sjbe]

Once again the latest iPhone introduces revolutionary new ideas Android has had for years.

We get it. You don't like Apple. We'll all pretend for your benefit that the Android ecosystem hasn't "borrowed" any features from Apple and the Android is the one true system from which all good things originate.

Re:Borrowing features

[Anonymous Coward]

Android manufacturers do not pat themselves on the back and declare it innovative when they implement ideas that came from elsewhere.

Re:Borrowing features

[Anonymous Coward]

Rabid fanboy overreaction to startboard, captain!

Speaking of which, captain, what ever happened to port?

Re:Borrowing features

[Oliver Wendell Jones]

It's not a question of whether or not someone likes Apple. Many of the "all new, we just created this and it's never been seen before!" additions to iOS have been blatant rip-offs of features in use for Android for months, if not years before Apple claims it is "all new".

It's the exact sort of crap that Apple would have sued for if the roles were reversed.

Re:Borrowing features

[Anonymous Coward]

There's been open stealing by all sides for their entire lifespan. But only Apple will introduce something that other vendors have had for years and sell it like some grand innovation. People are smart enough to know when they're being lied to and many of us find it insulting.

Re:Borrowing features

[Wovel]

Have you never seen a commercial for any Android device?

Re:Borrowing features

[Rakarra]

We get it. You don't like Apple. We'll all pretend for your benefit that the Android ecosystem hasn't "borrowed" any features from Apple and the Android is the one true system from which all good things originate.

I think claims that Android stole from Apple tend to be wildly overblown. Now Samsung stealing ideas from Apple? Now you've really got something.

Re:Borrowing features

[Anonymous Coward]

Port was removed. Courage was stated. Bullshit was detected.

Marginal improvement curve going flat

[loranger]

The marginal improvement curve is slowing but surely heading towards asymptotic flatness. Time to move on to a new product.

Make Siri more useful

[RogueWarrior65]

Yesterday, I needed to turn on the iPhone's flashlight and for some bizarre reason, it wouldn't let me swipe up from the bottom of the screen to turn it on. So I asked Siri to do turn it on and she said, "I can't do that." Siriously? A while back, the speedometer cable in my truck broke so I couldn't tell how fast I was going. I asked Siri thinking that she would be able to use the GPS to figure it out. "Hey, Siri, how fast am I going?" She said, "I've been wondering that for a while." Yeah, um, hey Siri, quit being a smartass millenial and do some work.

Re:Make Siri more useful

[Anonymous Coward]

Siri is seriously lacking. You can use the Harry Potter "light" spells to toggle the flashlight on Android, but you can't toggle it at all on iOS. There are a lot of edge cases where you can do things with Siri but only if you phrase it in the exact correct way. And then there are weird things, like where Siri will let you enter Airplane Mode, which leaves Siri disabled because that kills the Internet connection.

The funny thing is that for things like your current speed, your iPhone does calculate that. It's used to populate traffic data for Apple Maps.

There's just absolutely no way to see that data using first-party apps.

Re:Make Siri more useful

[nuckfuts]

My wife had the same problem on her iPhone - could not swipe up to access the flashlight icon. After considerable futzing I was able to get it working again. I think the swipe up function might have been turned off under Settings -> Control Center, but I can't remember for sure.

Re:Make Siri more useful

[RogueWarrior65]

I heard that and tried saying "Lumos Maximus" but all Siri wanted to do is search for limousine services in the area. She does know what the fox says even though that's a pretty dated joke.

Re:OMG I can see it now

[Anonymous Coward]

Citation required. For it all.

Both borrow

[sjbe]

It's not a question of whether or not someone likes Apple.

Sure it is. Otherwise he wouldn't get any pleasure out of making snarky comments about how some feature in an Apple product was done somewhere else first despite the fact that very few people actually care.

Many of the "all new, we just created this and it's never been seen before!" additions to iOS have been blatant rip-offs of features in use for Android for months, if not years before Apple claims it is "all new".

Yeah yeah, Apple doesn't do anything new. Blah blah blah. Old argument. Here's the thing. Whether or not Apple is first to market with a given feature is more or less irrelevant. Very few people care if Apple or Samsung or HTC actually put the feature in a product first. What matters is A) whether that feature matters to a potential buyer enough to make them buy the product and B) whether the feature matters as a part of the entire product. I don't buy my phone piecemeal. I buy a phone with the best implemented SET of features. Worrying about who did it first is irrelevant.

It's the exact sort of crap that Apple would have sued for if the roles were reversed.

Really? What's stopping the Android handset makers from suing? You aren't going to argue that they are a bunch of nice guys who just wouldn't do that... because that would be ridiculous. I assure you Samsung will sue just as readily as Apple will. Two things there. First, Apple isn't as trigger-happy with lawsuits as you seem to imply and second, Android makers take ideas from Apple and vice-versa all the time. There are no innocent parties here.

