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One Day Left To Comment on the FCC's Plan To Kill Net Neutrality (theverge.com)

An anonymous reader quote The Verge: After four months of debate, the FCC is nearly ready to stop accepting feedback on its proposal to kill net neutrality. Final comments are due this Wednesday, August 30th, by end-of-day Eastern time. Once the comment period closes, the FCC will review the feedback it received and use it as guidance to revise its proposal, which if passed, would reverse the Title II classification that guaranteed net neutrality just two years ago. The commission is supposed to factor in all of the feedback it received when writing its final draft, so if you do have strong feelings on the matter, it's worth leaving a comment...

To leave a comment, you'll have to go to this site, click "+ Express," and then fill out the form it opens up to. Make sure you leave the proceeding number "17-108" in place, as that's what ties it to the net neutrality proposal. Also, be aware that everything filed is public, so others will be able to see your name and address.

"ISPs shouldn't be gatekeepers," wrote the EFF in a tweet sharing tips on the way to write effective comments. The number of comments matter because "the commission will very likely have to defend its changes in court," according to the article. And the commission has now received a record 22 million filings -- nearly six times the previous record of 3.7 million comments (when the net neutrality rules were first implemented).

99 comments

  1. And by kill Net Neutrality You Mean... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    On their plan to kill a set of rules previously labeled as "Net Neutrality" that everyone agreed were ineffective at actually enforcing net neutrality anyway.

    1. Re:And by kill Net Neutrality You Mean... by ShanghaiBill · · Score: 2

      ... that everyone agreed were ineffective at actually enforcing net neutrality anyway.

      Not everyone agreed with that.
      Since I do not pay a surcharge to Comcast for Netflix and Amazon content, the current rules are working effectively for me.
      I expect that to change.
      The toll booths will be going up soon.

    2. Re:And by kill Net Neutrality You Mean... by Rick+Schumann · · Score: 1

      I'm currently subjected to having Comcast. If they start that bullshit of which you speak, I'll be hastily looking for a different ISP, and I'll be damned well telling them exactly WHY I'm dumping them, when I go in person to their customer service office with the cable modem in hand, demanding a receipt showing I returned it, and paperwork showing I no longer do business with them.

    3. Re:And by kill Net Neutrality You Mean... by burtosis · · Score: 1

      I'm currently subjected to having Comcast. If they start that bullshit of which you speak, I'll be hastily looking for a different ISP, and I'll be damned well telling them exactly WHY I'm dumping them, when I go in person to their customer service office with the cable modem in hand, demanding a receipt showing I returned it, and paperwork showing I no longer do business with them.

      Sucks to be you. For high speed internet I've got Comcast, xfinity, and shipping a big pile of hard drives by usps.

    4. Re:And by kill Net Neutrality You Mean... by ShanghaiBill · · Score: 5, Insightful

      I'll be hastily looking for a different ISP

      You are missing the point. Without NN, the ISPs will be able to charge arbitrary fees precisely because they are monopolies or near monopolies in most areas where they operate. If you are actually able to take your business to a competitor, then you are in a small minority.

    5. Re:And by kill Net Neutrality You Mean... by SQLGuru · · Score: 2

      If they reverse Net Neutrality, I saw we start a GoFund me to buy out all of the ISPs and then de-prioritize all government traffic as well as the personal traffic of Ajit Pai. Since it will then be legal to do, we might as well work it in our favor.

    6. Re:And by kill Net Neutrality You Mean... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Xfinity is Comcast...

    7. Re:And by kill Net Neutrality You Mean... by pedrop357 · · Score: 1

      Thanks for this. Over and over again, people here made this charge that everyone was conspiring against Netflix when in fact Netflix was just trying to cut costs by deliberately seeking out companies that would load up settlement free links with Comcast.

    8. Re:And by kill Net Neutrality You Mean... by burtosis · · Score: 1

      Xfinity is Comcast...

      Woosh

    9. Re:And by kill Net Neutrality You Mean... by Gr8Apes · · Score: 1

      Good luck with that, you seem to be in poor control of reality.

      --
      The cesspool just got a check and balance.
    10. Re:And by kill Net Neutrality You Mean... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Who are you to tell a company what to do with the network they built? More importantly do you have ANY idea how this impacts the people who have to manage traffic on that network?
      You're trying to legislate control over private property. It's wrong.

  2. just added my comment by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Love is potatoes.
    Potatoes are love.

    1. Re:just added my comment by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I want fries with that.

  3. Why though? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Can't stop it. We have limited choices on who to elect, and they're all corrupt. There's no stopping any of this. Go ahead and comment into the black hole.

    1. Re:Why though? by ShanghaiBill · · Score: 2

      Can't stop it. We have limited choices on who to elect, and they're all corrupt.

      That is Bullcrap. No politician is 100% pure, but it is absurd to say they are all equally corrupt. Denmark is not as corrupt as Nigeria, and Minnesota is not as corrupt as Louisiana. We can do better, and by just giving up and apathetically saying we "Can't stop it" you are part of the problem.

