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FCC Votes To Lift Net Neutrality Transparency Rules For Smaller Internet Providers (theverge.com)

The Federal Communications Commission today voted to lift transparency requirements for smaller internet providers. According to The Verge, "Internet providers with fewer than 250,000 subscribers will not be required to disclose information on network performance, fees, and data caps, thanks to this rule change. The commission had initially exempted internet providers with fewer than 100,000 subscribers with the intention of revisiting the issue later to determine whether a higher or lower figure was appropriate." From the report: The rule passed in a 2-1 vote, with Republicans saying the reporting requirements unfairly burdened smaller ISPs with additional work. Only Democratic commissioner Mignon Clyburn opposed. Clyburn argued that the disclosures were an important consumer protection that was far from overbearing on businesses, particularly ones this large. Clyburn also argued that the rule would allow larger internet providers to avoid disclosing information by simply breaking their service areas up into different subsidiaries. Republican commissioner Michael O'Rielly voted in favor of the change, saying he actually would have preferred the subscriber exemption to be even higher. And commission chairman Ajit Pai said the rules were necessary to protect "mom and pop internet service providers" from "burdensome requirements [...] that impose serious and unnecessary costs."

18 of 115 comments (clear)

  1. Wow, just wow. by Qzukk · · Score: 5, Insightful

    So apparently an ISP being able to tell people up front what their fees and charges will be is a

    burdensome requirements [...] that impose serious and unnecessary costs

    I guess this explains why big ISPs like Comcast and such manage to fuck up billing people on a regular basis. It's just too goddamn hard for companies to know what they charge for their services.

    --
    If I have been able to see further than others, it is because I bought a pair of binoculars.
    1. Re:Wow, just wow. by boristdog · · Score: 4, Funny

      Well, you know only the BIG ISPs are able to afford things like computers, which can automatically calculate things like fees and bandwidth usage.

      It's these poor "Mom and Pop" providers that are still keeping all their records on paper, and have to manually copy every packet from one internet tube to the next. It's REALLY exhausting. Can you imagine if they had to add up all the numbers and write a report for each and every subscriber every month? That would truly be burdensome. Someone needs to help these poor overworked people.

    2. Re:Wow, just wow. by gweilo8888 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      No, the cost is small. It's just that the cost of institutionalized bribery (ahem, I mean lobbying) is even smaller, as far as your company is concerned. I'm sure the money your lobbyist threw around was greedily gobbled up by Trump and his cronies, though.

      And no, you're being disingenuous: It's stated right in the freaking summary how it will affect the large ones too: They just split their business into multiple distinct 100,000-person "businesses", all of which are owned by Comcast or whomever. These then tell the customers that since you're only doing business with the "tiny company", you aren't entitled to any information on fees, performance or data caps. And that's the real concern here.

    3. Re:Wow, just wow. by rtb61 · · Score: 2

      So what you are saying is that smaller ISPs need to be able to lie about the quality of their services to compete, hmm, OK :| (FU).

      --
      Chaos - everything, everywhere, everywhen
    4. Re:Wow, just wow. by gweilo8888 · · Score: 2

      You get it from CenturyLink, paying them if necessary. Should've been negotiated in your contract; if you failed to do so, that's your fault.

    5. Re:Wow, just wow. by Altrag · · Score: 2

      So you're saying that small ISPs don't have the resources to do things like know what their own damned pricing structure is? They don't have the ability to know/remember what data caps they themselves put in place?

      Sorry but this is all just anti-consumer BS wrapped up in a "think of the little guys!" Given Trump's recent appointments, its also likely as an intentional step down the slippery slope with the full intention of seeing the big providers cry foul next year and having the requirements dropped completely.

      Basically the "burden" here is printing an extra copy of data they already need to run their damned business and mailing it to the SEC once a year (or maybe 4 times a year if its a quarterly thing.)

      Meanwhile we apparently don't see it as too burdensome to store and be able to retrieve on demand months of history of specific user accounts (or even en masse) and other such requests at any time on the whim of law enforcement.

