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Boeing and Airbus Can't Make Enough Airplanes To Keep Up With Demand (axios.com)
From a report on Axios: Aerospace manufacturers like Boeing and Airbus cannot produce airplanes fast enough to meet demand despite what the Wall Street Journal calls "one of the industry's steepest production increases since World War II." The run up in demand is partially the result of fast-growing airline industries in the Middle East and China. Manufacturers will need to increase production by 30% to meet current orders, and such booming demand is one sign of a healthier global economy.
There's a huge waiting list to buy their new G600 long-range luxury jet.
I thought about buying one but decided to get a used 757 instead... but no tacky gold letters
That is interesting. One would expect, if this is the case, that the manufacturers would increase prices until there are only so many interested buyers that the whole production will be sold. What am I missing?
Cannot they make some? Ok I know they are smaller, but the Bombardier CS300 has 135 seats, not that bad
"Science will win because it works." - Stephen Hawking
I agree, such things is a sign that the economy is getting overheated and we'll see a crash soon.
If builders built buildings the way programmers wrote programs, then the first woodpecker would destroy civilization.
I may be incorrect but I was thinking that most planes were issued basically on credit to these airlines, just like when you buy a new car.
These airlines purchased these airplanes years in advance with people trying to guess what travel expectancy will be at the time they receive the plane. Lets say one of these airlines misjudged and they have to renege on their purchase of a plane or two as their passenger pool has not gained as their model suggested. No problem, Boeing/Airbus can just refit the interior to meet the preference of another airline.
Now lets suppose several of these airlines have to renege due to various factors - rising fuel costs, nearby conflicts chasing away travelers, etc. This could be a very precarious position for Boeing and Airbus if they have a surplus of planes.
Honestly, running with a 30% header in demand seems wise when considering the length of time it takes for these planes to be brought out for first flight. Not to say this necessarily means the economy is doing poorly, but I don't feel like this is at all any indication of a booming economy.
From what I saw at my time with Boeing, they don't do well when they are under pressure. Things get rushed, forgotten or hastily slapped together. There was an anonymous thread a few weeks ago on an aircraft discussion board as to whether it was OK to use hardware store grade fasteners on aircraft structures. I shuddered. Because I've seen it come close to that when they ran out of approved parts.
Boeing (also known as the Lazy-B) builds good stuff when it's done at a leisure pace. But try to accelerate things and they go to hell pretty quickly.
Have gnu, will travel.
They are in the boneyard for a reason. If anything, you keep the airworthy but old ones running longer. No shortage there.
John McAfee 'It was like that time I hired that Bangkok prostitute; to do my taxes, while I fucked my accountant'
The solutions to all problems Boeing.
Wait, so the price goes up (extra fees) and they put more passengers on each plane (less leg room) and you think that is NOT a sign that flight demand is NOT increasing?
Browsing at +1 - no ACs, I ignore their posts. So refreshing!
many of them don't even have high school diplomas
Right in the GP post...
Browsing at +1 - no ACs, I ignore their posts. So refreshing!
Unbeknown to many, Ukraine has some very advanced aircraft technology. Its "Mria" aircraft remains the largest cargo airplane in the world. And it is not just the size — recently it was used to bring a replacement engine to a Boeing...
They are partnering with Saudis now to develop their know-how into mass-production...
In Soviet Washington the swamp drains you.
I prefer to fly on airplanes that were not built by sleep-depraved, overworked slaves.
Just over a month into his term and you Trumpettes are giving him credit for aircraft orders?
And China and India are booming. The largest airplane order was from Indica, a domestic airline from India. 410 orders for Airbus 320. Airbus with their government funding is able to give them very long lease terms and guaranteed buy back price. Boeing needs to raise cash on commercial paper, Airbus does so on government underwritten bonds. But that is a different story.
Confluence of these factors, and a general belief that oil is never going to exceed 100$ ever again is fueling the optimism and large airplane orders. Oil producers trying to kick their oil dependence are trying to become transportation centers. Now a days it is impossible to beat the fares offered by Emirates, Qatar, Kuwait, Etihad to India/China from USA. So even the oil states are investing in airplanes.
They believe the moment oil goes above 60, fracking becomes profitable again. At 80, the fracking will flood the market with over supply and oil will slideback.
sed -e 's/Chuck Norris/Rajnikant/g' joke > fact
Most of them make well into six figures despite the fact many of them don't even have high school diplomas
Most craftsmen don't need post-secondary education. Craftsmen learn by doing, not by studying. Look in any of the skilled trades, carpenters, boilermakers, electricians, pipefitters, very very few of them have anything past high school, and there are a large number that don't have high school diplomas. You just don't need that type of education to do that type of work.
This is the fault of unions.
I'm not sure I follow your logic though. You are saying they are going bankrupt because of the unions? While saying they are making well into 6 figures? That sounds like a money management issue rather than a union issue.
Boeing simply can't afford to work them more than forty hours,
Why the hell would you want them working more than 40 hours? Since when is that a sign laziness? I don't want a guy working 6-10's assembling my air planes. People get burned out working that many hours.
Thanks, Trump. Making America Great Again, one victory at a time.