    2. Re:Why though? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      How about you stop being a pussy little yellow-bellied COWARD that just lays down and passively accepts whatever abuse anyone wants to subject you to?
      On second thought where you do live? I'm a little short on cash and it sounds like shaking you down for it won't take any effort at all. Is your wife good looking? Might just take a run at her, too. Oh, wait, better yet: Got a teenage daughter? I know you won't mind, right AC?

    3. Re: Why though? by PoopJuggler · · Score: 0

      How about you do something, other than spouting defeatist crap on internet forums while Trump and his corporate cronies fuck you in the ass with their old, wrinkled white cocks.

    4. Re:Why though? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      We have the internet and blockchain technology. The corrupt political and financial systems could be replaced. The concept of open government is already in existence. Most western countries are moving slowly, but steadily toward becoming 'police states'. Looks like the window of opportunity is closing. The solutions would have to be all inclusive for there to be any chance of success. No 'us versus them'.

    5. Re:Why though? by bluefoxlucid · · Score: 1

      We don't have enough time in any case. The next election cycle is next year.

      I need more information on Net Neutrality. All I've been able to come up with is a jumbled mess about false choice: in theory, you just vote with your dollars and go to an ISP who doesn't throttle Netflix or whatever; in practice, Verizon and Comcast do it, and the other small players are either not carrying big enough pipes to make Netflix useful or not carrying enough customers to make Netflix profitable. Net Neutrality prevents the tyranny of false choice between capable suppliers who won't and willing suppliers who can't.

      So far, I haven't been able to build a strong, defensible argument, though, so the best I've got is "Vote YES for Net Neutrality!" It's no good saying anything if I can't argue on it at-length.

  4. If you choose ignorance... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0, Insightful

    Actually we had a choice on whether to vote for a boring centrist who would have kept net neutrality, or for a racist fascist who would destroy the internet in a second if it would personally enrich himself, his business, or his donors.

    The problem is that a lot of people are to stupid and ignorant to see the choice in front of them, so they stayed home, hiding behind smarmy nonsense like "we had limited choices"

    Well now we have a president who proudly pardons racist law enforcement, telling them that their racist, illegal, unconstitutional tactics are just doing their jobs.

    Yeah... such limited choices on how you could stand up and vote for America instead of rolling over for Russia's candidate while mumbling some smarmy nonsense on how "they are both bad"

    - bit trollent
    (Posted AC because pointing out the obvious has really taken a toll on my karma. The truth hurts I suppose...)

    1. Re:If you choose ignorance... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      http://www.insidesources.com/hillary-clinton-ambivalent-about-net-neutrality-podesta-emails-show/

      Hillary didn't give a fuck about net neutrality.

      BOTH SIDES ARE FUCKING YOU. But none of you get it. Keep eating up those lies and promises. Then in 4-8 years we'll switch back. Then in 4-8 years we'll switch back. Then in 4-8 years we'll switch back. No one wants a 3rd option because you're too busy hating one side. They both need each other to keep this going. Then in 4-8 years we'll switch back. Then in 4-8 years we'll switch back

    2. Re:If you choose ignorance... by david_thornley · · Score: 1

      If Clinton indeed didn't give a fuck about net neutrality, that means she was a better choice on that issue than Trump.

      --
      "When you have eliminated the unacceptable, whatever is left, however improbable, must be the truthiness" - Holmes
    3. Re:If you choose ignorance... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Let's see if you can tell the difference between Hillary Clinton and Donald Trump's positions on net Neutrality:
      citation provided

      Hillary Clinton

      Hillary Clinton has indicated support for net neutrality. She gave two thumbs up to FCC chairman Tom Wheelerâ(TM)s proposal for strong net neutrality rules, though admitted it was only a âoefoot in the door.â

      Donald Trump

      Donald Trump does not support net neutrality. Actually, he thinks it will lead to the censorship of conservative media. âoeObamaâ(TM)s attack on the internet is another top down power grab. Net neutrality is the Fairness Doctrine. Will target conservative media,â he tweeted in 2014.

      Question:

      How can you be so wrong, and so smarmy in your fucking ignorance, and not at some point examine your idiotic and wrong "both sides suck" worldview, which has you actively assisting the people who actually are screwing you.

    4. Re:If you choose ignorance... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      BOTH SIDES ARE FUCKING YOU. But none of you get it. Keep eating up those lies and promises.

      time to up your meds.

      Hillary didn't promise to build a wall, and make Mexico pay for it –Twitler did.

      Hillary didn't promise to bring back coal jobs –Twitler did.

      Hillary didn't promise to keep "grabbing 'em by the pussy" – Twitler did.

      Hillary didn't promise to repeal and replace the ACA – Twitler did. (And failed miserably. Such a loser.)

      and so on and so on.

      So yeah, keep telling us about those promises.

      Whatever Hillary's faults are and were, she isn't the fuckwit we have now; no thanks to the likes of you.

    5. Re:If you choose ignorance... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      You are a fucking moron.

      A democrat enacted net neutrality in the first place!