    6. Re:Wow, just wow. by lexman098 · · Score: 2

      Thanks for the interesting perspective, but I just don't agree.

      #1 Common sense would dictate that they should at least be able to report what they *are* doing or not doing. I don't believe the requirement is to report information that they don't already have and would require an expensive enterprise level system to obtain.

      #2 This is kind of irrelevant. Most people would rather drive a car that can go 300 mph even though they'd realistically never use that. That doesn't mean Honda should be allowed to falsely advertise a 300mph Civic.

      #3 You've provided a reason why an ISP might oversubscribe, but no reason why they shouldn't be able to report it.

      #4 The "right" way is not to get rid of net neutrality. The 1% of users are still paying for what you're advertising. You should advertise to everyone what is and isn't available and treat your customers equally. Lunch buffets have been dealing with this kind of thing for a while without false advertising or "shaping" the food available to the over-eating 1%.

  2. Re:Mom & Pop internet providers? by JBMcB · · Score: 2

    Everyone on the 21 pages after page 4 in this list:
    http://broadbandnow.com/All-Pr...

    Most are rural providers that only cover a few thousand subscribers over a large area, and only have a few employees. Installation and cable work are contracted out, and lines are piggy-backed on existing telecommunication wires. Equipment is co-located at the telcos. Most of the "offices" I've seen are storefonts in strip malls.

    --
    My Other Computer Is A Data General Nova III.
  3. Re:Mom & Pop internet providers? by oddaddresstrap · · Score: 2

    You know, a small two-person operation that serves fewer than a quarter million people.

  4. As someone who worked for a small ISP... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Interesting

    As someone who worked for a small ISP when the transparency rules were first implemented... the transparency rules do not add burden to the ISP. It just required you to publish the truth about your business practices. If there is a data cap, you have to have the data cap listed. If you throttled the speeds, you had to say you throttled the speeds and under what circumstances (ex: if you download > 20 GB in x time, your speed will get throttled down to x speed for x amount of time). If there was any special traffic shaping to say torrent traffic, you'd have to be "transparent" that you did this. Quite literally every ISP just published a PDF on their website with the facts of the products they were selling dubbed a "transparency report".

    Anyone who thinks it is a burden to be truthful to customers about the product you're selling, definitely has something wrong with them.

  5. Precedent by Rick+Schumann · · Score: 2

    Considering how the current administration appears to feel about consumers rights, I'll take this as them setting precedent to deregulate internet regardless of how large the ISP is, so they can charge you whatever 'fees' they want to charge you on top of the actual service, and you won't have any say in the matter because you signed a contract. You thought Comcast violated your anus before? Just wait.

  6. Re:Mom & Pop internet providers? by Anubis+IV · · Score: 4, Interesting

    I'd take it to mean ISPs like Brazos WiFi, a small ISP that operates in the rural areas close to where I live. It was started about a decade back by a lone tech guy who was frustrated that none of the major ISPs were serving the town he lived in. At this point, it's his full-time job and he's putting up a handful of new towers every year to expand his region, improve his service, and lower his prices. I'd imagine he has customers in the low thousands at this point, since he's serving several rural towns and has even started getting into the outskirts of the main cities in the area.

    I'd consider that a mom and pop ISP.

  7. The (400 page) requirements you can read. $3.25 by raymorris · · Score: 2, Interesting

    I just spent two days filling out forms and schedules for the IRS, in order to report the fact that I owe them $3.25. All those forms might make sense for a big company; it's asinine that I had to do all that to calculate $3.25 in federal unemployment tax because I earned $530 from a side business last year. My total tax forms for that $530 business are probably 40 pages of tax forms per year. I fully support distinguishing between a company like Verizon vs Ray Morris Inc when it comes to reporting requirements.

    The subject of the present action is categorizing ISPs as common carriers under Title II - classifying them as phone companies. Title II was written with AT&T in mind, assuming the related company will have a team of people dedicated to compliance. It wasn't written for small companies. Here's the Congressional statute (not too bad) and 400 PAGE FCC order on applying it to ISPs:
    https://www.law.cornell.edu/us...

    https://apps.fcc.gov/edocs_pub...