Passenger miles are increasing. And planes are getting hard to buy. Prices go up and they put more people on a plane. Not really unexpected!
Browsing at +1 - no ACs, I ignore their posts. So refreshing!
That's complete Bullsh*t.
I live in Seattle. Boeing announced it will be cutting jobs in 2017 due to " fierce competition with rival Airbus and a drop in new orders".
They will be cutting the number of planes produced per month.
http://www.bizjournals.com/sea...
You know, little things like the wings.
That would be Japan, not China.
I don't think it would be a problem having planes built in China for the Chinese domestic market.
Have gnu, will travel.
Boeing can't afford to have that much headroom. This is the fault of unions.
Welcome to South Carolina, Boeing.
Have gnu, will travel.
I don't know if there is a law he absolutely must stay at the White House and use Air Force One just because he is the president, but I wouldn't be surprised if there is. But security! is probably the claim.
Well, if it's so awesome in the factory, why don't you get a job there?
30% increase of air traffic will not help curbing down CO2 emissions.
The framework which is designed for asynchronous responses...such as planes not appearing on demand! Whoa!
I'm really getting sick of this 'Trump this, Trump that' shit!
I'm now so irritated by all that off-topic Trump pushing/bashing that as soon as my eyes meet the word 'Trump', I close the whole thread and continue with the next one, so good luck with your comments on Trump and your other frustrations, losers...
"Trump!!", the new Godwin.
As if the Ukrainians and Saudis care about that...
"Trump!!", the new Godwin.
Wrong. The name of the country is Sudan. The Sudan is a name of a geographic region . Face it, your English really sucks and you are most uncultured.
Some countries have a long name and a short name. The article is not used in front of the short name. The Kingdom of The Netherlands is the long name, Holland (no "the") is the short name.
Like Germany, Ukraine has no "long name" — since it stopped being merely a region of the delightfully dead USSR and became and independent state, the "the" in front of it is inappropriate although frequently used to insult by the Russian assholes. Which is exactly what you did — and are.
In Soviet Washington the swamp drains you.
Nazis are so out fashion, dumbass, you really should try to do a better job hiding it... Not that you can do a better job at anything, even /. trolling.
In Soviet Washington the swamp drains you.
The thing to bear in mind that what's driving the current boom cycle is mainly orders from outside the USA/EU.
Asian tiger economies had their crash and burn cycle in the 1990s and whilst western ones are now having their wheels fall off in a smilar way (right down to IMF bailouts primarily benefitting banks, not the countries being loaned money) , the asian ones are recovering nicely and having been burned once, the people in charge are not willing to allow it to occur again - unlike western countries who've walked straight back into the same short-cycle goals that caused the crashes in in the first place.
That said, the last 8-9 years have been particularly dire for the aircraft makers, with Boeing avoiding massive cuts in Washington state by doing it in subsidiary companies such as Spirit (the Kansas lines were pretty much obliterated). This has had an interesting benefit of forcing them to streamline everything and leaves them in a good position to fill orders (but of course the problem is when they overproduce and the next bust cycle leaves them with excess inventory)
For those who don't grok the reason: Operating costs.
Fuel and engine maintenance costs are easily far higher for an older aircraft than simply buying a new one and you can't leave aircraft parked around because they cost millions to keep airworthy even if they're not flying. Every minute one isn't in the air or at a gate loading/unloading passengers/freight, it's a liability to the company that owns it.
Craftsmen receive a shitload of training, even if it's not a "diploma" at the end.
Good companies and industries recognise that. Some have some up with equivalents to tertiary qualifications that are recognised universally.
The very skilled trades you mention _all_ have significant requirements for safety and technical training. Throwing a HS graduate at any of those fields without several years of training through apprenticeships or other on-the-job training results in _deaths_
As for hours worked: Amen. Any more than 35 hours worked results in documented reductions in throughput and increases in errors. That might be ok if you're a minimum wage oik behind the counter at 7-11, but I'd prefer that my aircraft have their full complement of fasteners, of the right type and tensioned correctly, given that the stress calculations of the airframe are finely put together to give maximum strength without excess weight.
Of course that kind of hting is exactly the area where robots win overall (no mistakes, don't get tired), but the improvement in productivity for that kind of incremental change means that only a few people are surplus to requirements and the increase in production might well mean there's an opening for them fitting cabin seats instead.
Craftsmen receive a shitload of training, even if it's not a "diploma" at the end
That's pretty much what I was implying. Years of apprenticeship, on the job training and classroom instruction, none of which ends with a degree. But it ends with a 100k/year job. I've worked with a ton of craftspeople, just like every other profession they have brilliant people and people I wouldn't trust to tie their shoes correctly. College education has nothing to do with it.
Your sig seems to indicate you are sick of yourself...
Yeah, like the loss of nutrition already caused by the (over-) use of chemical fertilizers, always re-cropping the land without resting, maximizing the yield, i.e.: extracting as much nutrients from the soil as possible (without of course returning them).
The problem you mention is already there without CO2 increase.
"Trump!!", the new Godwin.
Maybe it seems, but it doesn't.
"Trump!!", the new Godwin.