      Now you want to throw out a bunch of smarmy bullshit about how democrats are just like republicans, when a republican is repealing the net neutrality protections that a democrat passed.

      How can you be so fucking blind, that you seriously can't even see the obvious reality of democrats supporting and enacting protections for your interests like net neutrality?

      America believed the smarmy bullshit that you are selling here (enough for electoral college anyway), and that's the reason why we have the worst president in history. Examine your conscience and consider the real harm that your ignorant worldview has done to this country, such as the elimination of net neutrality.

    6. Re: If you choose ignorance... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Let's check in with 3rd party candidate "Jill Stein"

      uh oh

      Looks like Jill Stein was with Trump's treasonous national security adviser in Russia in the runup to the US election, and is now under investigation for colluding with Russia's attack on our democracy.

      If you want me to take your 3rd party seriously, then show up at the local, state, and house/senate level before you shoot for the presidency. As it stands, the last 3rd party candidate vote totals in the 3 states that swayed the electoral college are greater than Trump's margin of victory.

      So far a Putin connected 3rd party candidate aided Putin' Puppet "Moscow Donald" disastrous election as president, with all the negative consequences that has caused.

      The only thing that liberal 3rd party voters did in the 2016 election was sway the election for a candidate whose stated policies are in direct opposition to their own interests.

    7. Re: If you choose ignorance... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I didn't do nothing to stop Trump's treasonous rise to power.

      I voted, which is more than I can say for shit stains like you who lovingly gobble smarmy bullshit about how "both sides are bad" while their actions support the election of the candidate who promised to end net neutrality, and harm their lives in direct and measurable ways.

    8. Re:If you choose ignorance... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      as long as the Independents and third parties focus on the president without building a base of local and congressional seats they're not going to have much success

    9. Re:If you choose ignorance... by Plus1Entropy · · Score: 1

      Hillary Clinton panders to her base, but when the money rolled in and her position secured, what would she have really done?

      She wouldn't be able to risk losing part of her base on an issue like that. And I don't think Net Neutrality is an issue that really gets conservatives to the polls, in general. So it wouldn't be like she was going to win over any moderates by scrapping it anyway.

      While you could say that she would do it for the campaign donations... well she had more money than Trump but still lost, so how would more campaign contributions in the next election really help her? Especially if she's not going up against the only candidate less popular than her (ever), but a "normal" Republican. I doubt it would be worth demotivating her base. Particularly on an issue that is probably more important to younger voters, who are already hard to motivate (and many of whom probably preferred Sanders, if they voted for her at all).

      So, even if I accept the premise that she would act only in her own best interest, she doesn't hold any integrity or ideology but merely "panders to her base" when convenient... no, I still don't think she would have scrapped NN.

      --
      Only crack the nuts that crack. You don't put the ones that don't crack in the sack.
    10. Re: If you choose ignorance... by Plus1Entropy · · Score: 1

      It's called the Spoiler effect. It's why we need to scrap first-past-the-post and replace it with instant runoff voting. Then people are not punished in the way you describe by voting for a 3rd party candidate.

      When approval ratings are historically low but the incumbency rate is historically high... something is seriously wrong.

      --
      Only crack the nuts that crack. You don't put the ones that don't crack in the sack.
    11. Re:If you choose ignorance... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Comparing Trump to Hitler shows that you are a troll, ignorant as fuck, have no grasp of history, or any idea what Hitler did to an unimaginable amount of victims.

    12. Re: If you choose ignorance... by Tenebrousedge · · Score: 1

      Really anything other than FTTP would be good. At this point one can make a pretty serious argument for choosing leaders by random lottery: at least it would "drain the swamp", right? Personally I think I would rather have range voting or approval voting. A five-star rating or a YouTube-style thumbs-up thumbs-down ballot would hopefully be familiar enough from daily use to be palatable to voters.

      --
      Those who advocate genocide deserve every protection afforded by law, and none afforded by common human decency.
    13. Re:If you choose ignorance... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It's an insult, not an analogy. Go be triggered somewhere else.

    14. Re: If you choose ignorance... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Rent free.

    15. Re: If you choose ignorance... by Plus1Entropy · · Score: 1

      Maybe we could all take it in turns to act as a sort of... executive officer of the week? But all the decisions of that officer must be approved at bi-weekly meetings; by a simple majority in the case of purely internal affairs, but by a two-thirds majority in the case of more major affairs.

      Or we just base our system of government on strange women lying in ponds distributing swords. Gotta be better than what we've got now.

      --
      Only crack the nuts that crack. You don't put the ones that don't crack in the sack.
  5. Doesn't matter... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Everyone in the USA could comment for keeping net neutrality but Ajit Pai will do what ever his corporate masters tell him to do.

    1. Re:Doesn't matter... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Someone call ICE and have that gods-be-damned Pajeet shipped back to India, or whatever shithole country his thrice-damned ancestors came from, sure as fuck don't need his shit here.

  6. Re: Spoiler Alert by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Yeah, because Hillary was going to kill it. /s

    All you fucking tools pick a side, defend it to the death, and ignore that both sides are screwing you.