Re: Both borrow

[Anonymous Coward]

Nice fanboi meltdown. Thoroughly enjoyed. Would trigger again.

Re:Both borrow

[sysrammer]

So which is The One True Ring?

Re:Both borrow

[Anonymous Coward]

This is a great idea. I think all real tech companies should form a consortium to go "thermonuclear" against apple. It does not even have to be a consortium; it could just be a shady price fixing type of collusion. That might actually be better.

But alas, not all companies are run by a raging narcissistic asshole who would do this kind of thing.

Too bad..

Re:Both borrow

[thegarbz]

Otherwise he wouldn't get any pleasure out of making snarky comments

For many of us we don't get pleasure about pointing out other people's bullshit. Actually it saddens me a bit that this is "news". Quite the opposite of pleasure.

Re:Both borrow

[thegarbz]

Really? What's stopping the Android handset makers from suing?

Not patenting trivial utter shit like OMG I CAN SLIDE MY FINGER ON A SCREEN!

Lolz!

[Anonymous Coward]

so true!

Courage

[Anonymous Coward]

Are you blind? Tim Cook touched my function area liberally. he strapped me in to his Applemobile and he couldnt keep his offensive hands off of me. he was performing many red flag touches. i couldnt believe what the fuck was going on. i told Tim Cook the board would not approve of a billionaire touching an underage kid for free.

can you believe it? Tim Cook did all this. he picked me off the street, strapped my arms and legs down in the Applemobile's passenger seat, and just wouldn't stop fondling my cock'n'balls.

they definately were red flag touches. the goddamn referee he had in the back seat kept on raising up this red flag every time he touched my function area but did Tim Cook care? NO WAY! he just kept on doing it. I couldn't believe what the fuck was going on, indeed. I pleaded with Tim Cook but to no avail. I told him the stockholders would not approve of such a wealthy man touching an underage kid like me (at the time I was 13) without at least compensating me for the trauma and the use of my body as his own personal plaything.

this got to him, worrying about his image. he continued to fondle me, all the while ignoring the referee's red flags. then he drove the Applemobile to my house and ejaculated the seat i was in! it was amazing. but surprisingly, after I woke up the next morning, my bank account had $150k in it!!! Can you b???????????????????

Re: OMG I can see it now

[Anonymous Coward]

Even the flying pigs part?

Make it thinner

[Maritz]

If it isn't thinner a lot of people are going to be very, very angry. We need to aim for phones that are effectively invisible when viewed side on. If that means the screen has to go, so be it.

Re:Steve Jobs has truely left the building

[Rakarra]

I remember his initial iPhone announcement/unveiling, where he talked about phones with hard keyboards built into the display and how much it sucked that display space was taken by these buttons you only sometimes used.

It's bitztream

[Anonymous Coward]

the autism-hating, custom EpiPen-hating, Musk-hating Slashdot troll!

Tons of them got it right.

[DrYak]

My android phone has two "soft" buttons next to a physical home button, and I hate those little fuckers.

Other device did it better :

- more recent android device have no physical button or touch zone, just a bigger screen. It's either 3 clickable button displayed at the bottom of the screen.
Or full screen, with the button appearing if you touch the screen (used for gaming and movie watching). They are handled by the same code that handles most UI button on the OS, so a little bit better handled than the "a fly could click on it" older softbutton you mention.

- before that, Palm/HP WebOS used to produced devices that started using gestures on the touch area under the screen.
Harder to confuse a touch with a gesture, than a touch with a click.

- Sailfish OS (Meego/Maemo/Mer descendant, cousin of Tizen, full blown GNU/Linux under the hood) has completely abandoned system button. Applications always display full screen, and users use some type of swipes (starting for the screen's edge) to do commands that would require buttons on other phones.
(Except when running android apps in the emulator that still require button. For those it goes to the software displayed soft button like android)

My preference goes for the later 2 (webOS and Sailfish)

Re:Sigh

[Anonymous Coward]

Dear Apple,

Please make me an iPhone with a 3.5" screen again so that jack shit fits on the screen and I can scroll/flip pages more. I like this, so obviously everyone else does too.

Thanks.

FTFY

Re:Sigh

[tzanger]

It's called the iPhone SE. 5 form factor but close enough. That's what I got to replace the 5S I've had for the last few years. I don't like the bumpy 6, and really dislike the 7 for dropping the headphone port. Maybe Apple will pull their heads out their asses on the 8S/9 when I'm next ready to upgrade, or maybe I'll end up leaving their ecosystem. I'm already one leg out the door due to their recent shenanigans with the MacBook Pro/Air lines.

Pity, their hardware really is very good.

So.....

[BitztreamNotARealNam]

How's life in the hypocrite lane?

Unique Nature of webapps

[rrajdev]

http://softwareengineeringmca....

Re: OMG I can see it now

[Anonymous Coward]

Yup. If apple cultists want to make crazy claims they should back them up.