    You say *complying* with the order should be easy, I dare you to even try to READ the order. There are 400 pages in the order itself, many of which refer to other FCC regulations you'll need to read. Make sure to read the part about how you're not allowed to bring up a new connection or remove an old one without a certificate of preapproval from the FCC.

  8. To be the phone company by raymorris · · Score: 2

    ISPs are now subject to Title II regulations as common carriers - the rules written for Verizon and AT&T now apply to ISPs. Ponder for a moment how many regulations a thousand bureaucrats have written over the last several decades for phone companies.

    The order which lists which regulations now apply to ISPs as well is 400 pages. Here is is for your reading pleasure:

    https://apps.fcc.gov/edocs_pub...

    Note that's not 400 pages of regulations, that's 400 pages of REFERENCES to regulations. The total regulations will be in the thousands of pages.

  9. Re: Lack of understanding rather than nefarious by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Interesting

    I propose this to ponder:

    Have you considered that other Republican actions to loosen or remove policies in industries you're less familiar with could in fact be almost identical to this case? That is to say, if you were as knowledgeable in other sectors as you are in network infrastructure, it might be the case that many of those decisions to remove "burdensome restrictions" might appear prettt BS-esk and geared to undermine the average consumer/citizen?

    I'm not proposing that silly regulations don't exist that could be consolidated, streamlined, altered or in some cases, flat out removed (I see them in sectors I deal with). At the same time, the more regulations I see removed and the more I read into why they were built, look at both sides of the argument, and check the data, the less I believe your or my interests as working class citizens are being served.

  10. Re:Mom & Pop internet providers? by vanyel · · Score: 4, Interesting

    As a sysadmin, speaking very unofficially, from a small regional provider, and who used to single-handedly run a small local isp (which is still a withering hosting service), fees and caps had ought to be clear up front, and network capacity reporting is not a big deal. It's something you'd better be monitoring anyhow.

  11. Re:Mom & Pop internet providers? by WheezyJoe · · Score: 3

    The trouble comes when these small "rural providers" get bought up by giant conglomerates. These "holding companies" can cheat the system, claiming the benefits of small when they've actually got deep deep pockets that could pay for compliance, but instead ear-mark that money to lobbyists and the "regulation hurts business" crusade.

    The original exemption for ISPs with 100,000 or fewer subscribers was applied to the aggregated total of subscribers "across all affiliates," so that small ISPs owned by big holding companies wouldn't be exempt.

    The new regulations change that. I think it's bad enough screaming vicious hate toward a known enemy like Comcast, but it's gotta be worse for people relying on some small service-provider that enjoys small-business exemptions but without any folksy small-business courtesy and service we're supposed to associate with small business, 'cause the small businessman sold out to an offer he don't refuse years ago, and now that "small business" is just one of a thousand pages in some nameless guy's portfolio whose only interest is income and territory.

    --
    Take it easy, Charlie, I've got an Angle...
  12. Re:Lack of understanding rather than nefarious by Altrag · · Score: 2

    For all the rhetoric, very few people want full net neutrality. A VOIP packet and a BitTorrent packet just aren't the same and you'd be hard pressed to find anyone who claims otherwise.

    What people want is for equivalent traffic to be neutral. My VOIP packet shouldn't have priority over your VOIP packet, and your BitTorrent packet shouldn't have priority over my BitTorrent packet.

    The rhetoric breaks down due to this kind of disconnect:
    - People claim they want full neutrality when what they really want is equivalence-based neutrality and shaping/prioritization applied between non-equivalent packets.

    - While the ISPs claim they need to do shaping between non-equivalent packets but what they really mean is they want to do prioritization between equivalent packets based on external factors (ie: whether or not those packets are owned by someone who paid for the fast lane boost.)

    So basically people don't say what they mean because they don't really understand what they're talking about, and ISPs don't say what they mean because its not politically cool to just outright say they want to double-dip on Google and Netflix' extreme traffic usage.