  7. If you want NN, add Platform Neutrality to it. by sethstorm · · Score: 0

    Trying to silence someone on a major platform is just as bad as Comcast doing the same with fast lanes.

    --
    Twitter supports and protects racists - by smearing their critics with the "Hate Speech" label.
  8. Re: Spoiler Alert by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    Hillary showed no indication of killing it, and as someone one the progressive / centrist side she advocates for regulations which benefit Americans.

    The problem is you hide behind smarmy nonsense like "both sides are screwing you", while you fail to vote for the candidate who would protect your interest, and thus empower the politicians that actually are harming you.

    Worst of all, you empower America's traitors and enemies the most obnoxious, faux intellectual way possible.

  9. Why bother by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Everyone on the planet could legitimately write a logical, thoughtful and grammatically correct comment in favor of Net Neutrality and it will not make any difference.

    Ajit Pai does not care about you, your comments or Net Neutrality. The decision has already made, the lobbyists and corporations will get their way. They will get increased profits and the C Level executives will get higher bonuses and even more hookers and blow in return. The decision to kill Net Neutrality have enough support in the lower levels of Government and the Trupen-Führer will sign the order to kill Net Neutrality without hesitation.

    You'll pay more for even less, you'll hit your cap sooner and you'll soon be paying additional feese to use the Internet to reach and of the things you want to actually see. Pai, Trump and pretty much everyone at all levels of Government do not care about you. As long as the rich get richer, who gives a damn about you peon. Just keep reminding yourself that it has to get worse before it gets better.

    1. Re:Why bother by Rick+Schumann · · Score: 0

      Fucking cowards like you make me sick. Yellow-bellied cowards like you don't deserve to live in the United States, why don't you renounce your citizenship and go live in China or something, since you seem to have no use for CHOICE in how things are where you live. Then we can give your job to someone who actually deserves to live here, who appreciates the right to actually speak up about things that matter and expects something to be done about it.

    2. Re:Why bother by Rick+Schumann · · Score: 0, Offtopic

      I spoke my mind, which is more than that little coward did. What do you expect me to do? Grab a shotgun and turn Ajit Pai's head into a fine red mist, in the name of Freedom or something? I'm also encouraging cowards like that guy (you?) to STOP BEING COWARDS AND STAND UP FOR WHAT YOU THINK IS RIGHT. That's what you do, that's where it starts, with TALKING TO PEOPLE and SPEAKING YOUR MIND. If you can't fucking be bothered to even do THAT MUCH then you are part of the problem.

    3. Re:Why bother by Narcocide · · Score: 1

      Well, he pissed YOU off enough to de-anonymize yourself unwittingly, so I don't think it can be fairly said he's evidently done NOTHING today. Just food for thought.

    4. Re:Why bother by Rick+Schumann · · Score: 1

      Sadly these are not trolls, there are actual people living in the U.S. who don't seem to value that they live somewhere where they're not only allowed but encouraged to speak their minds about how things are done. By the way if that attitude from people doesn't piss you off too then I'm telling you: it should. BTW I was never AC or even meant to be.

    5. Re:Why bother by Billly+Gates · · Score: 0

      Fucking cowards like you make me sick. Yellow-bellied cowards like you don't deserve to live in the United States, why don't you renounce your citizenship and go live in China or something, since you seem to have no use for CHOICE in how things are where you live. Then we can give your job to someone who actually deserves to live here, who appreciates the right to actually speak up about things that matter and expects something to be done about it.

      But the emails! What about the Clinton's emails! We have to vote agaisn't our own self interests as those guys on AM radio and Fox make seem voting for anyone who favors us as pretty scary. If we give them some more free money they will be nice to us.

    6. Re:Why bother by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I get the feeling it doesn't matter... it feels like a political ploy to direct attention away from other things.

      Honestly, this will go to court. Ajit gets to tell his constituents "Well, we tried as hard as we could." It'll probably all fall through in court anyway... it just all seems like a big distraction.

    7. Re:Why bother by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Do you wave your arms at tornadoes trying to stop them? Flailing about accomplishing nothing is a giant waste of fucking time. These people don't CARE what you say or do, so long as they are in power and can keep the money flowing towards them. Not acknowledging that and pretending that your silly little words are going to make any difference whatsoever doesn't make you a strong man of action, it makes you a person that's too stupid to acknowledge reality as it actually exists.

    8. Re:Why bother by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      YOU ARE A COWARD, plain and simple. And you don't deserve to live in this country, helping the people who want to destroy it, via your APATHY. Just leave. Renounce your citizenship and go live somewhere else.

  10. GoDaddy, DreamHost, etc Already Killed It by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    GoDaddy, DreamHost, and Network Solutions, in particular, have each deleted / suspended at least one or more domain names due to content they didn't like. Internet neutrality, in effect, is already dead regardless of what the FCC does. Mandating minimum speeds / treating all data equally doesn't do much good when companies can use their terms of service instead *selectively* against users. It's the not the U.S. government one need to be concerned about, but corporations with far too much power.

    In my view, domain name registrars, dns providers, co-location facilities, ISPs, dominate email providers (Google, in particular), and network access points should all be regulated as common carrier, public utilities. They should not be permitted to arbitrarily shutoff one's service unless dictated to so by law.

    1. Re: GoDaddy, DreamHost, etc Already Killed It by temcat · · Score: 1

      This. I wonder how many people who are for network neutrality at the same time support disconnecting someone they disagree with, such as white supremacists, racists, Nazis etc.

  11. Federalist Model by Tablizer · · Score: 0

    Can states override this for their own state to have state-wide NN? To hell with red states! Let them nuke their telecom competition to dust like the suckers they are and be forced to purchase Teletubbies in HD in order to see NASCAR in HD. The #@$%'s probably secretly like Teletubbies anyhow.

  12. Re: Spoiler Alert by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Only one side is screwing you, the side being paid shit tons of money by corporate interests diametrically opposed to what's good for people. Of course, that's nearly all democrats and republicans.

  13. Wonder how many astroturfers by rsilvergun · · Score: 2

    It's just a simple web form. It'd be child's play to astro turf it to kingdom come with anti Net Neutrality comments. Wasn't somebody already caught doing just that?

    --
    Hi! I make Firefox Plug-ins. Check 'em out @ https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/youtube-mp3-podcaster/
    1. Re: Wonder how many astroturfers by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It's a simple black hole webform, they aren't reading any of it.

  14. There is no debate by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    We need net neutrality. Mr. Pai appears to be an idiot but I'd guess he is just in it for himself.

  15. Re: Spoiler Alert by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0, Informative

    Except that democrats enacted net neutrality, and republicans are taking it away.

    You fucking moron.

  16. Meanwhile US bandwidth is going up... by TheSync · · Score: 1

    Akamai State of the Internet Report 2017Q1 has United States average (IPv4) home Internet connection speed at 18.7 Mbps, up 22% year-on-year.

  17. Doesn't matter by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Your feedback isn't being taken into consideration anyways.

    Rich crooks do whatever they want, regardless of your opinion.

    1. Re:Doesn't matter by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Lots of shit doesn't matter, until there's a cascade.

  18. Kill "net neutrality" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Kill it with fire. Bury it in a shallow grave.

  19. Thanks for reminding me by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I went and let the FCC know that I appreciate them taking a hands off approach. We don't need idiots in government trying to regulate ISPs. All you useful idiots that think this is about your Netflix account are too stupid to have an opinion on Net Neutrality.

  20. Oh boy by SeaFox · · Score: 1

    One more day to be ignored by my government.

    Oh, wait. That's just like any other day now.

  21. He's gonna kill it by Snotnose · · Score: 2

    Ajit has pretended to listen to the people, but he's already been paid. His biggest problem now is how to phrase "90% of the American public think you suck, but you're gonna suck anyway". We need independent courts to look this kind of corruption and send the fuckers responsible to prison. Ajit, you deserve 5-10 years, you asshole.

  22. I advise AGAINST leaving a comment for globalists by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    One would naturally have to wonder who exactly is paying for all these "independent" comments that support so-called net neutrality. Anyone who leeves a comment on the FCC site is probably going to be subject to some kind of investigation, I would imagine. And for anyone concerned about how antifa and globalists have gotten together so effectively, you will want to make a donation today to the NRA and the Trump 2020 campaigns to fight the good fight.

  23. We're doing it by Okian+Warrior · · Score: 1

    We have to vote agaisn't our own self interests as those guys on AM radio and Fox make seem voting for anyone who favors us as pretty scary. If we give them some more free money they will be nice to us.

    Our side has been actually doing something about it.

    Lots of Republican congress seats are coming up in 2018, and many of them realize that if they don't get off their butts and do something, they're going to be voted out. There's a mood running through the population right now to that specific effect: people are saying "do something or we'll kick your butt to the curb in next year's elections".

    Many Republicans are worried that they'll lose to a challenger in the upcoming primary if they don't start doing things.

    Some are planning to use the upcoming debt-limit deadline (end of Sept) to force the Democrats to fund building the wall(*).

    And Trump is being selective with his support for certain campaigns, with the result that not having POTUS support makes it increasingly difficult to win reelection. Karma for RINOs.

    All these things are putting pressure on Republicans to start making decisions that favour the American people.

    You might try asking your side to do that as well. I'd *love* to see the two sides compete for the role of "best leadership".

    Here's a hint: marketing tag-lines such as "a better deal" without specific policies to back them up simply won't work.

    (*) But with Hurricane Harvey in Texas there's talk of putting that off a few months so that the government doesn't shut down and leave Texas in the lurch.

    1. Re:We're doing it by bluefoxlucid · · Score: 1

      "A Better Deal" is just the same Democrat talking points rehashed with a hash tag: $15 minimum wage, tax businesses, healthcare, blahblahblah. There's a plan, and it's everything they've been saying with new paint.

      I'm going to be the black sheep of the party if I somehow manage to get elected (hoping Elijah goes to senate; would hate to see him bail out this round due to his health issues, even if I can't beat him in the primaries). My core platform is a Universal Social Security plan, which hits every end goal, but not in ways the other party members like.

      Universal Social Security completely-restructures our welfare system to get more aid to more households. I built models to show how the money moves around and what services get adjusted. It cuts out some expenses equivalent to 48% of the taxes taken by income (including all FICA taxes), drops a 15% tax on the new tax brackets, and then redistributes that 15% take to all adults. I built Social Security's current OASDI benefits, HUD housing assistance, WIC, and parts of TANF (childcare aid, basic aid, and administrative costs) back up on top of that.

      So let's talk about this a bit.

      The benefit pays out twice monthly (close to your paycheck cycle) to come as close to just not taking some of your taxes as possible. I thought about deducting it right from payroll owe, but that involves a hell of a lot of reporting and synchronization between every single payroll operation and the IRS and Social Security Administration, so not doing that.

      Across the top 20% of earners, it should take in about $750 million and pay out something like $500 million? I'm not entirely sure: I need the total adult householders and adult dependent household members in that bracket (not just households) and a report on the total FICA tax paid by that group to get a precise number. When you get to the bottom bracket, it's pretty much $64 million in, $500 million out. Until you get to the top 40% or so, you're still dealing with people paying in less for that 15% tax than they're getting back; with joint-filing 2-adult households, you have to get up to the top 15%.

      In other words: the middle-class gets more out of it than they pay in; and it's an enormous aid package on the poor, so much so that a single individual in 2016 gets $8,751/year and a 2-adult household gets $17,502/year--and it's not counted as income for tax purposes (we taxed it before we took it from everyone; we're not double-taxing it). That can pretty much replace the Federal proportion of unemployment insurance; and, from that basis, things like housing assistance, WIC, and TANF are cheaper to provide, simply because the financial position of households is improved (they're not as poor, so they don't need as much aid--same means-testing we do today).

      As well, Social Security's OASDI program promises to pay $X dollars in retirement, disability, and so forth. I put the payroll/FICA tax back at 5.3% (only needs to be 5.15%) instead of 6.2%, with nothing coming out of your paycheck. If you were going to get, say, $1,200/month, you now get e.g. $800/month Universal plus $400/month retirement, meeting the $1,200/month as promised. Social Security reported at the end of 2017 that the Trust would be insolvent in 2034; well it's now solvent forever.

      The Universal benefit grew by 8% in my model since 2013, by the way. OASDI grew by 6.72% in the same period; the retirement benefit grew by 5.1%. That 5.3% FICA can actually shrink over time, because I'll eventually overtake OASDI--without tax increases.

      What's not to like?

      The burden on the upper incomes is cut back. The top tax bracket is 35.8% instead of 39.6%. It's just an artifact of the raw number manipulation. The business income taxes are cut to 33.2% from 35%. Democrats generally don't like this.

      Minimum wage doesn't pay a minimum monthly wage for the underemployed. I'm guaranteeing a mo

  24. Net Neutrality is AWESOME!!! by RogueWarrior65 · · Score: 1, Troll

    Unless you're running a website that some people don't approve of.

    1. Re:Net Neutrality is AWESOME!!! by pedrop357 · · Score: 2

      This.

      The people celebrating this don't seem to understand how bad this is for an open, free internet. They also seem to have dropped their opposition to "corporations controlling the internet".

  25. No Open Source Alternative? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Is there really no open source alternative to hard wiring everyone together via ISPs?

  26. Dinner with Mitt Romney by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    This reminds me of the time Trump had dinner with Mitt Romney to "interview" him for the Secretary of State job. Now everybody knew Trump wasn't going to hire his enemy Romney. But Trump listened. Acted like he gave a shit. It was all for show of course, and to humiliate Romney. In the end he selected his buddy Rex Tillerson.

    The FCC, which is now majority Republican fascist owned, will not care one bit that nearly all the 22+ million comments say don't repeal net neutrality. The comments will have no influence whatsoever on the FCC decision. You know that, I know that. Why go through with this farce?

    The only way to fix this is to never ever vote for the once-great (like 150 years ago, once) Republican party. Convince your friends and everyone you know.

  27. Good! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    We can finally pressure the corporations to block all the racist websites. Especially the ones under the guise of "nationalism" and "southern heritage." Once in a while the idiocy of the Republicans can bite themselves in the ass.

  28. Network Neutrality gives FCC cenorship power by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Net Neutrality legislation is not what you're told it is. Face it: You have not read and understood the legislation. The legislation is not the idea of "packet equality", it has vast censorship clauses and should be thrown out.

    Net Neutrality is aimed to restrict technological innovation and 1st amendment rights by conflating Unlawful with Illegal. It is not illegal for me to walk backwards and sing the alphabet song, but it is unlawful for me to do so, because there is no law explicitly permitting me to do so. Net Neutrality legislation has grouped "illegal content" such as child porn with "unlawful content" (anything not explicitly permitted, such as new encryption or VOIP protocols or podcasts), and makes it legal to censor anything that is "unlawful content".

    Pro-net neutrality folks have been duped. Stop trusting corrupt media and actually READ. Don't trust the compromised EFF to give you a summary, it's not necessary. They're lawyers, they should know the difference between unlawful and illegal, but they have not said a damn thing about it. I suspect they're full of leftists that would LOVE to censor the right under Network Neutrality "hate speech" regulations, but your speech goes next.

    TL;DR: News flash: The PATRIOT Act is unpatriotic. Net Neutrality is anything but neutral; It gives government a much desired censorship control over the Internet.

    1. Re: Network Neutrality gives FCC cenorship power by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      But muh feefees!

  29. Well, what can one say by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    You can shit on some of the people some of the time, you can shit on some of the people all of the time and you can shit on all of the people some of the time, but you can't shit on all of the people all of the time.

    1. Re:Well, what can one say by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Donald Trump, is that you?

  30. Nazis are not a protected class by Tenebrousedge · · Score: 1

    You don't have to wonder, if you realize those are orthogonal issues. You see, hosting content on the Internet costs money, and it's not one of those universal government services. Therefore you are paying some private individual for this. Private individuals can generally conduct business as they choose within the bounds of the law. Businesses typically are able to refuse service for any reason, with the exception being if this decision is based on the customer's race, religion, sex, nationality, etc. So far, I don't believe anyone is claiming Nazism as a religion, and Nazis are not otherwise members of a protected class. The legal situation is pretty clear, barring motivated reasoning.

    Net neutrality on the other hand involves not prioritizing traffic based on endpoint. So one would not be able to de-prioritize traffic to Nazi websites based on these rules. To the degree that there has been any unfair prioritization, this has been based on business concerns and not the content itself. Thus while there is a potential avenue for a First Amendment claim, the actual issue being addressed by these rules is monopoly abuse.

    Nazis deserve all of the protections afforded to them by law, and not a damn thing more. In advocating genocide, you give up the protections afforded to you by common human decency. Freedom of speech does not imply freedom from consequences: if what you say makes people want to exercise their freedom not to associate with you, that's kinda a personal problem.

    --
    Those who advocate genocide deserve every protection afforded by law, and none afforded by common human decency.
    1. Re:Nazis are not a protected class by ZiggieTheGreat · · Score: 1

      Thank you.

      This has got to be the best summarized version of my thoughts I've seen yet.

      I'm going to use this later. Unless you opt out. :-P

    2. Re:Nazis are not a protected class by temcat · · Score: 1

      I still really, honestly cannot see the basic difference. Both hosters and ISP do business, which (of course) costs money. Why shouldn't both be able to refuse or provide inferior service for any reason within the bounds of the law? Or why shouldn't both be forbidden from doing that? (First Amendment shouldn't apply to private entities, and not all ISP are monopolies, so monopoly is a different issue.)

      Speaking of the law, "protected classes" are bullshit. They should be eliminated. Even disregarding the more fundamental and general reasons of individual freedom, this especially concerns religion, because nothing prevents it from including smth as bad as Nazi ideology as its part. The rules should not be different for any classes.

    3. Re:Nazis are not a protected class by pedrop357 · · Score: 1

      Should the political winds shift, you'll still have your Netflix, but the "extremist" or fringe political websites you might visit will be given the stormfront treatment.

    4. Re:Nazis are not a protected class by Tenebrousedge · · Score: 1

      I think your central confusion may be conflating "refusing service" with "providing inferior service". The business may accept or refuse customers for any non-discriminatory reason, but (in this case) they have to give all their customers the same service. And we would not necessarily make these rules if there were not direct financial incentives for abuse, and (perhaps arguably) a history of that actually happening. ISPs are not all monopolies, but the ISP markets generally are not characterized by robust competition, due to high costs of entry.

      I don't think you disagree with the concept of "protected classes" so much as you disagree with which classes are protected. The intent was to prevent people from discriminating against things that can't be changed about a person. I am sympathetic to the idea that religion should not belong in that category, but I am not sure that's something that I personally want to advocate. Saying that people shouldn't be allowed to discriminate based on age, sex, or some other physical characteristic is hopefully uncontroversial?

      --
      Those who advocate genocide deserve every protection afforded by law, and none afforded by common human decency.
    5. Re:Nazis are not a protected class by Tenebrousedge · · Score: 1

      Yes, someone was bound to show up with a "slippery slope" argument. Your point is completely sound, but I don't often find myself advocating genocide, so this is an acceptable risk. Also, whether or not you dislike this idea, you have no legal argument for an alternative: one cannot be forced to provide a platform for arbitrary speech. If we nationalized the Internet infrastructure, or if Nazism were a protected class, this would become a more interesting question. As is, I gotta say I sleep pretty easy knowing that somewhere out in the world, people who celebrate genocide are facing discrimination.

      --
      Those who advocate genocide deserve every protection afforded by law, and none afforded by common human decency.
    6. Re:Nazis are not a protected class by bluefoxlucid · · Score: 1

      Tenebrousedge, James P.: "Assholes Are Not a Protected Class", Harvard Ph.D. Programme Library, 2017.

    7. Re:Nazis are not a protected class by bluefoxlucid · · Score: 1

      ISPs control whether you can access a resource. Hosters provide a place to host a resource.

      If your host won't host you, you can find another host. There are lots of them.

      If ISPs won't allow access, then you have the big one or two in an area who can actually carry something (e.g. Netflix) but refuse, and the small ISPs who are willing to carry something but don't have the capacity. Changing hosts doesn't work at the supplier end: you have to get your customers to change to an ISP who supports you. It's even worse if some ISPs decide to block different things, so now customers need 3 different ISPs to have free and unrestricted access to all the hosted Internet content they want.

      Fundamentally different consequences. It's like allowing car dealers to ban you from buying cars there, versus allowing states to ban you from driving on their roads (or from driving above 15mph).

    8. Re:Nazis are not a protected class by Tenebrousedge · · Score: 1

      I'm not sure what you're trying to say here. Which probably isn't the best thing I could say about a congressional candidate. Good luck, by the way.

      --
      Those who advocate genocide deserve every protection afforded by law, and none afforded by common human decency.
    9. Re:Nazis are not a protected class by temcat · · Score: 1

      "Refusing service" vs. "providing inferior service" — this may well be how the actual law is designed, but it is what I question, too, because to me, refused service looks like a degenerate case of inferior service. In fact, why limit the discussion to B2B or B2C: it's the general issue of discrimination. For example, the notion of gender pay gap is structurally very similar to inferior service. Furthermore, "financial incentives for abuse" is just one way of seeing things, another being "costs and/or risks". So the question here is why exactly addressing these costs and/or risks is considered abuse in the first place.

      I'm opposed to all protected classes because their existence takes the freedom from private persons to non-violently associate or not associate with each other. Basically, anyone should be able refuse business to anyone else just as you can refuse sex to anybody for any reason, even if otherwise that person is fit for sex with you based on objective criteria, down to causing physically measurable sexual arousal in you.

      Apart from that fundamental reason, there may be objective monetary and non-monetary costs and/or risks associated with any class you mention in various scenarios, and it's not obvious to me that it's ethical to force a party to incur or bear them. Take gender: one may want to avoid male babysitters for one's daughter expecting lower likelihood of sexual abuse in case of females (whether it's actually true, I don't know, but this it's not an unreasonable idea.) Or one may refuse to hire females to certain positions in the military because they're less physically fit for them.

    10. Re:Nazis are not a protected class by bluefoxlucid · · Score: 1

      Shrug. It wasn't a campaign statement and I haven't gotten the idea that it's always a campaign statement yet.

      Either way, it's not funny if I have to explain it.

    11. Re:Nazis are not a protected class by temcat · · Score: 1

      So you're arguing that it's more or less about the degree of monopolization. That's a consistent approach.

    12. Re:Nazis are not a protected class by bluefoxlucid · · Score: 1

      Not just the degree of monopolization, but the end-to-end impact. Even if you have 1,000 ISPs in a city and only one excludes your Web site, the customers of that one must face whatever special impact their ISP has on you. If you have one giant monopoly ISP today and exactly two equivalent Web hosts, one Web host excluding you just means you go to the next (who we assume doesn't exclude you), and the people using the monopoly ISP experience exactly the same end-user experience.

      The ISP connection is not flexible; it's a fixed resource at the consumer end. With Net Neutrality, all Web hosts are equally-accessible from all ISPs as per the ISP's capability, and they're at the other end. Without Net Neutrality, all Web services (not necessarily hosts) are not equally-accessible from all ISPs as per the ISP's capability, and even changing your hosting provider will leave you blocked or degraded by an ISP.

      ISP monopolization causes the false choice, and is the practical situation today, and so prevents certain businesses from existing. ISP competition would lessen, but not eliminate the problem. Web hosting competition generally-eliminates the problem of some Web hosts not supplying adequately-unencumbered service from which to host.

  31. Internet censorship is openly celebrated by pedrop357 · · Score: 3, Insightful

    All this talk about open internet, ISPs not acting as gatekeepers, corporations not controlling the internet, etc. is a bit thin when people are openly celebrating corporations kicking websites off the internet with little notice for offensive (very offensive in these cases) content after having collected money from them for years.

    You can abhor places like the dailystormer and stormfront, while also disagreeing with what happened to them, how it happened, and pointing out that this bodes very badly for an open, free internet.

  32. Comments against Title 2 by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Posting as AC due to mod.
    I seem to recall someone posting a rather technical argument about the interplay between title 2 and NN, saying that title 2 actually needs to go in order for something else to happen (I seem to recall it being along the lines of "who pays for what traffic"). Anybody remember that one? Could anyone provide details?

  33. As if anything we have to say. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Will defeat Republitardation.

  34. Net Neutrality by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Will be destroyed. Praise Kek.